Hazing Incidents

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Yes this is true, however even with all of this in place, kids in every single school still find ways to sneak away from supervision. The easiest is to ask to use the bathroom and then just wander. Or never report to where you are supposed to be and again hide out in a bathroom where you can gamble, deal drugs, etc. No matter what, bad kids will find a way to do vad things.
Absolutely but risk is mitigated by having monitors in place.

I still don’t have all the facts on this case right now but Massillon has enough staffers to have somebody at the facility when kids are working out there. If nobody was there then they were negligent. There are no excuses.
 
Absolutely but risk is mitigated by having monitors in place.

I still don’t have all the facts on this case right now but Massillon has enough staffers to have somebody at the facility when kids are working out there. If nobody was there then they were negligent. There are no excuses.
That I absolutely agree with.

All I ust saying it is impossible to monitor every kid the entire time.

And when something unfortunate happens, how does the staff respond? Was it appropriate or was it ignored? I dont know the details here, but we will wait and see.
 
That I absolutely agree with.

All I ust saying it is impossible to monitor every kid the entire time.

And when something unfortunate happens, how does the staff respond? Was it appropriate or was it ignored? I dont know the details here, but we will wait and see.
Football operations were immediately shutdown and self reported. Punishments have been/are being handed down as the investigation continues. Nothing was swept under the rug.
 
I don't know what happened or care to know but this has been going on in schools world wide since the beginning of time. Even the future King of England endured it at his elite private school , just watch the Netflix series " The Crown". The thing is there has to be consequences to those involved, otherwise it will continue much as the crime we see in our cities today. Woke school boards and weak teachers and coaches circle the wagons to protect themselves, their athletic programs and the schools reputation. If this happens on school grounds then the kids should face strong disciplinary actions and the coaches as well for not haven proper oversight.
 
Legally educators (including Coaches and Lay Coaches once they step on campus) take on the role of parents and responsibility for kids - legally it's called In Loco Parentis. That is why we're supposed to have coaches, or at least a coach monitoring the locker room, weight room, or position group meeting room if student - athletes are in those areas. Whether it's fair or not, its part of the job and has been for at least a half century.
If they are required to be there by the coach then you are correct. If a kid shows up at 7am when told to be there at 8am or an hour after practice ended, what he does during that hour is on him and his parents, not a coach. The implication that a coach is responsible the moment a kid steps on campus is flat wrong. There is a fine line today regarding Loco Parentis that courts are pushing back on. "In place of parents" implies that those in place of parents would have the same rights as said parents and the courts have said no to that over and over when it comes to privacy arguements and discipline. Now if these kids were required to be on campus and unsupervised, that's an issue. Since there are no confirmed details to this story, I'm reserving my judgement all together.
 
Evidently, you live, or support a utopian community/school. Please post where that is located.
 
I don't know what happened or care to know but this has been going on in schools world wide since the beginning of time. Even the future King of England endured it at his elite private school , just watch the Netflix series " The Crown". The thing is there has to be consequences to those involved, otherwise it will continue much as the crime we see in our cities today. Woke school boards and weak teachers and coaches circle the wagons to protect themselves, their athletic programs and the schools reputation. If this happens on school grounds then the kids should face strong disciplinary actions and the coaches as well for not haven proper oversight.
This is an interesting take. It’s a “woke” position to defend hazing and cover up issues to protect athletic programs? Seems to me quite the opposite, and I generally think light hazing is natural, fine, and in fact unavoidable.
 
I don't know what happened or care to know but this has been going on in schools world wide since the beginning of time. Even the future King of England endured it at his elite private school , just watch the Netflix series " The Crown". The thing is there has to be consequences to those involved, otherwise it will continue much as the crime we see in our cities today. Woke school boards and weak teachers and coaches circle the wagons to protect themselves, their athletic programs and the schools reputation. If this happens on school grounds then the kids should face strong disciplinary actions and the coaches as well for not haven proper oversight.
Happened in their field house
 
This is an interesting take. It’s a “woke” position to defend hazing and cover up issues to protect athletic programs? Seems to me quite the opposite, and I generally think light hazing is natural, fine, and in fact unavoidable.
The woke position has been to turn stupid horse play into "hazing" turning everything into a major issue.
 
