Elder Basketball 2022-2023

JElder said:
Omar going to be upset when X announces their new hire today.
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Steve Rasso ring a bell? I’m willing to bet the biggest apprehension about him was being relatively young. You don’t see many HCs of GCL schools barely in their 30s.
 
ElderMackStud said:
Why? It is a great hire - makes the GCL more competitive and raises the profile of GCL basketball

A rising tide lifts all boats - John F. Kennedy
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That’s dumb. It makes it more difficult for Elder to beat X, that’s why it’s bad. Elder winning should be all that matters to Elder fans. Screw everyone else.

And if we’re being honest, Elder is going to be the doormat of the League after next yr. The Soph & Frosh classes are weak, while X has loads of talent. I’d rather see that talent get under developed or transfer out that destroy Elder.
 
MyNameIsDoug? said:
Yes, but if the boat has Moeller or X painted on the side, Omar wants it to get struck by lightning, catch on fire and get caught in a whirlpool
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Yeah, so what? They’re Elder’s rivals, not sure why that’s hard to understand. They should feel the same way about Elder.
 
Omar said:
Yeah, so what? They’re Elder’s rivals, not sure why that’s hard to understand. They should feel the same way about Elder.
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I mean, sure, maybe the kids actually playing. I, for one, loathed both schools when I was playing back in the day, but now I’m an adult and it doesn’t bother me at all
 
Also, a lot depends on if Joe Paterno/Crybaby Carl, has to face any consequences for his (alleged) cover up of his former AD’s behavior. My guess is no, but we’ll see.
 
ElderMackStud said:
Why? It is a great hire - makes the GCL more competitive and raises the profile of GCL basketball

A rising tide lifts all boats - John F. Kennedy
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Competition breeds success. It's a good thing to have very good coaches in your league. It keeps coaches on their toes and at the top of their game.

However, I don't know why everyone is giving instant credibility to what St X can become. Fleming has been a good coach at SCD, but talk of them overtaking Elder (and others) is pre-mature. He has to prove it. People won't admit it, but the last name gives him credibility above and beyond what he's currently earned. Let's wait a few seasons before we crown him king s**t.

The GCL is a hard league to win in. LaSalle has a good young team and Moeller does as well. LaSalle will contend for the next couple of years with their young nucleus. St X still might be the 3rd or 4th best program even after this hire.
 
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In saying that, I do agree that Elder is going to struggle the next few years. They return some decent pieces next year, but I'd bet you see some of the incoming freshman really getting some opportunities to elevate themselves this year knowing there's a lack of talent in the So and Jr classes. Elder somewhat missed on their 3 year opportunity with the talent that came through. Better years than typical, but those teams with Harp and Keller leading the way could have accomplished big things.

The incoming freshman class should have a very good bball team this coming year. Start developing and elevating those kids as quickly as possible. The grade behind them has some potential but currently isn't very good either, so the incoming class is going to have to carry alot, both in football and basketball.
 
Doublehelix said:
Competition breeds success. It's a good thing to have very good coaches in your league. It keeps coaches on their toes and at the top of their game.

However, I don't know why everyone is giving instant credibility to what St X can become. Fleming has been a good coach at SCD, but talk of them overtaking Elder (and others) is pre-mature. He has to prove it. People won't admit it, but the last name gives him credibility above and beyond what he's currently earned. Let's wait a few seasons before we crown him king s**t.

The GCL is a hard league to win in. LaSalle has a good young team and Moeller does as well. LaSalle will contend for the next couple of years with their young nucleus. St X still might be the 3rd or 4th best program even after this hire.
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You are correct that he has to prove himself in a league environment that is about as competitive as it comes year in and year out along with the fact that he will be dealing with a lot of difficult/challenging parents.

What he does have (& I believe why people are excited about the hire) is a ton of GCL experience (both on & off the court), is extremely likable, and seems to get buy-in from the teams he has coached. The X factor in all this is I would not doubt it his dad will be helping him out on many fronts.

The other hires St X brought in really didn't have the understanding of the GCL and all boys school environment. Look at the other 3 GCL coaches - Goedde and Scheonfeld both alumns and Kremer worked his way up from coaching the freshman.
 
