The Official 2024 Reds season thread

wolves82 said:
You really are not comprehending this? One last try...

I do not care how much the athletes make. That has nothing to do with it. I care about my favorite team retaining their best players. That is the entire point.

We all know that that the Reds cannot offer massive free agent contracts like LA, NY, Philly, etc. The dollars are just not there. So in order to retain their best players (Elly, for example), they need to get them longer contract extensions that extend beyond their free agent start date.

The only reason a player might sign a contract like that is if you give them a nice salary increase in the years before arbitration and free agency. So you pay a few million more than you need to the first couple years, and ramp up their salary as the contract goes longer, but you keep the salary well below the huge FA contract dollars.

As to your question "IF you could get Elly to sign off, but honestly why would he?", I have answered this many times for you. It is because:
a) He could make 2-3 million extra per year RIGHT NOW
b) He knows he could get hurt and the contract is a tremendous safety net
c) Everyone with half a brain knows that guaranteed money now is way better than "maybe" money 5 years from now

These are the same reasons that Hunter Greene signed.

Is this sinking in yet?
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What makes you think the money is not going to be there in 5 years? There's not been a generation that it's got "worse" for the players.

To your point of Elly making 2-3 extra mill per season, could he and Scott Boros decide to make that up in endorsements and other money outside of his baseball contract, and then cash in after 2029?
 
14Red said:
What makes you think the money is not going to be there in 5 years? There's not been a generation that it's got "worse" for the players.

To your point of Elly making 2-3 extra mill per season, could he and Scott Boros decide to make that up in endorsements and other money outside of his baseball contract, and then cash in after 2029?
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You're thinking players are more altruistic than they are. It's pretty simple. If my boss offers me money for my services that I receive now vs money that will be paid to me 3 years from now, I'm taking the money now.
 
14Red said:
What makes you think the money is not going to be there in 5 years? There's not been a generation that it's got "worse" for the players.

To your point of Elly making 2-3 extra mill per season, could he and Scott Boros decide to make that up in endorsements and other money outside of his baseball contract, and then cash in after 2029?
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I did not say that money would be worse in 5 years. But you've said it 100 times. What if he gets seriously injured? No free agent money at all.

The early extension is a great way to make more money now, and have some insurance against injury. Sure, you might make $10-15M less in 2029 and 2030, but if you have made $8-10M extra in the early years of your contract, it is worth it. How many times must I explain?

Why did Hunter Greene sign? KeBryan Hayes? Corbin Carroll? etc, etc. etc. It is smart for the team, and smart for the young player.
 
14Red said:
What makes you think the money is not going to be there in 5 years? There's not been a generation that it's got "worse" for the players.
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What if he suffers a career-altering injury in the interim? The money will not be there in 5 years if that happens.
 
AEW Champion said:
What if he suffers a career-altering injury in the interim? The money will not be there in 5 years if that happens.
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A large majority of the Latin players can forever live comfortably with one nice contract. They seem to not chase the greed that our US born brethren do. They are national heroes for the most part. There are exceptions but 50 mil is 50 mil.
 
wolves82 said:
I did not say that money would be worse in 5 years. But you've said it 100 times. What if he gets seriously injured? No free agent money at all.

The early extension is a great way to make more money now, and have some insurance against injury. Sure, you might make $10-15M less in 2029 and 2030, but if you have made $8-10M extra in the early years of your contract, it is worth it. How many times must I explain?

Why did Hunter Greene sign? KeBryan Hayes? Corbin Carroll? etc, etc. etc. It is smart for the team, and smart for the young player.
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I'm about 1000% sure the Reds are talking to Elly and his people about an extension, but we'll never know it until the ink is dry.

So since we're talking about it, who on the Reds would you guys like to see extended, as opposed to letting things ride?
 
Since we are talking about the present and the future, here is the new Reds top 30 prospect list. We can debate until the cows come home weather this means anything specific, but it's what the club uses to project what the team may look like moving forward. The million dollar question then becomes do you keep the guys you have now and pay them more, do you bring these guys up to replace SOME of them or do you trade some of these guys to fill a need. Lowder and Burnes are untouchables IMO, and possibly Collier. I'd also say that since we are stacked in the infield and 4 of these guys are infielders, some may be moving to the outfield. Interesting that they have Lowder with an ETA of 2024.

