It’s Time for a Shot Clock

AllSports12 said:
Because the NBA and the NCAA need butts in the seats, eyes watching the telecasts, and advertisers to keep them viable. HS needs none of that.

The only thing worse than adding a shot clock at the HS level is adding the clock at the levels below hgh school. (see 3pt arc for grade school play)
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So you agree it’s better brand of basketball and more entertaining from a fan standpoint?
 
?????? said:
So you agree it’s better brand of basketball and more entertaining from a fan standpoint?
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I think both of those are up for debate. While some may feel that the up and down pace and limited possession time is more entertaining and better basketball. Others like the defensive struggles and quirks that come up only in HS Bball.
 
CedarBuck92 said:
I think both of those are up for debate. While some may feel that the up and down pace and limited possession time is more entertaining and better basketball. Others like the defensive struggles and quirks that come up only in HS Bball.
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Sure, I agree, I’ve been on the fence for years. If it weren’t for the logistics of running the shot clock I would be all for it. My concern was that we would see a bunch of junky shots and the end off shot clocks, along with constant resets on the clock
 
AllSports12 said:
Because the NBA and the NCAA need butts in the seats, eyes watching the telecasts, and advertisers to keep them viable. HS needs none of that.
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Sure but what 15-18 year olds do need is to learn the game and its fundamentals. Right now we're in an era where you're seeing coaches dictate on a vast basis each possession, and this leads to kids being taught more how to run offense and less good fundamentals & decision making. That's why I'm a big proponent of the shot clock, basketball is an offensive game where you should always be attempting to score, not where you should run offense for 1 minute. I would wager maybe 70% of teams currently are pretty much running the "Wisconsin" offense
 
smurfyeah19 said:
Sure but what 15-18 year olds do need is to learn the game and its fundamentals. Right now we're in an era where you're seeing coaches dictate on a vast basis each possession, and this leads to kids being taught more how to run offense and less good fundamentals & decision making. That's why I'm a big proponent of the shot clock, basketball is an offensive game where you should always be attempting to score, not where you should run offense for 1 minute. I would wager maybe 70% of teams currently are pretty much running the "Wisconsin" offense
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The average possession is less than 30 seconds.
 
smurfyeah19 said:
Sure but what 15-18 year olds do need is to learn the game and its fundamentals. Right now we're in an era where you're seeing coaches dictate on a vast basis each possession, and this leads to kids being taught more how to run offense and less good fundamentals & decision making. That's why I'm a big proponent of the shot clock, basketball is an offensive game where you should always be attempting to score, not where you should run offense for 1 minute. I would wager maybe 70% of teams currently are pretty much running the "Wisconsin" offense
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The Wisconsin offense is nothing without 3 point shooters. Lack of shooters allows the defense to drop and clog the passing lanes on the cuts.

3 point shooting in HS is abysmal.
 
?????? said:
Like to see that survey, wouldn’t be schocked if they simply divided gametime by possessions, with a pencil and an eraser because they think calculators are too fast and uptempo.
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🤣….you need to take out transition shots and buckets and determine the average time of a half court possession. However if we insist it is less than 30…what harm would a 35 second clock do…there would be some bad shots but probably no more than I see now…and for the record I am wildly entertained by pro, college and high school basketball….it is a wonderful game! When my son graduates I am sure I will get sucked back in to coaching lol
 
smurfyeah19 said:
Sure but what 15-18 year olds do need is to learn the game and its fundamentals. Right now we're in an era where you're seeing coaches dictate on a vast basis each possession, and this leads to kids being taught more how to run offense and less good fundamentals & decision making. That's why I'm a big proponent of the shot clock, basketball is an offensive game where you should always be attempting to score, not where you should run offense for 1 minute. I would wager maybe 70% of teams currently are pretty much running the "Wisconsin" offense
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Real problem is that a lot coaches aren't very good in any scenario. The really good ones adapt to players, rules etc and get the best out of their teams. Not saying they always win big but if the process is in place then results follow, especially when they develop players from a young age and have a program.
 
smurfyeah19 said:
Sure but what 15-18 year olds do need is to learn the game and its fundamentals. Right now we're in an era where you're seeing coaches dictate on a vast basis each possession, and this leads to kids being taught more how to run offense and less good fundamentals & decision making.
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If I had to pinpoint the main reason, this would be it. I blame the coaches.

The ability to create a shot is completely gone for the vast majority of players. It's why it's terrible to watch. If the play or set doesn't work, you can forget about scoring.
 
Doublehelix said:
If I had to pinpoint the main reason, this would be it. I blame the coaches.

