2021 Football Updates - DV: Versailles vs Kirtland Updates and Game Discussion

You know I had a very similar discussion with a friend of mine just the other day, only I was questioning why Clinton Massie continues to handicap themselves by running such a one dimensional offense. His response was that Massie was able to make such a memorial comeback for the win, that and a couple other State championship trophies in their case. True but why make it so difficult. My counter was the Marion Local game, Newark's game plan was to shut down Marion's run game, and it worked for the first half of the game.. Instead of falling into a battle of wills, Marion adjusted, and made them bleed. Rather than needing the late game rally that Massie required, Marion had a comfortable lead when they were able to establish a running game later in the game.

I know you guys are thinking that Marion and MAC teams in general always run balanced offences. True, (by necessity in their league), but this years Marion team was a run first team, considering our senior QB was a wide receiver last year.

Kirtland's success is undeniable. I know the Kirtland folks can point out the 2015 Marion / Kirtland championship game as an example of their style of game wearing a team out and allowing them to come back for the win, and it is. I offer the years prior 2014 Kirtland / Minster State championship game as an example of a won game lost in the end by Kirtland's lack of options with their offense after Minster scored too soon after recovering the late onside kick.

Just saying if something works for you great, ride that horse, but in the long run I think it wise to have some viable options in your back pocket for that occasion when it doesn't.
 
Congratulations to Kirtland on their win streak and to Versailles on ending it, and a BIG THANK YOU from a DSJ fan
 
big medicine said:
Just saying if something works for you great, ride that horse, but in the long run I think it wise to have some viable options in your back pocket for that occasion when it doesn't.
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I’m far from an Xs and Os expert, but isn’t it reasonable to assume that more emphasis on the passing game could take away from the effectiveness of Kirtland’s dominant running game? The old “jack of all trades but master of none” philosophy?
 
serpico said:
Yeah, no. Kirtland was and is great.
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It really did seem like Kirtland had a great chance to come back and win. After they scored the touchdown in the 4th quarter, it really felt like they had the momentum to make the comeback and win. It seemed like Kirtland would get the ball back and drive right down the field again. It was somewhat surprising they tried a half back option twice in a row on consecutive drives. After the first interception on the halfback option in the fourth quarter their defense got the ball back very quickly and then another interception was thrown on the halfback option just about two minutes later. It would be interesting to speculate on what would have occurred if they had just ran their same offense that they ran on the first TD of the 4th quarter.
 
Mackinbiner said:
They won 55 games in a row.
They made it to the State Championship game 10 of the last 11 seasons.
They won 6 of the last 11 State Championships.

But that's not enough? Tough crowd here.

I would take it.
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Sure they did, in Division 5. That stuff would not work in D2 or D1
 
VTJGball said:
Nfl just won a game with 3 passes for the game.
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Big Time football doesn’t want this type or style of offense. They flag it ounce a possession and it’s compromised. D1 Football is about going to College and fitting into a modern system.

Big Time football is more about entertainment than football. It’s why I absolutely love D3 and below in ohio.
You still see a contrast of styles and approaches to the game not discouraged by those worried about tv ratings, politics and and reaching a more diverse Menagerie of low IQ casual football fans and viewers looking for big plays and constant excitement.
 
Spartacus1987 said:
Sure they did, in Division 5. That stuff would not work in D2 or D1
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In the D - 2 final this year the 2 teams combined for 98 yds. passing. I agree the QB play in Ohio is not very good however this is one of the reasons why MAC schools succeed so well in the Ohio playoffs. Most MAC schools are run 1st teams however can still throw the football and also defend the pass. Versailles did throw the football with some success and ML after Newark Catholic sold out to stop the run threw for 250 yds.
 