1723832399586.png
 
Unique opponent for the Reds this weekend. The Reds / Royals really don't have or ever had any kind of rivalry. Obviously before interleague play, the Reds/ Royals never played in a world series. And up until recently, there would be years between games. As an older guy growing up in the 70's and 80's the Royals were really one of the better teams during that time. From 1975 to 1985, the Royals finished 1st or 2nd in the AL west all but one season. Lost in the league championship series 4 times, lost in the divisional round once, lost a world series and finally won a series in 1985 over the interstate St. Louis Cardinals. For the next 20 years, the were not competitive, then 2014 and 2015, made the World Series, losing in '14 and winning in'15.
Some of the names I remember in KC, George Brett, Dan Quisenberry, Frank White, Willie Wilson, Bret Saberhagen.
Not alot of familiar names on this version of the Royals. Bobby Witt, Jr. is a budding young star, ageless catcher Savador Perez and a bunch of other guys make up this team.
Reds have Nick Martinez, Nick Lodolo and Andrew Abbott going this weekend.
 
14Red said:
Since we are talking about the present and the future, here is the new Reds top 30 prospect list. We can debate until the cows come home weather this means anything specific, but it's what the club uses to project what the team may look like moving forward. The million dollar question then becomes do you keep the guys you have now and pay them more, do you bring these guys up to replace SOME of them or do you trade some of these guys to fill a need. Lowder and Burnes are untouchables IMO, and possibly Collier. I'd also say that since we are stacked in the infield and 4 of these guys are infielders, some may be moving to the outfield. Interesting that they have Lowder with an ETA of 2024.

View attachment 63370
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I would extend Steer and Elly, period. Steer obviously at a price lower than Elly. Everyone else needs to prove they can stay in the lineup and be a productive MLB player.

As for these prospects, they are soooooo young. Which is good for the future. I'd be surprised if we see Lowder this year, but who knows. I have been reading raves about Burns. I could see Lowder possibly winning a rotation spot next year, and I bet they give Burns a shot in the spring too. So maybe the longer term rotation is Greene, Lodolo, Lowder, Burns and Abbott? I do still like Ashcraft if he could harness his command a little more consistently.

As for Arroyo and Stewart, at this point Marte has to prove he deserves his spot, and McLain has to prove he can be available. So we shall see.
 
Tonight's lineup. In an un-Bell like move, looks like we're sticking with TJ in the cleanup spot. I assume Benson is in right field? I don't know how you an put him in the lineup at this point. Fraley, Stu, we have options.

1723839043346.png
 
wolves82 said:
I would extend Steer and Elly, period. Steer obviously at a price lower than Elly. Everyone else needs to prove they can stay in the lineup and be a productive MLB player.

As for these prospects, they are soooooo young. Which is good for the future. I'd be surprised if we see Lowder this year, but who knows. I have been reading raves about Burns. I could see Lowder possibly winning a rotation spot next year, and I bet they give Burns a shot in the spring too. So maybe the longer term rotation is Greene, Lodolo, Lowder, Burns and Abbott? I do still like Ashcraft if he could harness his command a little more consistently.

As for Arroyo and Stewart, at this point Marte has to prove he deserves his spot, and McLain has to prove he can be available. So we shall see.
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I heard Brantley recently and he said they should consider Ashcraft in the backend of the bullpen. A GREAT problem the Reds will have in a few years is where are all these starting pitchers going? Chase Petty and Connor Phillips is still in the mix, and you add Lowder and Burns to Greene, Lodolo and Abbott and some are either headed to the bullpen or getting traded for other capital.
 
Bell chooses a 3-1 game in the 9th with 40 games to go as the time to work on trying to stretch out Fernando Cruz. Unreal. He admitted as much after the game, saying they need to stretch Cruz out because they want to make him a multi-inning reliever.

Cruz is already toast. Send him to Louisville. And Junis was brought in to purportedly be a long reliever anyway.

What is wrong with this front office and coaching staff?
 
AEW Champion said:
Bell chooses a 3-1 game in the 9th with 40 games to go as the time to work on trying to stretch out Fernando Cruz. Unreal. He admitted as much after the game, saying they need to stretch Cruz out because they want to make him a multi-inning reliever.

Cruz is already toast. Send him to Louisville. And Junis was brought in to purportedly be a long reliever anyway.

