Elder Enrollment Strategy

[1965 Panther]

One thing that is interesting is Seton's leadership structure has a President that focus on the growth of the school and Principal (like a COO) that focuses on the day to day operations of the school. Similar schools are setup like that - would Elder benefit from that as this would be a challenge to focus on both?

This is great for Seton!

but are you inferring that Elder is not doing something right by your last two posts. I believe enrollment is up over 10% in the last 4 years.

 

[1965 Panther]

This is great for Seton!

but are you inferring that Elder is not doing something right by your last two posts. I believe enrollment is up over 10% in the last 4 years.

And I love Seton. Wife is a grad and currently have 3 granddaughters there.

 

[ElderMackStud]

This is great for Seton!

but are you inferring that Elder is not doing something right by your last two posts. I believe enrollment is up over 10% in the last 4 years.

Is that growth because the number of available 8th graders has grown or are they doing things to get more of a percentage of 8th graders to attend Elder &/or expanding their reach to non-traditional areas - i.e. eastside, public schools etc - one thing to keep in mind with that percentage is last years graduating class was abnormally low (I believe Victory only had around 9-10 boys that went to Elder and only about 13-14 in the total class)

I think Elder should adopt a similar structure to St X, Seton, Moeller, Roger Bacon etc that will free up time for someone to work 100% on Elder and not having to deal with the day to day challenges that takes chunks of your time. A couple key areas would be fund raising, marketing and overall long-term strategic thinking. Elder would benefit greatly from an outsider running the school like, Fr Schaeper, brining a different perspective rather than an Otten type that would be happy with the status quo. Let Kurt run the day to day as he understands the culture.

 

[EHS 2001]

I think Elder should adopt a similar structure to St X, Seton, Moeller, Roger Bacon etc that will free up time for someone to work 100% on Elder and not having to deal with the day to day challenges that takes chunks of your time. A couple key areas would be fund raising, marketing and overall long-term strategic thinking. Elder would benefit greatly from an outsider running the school like, Fr Schaeper, brining a different perspective rather than an Otten type that would be happy with the status quo. Let Kurt run the day to day as he understands the culture.

La Salle's current principal and board of limited jurisdiction announced last school year that the Archdiocese is transitioning their school to a principal/president administration model. So it'll almost certainly happen at Elder...eventually. I don't know if it can/will happen without archdiocesan approval.

Edit: Here is information about the change on La Salle's website: https://www.lasallehs.net/about/board-of-limited-jurisdiction/president-principal-model/ The change was announced in September 2022. (According to their FAQ, they originally planned to announce the president of the school by January 2023--so maybe we'll get some news about the matter tonight or tomorrow?)

 

[Omar]

Before the merger, Seton was already kicking Mercy's rearend and in the process of taking students from McAuley in St James & St I's Parish's.

It wasn't that Seton just "got" the students to come over to the school from the Westside without doing anything. Yes they got a few but they have competition from Ursula, MND, Ursuline, Roger Bacon etc. There were around 6 girls from Visi last year that went to MND.

Seton is doing something right as they are getting eastside girls going there too. They are also getting a handful from Taylor each year

You’re telling me if LS went under, Elder wouldn’t be getting an extra 20+ students a yr? BS. I’m not saying Seton isn’t doing a great job, but Mercy going under was a huge boost. And it’s even better with Mercy-McAuley struggling.

Elder is competing in a more difficult marketplace for students. Ignoring that reality when comparing them to Seton, invalidates that comparison.

 

[cincifbfan]

I honestly find it incredible that there are still so many catholic schools afloat. Good for them.

As far as Seton getting more students, which is good for the bottom line, how does the education actually compare to before? Every time you talk to someone about why Seton is great now, you get things about social media, winning radio contests, performances by famous people at the school, and how the lunches are incredible. So it sounds like people are paying big bucks for their daughters to be in the popular school.

Not sure Elder should follow Seton's path.

 

[Omar]

I honestly find it incredible that there are still so many catholic schools afloat. Good for them.

As far as Seton getting more students, which is good for the bottom line, how does the education actually compare to before? Every time you talk to someone about why Seton is great now, you get things about social media, winning radio contests, performances by famous people at the school, and how the lunches are incredible. So it sounds like people are paying big bucks for their daughters to be in the popular school.

Not sure Elder should follow Seton's path.

I’m sure it’s fine. Elder should take as many students as possible up to 1000. If they’re ever fortunate enough to get to that point, then they can reassess things.

