St. Ignatius priest has been placed administrative leave

EHS 2001 said:
It's a matter of fact according to that article. I'm dumbfounded. The bishops of the Catholic church are their own worst enemy.
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Yes, dumbfounded is the best word for it. Using my corporation theme, this one needs a top-to-bottom flush, a PR overhaul, sensitivity training and a renewed commitment to zero tolerance.

I just wrote a message that tried hard to see this from both sides. However, it's awfully tough not to become cynical, or angry, when these things are just repeated ad nauseam, be it the Church or Scouts.

There are good public school systems in Cincinnati. My sister just joined Crossroads after being raised Catholic for 30+ years. I can try to empathize with those Catholics who trudge forward but I cannot logically understand it.
 
EHS 2001 said:
Binzer is a member of the USCCB committee on child protection.

www.catholicnewsagency.com

Cincinnati auxiliary Bishop Jospeh Binzer accused of withholding information about inappropriate contact with minors

An auxiliary bishop in the Archdiocese of Cincinnati, and member of the USCCB committee on child protection, is facing accusations that he failed to report to Cincinnati’s archbishop a series of allegations that a priest had engaged in inappropriate behavior with teenage boys.
www.catholicnewsagency.com www.catholicnewsagency.com
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Did you catch this quote in the article you linked:

"Binzer received a letter in October 2018 from a St. Ignatius parishioner describing an encounter between Drew and a boy at Elder High School, where Drew had been a music teacher from 1988-1991."

Drew actually worked from Elder from '83 to '90, but was this alleged interaction during that tenure or recently?
 
Based on the statement released today by the Archdiocese, it appears that incident occurred during Drew's time as a teacher at Elder in the 80s.

In October 2018, Bishop Binzer received a letter from a St. Ignatius parishioner describing her son-in-law’s very negative reaction to Fr. Drew dating back to his experiences with then-Mr. Geoff Drew at Elder High School. The son-in-law stated that Fr. Drew inappropriately touched his leg and made him feel very uncomfortable. This letter was promptly forwarded to the Butler County Prosecutor to inform their investigation which was in progress.
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www.thecatholictelegraph.com

Archdiocese responds to Fr. Drew being placed on a leave of absence

Today the Archdiocese of Cincinnati held a press conference to address Father Geoff Drew being placed on leave. The following relates the series of events that led to this course of action: • In 2013 and again in 2015, the central office of the archdiocese received concerns from St. Maximilian ...
www.thecatholictelegraph.com www.thecatholictelegraph.com
 
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EHS 2001 said:
Binzer is a member of the USCCB committee on child protection.

www.catholicnewsagency.com

Cincinnati auxiliary Bishop Jospeh Binzer accused of withholding information about inappropriate contact with minors

An auxiliary bishop in the Archdiocese of Cincinnati, and member of the USCCB committee on child protection, is facing accusations that he failed to report to Cincinnati’s archbishop a series of allegations that a priest had engaged in inappropriate behavior with teenage boys.
www.catholicnewsagency.com www.catholicnewsagency.com
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What an absolute joke. The Archdiocese is truly a sick and corrupt organization. Every one of them should be forced to resign.
 
What a cluster. The policy in place is good, on paper. If it is not complied with, to the letter, it is not worth the paper it is written on. Bishop Binzer, as much as I like him personally, must be relieved of his position and sent to a ministry where he will have no administrative function (hospital chaplain as I said before). I like that all allegations were immediately reviewed by prosecutors, however, finding no criminal violations is not enough. Children must be protected from emotional and spiritual damage. The mia cupa is not enough. The article indicates that there will be personnel changes. That must include Bishop Binzer's demotion and reassignment.

I do believe that the current discernment process at the seminary would have guaranteed that Geoff Drew would have never become a priest.

If you ever want to see what started all this crap, read the book "Goodbye Good Men". The corruption of the seminaries in the 60's has plagued us ever since.
 
Purplemojo said:
I like that all allegations were immediately reviewed by prosecutors, however, finding no criminal violations is not enough.
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This was the most damning bit that popped up. It shows a gross lack of historical perspective on this issue and applies a letter, not spirit, of the law enforcement on issues pertaining to potential child assault. Unforgivable...

As a show of good faith, they should terminate Binzer, not make him a broom boy in a lesser position. Never will happen. He's gone as head of priest personnel, that's it.

For those in the flock, shouldn't your expectation of the Catholic Church's reaction to such events be more, not less, robust than secular corporations?

Will the attendance at St. Ignatius be 40% less this Sunday? 100% less? Will someone stand up and demand the pulpit, speak from the heart and voice the opinion of the parishioners? (Or, are the parishioners in denial?) If such an act of resistance took place would there be light applause or nervous looks for rocking the boat? Well, when the boat is this leaky and mis-captained, there ain't no amount of rockin' that can make things worse...
 