If they are required to be there by the coach then you are correct. If a kid shows up at 7am when told to be there at 8am or an hour after practice ended, what he does during that hour is on him and his parents, not a coach. The implication that a coach is responsible the moment a kid steps on campus is flat wrong. There is a fine line today regarding Loco Parentis that courts are pushing back on. "In place of parents" implies that those in place of parents would have the same rights as said parents and the courts have said no to that over and over when it comes to privacy arguements and discipline. Now if these kids were required to be on campus and unsupervised, that's an issue. Since there are no confirmed details to this story, I'm reserving my judgement all together.
I feel this to my core. This right here was a HUGE reason I stopped coaching. Every school I worked at blamed the coaches for a kid showing up an hour or more earlier than they were supposed to , or staying hours upon hours late. Kids would be dropped off by Mom on her way to work or picked up whenever someone was on their way home. Even if the kids didn't do anything wrong, it's "why were they unsupervised?" I can't count how many meetings fellow staff members and I have been in where something along the lines of, "Why were your players still on campus unsupervised at 8:30 pm on a Tuesday?" Uh, they decided to stay to watch the soccer game. Or after a Friday night, it's midnight and you go to finally leave and there's still kids "waiting on rides." Admin was always adamant that someone had to be there until the last one left. And even though it was crystal clear that unfortunately nobody was showing up for these kids, I got reprimanded more than once for loading them up into the minivan and taking them home.

More common sense is needed in situations like you mentioned.
 
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If it's your team, then it's " horseplay." If it's your rival's team, it's a "major issue." Funny how that always seems to be the case.
My point is, the line has moved so far from kids goofing off to "hazing" it's stupid. Kids picking on a kids is just that and should be handled as such. Hazing is what seems to be happening a Northwestern (ritual pushinments handed out). The term "hazing" has become hot button over the years, so when you want to make horseplay or kids picking on kids a big deal you redefine it as "hazing" and everyone gasps and starts calling for coach's job. This is wokeism at it's finest. What happened at McKinley wasn't "hazing" it was stupid coaching. This sounds like kids picking on other kids and it's stupid but it's not hazing.
 
My point is, the line has moved so far from kids goofing off to "hazing" it's stupid. Kids picking on a kids is just that and should be handled as such. Hazing is what seems to be happening a Northwestern (ritual pushinments handed out). The term "hazing" has become hot button over the years, so when you want to make horseplay or kids picking on kids a big deal you redefine it as "hazing" and everyone gasps and starts calling for coach's job. This is wokeism at it's finest. What happened at McKinley wasn't "hazing" it was stupid coaching. This sounds like kids picking on other kids and it's stupid but it's not hazing.
So please define the differences between hazing and horseplay since you are the expert.

And McKinley was hazing based on what you said "ritual punishment." That's exactly what the coaches did there.
 
Certain situations are different. If an incident happens and there is already differences between coaches and admin. It’s a perfect scenario to can a coach.
If everything is good internally, you follow protocol ,dish out punishments , take preventative steps so it doesn’t happen again and move forward.
Also scenarios probably change if the victim/victims and said parents aren’t pushing for heads to roll. With that being said you still cannot turn a blind eye for poor conduct.
 
I feel this to my core. This right here was a HUGE reason I stopped coaching. Every school I worked at blamed the coaches for a kid showing up an hour or more earlier than they were supposed to , or staying hours upon hours late. Kids would be dropped off by Mom on her way to work or picked up whenever someone was on their way way home. Even if the kids didn't do anything wrong, it's "why were they unsupervised?" I can't count how many meetings fellow staff members and I have been in where something along the lines of, "Why were your players still on campus unsupervised at 8:30 pm on a Tuesday?" Uh, they decided to stay to watch the soccer game. Or after a Friday night, it's midnight and you go to finally leave and there's still kids "waiting on rides." Admin was always adamant that someone had to be there until the last one left. And even though it was crystal clear that unfortunately nobody was showing up for these kids, I got reprimanded more than once for loading them up into the minivan and taking them home.

More common sense is needed in situations like you mentioned.
Oh, and don't forget, that you should never give that kid an unsupervised kid a ride home or you'll get in trouble for that. Cursed regardless of what you do.
 
I feel this to my core. This right here was a HUGE reason I stopped coaching. Every school I worked at blamed the coaches for a kid showing up an hour or more earlier than they were supposed to , or staying hours upon hours late. Kids would be dropped off by Mom on her way to work or picked up whenever someone was on their way way home. Even if the kids didn't do anything wrong, it's "why were they unsupervised?" I can't count how many meetings fellow staff members and I have been in where something along the lines of, "Why were your players still on campus unsupervised at 8:30 pm on a Tuesday?" Uh, they decided to stay to watch the soccer game. Or after a Friday night, it's midnight and you go to finally leave and there's still kids "waiting on rides." Admin was always adamant that someone had to be there until the last one left. And even though it was crystal clear that unfortunately nobody was showing up for these kids, I got reprimanded more than once for loading them up into the minivan and taking them home.