What is wrong with this front office and coaching staff?
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Yup. it is a low IQ issue.

If regular fans like us can see that Cruz is gassed, how can the manager and staff not see it? He has gone from a dominant reliever to a guy with a 5.50 ERA. But sure, lets have him go an extra inning in a tight game in mid August. It was only his 58th appearance; no other pitcher on the team has more than 44 appearances.

Bell & his staff are idiots.
 
AEW Champion said:
Hunter Greene to the IL with elbow soreness
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The Reds have been playing so well lately, you hate for this kind of issue to crop up now. They will have a much tougher path to 85-86 wins without Greene! Hopefully he only misses three or four starts and can get right back at it by mid September, and deep into the playoffs.
 
24 and 16 is my minimum for having any chance this year, and really that looks like it just became 24 and 15 with the score today. That is tough with Greene, without him , not very likely at all.
 
Sweep the Cards. Lay an egg against KC. Story of the whole season - just no consistency. The Greene news is likely the nail in the coffin for this year. Probably were not catching the Braves anyway.

Keys for the remainder of the season:
- Can McLain come back and just get a little rhythm playing ball again? It would be nice for him to knock the rust off in September instead of next spring.
- Can Marte get back to being the player he was last year? He has been awful at the plate and in the field. He may need to compete for a roster spot next year.
- When can CES start swinging a bat again?
- Can we give Lowder a couple of starts in Sept to get his feet wet?
 
There’s not much to say other than what an embarrassment of a weekend. Beaten from pillar to post by another small-market team.

And the front office’s habit of invading the clearance rack to put a Band-Aid on a bullet wound continues with the quizzical claim of Amed Rosario. Are they finally demoting one of the several underperforming position players?
 
Omega said:
Well even not showing up likely would not hurt the Reds ownership group given MLB revenue sharing. As I have posted before, my opinion is that the Reds ownership group has no commitment to winning or excellence and that trickles down through the whole organization. Firing Krall and Bell would change nothing until the Castellinis are gone.

Looking at the Reds season they are on pace for 77 wins. Last year, if you remove the improbable 12 game win streak that passed their winning percentage , the Reds would have finished up with 76 wins. The very definition of below average.
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They don't care to win. They have their $$ guys run numbers and increasing payroll to what it would take to MAYBE compete just isn't worth the risk.

They'd rather keep their money in the "Christmas Club" account end make a little.money instead of playing the stock market with more risk.

Swept.

Hahahahahahabab
 
Thavoice said:
They don't care to win. They have their $$ guys run numbers and increasing payroll to what it would take to MAYBE compete just isn't worth the risk.

They'd rather keep their money in the "Christmas Club" account end make a little.money instead of playing the stock market with more risk.

Swept.

Hahahahahahabab
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As a lifelong Reds fan, I find nothing about it being funny. I’m also not ignorant enough to get caught up in a mediocre at best ball club.

There is no reason for Matt McClain to play an inning this season. Rest and rehab would benefit him more than playing 30 or fewer games. With that said I’m sure they will activate him at some point. I’m hoping he’s not another Nick Senzel.
If you think Greene is put on the IL for elbow soreness you’ve not been paying attention.
I just see what I see. I’m afraid that when Bell is let go we get D Johnson as our manager. Bringing your infield in when down 13-0 should have gotten you fired on the spot imo. What the heck.
There are just too many problems to speak on.
 
It had to happen. Cincy pitching and hitting collapsed at the same time as KC swept the Reds three straight at GABP this weekend. The losses were crushing coming after the Reds swept three from Cards earlier in the week, climbing to second place and within one game of .500. Cincy is now 60-64, twelve games out of first and six back of a wild card spot. To add insult to injury, Hunter Greene is now on the disabled list. The Reds may still have a mathematical chance at the playoffs, but one can hear the fat lady warming up in the bullpen.
 
GCPRO said:
As a lifelong Reds fan, I find nothing about it being funny. I’m also not ignorant enough to get caught up in a mediocre at best ball club.