 

[cincifbfan]

I’m sure it’s fine. Elder should take as many students as possible up to 1000. If they’re ever fortunate enough to get to that point, then they can reassess things.

So, it doesn't matter what the school is offering academically, as long as it stays open with as many students enrolled?

That's just dumb.

 

[Omar]

So, it doesn't matter what the school is offering academically, as long as it stays open with as many students enrolled?

That's just dumb.

As always, it depends on the marginal contribution in tuition $ from each additional student vs the number of teachers on staff. However, not long ago, Elder had closer to 1,000 students and operated just fine.

 

[ElderHSfan02]

I honestly find it incredible that there are still so many catholic schools afloat. Good for them.

Why? There are parents out there that want their kids to learn/study Religion. That is something public schools cannot offer. I don't have any stats to back this up, but some would argue the education some Catholic schools provide is superior to some public schools. This one is more opinion also, but one could argue they don't want their kids in a school with the wrong crowd. I have heard some parents say there is no way they would send their kid to Oak Hills, because of some of the kids in that school causing trouble. Again, they may have no evidence or proof to back that up, but that is the thought process for some people. For Elder/Seton, there are some that an all boys or all girls school is appealing to them, because they want their kids to focus on school and not have boys or girls be a distraction. There's also the brotherhood/sisterhood aspect that is perceived to some. There is also the sports programs that are highly successful year in and year out that draws students.

You make it sound like there is no value to paying for a private, Catholic school education with nothing to back up your statement.

 

[cincifbfan]

As always, it depends on the marginal contribution in tuition $ from each additional student vs the number of teachers on staff. However, not long ago, Elder had closer to 1,000 students and operated just fine.

I don't think your following what I'm saying.

I'm saying increased enrollment is positive, we all agree on that. What I'm saying is Seton has done so by trying to be the "cool school" and not really offering anything of actual value. They are marketing on fun and it's working. I just don't understand why parents would want that for their child and don't think that's a path Elder should follow is what I'm saying.

 

[cincifbfan]

Why? There are parents out there that want their kids to learn/study Religion. That is something public schools cannot offer. I don't have any stats to back this up, but some would argue the education some Catholic schools provide is superior to some public schools. This one is more opinion also, but one could argue they don't want their kids in a school with the wrong crowd. I have heard some parents say there is no way they would send their kid to Oak Hills, because of some of the kids in that school causing trouble. Again, they may have no evidence or proof to back that up, but that is the thought process for some people. For Elder/Seton, there are some that an all boys or all girls school is appealing to them, because they want their kids to focus on school and not have boys or girls be a distraction. There's also the brotherhood/sisterhood aspect that is perceived to some. There is also the sports programs that are highly successful year in and year out that draws students.

You make it sound like there is no value to paying for a private, Catholic school education with nothing to back up your statement.

Wow, sensitive much. I said nothing bad about Catholic schools. It is surprising that they haven't priced themselves out of the market. It's nowhere close to cheap.

Yes, I know there is financial aid and the argument "If you want your child to go to Elder, or whatever school, they will find a way." Well, first off, that's simply just not true, many families could never swing it even with financial aid. Secondly, if there's that much cash available, just lower tuition for everyone.

Again, none of this is a dig, it's economics. The competition is much stiffer than it used to be, the tuition keeps rising, and there's fewer kids to choose from. Something will eventually have to give or else more Catholic schools will close. I get everything that you're saying, I'm just saying the Catholic school model is becoming not economically viable, and many of these schools will be closed in 40 years unless there is a fundamental shift in how they operate.

 

[Omar]

I don't think your following what I'm saying.

I'm saying increased enrollment is positive, we all agree on that. What I'm saying is Seton has done so by trying to be the "cool school" and not really offering anything of actual value. They are marketing on fun and it's working. I just don't understand why parents would want that for their child and don't think that's a path Elder should follow is what I'm saying.

Whatever gets kids in the door. There’s a lot of choices and it’s a brutal competition for students.

 

[ElderHSfan02]

Wow, sensitive much. I said nothing bad about Catholic schools. It is surprising that they haven't priced themselves out of the market. It's nowhere close to cheap.

Yes, I know there is financial aid and the argument "If you want your child to go to Elder, or whatever school, they will find a way." Well, first off, that's simply just not true, many families could never swing it even with financial aid. Secondly, if there's that much cash available, just lower tuition for everyone.

