Rumor about 6-7 divisions in basketball

Yappi

Yappi

Go Buckeyes
Just saw a rumor that I thought it was an interesting subject.

Would you be in favor of expanding HS basketball to 6-7 divisions for boys basketball? At 7, it would match HS football in the state.
 
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I heard this a couple months ago. I look for it to happen.

Good money making cash grab for the OHSAA, and also helps filter some of the problems IMO that a lot of folks have with certain smaller schools stacking rosters every year.
 
I'm not a fan of the idea. In my mind, divisions are meant to give smaller schools that can't compete with larger schools a chance to win. That doesn't happen in Ohio anymore. Now, if the four state champions would play a Final Four, it's anyone's guess who would be the champion. That should never be the case. The Division 4 champ should not be able to compete with the Division 1 champ in any sport.
 
I am in regular communication with the girls coach from my school and he told me a few months ago that this was very much in the works. The only mystery is how far we will take this.
 
I really hope not. Just let teams move up. Let a few small towns win the d4 and d3 championships and no one will complain any more. That’s a simple fix. Don’t water it down even more.
 
Football has 7 divisions with 700 schools. Basketball has 800 schools and I've heard they favor the idea of 6 divisions with the largest having a smaller number like in football.
 
Let do 5 and a team can choose to move up. Richmond heights would elect to go D1, SVSM, LUE, and all the other teams people belly ache about. Could you imagine 6-7 championship games. The state would only be championship games and no semi finals. There has to be better solutions.
 
There are 99 more boys basketball teams and 70 more girls basketball teams than there are football teams in Ohio, yet we have 3 more divisions in football than basketball. That, I'm sure, is the driving force behind this (and I'm also sure the OHSAA has an eye on all that $$$, too).

FOOTBALL:
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BOYS BASKETBALL:
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GIRLS BASKETBALL:
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When I first read the thread title, my gut reaction was, "Yuck! No thank you." But honestly, looking at the numbers, it really does make sense to make some kind of change. Is it 5 divisions? 6? Does it really make sense to go to 7 to match football?

Football has always been a numbers game more than other sports, IMO, so I feel there would be more parity in basketball than football when it comes to a ratio of competitiveness per student. Therefore I don't think 7 is the answer. But I think 5 or 6 would be fine, and I could live with that.

The logistics of scheduling the semifinals vs championship games is another topic, sure, but the primary objective is to figure out whether or not 5-7 divisions is the right thing for the sport in Ohio. It might be.
 
hammer89 said:
It’s happening. Not just basketball either, all team sports are about to see an explosion in divisions.
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If the primary reason for expanding is to bring the teams-per-division closer to what football has, then yes, that makes sense.

Football has 701 schools across 7 divisions (70 in Division I, 105 in Divisions II-VII).

VOLLEYBALL:
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BASEBALL:
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SOFTBALL:
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Then keep 2-3-4 the same and just bump them down. Break up D1. I’m curious how many people would want that if that is how they would break them up.
 
thePITman said:
If the primary reason for expanding is to bring the teams-per-division closer to what football has, then yes, that makes sense.

Football has 701 schools across 7 divisions (70 in Division I, 105 in Divisions II-VII).

VOLLEYBALL:
View attachment 49111

BASEBALL:
View attachment 49112

SOFTBALL:
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The goal is to decrease the overall enrollment disparity within divisions. It’ll break down like this- d1, 64 schools. D2, 64 schools. D3-7, an even split of the remaining schools.
 
419Jester said:
Let do 5 and a team can choose to move up. Richmond heights would elect to go D1, SVSM, LUE, and all the other teams people belly ache about. Could you imagine 6-7 championship games. The state would only be championship games and no semi finals. There has to be better solutions.
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What makes you think they or any school would willing move up divisions?
 
hammer89 said:
The goal is to decrease the overall enrollment disparity within divisions. It’ll break down like this- d1, 64 schools. D2, 64 schools. D3-7, an even split of the remaining schools.
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For D1 and D2, each, that’s six games to win a state title. 64 > 32 > 16 > 8 > 4 > 2

So, would this mean the district stage of the tournament for the future D1 and D2 become obsolete? And it becomes four regions of sixteen?
 
The Dock said:
For D1 and D2, each, that’s six games to win a state title. 64 > 32 > 16 > 8 > 4 > 2

So, would this mean the district stage of the tournament for the future D1 and D2 become obsolete? And it becomes four regions of sixteen?
Click to expand...
The second round is the district championship.....
 
419Jester said:
Let do 5 and a team can choose to move up. Richmond heights would elect to go D1, SVSM, LUE, and all the other teams people belly ache about. Could you imagine 6-7 championship games. The state would only be championship games and no semi finals. There has to be better solutions.
Click to expand...