Commish said:
This was the most damning bit that popped up. It shows a gross lack of historical perspective on this issue and applies a letter, not spirit, of the law enforcement on issues pertaining to potential child assault. Unforgivable...

As a show of good faith, they should terminate Binzer, not make him a broom boy in a lesser position. Never will happen. He's gone as head of priest personnel, that's it.

For those in the flock, shouldn't your expectation of the Catholic Church's reaction to such events be more, not less, robust than secular corporations?

Will the attendance at St. Ignatius be 40% less this Sunday? 100% less? Will someone stand up and demand the pulpit, speak from the heart and voice the opinion of the parishioners? (Or, are the parishioners in denial?) If such an act of resistance took place would there be light applause or nervous looks for rocking the boat? Well, when the boat is this leaky and mis-captained, there ain't no amount of rockin' that can make things worse...
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Good points. Attendance at St. Ignatius remains to be seen. I wonder what happened to attendance at St. Max after Fr. Drew moved?
The problem faced by church going Catholics is this: there is no other place to receive the Sacraments. The Liturgy of the Mass, Sacrament of Reconciliation, Confirmation, Marriage all involve an ordained priest standing the place of Jesus administering the Sacrament. There is no where else to go for a believing Catholic.

Personally, me and my family still attend Mass every week. I do not ever TRY to think, is my priest a child molester, during the Consecration. Heck, we had Fr. Binzer celebrate our mass a couple of weeks ago. He has even Confirmed two of my children. Even given recent events I do not consider that Mass invalid or my children unconfirmed. However, my contributions to the Church have remained the same since all this started. I definitely think about where my money is going when I contribute. We have now chosen to donate more to Organizations like St. Vincent de Paul.

I can definitely understand someone who leaves the Church and organized religion all together over child abuse, or any reason really. I have a harder time understanding someone leaving the Catholic Church and trying some other organized religion. But that, of course, is because I believe the Catholic Church's teachings to be correct. I do not believe all of it's members are infallible.

As for my expectations about how to handle the current situation? I think Mojo has it right. Laicization for Fr Drew, removal from authority for Bishop Binzer. Also, make sure that direct line to the Archbishop occurs when allegations are made, report all allegations to the prosecutors office and have a third party investigate all allegations. When an allegation comes in, place the accused on some sort of leave during the investigation. I am unsure about when to make allegations public. As soon as they come in? After they have been verified? Even if they have been proven false? I don't think my current place of employment makes allegations of fraud or impropriety public right away. They try to handle it and investigate it internally. However, they also more that likely do not involve minor children.
 
Commish said:
As a show of good faith, they should terminate Binzer, not make him a broom boy in a lesser position. Never will happen. He's gone as head of priest personnel, that's it.
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I agree. This is absolutely what should happen. Termination, period. What will most certainly happen? Moved into another position, maybe slightly "lesser" yet still with likely a lot of power and say so.
 
Don Flamenco said:
I agree. This is absolutely what should happen. Termination, period. What will most certainly happen? Moved into another position, maybe slightly "lesser" yet still with likely a lot of power and say so.
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"Termination" in the secular sense, doesn't happen within the Roman Catholic Church, or within any faith community other than independent or congregationalist churches. You cannot just fire a Catholic priest, just as you cannot fire a Lutheran, Episcopal or Methodist pries or minister. It is considered a serious enough matter (after all they are supposed to be vicars of Christ) that there are tribunals and internal laws to address that. I do not know much about cannon law but the Bishop's dereliction is enough to withdraw his title and authority as a bishop, but not to laicization him.

Also, a bishop is a powerful position. Being a simple chaplain is not. As a chaplain, he would have no administrative authority, no employees, no physical property of which he would be responsible and no permanent congregation. He would merely perform the sacraments for individuals who find themselves in the hospital for a short period of time. Mass, communion, last rights, that would pretty much be that.

So, you can take what I have said and rage that it should not be that way and that the Bishop should be run out of town on a rail, but that is not the process and I believe it should not be.

As far as Drew is concerned (I never call these perps "Father") his malfeasance is direct, contrary to the rules and laws of the Church and contrary to the therapy, treatment and guidance he has received. God will forgive if he is truly contrite, and we should as well, but in no way shape or form should he retain his ministry nor should he be given another chance. It should be one and out for proven violations of the rules.
 
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Bottom line - the Church has their own rules. They always have. More and more people are realizing they can be a good Catholic without having to bow down to the authority of the Church, and that's a good thing.
 
Purplemojo said:
So, you can take what I have said and rage that it should not be that way and that the Bishop should be run out of town on a rail, but that is not the process and I believe it should not be.
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Disagree, Purplemojo. Your belief is your wont but wouldn't you agree the process has...not been very successful? This week's revelations don't convince me of a system that works but one that has suffered no real penalty for past crimes and is still on cruise control. Why not change it then?