More common sense is needed in situations like you mentioned.
I also coached for 30+ years, a handful of schools, and what cincifan is saying was the norm, IMO, from all those years, based on my experience as well. Admin & ADs were typically very quick to put "more work back on the coaching staff", for these situations. Over time, assistant coaches on the staff were simply "expected" to take turns monitoring, supervising, staying after, until the last kid was picked up. The head coach made that part of the expectations for the "staff"...end of story. No respect for our time, or our familie's time. Instead of putting this right back onto the parents for why they couldn't pick their kid up, any excuse offered by parents was met by admin as acceptable. One parent awhile back was already an hour & a half late (after a Thursday practice), my day to stay, and flat out told their son..."well, a coach is there to watch you right?..." Kid acknowledged yes, and the mom actually went on to let the kid know "well, good, b/c I'm getting my nails done and won't be able to pick you up til 7...that call happened @ 5:30...I knew then it was about time to step away from coaching.
 
Oh, and don't forget, that you should never give that kid an unsupervised kid a ride home or you'll get in trouble for that. Cursed regardless of what you do.
Yep got in trouble for that too, but will always still do it to make sure the kid got home safely. I mean what else are you supposed to do, it's after midnight, parents won't answer the phone.
 
I also coached for 30+ years, a handful of schools, and what cincifan is saying was the norm, IMO, from all those years, based on my experience as well. Admin & ADs were typically very quick to put "more work back on the coaching staff", for these situations. Over time, assistant coaches on the staff were simply "expected" to take turns monitoring, supervising, staying after, until the last kid was picked up. The head coach made that part of the expectations for the "staff"...end of story. No respect for our time, or our familie's time. Instead of putting this right back onto the parents for why they couldn't pick their kid up, any excuse offered by parents was met by admin as acceptable. One parent awhile back was already an hour & a half late (after a Thursday practice), my day to stay, and flat out told their son..."well, a coach is there to watch you right?..." Kid acknowledged yes, and the mom actually went on to let the kid know "well, good, b/c I'm getting my nails done and won't be able to pick you up til 7...that call happened @ 5:30...I knew then it was about time to step away from coaching.
Yep happened regularly. At every school I worked at.... Private, public, rich and poor. It was many more kids at the poor schools. Most Fridays every coach would load up as many kids as they could to take them home.
 
This is a huge reminder to all of us educators and people who work in the schools not to leave students unattended to for even 1 minute.
So if a student asks to go to the restroom their teacher is suppose to leave the classroom and escort them to the restroom?.... Then the rest of the classroom is unattended.... What a dilemma!!!!!! Should the teacher go into the stall with them as well? Geesh.....
 
This is a huge reminder to all of us educators and people who work in the schools not to leave students unattended to for even 1 minute.
You obviously have never walked around McKinley HS on a normal day. Kids are walking the halls unsupervised all day same as at Massillon. You can’t watch them every minute. What you can do is discipline the idiots when they do stupid crap, and stop blaming everybody else and not the offender.
 
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This is an interesting take. It’s a “woke” position to defend hazing and cover up issues to protect athletic programs? Seems to me quite the opposite, and I generally think light hazing is natural, fine, and in fact unavoidabl
Oh, and don't forget, that you should never give that kid an unsupervised kid a ride home or you'll get in trouble for that. Cursed regardless of what you do.
I used to take kids home in the back of my open bed truck. Told them to lay down so cops wouldn't see them.
 
You obviously have never walked around McKinley HS on a normal day. Kids are walking the halls unsupervised all day same as at Massillon. You can’t watch them every minute. What you can do is discipline the idiots when they do stupid crap, and stop blaming everybody else and not the offender.
What we in education know is that even if kids are caught acting up or doing something wrong blame goes back to who Was supposed to be supervising the kids, especially kids in your classroom. Kids are walking halls at various time in schools. Some things are out of your control. At a time like this someone is going to have to be the scapegoat. Parents could possibly sue the school system. The coach is going to be given the blame.
 
What we in education know is that even if kids are caught acting up or doing something wrong blame goes back to who Was supposed to be supervising the kids, especially kids in your classroom. Kids are walking halls at various time in schools. Some things are out of your control. At a time like this someone is going to have to be the scapegoat. Parents could possibly sue the school system. The coach is going to be given the blame.
It’s not fair, but it’s true.
 
You obviously have never walked around McKinley HS on a normal day. Kids are walking the halls unsupervised all day same as at Massillon. You can’t watch them every minute. What you can do is discipline the idiots when they do stupid crap, and stop blaming everybody else and not the offender.
trust me, headed into year 38 as a high school teacher, this shyt goes on EVERYWHERE. These are the kids that learn early on the rules don't apply to them, admin pretty much enables this to go on, no consequences, etc. etc.
 
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