What makes you think Richmond Heights would elect to go up? What's the motivation for them? To face better competition? They already do that in the regular season. Staying in D4 is a guaranteed way to win a State Title. There's a reason these AAU type coaches cling to smaller schools, they know their shot at a state title is exponentially higher in D4-D3 compared to D1.


In terms of the topic at hand... I know people won't like it, but it makes sense. Nearly 100 more schools have Basketball than Football in Ohio, yet Football has 7 divisions and Basketball has 4? As soon as Football expanded to the 7th division this was inevitable.

The gap in the D1 schools is truly too much of a gap. There's a good case to be made that the D1 schools need split. I'd imagine they'll add another one and we'll see 6 divisions as soon as next season.

Is it also a money grab for more tournament revenue for the OHSAA? Definitely. Smaller towns typically provide a very good gate, thus more $ for OHSAA. Higher odds of a small town traveling in great numbers to a state championship game, a game they likely wouldn't have played in if certain schools weren't moved up etc.

But I also think they have enough reasoning and arguments to push this through.
 
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bbjunky81 said:
What makes you think Richmond Heights would elect to go up? What's the motivation for them? To face better competition? They already do that in the regular season. Staying in D4 is a guaranteed way to win a State Title. There's a reason these AAU type coaches cling to smaller schools, they know their shot at a state title is exponentially higher in D4-D3 compared to D1.


In terms of the topic at hand... I know people won't like it, but it makes sense. Nearly 100 more schools have Basketball than Football in Ohio, yet Football has 7 divisions and Basketball has 4? As soon as Football expanded to the 7th division this was inevitable.

The gap in the D1 schools is truly too much of a gap. There's a good case to be made that the D1 schools need split. I'd imagine they'll add another one and we'll see 6 divisions as soon as next season.

Is it also a money grab for more tournament games / tournament revenue for the OHSAA? Definitely. Smaller towns typically provide a very good gate, thus more $ for OHSAA. But I also think they have enough reasoning and arguments to push this through.
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I just think they move up. We can agree to disagree on that point 🤷‍♂️
 
bbjunky81 said:
What makes you think Richmond Heights would elect to go up? What's the motivation for them? To face better competition? They already do that in the regular season. Staying in D4 is a guaranteed way to win a State Title. There's a reason these AAU type coaches cling to smaller schools, they know their shot at a state title is exponentially higher in D4-D3 compared to D1.


In terms of the topic at hand... I know people won't like it, but it makes sense. Nearly 100 more schools have Basketball than Football in Ohio, yet Football has 7 divisions and Basketball has 4? As soon as Football expanded to the 7th division this was inevitable.

The gap in the D1 schools is truly too much of a gap. There's a good case to be made that the D1 schools need split. I'd imagine they'll add another one and we'll see 6 divisions as soon as next season.

Is it also a money grab for more tournament games / tournament revenue for the OHSAA? Definitely. Smaller towns typically provide a very good gate, thus more $ for OHSAA. But I also think they have enough reasoning and arguments to push this through.
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It wouldn’t be more tournament games. It’s the same number of tournament games. It will probably lose money, unless state title attendance greatly increases, as now they have to rent the biggest venues for more games.
 
hammer89 said:
It wouldn’t be more tournament games. It’s the same number of tournament games. It will probably lose money, unless state title attendance greatly increases, as now they have to rent the biggest venues for more games.
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Maybe a little bit more money but not enough to justify splitting I think.
 
The Dock said:
For D1 and D2, each, that’s six games to win a state title. 64 > 32 > 16 > 8 > 4 > 2

So, would this mean the district stage of the tournament for the future D1 and D2 become obsolete? And it becomes four regions of sixteen?
Click to expand...
SWOHHoops said:
The second round is the district championship.....
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What had sprung to mind is some athletic districts, like the NW, may only have 1 or 3 teams in a new D1. Whitmer is the only school that will have the raw numbers to consistently be in the top 64 of enrollment on the boys basketball side. Findlay and Perrysburg are both the 59th and 60th largest, currently.

So what is done for that odd man out if there’s three? Pair Findlay to a Columbus opponent? Perrysburg to Elyria as a constant matchup? If there’s one, where does Whitmer go?
 
hammer89 said:
It wouldn’t be more tournament games. It’s the same number of tournament games. It will probably lose money, unless state title attendance greatly increases, as now they have to rent the biggest venues for more games.
Click to expand...

I guess I need to clarify that better, I didn't word it like I thought.

Now we have greater odds of smaller towns making a Final 4 and State Championship game. Those towns would travel greatly to Dayton whether it be one game or just the championship ---- thus more money in OHSAA pockets compared to these small teams likely losing in the Regionals to teams that may move up a division or so with the new changes.
 
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