I think it's safe to say that the Church self-regulating itself has been a failure. While it's realistic to view these punishments in the real world terms in which they will be doled out, that's still an artificial constraint, not natural law. This institution is, after all, man-made. Bad/Ineffective laws can be changed. If some dude in the backseat of a drive-by shooting who didn't pull the trigger can get life, then I think a bishop can lose his job for covering up a sexual predator.
 
Commish said:
Disagree, Purplemojo. Your belief is your wont but wouldn't you agree the process has...not been very successful? This week's revelations don't convince me of a system that works but one that has suffered no real penalty for past crimes and is still on cruise control. Why not change it then?

I think it's safe to say that the Church self-regulating itself has been a failure. While it's realistic to view these punishments in the real world terms in which they will be doled out, that's still an artificial constraint, not natural law. This institution is, after all, man-made. Bad/Ineffective laws can be changed. If some dude in the backseat of a drive-by shooting who didn't pull the trigger can get life, then I think a bishop can lose his job for covering up a sexual predator.
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Lose his "job" or lose his ministerial authority. Yes, he can have his title withdrawn and removed from his current "job" but the once a priest always a priest concept is pretty integral to Catholic law and tradition. Yes, the cannon law can be modified, however, due process, whether it is in secular life or institutional tribunals, should still be maintained. Bishop Binzer screwed up royally. Thank God no child was raped, or physically molested, but due to his dilatory actions they could have been. So, he did not personally benefit from any of this, he was not directly involved in any violation of a child, he did not keep information from the civil authorities and the matters were investigated for criminal offenses. He was wrong, very much so, and cannot be in a position of authority of administrative responsibility any longer. Does that mean he should not be able to say Mass, anoint the dead and dying, perform a marriage? I don't think so, but others may differ. Certainly no one would be harmed by him performing those ministries so I guess prohibiting him would just be punitive in nature. Is that really what you want?
 
I’m trying to figure out how unwanted shoulder massages and direct comments about a teenage boys body/body parts are not criminal? It’s legal for a Priest or Teacher to “massage” a child is disgustingly sad.
 
Purplemojo said:
Lose his "job" or lose his ministerial authority. Yes, he can have his title withdrawn and removed from his current "job" but the once a priest always a priest concept is pretty integral to Catholic law and tradition. Yes, the cannon law can be modified, however, due process, whether it is in secular life or institutional tribunals, should still be maintained. Bishop Binzer screwed up royally. Thank God no child was raped, or physically molested, but due to his dilatory actions they could have been. So, he did not personally benefit from any of this, he was not directly involved in any violation of a child, he did not keep information from the civil authorities and the matters were investigated for criminal offenses. He was wrong, very much so, and cannot be in a position of authority of administrative responsibility any longer. Does that mean he should not be able to say Mass, anoint the dead and dying, perform a marriage? I don't think so, but others may differ. Certainly no one would be harmed by him performing those ministries so I guess prohibiting him would just be punitive in nature. Is that really what you want?
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"Dilatory actions" nice try, he covered up a predator pig. You make it sound like a sloppy mistake. It was purposeful, and thought out. Do you believe he has never done anything like this before? Of course he has, that's why he's in that position. You say he had nothing to gain? How the heck do you know that, Lord knows what dirt Drew had on Bizner. If Bizner was an honest, do the right thing, let's get this right kind of guy, who has had to suffer threw all the pain of being a priest because of these pigs, what makes you think after all these years and everything the church has dealt with over the past 20 yrs he would now, for the first time ever, cover up a pig? Is this what I want, yes I would like to see him gone, and if he ever showed up to anoint me or my family he'd be shown the door.
 
Commish said:
Disagree, Purplemojo. Your belief is your wont but wouldn't you agree the process has...not been very successful? This week's revelations don't convince me of a system that works but one that has suffered no real penalty for past crimes and is still on cruise control. Why not change it then?

I think it's safe to say that the Church self-regulating itself has been a failure. While it's realistic to view these punishments in the real world terms in which they will be doled out, that's still an artificial constraint, not natural law. This institution is, after all, man-made. Bad/Ineffective laws can be changed. If some dude in the backseat of a drive-by shooting who didn't pull the trigger can get life, then I think a bishop can lose his job for covering up a sexual predator.
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I think everyone agrees that the process failed. For argument's sake, let's say Bishop Binzer hears the first, 2015, complaint, passes on the information, and Fr Drew is removed from St. Max and the priesthood. Would you consider that a procedural success? Unfortunately, the process itself can not prevent the original case of abuse only subsequent.
 
