The Official 2021 Cincinnati Reds Thread

wolves82

Well-known member
He’s a terrible player and the Reds are stuck with him, why can’t you acknowledge that? You love stats, why is he a -2.5 WAR?
I've answered that question for you twice before. Can't you remember? Scroll back and find it.

Or are you saying that 24 HR, 67 RBI, 58 Runs don't matter and makes him "terrible"? If so, we have a lot of guys worse than terrible. How do we ever win?
 

zeeman

Well-known member
I've answered that question for you twice before. Can't you remember? Scroll back and find it.

Or are you saying that 24 HR, 67 RBI, 58 Runs don't matter and makes him "terrible"? If so, we have a lot of guys worse than terrible. How do we ever win?
You cherry pick those stats and simply won’t look at any others. Of the 998 players that have played any games in MLB this year he is ranked 997 in WAR. The homers and ribeyes are all you talk about but those are just as misleading as BA
 

14Red

Well-known member
I've answered that question for you twice before. Can't you remember? Scroll back and find it.

Or are you saying that 24 HR, 67 RBI, 58 Runs don't matter and makes him "terrible"? If so, we have a lot of guys worse than terrible. How do we ever win?
There are alot of players and teams that would love a "terrible" player like Geno then. Look, he's not had a great year from an average standpoint. But remember, this is the new baseball. Strikeouts are not looked down upon as they once were.
 

zeeman

Well-known member
There are alot of players and teams that would love a "terrible" player like Geno then. Look, he's not had a great year from an average standpoint. But remember, this is the new baseball. Strikeouts are not looked down upon as they once were.
If that’s the case why not trade him?
 

wolves82

Well-known member
You cherry pick those stats and simply won’t look at any others. Of the 998 players that have played any games in MLB this year he is ranked 997 in WAR. The homers and ribeyes are all you talk about but those are just as misleading as BA
WAR is a very flawed stat. I know you don't believe me, so just know this: https://www.espn.com/mlb/war/leaders/_/year/2021/type/seasonal/alltime/false/count/1

Robbie Ray is #1 in WAR. Wade Miley is #6. :ROFLMAO:
Tatis is #8, V. Guererro is #11, Ohtani is #27, Bryce Harper is #30, Freeman is #62. Votto is #152.

No smart baseball people hang their hat on WAR.
 

GCPRO

Well-known member
The smart ones hang their hat on hard hit balls.
Help me to understand which of these stats are helpful: .195 BABIP
.204 ISO
.305 K%
.636 OPS
.378 SLG
.258 OBP
Those last three are the lowest on the team for anyone playing any more than 10 or more games. Lower than Moustakas. I was also told RBI is an overrated stat. After seeing what Moustakas can/can't do I believe Geno should be in the lineup on most days except against Scherzer type dude. Just trying to educate myself. My sons follow the game much closer than I do and one of them is all about WAR so your comment suprised me. Another is a college baseball coach and when I watch his team play I cannot believe the silly crap they try. But I'm an old man and trying to learn so help me.
 

wolves82

Well-known member
My last word on the matter.

Suarez is not awesome, he is having a terrible year by his standards, and by many statistical measures. However, he is producing more runs per plate appearance than many on the team. He needs to be in the lineup among the top 8, unless Moose can get his act together. Can I say it any plainer?

I just want the Reds to win. You all can keep crying about Suarez if it helps get you through the day.
 

Indiandad

Well-known member
The smart ones hang their hat on hard hit balls.
Help me to understand which of these stats are helpful: .195 BABIP
.204 ISO
.305 K%
.636 OPS
.378 SLG
.258 OBP
Those last three are the lowest on the team for anyone playing any more than 10 or more games. Lower than Moustakas. I was also told RBI is an overrated stat. After seeing what Moustakas can/can't do I believe Geno should be in the lineup on most days except against Scherzer type dude. Just trying to educate myself. My sons follow the game much closer than I do and one of them is all about WAR so your comment suprised me. Another is a college baseball coach and when I watch his team play I cannot believe the silly crap they try. But I'm an old man and trying to learn so help me.
Do you believe that luck plays a part in baseball?
 

14Red

Well-known member
If that’s the case why not trade him?
My best guess is his contract scares teams. Let's face it, there are only about 8-10 teams that can even consider adding bigger contracts. Most smaller market teams are going by the way of the Rays and A's. Draft, develop keep cheap talent OR add middle range guys who aren't stars but are servicable major leaguers. I look at a team like the A's for instance, Jed Lowery, Elvis Andrews, Tony Kemp, Starling Marte, Josh Harrison, Yon Gomes...major leaguers who are solid but not all star type players, good team friendly contracts. They sprinkle in their own young guys who are on their rookie deals and they stay competitive.

I just don't think you're going to get alot of trade talks with Geno. Also working against him is his HR numbers are inflated in playing at GABP. In my mind, that's a reason to keep him. Even in a perceived awful year like this year, he's in the top 25 in the NL in home runs and the top 30 in RBI. And pretty much the last month his playing time has been cut down significantly.
 

zeeman

Well-known member
My best guess is his contract scares teams. Let's face it, there are only about 8-10 teams that can even consider adding bigger contracts. Most smaller market teams are going by the way of the Rays and A's. Draft, develop keep cheap talent OR add middle range guys who aren't stars but are servicable major leaguers. I look at a team like the A's for instance, Jed Lowery, Elvis Andrews, Tony Kemp, Starling Marte, Josh Harrison, Yon Gomes...major leaguers who are solid but not all star type players, good team friendly contracts. They sprinkle in their own young guys who are on their rookie deals and they stay competitive.