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Omar said:
That’s dumb. It makes it more difficult for Elder to beat X, that’s why it’s bad. Elder winning should be all that matters to Elder fans. Screw everyone else.

And if we’re being honest, Elder is going to be the doormat of the League after next yr. The Soph & Frosh classes are weak, while X has loads of talent. I’d rather see that talent get under developed or transfer out that destroy Elder.
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Why is it dumb? Competition is just that - competition. Anyone that considers themselves a competitor wants to beat the best at their best - who wants to beat a crappy team year in and year out.
 
ElderMackStud said:
Why is it dumb? Competition is just that - competition. Anyone that considers themselves a competitor wants to beat the best at their best - who wants to beat a crappy team year in and year out.
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There’s already good enough competition, plus the Elder Frosh & Soph are extremely weak. Losing 6 GCL games won’t help them.
 
Omar said:
There’s already good enough competition, plus the Elder Frosh & Soph are extremely weak. Losing 6 GCL games won’t help them.
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So hopefully some of the athletes on Frosh & JV will start working their rearend's off and get better. This happens with high school programs - goal is to make sure this doesn't happen over a long period of time.
 
ElderMackStud said:
So hopefully some of the athletes on Frosh & JV will start working their rearend's off and get better. This happens with high school programs - goal is to make sure this doesn't happen over a long period of time.
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Correct.

This will go one of two ways. The players will look themselves in the mirror and decide to get better, or younger players will take their minutes. It's up to them.
 
Doublehelix said:
Competition breeds success. It's a good thing to have very good coaches in your league. It keeps coaches on their toes and at the top of their game.

However, I don't know why everyone is giving instant credibility to what St X can become. Fleming has been a good coach at SCD, but talk of them overtaking Elder (and others) is pre-mature. He has to prove it. People won't admit it, but the last name gives him credibility above and beyond what he's currently earned. Let's wait a few seasons before we crown him king s**t.

The GCL is a hard league to win in. LaSalle has a good young team and Moeller does as well. LaSalle will contend for the next couple of years with their young nucleus. St X still might be the 3rd or 4th best program even after this hire.
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Young and hungry with something to prove. It's a really good hire for X.
 
Doublehelix said:
In saying that, I do agree that Elder is going to struggle the next few years. They return some decent pieces next year, but I'd bet you see some of the incoming freshman really getting some opportunities to elevate themselves this year knowing there's a lack of talent in the So and Jr classes. Elder somewhat missed on their 3 year opportunity with the talent that came through. Better years than typical, but those teams with Harp and Keller leading the way could have accomplished big things.

The incoming freshman class should have a very good bball team this coming year. Start developing and elevating those kids as quickly as possible. The grade behind them has some potential but currently isn't very good either, so the incoming class is going to have to carry alot, both in football and basketball.
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You're writing off the sophomore class already? Pot calling the kettle black wow.
 
ElderMackStud said:
So hopefully some of the athletes on Frosh & JV will start working their rearend's off and get better. This happens with high school programs - goal is to make sure this doesn't happen over a long period of time.
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I’m going to be blunt, it doesn’t matter how hard the majority of them work, they won’t raise their level of play to match X’s talent.
 
Elder had 4 sophomores up on Varsity at times. Grant it, only Cam Willliams played, but that should be enough to tell you not to write them off like Trey2k is doing. Trey is also already crowning the current 8th grade group which is extremely ironic. This guy loves to talk out of both sides of his mouth.

Williams is a good building block for the sophomore group. He scored 17 in a game against X as a sophomore. I see Elder continuing to be competitive. They do lose some talent of course, but to write off the next couple seasons already is foolish.
 
ElderHSfan02 said:
Elder had 4 sophomores up on Varsity at times. Grant it, only Cam Willliams played, but that should be enough to tell you not to write them off like Trey2k is doing. Trey is also already crowning the current 8th grade group which is extremely ironic. This guy loves to talk out of both sides of his mouth.

Williams is a good building block for the sophomore group. He scored 17 in a game against X as a sophomore. I see Elder continuing to be competitive. They do lose some talent of course, but to write off the next couple seasons already is foolish.
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Boeing is the only other Soph on the Varsity roster. I think he’ll end up focusing on Football.
 