Again, none of this is a dig, it's economics. The competition is much stiffer than it used to be, the tuition keeps rising, and there's fewer kids to choose from. Something will eventually have to give or else more Catholic schools will close. I get everything that you're saying, I'm just saying the Catholic school model is becoming not economically viable, and many of these schools will be closed in 40 years unless there is a fundamental shift in how they operate.

The smaller Catholic schools have something to offer also that the bigger schools do not. Mainly, they are smaller and the classroom size is smaller meaning more attention to your kid in school. Smaller is better to some people. The school itself has to remodel to survive as a smaller school, but it is possible. See Roger Bacon for example.

Also to counter your argument about tuition. Families can and do afford it. There are many more families with mom and dad both working full time now than years ago. Family income is higher. There are also smaller families. It's easier to send 2 kids through Catholic school than 4.

All in all, you are almost completely wrong and the fact Catholic schools are still open and thriving should not be a surprise to anyone around here.

 

[IKS]

I don't think your following what I'm saying.

I'm saying increased enrollment is positive, we all agree on that. What I'm saying is Seton has done so by trying to be the "cool school" and not really offering anything of actual value. They are marketing on fun and it's working. I just don't understand why parents would want that for their child and don't think that's a path Elder should follow is what I'm saying.

You couldn't be more incorrect. I was on the Seton board from the time the new administration came in until a year ago. Things were bleak at first for the current leadership, inheriting a system that was producing freshman enrollment below 90 students. They looked at all areas and produced a plan to upgrade academics, facilities, and yes, enthusiasm. The effort for enthusiasm was immediate and extremely visible, and continues through today. The facilities took a couple of years to plan and fund, but is now complete with individual, specific projects continuing as needed. The board and leadership were united in the program to upgrade the academics. It takes longer and is not as visible to most. Many improvements have been made in many areas of the curriculum and is paying huge dividends in higher scores, more admissions to selective college programs and early college credit classes offered.
Please look deeper before making claims. You may have been correct 6 years ago, but the world is different today.

 

[cincifbfan]

You couldn't be more incorrect. I was on the Seton board from the time the new administration came in until a year ago. Things were bleak at first for the current leadership, inheriting a system that was producing freshman enrollment below 90 students. They looked at all areas and produced plan to upgrade academics, facilities, and yes, enthusiasm. The effort for enthusiasm was immediate and extremely visible, and continues through today. The facilities took a couple of years to plan and fund, but is now complete with individual, specific projects continuing as needed. The board and leadership wee united in the program to upgrade the academics. It takes longer and is not as visible to most. Many improvements have been made in many areas of the curriculum and is paying huge dividends in higher scores, more admissions to selective college programs and early college credit classes offered.
Please look deeper before making claims. You may have been correct 6 years ago, but the world is different today.

Ok, so what new academics are offered now since you have the inside scoop?

 

[cincifbfan]

The smaller Catholic schools have something to offer also that the bigger schools do not. Mainly, they are smaller and the classroom size is smaller meaning more attention to your kid in school. Smaller is better to some people. The school itself has to remodel to survive as a smaller school, but it is possible. See Roger Bacon for example.

Also to counter your argument about tuition. Families can and do afford it. There are many more families with mom and dad both working full time now than years ago. Family income is higher. There are also smaller families. It's easier to send 2 kids through Catholic school than 4.

All in all, you are almost completely wrong and the fact Catholic schools are still open and thriving should not be a surprise to anyone around here.

Ok, yes smaller is better for some..... great.... there's Bacon, Purcell, McNick, etc. if you want small. What's your point there?

Second about tuition. Yes, SOME families afford it. You point to more families with both mom and dad working, again accurate......BUT for the past 10 years, over 50% of kids come from single parent households. So, you are really limiting yourself with who you are attracting. Family income is definitely not higher. In 1980, the median family income was $21,020, which adjusted for inflation would be the equivalent to $80,188 in December of 2022 dollars. The median household income for 2022 was $70,784. So in over 40 years, family buying power has decreased about 10k, or about 12% lower. These are directly from the US Census Bureau and the US Bureau of Labor Statistics. All the while Housing costs, and transportation costs have grown exponentially during that time.

It is not easier to send 2 kids today to Catholic school than 4+ kids from past generations. It simply is not.

 

[IKS]

Ok, so what new academics are offered now since you have the inside scoop?