?????? said:
"Dilatory actions" nice try, he covered up a predator pig. You make it sound like a sloppy mistake. It was purposeful, and thought out. Do you believe he has never done anything like this before? Of course he has, that's why he's in that position. You say he had nothing to gain? How the heck do you know that, Lord knows what dirt Drew had on Bizner. If Bizner was an honest, do the right thing, let's get this right kind of guy, who has had to suffer threw all the pain of being a priest because of these pigs, what makes you think after all these years and everything the church has dealt with over the past 20 yrs he would now, for the first time ever, cover up a pig? Is this what I want, yes I would like to see him gone, and if he ever showed up to anoint me or my family he'd be shown the door.
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Yes, I know, you do want to be punitive.
 
This discussion seems to be purely semantics at this point. Neither "side" is going to convince the other.

There are vested interests involved in those who are choosing to remain active Catholics and also think that justice was served during this latest round. These vested interests don't negate their respective arguments but they sure temper them. What are the vested interests? Kids still going to school at St. Ignatius or other parish, whole life wrapped up in the dogma/hierarchy of the Church, fear of the existential impact of admitting the Church's full wrong doing.

These folks are gonna seem insane to those who want stricter ramifications. I don't see much consensus. For those who remain, the onus is on you to demand the kind of Church you think you deserve.
 
Commish said:
These folks are gonna seem insane to those who want stricter ramifications. I don't see much consensus. For those who remain, the onus is on you to demand the kind of Church you think you deserve.
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Well said. I do not fault anyone who reconsiders their religious affiliation after all of this. I appreciate the respect you seem willing to accord those who stay. It is a challenge, but not the first the Church has faced in 2,000 years.
 
Listening to press conference with Deters. Drew is arrested and in custody. Heads to need to roll.

Deters just said "its a sad, sickening case, that someone with that authority would prey on little children"
 
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Joe Deters office is issuing a 9-count indictment against Drew for allegedly raping an elementary student while working at St. Jude in the late 90's. Concerned there are more victims from Drew's time at St. Jude, Deters is urging anyone else who was affected to come forward.
 
Deters said he was told by the assistant prosecutors who handled this case that the number of charges in the indictment could have been much worse but once you get a certain point where the perpetrator is facing life in prison there's no sense in adding additional charges.

The victim was around 10-12 years old when the alleged rapes occurred around 1988-1991. He's now 41.
 
I am very happy they were able to find chargable crimes against this guy. He should spend the rest of his life in prison. FYI: I talked to Bishop Binzer last week. I just happened to see him on the street as I have several times before. He is always very approachable and did approach him as I have in the past. I brought up the "bad couple of weeks". He said as bad as his have been they cannot compare to the pain he has caused others. I ended by saying I would pray for him and all who have been injured. As much as I like the man, it is clear that he did not follow the rules the Diocese has set for itself and he has to go. I hope that is part of the HR moves that the Archbishop alluded to in his previous statement. I also hope that Bishop Binzer makes a public statement. The Archbishop's statement is not enough when the Bishop's personal failing is an issue.

I am glad this issue came to light. I am glad the authorities were contact on two occasions and I am glad that this creep will face justice. I pray that no one at the Archdiocese ever deviates from the protocol in the future.
 
At this point, there is ZERO reason for anyone that has been involved in a leadership position in the Church over the last 10-20 years to still have control over of anything related to these parishes. How anyone can trust any Catholic leader at this point is beyond me.

Give the power back to the people. It's way overdue.
 
Binzer should be Fired immediately! He was aware of inappropriate things being done by this Priest at St. Max and then let the guy transfer to the largest grade school in Cincinnati. Basically sounds like a creep covering for then enabling another creep to keep preying on young boys. 2 total scumbags! Sure hope Drew gets Life and an a** whippin at the JC before heading to prison!
 
EHS 2001 said:
www.fox19.com

Hamilton Co. priest indicted on 9 counts of rape

Deters said Father Geoff Drew is charged with raping a male elementary school student while he was employed at St. Jude School.
www.fox19.com www.fox19.com
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I hope the Church has gotten better at identifying possible predatory seminarians. According to the article, Drew was ordained in 2004. That occurred after the Boston criminal charges were filed in 2002. The Church was in the middle of the sexual scandal and still ordaining priests like Drew.
 
Noeyboey said:
I hope the Church has gotten better at identifying possible predatory seminarians. According to the article, Drew was ordained in 2004. That occurred after the Boston criminal charges were filed in 2002. The Church was in the middle of the sexual scandal and still ordaining priests like Drew.
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Not ordained till 2004 but was an Archdiocese Employee for a good amount of time before that. Been around children an awful lot between here and Dayton since the mid 80s. I’m with Deters, almost has to be more victims. Sure hope they have the courage and strength needed to come forward to authorities!
 
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