The ability to create a shot is completely gone for the vast majority of players. It's why it's terrible to watch. If the play or set doesn't work, you can forget about scoring.
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I agree! Back in the old days we worked for hours on jump shots…baseline..curling off a screen..v cut…nothing long (no 3 point line) but my coach said if you couldn’t make a 15 footer you better get 10+ Rebounds or you wouldn’t see the floor
 
CDRam84 said:
I agree! Back in the old days we worked for hours on jump shots…baseline..curling off a screen..v cut…nothing long (no 3 point line) but my coach said if you couldn’t make a 15 footer you better get 10+ Rebounds or you wouldn’t see the floor
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And to make matters worse, the coach will yank a kid trying to improvise a scoring opportunity that may exist that's outside of their offense.

Don't blame the kids for this one. They have more skills than they are allowed to show. It's not a "they don't work hard enough to get better" scenario.
 
CDRam84 said:
🤣….you need to take out transition shots and buckets and determine the average time of a half court possession. However if we insist it is less than 30…what harm would a 35 second clock do…there would be some bad shots but probably no more than I see now…and for the record I am wildly entertained by pro, college and high school basketball….it is a wonderful game! When my son graduates I am sure I will get sucked back in to coaching lol
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Definitely my favorite sport also!
 
I am also not so sure a shot clock favors the more talented team. I feel like its much easier for the more talented team to hold the ball until they get the perfect look. Kinda like the NC “4 corners” team with 3 lottery players on it. Or some of the moeller teams chalk full of D1/D2 talent on the roster. Either way, I liked to see it come to high school but admit there is the some risk of buyers regret.
 
AllSports12 said:
You want a 14 year old to entertain you?
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There is a ton of entertainment in high school sports.

I am in the camp that thinks a shot clock is needed, but I'm still entertained. But the product is certainly not helping itself. The people that won't admit that just want to argue, I think. It's pretty obvious.
 
cincinnatieng82 said:
Most Kids that I know and have coached are trying to go to play in college regardless of level placing a shot clock will allow them to develop to a style that will be closely played at the next level whether its JUCO NAIA D1, D2 D3 does not matter. Shot clock provides them a chance to adjust their style to fit what coaches are looking for at the next level. Placing a percentage on "players who make it to the next level" does not detour them from trying to achieve a goal. Shot clock is a reason why Ohio guys aren't being recruited less not the biggest reason but it is definitely in the reasoning from college coaches that I have personally had conversations with.
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The primary purpose of high school basketball is to win. Not get kids ready for college. A team striving to win develops all the qualities that you should be trying to teach. Teamwork, discipline, integrity to the group, etc. It’s nice if they develop and get to play at the next level. But again, it’s about the team winning. Sounds like the dumb shat that Calipari says about Kentucky basketball, which is why they underachieve every year. Don’t be ridiculous. No college coach has ever said that to you or anyone else.
 
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Doublehelix said:
There is a ton of entertainment in high school sports.

I am in the camp that thinks a shot clock is needed, but I'm still entertained. But the product is certainly not helping itself. The people that won't admit that just want to argue, I think. It's pretty obvious.
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Aids the team with the most talent. Takes tempo out of the game. Leads to less upsets for the less talented.
 
smurfyeah19 said:
Sure but what 15-18 year olds do need is to learn the game and its fundamentals. Right now we're in an era where you're seeing coaches dictate on a vast basis each possession, and this leads to kids being taught more how to run offense and less good fundamentals & decision making. That's why I'm a big proponent of the shot clock, basketball is an offensive game where you should always be attempting to score, not where you should run offense for 1 minute. I would wager maybe 70% of teams currently are pretty much running the "Wisconsin" offense
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Wins are mostly determinedly on the defensive end of the floor. Running offense teaches a lot of fundamentals. Racing it down the floor and jacking it up teaches few.
 
Looseball said:
Aids the team with the most talent. Takes tempo out of the game. Leads to less upsets for the less talented.
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Takes tempo out of the game? It enhances tempo imo.

And what does a shot clock have to do with racing up and down and jacking up shots? As others have said, the average possession is like 30 seconds. If that's the case, aren't they doing that now anyway?
 
Doublehelix said:
There is a ton of entertainment in high school sports.

I am in the camp that thinks a shot clock is needed, but I'm still entertained. But the product is certainly not helping itself. The people that won't admit that just want to argue, I think. It's pretty obvious.
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I wondered how long it would take til you created your 6th user name.

The guys over on the Elder forum know you are back?
 
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