I don't have time to go back and forth with you like you do with omar and others. Do your own investigation before you go making disparaging remarks. They have twitter, webpage and facebook available for you with little effort. After that, you can reach out to some of the parents of students that have been participating in/accepted to the new honors programs that have been instituted in the last couple of years. Also reach out to Mt. St. Joe regarding their involvement with early credit programs. Also reach out to Tri-Health and discuss the summer programs they have in their hospitals for Seton students. And ask UC why they chose to visit Seton last week to present the first in-person admittance of their admittance day special program to DAAP to a Seton student (including a presentation from a UC VP).

 

[cincifbfan]

I don't have time to go back and forth with you like you do with omar and others. Do your own investigation before you go making disparaging remarks. They have twitter, webpage and facebook available for you with little effort. After that, you can reach out to some of the parents of students that have been participating in/accepted to the new honors programs that have been instituted in the last couple of years. Also reach out to Mt. St. Joe regarding their involvement with early credit programs. Also reach out to Tri-Health and discuss the summer programs they have in their hospitals for Seton students. And ask UC why they chose to visit Seton last week to present the first in-person admittance of their admittance day special program to DAAP to a Seton student (including a presentation from a UC VP).

You don't have time, or don't have anything concrete to back up your assertions. That is the classic retort from many on this thread.... "do your own research, I can't be bothered with giving information that I have" and then when someone else puts claims up it is "Where did you get that, prove it."

Again, I did my research on Seton from their website, news outlets and I have spoken to parents of recent graduates and current students, some even in the honor's program, and none feel that their child got anything special for their investment other than "fun things they can post about on social media." Hence my conclusions.

Great, a kid got into DAAP and got a 2k grant, I'm sure that tuition of over 10k per year really paid off. That same day, UC visited numerous CPS high schools (same special presentations from UC VP and accompanying crew) and gave out full scholarships.

I am an MSJ alum and know about the early credit programs, and all the public schools have those as well with MSJ, UC, XU, and even Miami.

I will try to find some info on the Tri-Health, but you could just tell me about it and the other amazing things instead of being defensive and telling me you were a board member and to go figure it out for myself.

 

[IKS]

I don't have time to go back and forth with you like you do with omar and others. Do your own investigation before you go making disparaging remarks. They have twitter, webpage and facebook available for you with little effort. After that, you can reach out to some of the parents of students that have been participating in/accepted to the new honors programs that have been instituted in the last couple of years. Also reach out to Mt. St. Joe regarding their involvement with early credit programs. Also reach out to Tri-Health and discuss the summer programs they have in their hospitals for Seton students. And ask UC why they chose to visit Seton last week to present the first in-person admittance of their admittance day special program to DAAP to a Seton student (including a presentation from a UC VP).

And I'll sign off with this...
My three children have 9 college degrees between them. Two attended Seton, one Elder. A medical doctor, a nurse practitioner with a doctorate and an engineer with an MBA. Academics were very important to me and other board members. Quality of the education was certainly as important as the enrollment numbers.
These two schools provide great curriculum and preparation for college, if that's what the student wants.
I'm extremely happy my children attended these schools, and their children are following in their footsteps.

 

[IKS]

You don't have time, or don't have anything concrete to back up your assertions. That is the classic retort from many on this thread.... "do your own research, I can't be bothered with giving information that I have" and then when someone else puts claims up it is "Where did you get that, prove it."

Again, I did my research on Seton from their website, news outlets and I have spoken to parents of recent graduates and current students, some even in the honor's program, and none feel that their child got anything special for their investment other than "fun things they can post about on social media." Hence my conclusions.

Great, a kid got into DAAP and got a 2k grant, I'm sure that tuition of over 10k per year really paid off. That same day, UC visited numerous CPS high schools (same special presentations from UC VP and accompanying crew) and gave out full scholarships.

I am an MSJ alum and know about the early credit programs, and all the public schools have those as well with MSJ, UC, XU, and even Miami.

I will try to find some info on the Tri-Health, but you could just tell me about it and the other amazing things instead of being defensive and telling me you were a board member and to go figure it out for myself.

Looking forward to you joining their board to improve things with your great and unparalleled insight and intelligence.

 

[cincifbfan]

And I'll sign off with this...
My three children have 9 college degrees between them. Two attended Seton, one Elder. A medical doctor, a nurse practitioner with a doctorate and an engineer with an MBA. Academics were very important to me and other board members. Quality of the education was certainly as important as the enrollment numbers.
These two schools provide great curriculum and preparation for college, if that's what the student wants.
I'm extremely happy my children attended these schools, and their children are following in their footsteps.