There is no reason for Matt McClain to play an inning this season. Rest and rehab would benefit him more than playing 30 or fewer games. With that said I’m sure they will activate him at some point. I’m hoping he’s not another Nick Senzel.
If you think Greene is put on the IL for elbow soreness you’ve not been paying attention.
I just see what I see. I’m afraid that when Bell is let go we get D Johnson as our manager. Bringing your infield in when down 13-0 should have gotten you fired on the spot imo. What the heck.
There are just too many problems to speak on.
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When Castellini tipped his hand to fans that he didn't GAF about putting a good product on the field for his customers I checked out completely....maybe seen a total of 9 innnongs total mostly when I'm someplace and it's on.

I used to pay attention daily....go to MiLB r3fs games to see some of the young prospects but not anymore. Nada. Bupkus.

I will not enable this ownership by giving one penny.


I like to pop in here to see the jocksniffers who actually believe this franchise has a chance .

It's actually been quite nice in not having the nightly struggle paying attention to a dumpster fire
 
This thread is pretty amusing because there are a select few who only seem to come on here when the Reds fall apart and they gloat? Of course they say they have checked out and don't pay attention, but they always seem to pop in after the team loses???

The weekend notwithstanding, here is some points to still consider moving forward:
  • the development of this team continues, Elly, Steer, Marte, Friedl, Abbott, Lodolo, guys we are moving forward with need to continue to get at bats and starts
  • IF Matt McLain can play, he NEEDS to play. Any time he gets this year will help his development.
  • This franchise still has the building blocks in place. Next season, with the guys mentioned above and Greene, you'll have a healthy McLain, CES, and any other additions they can get. My guess sometime in '25 you'll see Rhell Lowder.
  • This team is still on the right track.
 
Omega said:
It had to happen. Cincy pitching and hitting collapsed at the same time as KC swept the Reds three straight at GABP this weekend. The losses were crushing coming after the Reds swept three from Cards earlier in the week, climbing to second place and within one game of .500. Cincy is now 60-64, twelve games out of first and six back of a wild card spot. To add insult to injury, Hunter Greene is now on the disabled list. The Reds may still have a mathematical chance at the playoffs, but one can hear the fat lady warming up in the bullpen.
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I thought after the very atypical sweep of the Cardinals they might go 10-0 or 9-1 in the next ten games and be real close to getting to 84 wins by going .500 the rest of the way. Turns out I was very wrong. Now they have to go 24-14 to get to 84 wins and have a chance. With Greene out, that is not likely to happen.

So we turn to Bell to prepare the kids for 2025. I'm pretty much sticking a fork in this season.
 
14Red said:
This thread is pretty amusing because there are a select few who only seem to come on here when the Reds fall apart and they gloat? Of course they say they have checked out and don't pay attention, but they always seem to pop in after the team loses???

The weekend notwithstanding, here is some points to still consider moving forward:
  • the development of this team continues, Elly, Steer, Marte, Friedl, Abbott, Lodolo, guys we are moving forward with need to continue to get at bats and starts
  • IF Matt McLain can play, he NEEDS to play. Any time he gets this year will help his development.
  • This franchise still has the building blocks in place. Next season, with the guys mentioned above and Greene, you'll have a healthy McLain, CES, and any other additions they can get. My guess sometime in '25 you'll see Rhell Lowder.
  • This team is still on the right track.
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What do any at bats that occur when there is zero pressure to produce matter? Please answer that for me? September baseball for teams out of contention is no better than the Arizona Fall league
 
D4fan said:
I thought after the very atypical sweep of the Cardinals they might go 10-0 or 9-1 in the next ten games and be real close to getting to 84 wins by going .500 the rest of the way.

So we turn to Bell to prepare the kids for 2025. I'm pretty much sticking a fork in this season.
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I always have difficulty determining whether your posts are satire or your honest beliefs, but two points:

1. No one who has watched any amount of the 2024 Reds would even consider a 10-0 run as possible. The team’s crappy offense is incapable of supporting that type of a run.

2. A big part of the problem is the lack of progression of players at the major-league level under this coaching staff. The true stars whose talent wins out have improved (Elly, Greene), but other guys don’t. Allowing Bell to continue on into 2025 would be total negligence.

Never in the 150 year history of the Reds franchise has a manager gotten 6 or more years while winning nothing. That right there is a sign of the lowered expectations and acceptance of failure under the Castellini regime. It’s still head-scratching how this franchise has gone from great managers like Sparky, Lou Piniella, Davey Johnson and Jack McKeon to their run of horrible managerial hires in the 21st Century, barring Dusty Baker.
 
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