ElderHSfan02 said:
You're writing off the sophomore class already? Pot calling the kettle black wow.
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Not at all. I just said it's going to go one of two ways. They're either going to work harder and get better, or some of the younger guys will pass them up. Also, I'm not anointing the group coming in, but they will do well on Frosh and JV - probably an average type of varsity team.

And I'm basing most of this off of HIGH SCHOOL results, not grade school accolades. When Elder teams struggle at the frosh and JV levels, it's not good. Frosh and JV competition is so watered down, if you're close to or below .500, that's a real bad sign for varsity. These two classes at Elder have lost to Oak Hills in football and had terrible basketball seasons. It's pretty easy to see the talent level isn't what you typically see at Elder.

Christ, they were losing to St X like 35-2 or something crazy. That's not normal.
 
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ElderHSfan02 said:
Elder had 4 sophomores up on Varsity at times. Grant it, only Cam Willliams played, but that should be enough to tell you not to write them off like Trey2k is doing. Trey is also already crowning the current 8th grade group which is extremely ironic. This guy loves to talk out of both sides of his mouth.

Williams is a good building block for the sophomore group. He scored 17 in a game against X as a sophomore. I see Elder continuing to be competitive. They do lose some talent of course, but to write off the next couple seasons already is foolish.
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They will be fine next year with Williams, Murphy and Johnson as their core. They likely won't be top 5 in the city, but probably closer to the back half of the top 10. But competitive.

The year after, they will need some creativity to compete with the top teams in the city. It's just reality.

And I didn't crown the incoming class. I said they will have the typical Elder type feeder team. The two classes above them aren't the typical talent level - but yes, they have time to improve.

Every 10 years, you're going to have 1-2 above average classes, 1-2 bad classes, and 6-8 of the normal type of talent. But you can't begin to even make that assessment until you start seeing high school results.
 
Doublehelix said:
Not at all. I just said it's going to go one of two ways. They're either going to work harder and get better, or some of the younger guys will pass them up. Also, I'm not anointing the group coming in, but they will do well on Frosh and JV - probably an average type of varsity team.

And I'm basing most of this off of HIGH SCHOOL results, not grade school accolades. When Elder teams struggle at the frosh and JV levels, it's not good. Frosh and JV competition is so watered down, if you're close to or below .500, that's a real bad sign for varsity. These two classes at Elder have lost to Oak Hills in football and had terrible basketball seasons. It's pretty easy to see the talent level isn't what you typically see at Elder.

Christ, they were losing to St X like 35-2 or something crazy. That's not normal.
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Backpedal ok trey. You were the one that said there is a lack of talent in the frosh and soph classes. Your words.
 
ElderHSfan02 said:
Backpedal ok trey. You were the one that said there is a lack of talent in the frosh and soph classes. Your words.
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Well, look at the results. I'm not making it up. There's certainly evidence for the claim, not just going off of grade school trophies where it's "assumed" they will dominate.

It's not an opinion when the results back it up.

In saying that, I disagree with Omar that they can't get better. They absolutely can with hard work.
 
ElderMackStud said:
How do you know this?
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Because I have eyes. How often do kids who weren’t good Freshmen or JV players develop into good varsity players? It happens on occasion, but very rarely. If you’re relying on a rare occurrence to happen in order to make the team competitive, that’s not a great situation.
 
Another thing I will disagree with Omar with is what he seems to be amazing talent at St X. They have a couple of good younger players (e.g. Waleskowski), but I'm not sure there is the depth of talent there that he says there is. In fact, they're probably 3rd or 4th in terms of talent returning next year.

This isn't going to be easy success for Fleming.
 
Doublehelix said:
Another thing I will disagree with Omar with is what he seems to be amazing talent at St X. They have a couple of good younger players (e.g. Waleskowski), but I'm not sure there is the depth of talent there that he says there is. In fact, they're probably 3rd or 4th in terms of talent returning next year.

This isn't going to be easy success for Fleming.
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Disagree. 3rd or 4th? You think Elder has more returning basketball talent?

X has quality and depth. They will be good for at least the next few years. The new coach will get the credit, but they would have been good regardless of the coach.
 
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