That is all extremely commendable and you should be absolutely glowing with pride, which appears you are.

 

[cincifbfan]

Looking forward to you joining their board to improve things with your great and unparalleled insight and intelligence.

So you will just refuse to provide any details that you have inside knowledge of and instead be sarcastic toward an inquiring minds?

Way to exemplify the Catholic spirit that these institutions are supposed to provide.

 

[ElderMackStud]

You’re telling me if LS went under, Elder wouldn’t be getting an extra 20+ students a yr? BS. I’m not saying Seton isn’t doing a great job, but Mercy going under was a huge boost. And it’s even better with Mercy-McAuley struggling.

Elder is competing in a more difficult marketplace for students. Ignoring that reality when comparing them to Seton, invalidates that comparison.

I never said that the increase in students was not positively affected by the MM merger but the impact isn't as meaningful because Seton was already making positive inroads into strong traditional Mercy & McAuley feeder schools. This is probably one of the major reasons for the merger as the Sisters of Mercy were getting their rearends handed to them.

Another point of reference is when Seton's new regime came in, they were at 80ish incoming freshman before the board acted quickly with that news and eventually got it to 100ish. Since then, Seton's #'s have been skyrocketing. This type of growth/excitement/momentum doesn't come with a closing of a school. The have donations coming in from everywhere, getting students from non-traditional feeder schools.

The "marketplace" is the same for both - in Seton's feeder school system, there are girls going to the Public Schools as well as Roger Bacon, SUA, UA, MND & MM (still). Elder is X, Moe, LS & Public Schools.

 

[IKS]

You don't have time, or don't have anything concrete to back up your assertions. That is the classic retort from many on this thread.... "do your own research, I can't be bothered with giving information that I have" and then when someone else puts claims up it is "Where did you get that, prove it."

Again, I did my research on Seton from their website, news outlets and I have spoken to parents of recent graduates and current students, some even in the honor's program, and none feel that their child got anything special for their investment other than "fun things they can post about on social media." Hence my conclusions.

Great, a kid got into DAAP and got a 2k grant, I'm sure that tuition of over 10k per year really paid off. That same day, UC visited numerous CPS high schools (same special presentations from UC VP and accompanying crew) and gave out full scholarships.

I am an MSJ alum and know about the early credit programs, and all the public schools have those as well with MSJ, UC, XU, and even Miami.

I will try to find some info on the Tri-Health, but you could just tell me about it and the other amazing things instead of being defensive and telling me you were a board member and to go figure it out for myself.

If you have a problem with private school tuition, why do you care to follow this board?

DAAP is a highly selective program...proof a Seton education can result in an acceptance.

Are you a lawyer? You seem to want to split hair just so you can satisfy yourself that you won an argument.

All those dissatisfied parents you spoke to had the chance to remove their students and go to a free option over the 4 years...couldn't you convince them to do that? They also could've transferred over to Ursula or MND, etc....or moved to NKy.

Was your experience at Elder bad, so you're on here to get your piece of flesh?

 

[IKS]

So you will just refuse to provide any details that you have inside knowledge of and instead be sarcastic toward an inquiring minds?

Way to exemplify the Catholic spirit that these institutions are supposed to provide.

All the parents of candidates for acceptance have these details available to them. you are not the only one that can look at a situation and make an informed choice. The parents making these comparisons to other options over the last few years have voted with their pocketbooks. Evidently, the dissatisfied mass of parents just talk to you and no one else.

I realize it's not for everyone. When you make statements in an absolute fashion, it would be good to have all the facts. After all, if you are incorrect you suffer no damage, but the institution you discussed may have. But maybe thats the goal?

 

[cincifbfan]

If you have a problem with private school tuition, why do you care to follow this board?

DAAP is a highly selective program...proof a Seton education can result in an acceptance.

Are you a lawyer? You seem to want to split hair just so you can satisfy yourself that you won an argument.

All those dissatisfied parents you spoke to had the chance to remove their students and go to a free option over the 4 years...couldn't you convince them to do that? They also could've transferred over to Ursula or MND, etc....or moved to NKy.

Was your experience at Elder bad, so you're on here to get your piece of flesh?

So again, more deflection. You don't have time to "go back and forth" yet here you are. I'm just asking for details that you either refuse to provide or most likely CANNOT provide.

I don't have a problem with private school tuition, I don't have a problem with private schools, and think Elder, Seton in particular are extremely valuable to the Price Hill community.