Stirred not Shaken said:
In the D - 2 final this year the 2 teams combined for 98 yds. passing. I agree the QB play in Ohio is not very good however this is one of the reasons why MAC schools succeed so well in the Ohio playoffs. Most MAC schools are run 1st teams however can still throw the football and also defend the pass. Versailles did throw the football with some success and ML after Newark Catholic sold out to stop the run threw for 250 yds.
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MAC schools can throw as long as they are ahead of the chains and have the threat of play-action, similar to Kirtland. They cannot throw from a traditional dropback standpoint. Really leaves your offense with a small margin for error if you get behind the chains or get into a higher scoring game
 
Stirred not Shaken said:
In the D - 2 final this year the 2 teams combined for 98 yds. passing. I agree the QB play in Ohio is not very good however this is one of the reasons why MAC schools succeed so well in the Ohio playoffs. Most MAC schools are run 1st teams however can still throw the football and also defend the pass. Versailles did throw the football with some success and ML after Newark Catholic sold out to stop the run threw for 250 yds.
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Yes, the QB play is definitely bad and the talent IS NOT there in Ohio to run a more wide-open spread type of offense outside of a few teams. This is why Ohio loses a lot more games now against teams from other states. We used to be able to compete with the best in Florida in Georgia and now here we are losing to teams from Indiana and Michigan....
 
Spartacus1987 said:
Please show me the last Super Bowl won with that game plan
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Please show me the last high school team to play in a Super Bowl.

Bottom line is this. If you play basically the same game that 500 other schools play, the more talented teams will win. If you do something nearly no one else does, you can outperform your talent level. There's a D1 school right around the corner from where I'm sitting that has two really nice trophies that say "State Champion" that prove my point.
 
Spartacus1987 said:
MAC schools can throw as long as they are ahead of the chains and have the threat of play-action, similar to Kirtland. They cannot throw from a traditional dropback standpoint. Really leaves your offense with a small margin for error if you get behind the chains or get into a higher scoring game
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Have you watched enough MAC games/tape to even make this assumption? There's a difference between run first and not being able to pass from the pocket traditionally. Looking at Marion's recent QB's before Otte, who made plays with his legs on rollout passes and running the ball more often than prior QBs, theres a long line of guys and offenses who passed from under center or the gun and stepped up into the pocket after a traditional 3-5 step drop. Bertke, Rethman, Griesdorn, Leugers, Bruns, Muhlenkamp who were the most recent previous QBs before Otte all have plenty of tape being able to throw the ball in a traditional non play action setting. I'd even say before this year Marion wouldn't run much play action at all, it was either run or pass, there wasn't a lot of fake handoffs. Coldwater has also always excelled from having a pocket passer in recent years. The only threat they really had to bust a big run out of their QB on EVERY play was Brody Hoying about 7 years ago.
 
Spartacus1987 said:
Sure they did, in Division 5. That stuff would not work in D2 or D1
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Wait you're telling me a school with 50ish boys per grade couldn't beat the top football schools that have 250-300 per grade? Wow bold proclamation. Didn't Kirtland just beat D1 Solon by 20 last year?
 
Just found this interesting...

Guam's Father Duenas Memorial also had a 55 game winning streak going into this past weekend. They beat Southern, 21-0 to extend their win streak to 56 games.

Guam is a US territory. And yes, they do play HS football there. So, longest streak in the nation is in Guam at 56 now. They play the Guam High Panthers on 12/11 at 7pm local for the territory's championship.

www.postguam.com

Panthers pull off dramatic win over George Washington

The Guam High School Panthers football team is one win away from winning it all.
www.postguam.com www.postguam.com
 
queencitybuckeye said:
Please show me the last high school team to play in a Super Bowl.

Bottom line is this. If you play basically the same game that 500 other schools play, the more talented teams will win. If you do something nearly no one else does, you can outperform your talent level. There's a D1 school right around the corner from where I'm sitting that has two really nice trophies that say "State Champion" that prove my point.
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I was responding to the person who first brought the NFL into this, be upset with him.
 
Spartacus1987 said:
MAC schools can throw as long as they are ahead of the chains and have the threat of play-action, similar to Kirtland. They cannot throw from a traditional dropback standpoint. Really leaves your offense with a small margin for error if you get behind the chains or get into a higher scoring game
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2014 Minster vs Kirtland:

Passing: 26-41 for 418 yards and 4 TDs
 
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