I just don't think you're going to get alot of trade talks with Geno. Also working against him is his HR numbers are inflated in playing at GABP. In my mind, that's a reason to keep him. Even in a perceived awful year like this year, he's in the top 25 in the NL in home runs and the top 30 in RBI. And pretty much the last month his playing time has been cut down significantly.
Don’t know where you get your stats but he is 39th in homers and 61st if ribeyes that you and wolves think are so important. He ranks terribly in all the other stats so it’s not a “perceived” bad year
 

GCPRO

Well-known member
They aren’t trading Saurez. There is no replacement for him on the club
He also struggled in the 60 game 2020 season.
 

14Red

Well-known member
Don’t know where you get your stats but he is 39th in homers and 61st if ribeyes that you and wolves think are so important. He ranks terribly in all the other stats so it’s not a “perceived” bad year
And even so, if it's perceived as a bad year, the other questions are...
- do you have anyone better
- are you paying that person so much that you can't get away from them.

To me, you seem to be one to just bench or get rid of players with no understanding of the financial commitment you have for the player. Now we can debate all day "why" he was signed to the contract he has, but it's done. You can't change it. So when you commit that much money to a guy, you are kind of locked into playing him, regardless of performance levels. And ESPECIALLY when you don't have other options. This is why it works for the Rays because their philosophy is they draft and develop good enough that the do no sign players to expensive contracts. They feel their young guys will perform as well or better than big contract guys.
 

zeeman

Well-known member
And even so, if it's perceived as a bad year, the other questions are...
- do you have anyone better
- are you paying that person so much that you can't get away from them.

To me, you seem to be one to just bench or get rid of players with no understanding of the financial commitment you have for the player. Now we can debate all day "why" he was signed to the contract he has, but it's done. You can't change it. So when you commit that much money to a guy, you are kind of locked into playing him, regardless of performance levels. And ESPECIALLY when you don't have other options. This is why it works for the Rays because their philosophy is they draft and develop good enough that the do no sign players to expensive contracts. They feel their young guys will perform as well or better than big contract guys.
And I’ve said multiple time the Reds are a billion dollar franchise. If the Reds are serious about winning you cannot keep a player who has been historically bad because of money. What if he continues this into next year, the year after? Should they keep pitchers that keep losing games and have 6 plus ERAs?
 

wolves82

Well-known member
Don’t know where you get your stats but he is 39th in homers and 61st if ribeyes that you and wolves think are so important. He ranks terribly in all the other stats so it’s not a “perceived” bad year
LOL. If you are going to make an argument make one that isn't hurting your side of the argument.

There are 30 MLB teams? So 39th in HR means that each team has 1.3 guys better than Suarez. 61st in RBI means every team has 2 guys better than Suarez.

Were you captain of the debate team?!?!? :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
 

zeeman

Well-known member
LOL. If you are going to make an argument make one that isn't hurting your side of the argument.

There are 30 MLB teams? So 39th in HR means that each team has 1.3 guys better than Suarez. 61st in RBI means every team has 2 guys better than Suarez.

Were you captain of the debate team?!?!? :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
Simply correcting Red14 false ranking, I know you think he’s Babe Root, chicks dig the long ball
 

wolves82

Well-known member
Simply correcting Red14 false ranking, I know you think he’s Babe Root, chicks dig the long ball
To be fair, 14Red clearly said he was giving the NL rankings. You used the entire MLB. But we realize details are not your thing. Carry on.
 

14Red

Well-known member
And I’ve said multiple time the Reds are a billion dollar franchise. If the Reds are serious about winning you cannot keep a player who has been historically bad because of money. What if he continues this into next year, the year after? Should they keep pitchers that keep losing games and have 6 plus ERAs?
Always love it when fans spend other people's money. And just so you know, because they are a billion dollar franchise, it doesn't mean money is no object. They have budgets and a thousand other things they pay for that none of us understand. Also, the shareholders are smart business men who invest in smart things. They are not going to throw money away. Again, this isn't fantasy football.
 

GCPRO

Well-known member
Here we go-FUNDAMENTALS-Always keep the Double play in tact. Throwing to 3rd on the single to center, you better get an out. Once again, 2nd and 3rd with one out, you have to put the ball in play-our 4 hitter. In the end, doesn't matter.
Moustakas-good lord.
 

JUSTGOPLAY

Well-known member
My last word on the matter.

Suarez is not awesome, he is having a terrible year by his standards, and by many statistical measures. However, he is producing more runs per plate appearance than many on the team. He needs to be in the lineup among the top 8, unless Moose can get his act together. Can I say it any plainer?

I just want the Reds to win. You all can keep crying about Suarez if it helps get you through the day.
Moustakus has allowed himself to get so far out of shape that he looks like a clumsy pregnant woman stumbling around out there at third base. He ain't hitting near enough to compensate for him being such a liability on defense. Suarez may be frustrating with all his strikeouts, but Moose ain't the answer.
 

wolves82

Well-known member
4-8 the last twelve games; 4 straight series lost. 5 of those 8 losses the Reds scored 1 run. There have been a few blips in the pitching but this is mostly a problem with the offense. Gotta get going again right now. I read that Winker has taken some swings and been throwing a little. Need him back badly...
 
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