I am aware DAAP is highly selective, what's your point? Again they have students from public schools and other privates, I don't understand how you claim, 1 student made into DAAP, the school's academics are great? That doesn't make sense.

Not a lawyer, former educator.

The dissatisfied parents could have moved their kids, tried to convince them to do so, but they are the type of parents that just want to be liked by their kids and their daughters didn't want to change.

I have no experience with Elder. Again, I think they are good for the community. But again, I feel they and other Catholic schools really need to think long term about how to adapt or else they won't be around in a few decades.

 

[ElderHSfan02]

Ok, yes smaller is better for some..... great.... there's Bacon, Purcell, McNick, etc. if you want small. What's your point there?

Second about tuition. Yes, SOME families afford it. You point to more families with both mom and dad working, again accurate......BUT for the past 10 years, over 50% of kids come from single parent households. So, you are really limiting yourself with who you are attracting. Family income is definitely not higher. In 1980, the median family income was $21,020, which adjusted for inflation would be the equivalent to $80,188 in December of 2022 dollars. The median household income for 2022 was $70,784. So in over 40 years, family buying power has decreased about 10k, or about 12% lower. These are directly from the US Census Bureau and the US Bureau of Labor Statistics. All the while Housing costs, and transportation costs have grown exponentially during that time.

It is not easier to send 2 kids today to Catholic school than 4+ kids from past generations. It simply is not.

We are discussing Cincinnati here. Do your numbers support the Cincinnati area? Has the cost of living gone up or down in Cincinnati? Income risen or fallen? Has population gone up or down? I don't know. Don't even really care honestly. Let's say you are right, and families cannot keep up with the cost of tuition as you are suggesting, yes, as you have already said there is a lot of financial aid available. Elder is also taking vouchers now. Some who don't qualify for voucher or a lot of financial aid can make other sacrifices. 2nd job, used car instead of brand new, cheaper car, less vacations, smaller/cheaper house. You make it sound like Catholic schools are $40,000-$50,000 a year and only the real rich kids can afford it.

About the smaller schools, my point is there is a market for small, Catholic schools. You literally said "I honestly find it incredible that there are still so many catholic schools afloat. Good for them."

I've given more than enough reasons why "so many catholic schools afloat". Have a good cincifbfan.

 

[cincifbfan]

All the parents of candidates for acceptance have these details available to them. you are not the only one that can look at a situation and make an informed choice. The parents making these comparisons to other options over the last few years have voted with their pocketbooks. Evidently, the dissatisfied mass of parents just talk to you and no one else.

I realize it's not for everyone. When you make statements in an absolute fashion, it would be good to have all the facts. After all, if you are incorrect you suffer no damage, but the institution you discussed may have. But maybe thats the goal?

So again, please educate me. I have made no statements in an absolute fashion, just an inquisitive one.

I acknowledge that the 3 parents I have personally talked to are most likely in the minority, or else Seton would be down with their enrollment. But I ask again, what is great there besides all the fun stuff, what about their academics in particular sets Seton apart from the competition?

 

[IKS]

So again, more deflection. You don't have time to "go back and forth" yet here you are. I'm just asking for details that you either refuse to provide or most likely CANNOT provide.

I don't have a problem with private school tuition, I don't have a problem with private schools, and think Elder, Seton in particular are extremely valuable to the Price Hill community.

I am aware DAAP is highly selective, what's your point? Again they have students from public schools and other privates, I don't understand how you claim, 1 student made into DAAP, the school's academics are great? That doesn't make sense.

Not a lawyer, former educator.

The dissatisfied parents could have moved their kids, tried to convince them to do so, but they are the type of parents that just want to be liked by their kids and their daughters didn't want to change.

I have no experience with Elder. Again, I think they are good for the community. But again, I feel they and other Catholic schools really need to think long term about how to adapt or else they won't be around in a few decades.

You started this discussion with vague assertions. No concrete proof, other than your word. I'm sure you're a good person, but why should anyone on here believe your word is better than mine? Because you said it first, it's fact, and my response is deflection?
You question Seton's academics...I gave you one concrete example of the DAAP acceptance that Seton academics can be successful. That's my point.

By the way, thanks for your time as an educator. And I'm as serious as a heart attack here...I could never do it. I don't have the patience nor the skill needed to inspire and convey knowledge effectively.
My only hope after this long give and take with you is, that if asked about Seton, you will offer "does a good job with enthusiasm, you need to do your own homework to see if the academics fit your needs".

Fair enough?