Cincy Flames 7/8u 2023

[green_genes]

We had a local kid who would always get the foul balls. Always at the diamond for the HS games. We were doing a 4 team round robin so that meant 4 games on Saturday on the diamond. We always hated the process of the players going to get the foul balls. There should, and always was, enough younger brothers and sisters at games that gladly would do so. (funny I say this, i noticed over the years the LACK of siblings at these travel tournaments. Kids left at home with a family member, other parent, sibling whatever)/

We thought it would be nice to offer him some $$ before the round robin to do this so the players dont have to chase them down. He took the money up front....got them for one game and then took off!!!!! We gave him crap for years after that. Luckily, with community based teams, there are usually enough kids there that are willing to do it!

I worked a Perfect Game tournament a couple years ago...the "D-Bags Elite" team from the state up north was too good to send their bench players after foul balls, so about 2 innings in the opposing coach told the umpire "if they aren't going to chase foul balls, neither are we." The umpire said fine - we can stand here without a game ball until the time limit is up.

This was back during COVID when the complex limited the number of people who could be in the dugout and made spectators sit down the lines in the outfield. The bench kids were on the bleachers between the dugout and home plate - literally just had to get up and walk over to where the foul balls landed and couldn't be bothered to do so.

At the same tournament, saw a kid show up to pitch a game on Sunday morning...had to introduce himself to the coaches. I guess he and his dad drove down from Saginaw. He pitched four innings and left before the game ended.

This was also where the Little Caesar's 14U team coached by one of Mike Ilitch's sons had a Dominican shortstop who didn't speak English. I guess when you're a billionaire you'll go a little further than holding two weekend tryouts to find players.

 

[Thavoice]

and btw....i think the three other teams in the RR paid $100 to pay for the umpires and didnt charge an entrance fee. We felt that was fair to cover the umpires in the 3 games played between the out of town teams.

AND had local business coupons for discounted food for the teams/fans AND free entrance into the pool that is on site.....
One team did usually stay at a local campground but there was no special code they had to use and there was no kickback to us.....


but then again, it wasnt a money grab like the game has become today!

 

[Thavoice]

I worked a Perfect Game tournament a couple years ago...the "D-Bags Elite" team from the state up north was too good to send their bench players after foul balls, so about 2 innings in the opposing coach told the umpire "if they aren't going to chase foul balls, neither are we." The umpire said fine - we can stand here without a game ball until the time limit is up.

This was back during COVID when the complex limited the number of people who could be in the dugout and made spectators sit down the lines in the outfield. The bench kids were on the bleachers between the dugout and home plate - literally just had to get up and walk over to where the foul balls landed and couldn't beClas bothered to do so.

At the same tournament, saw a kid show up to pitch a game on Sunday morning...had to introduce himself to the coaches. I guess he and his dad drove down from Saginaw. He pitched four innings and left before the game ended.

This was also where the Little Caesar's 14U team coached by one of Mike Ilitch's sons had a Dominican shortstop who didn't speak English. I guess when you're a billionaire you'll go a little further than holding two weekend tryouts to find players.

Classic.
Saw a pitcher only a couple of weeks ago come in, pitch, and when he was taken out he and his dad left the game. Yeah....classic.

I cringe when I see PG is associated with a tournament as you know an extra screw job is coming to the fans.

 

[green_genes]

and btw....i think the three other teams in the RR paid $100 to pay for the umpires and didnt charge an entrance fee. We felt that was fair to cover the umpires in the 3 games played between the out of town teams.

AND had local business coupons for discounted food for the teams/fans AND free entrance into the pool that is on site.....
One team did usually stay at a local campground but there was no special code they had to use and there was no kickback to us.....


but then again, it wasnt a money grab like the game has become today!

To be fair to the hotels, I managed one up in Petoskey many years ago. The weekend of the big invitational soccer tournament was always a nightmare: kids out in the parking lot drilling cars with errant soccer balls, the ice machine being emptied out with people filling coolers, the Holiday Inn next door calling to bitch about our guests using their pool. Fun times. Only the skiers were worse...

 

[Thavoice]

To be fair to the hotels, I managed one up in Petoskey many years ago. The weekend of the big invitational soccer tournament was always a nightmare: kids out in the parking lot drilling cars with errant soccer balls, the ice machine being emptied out with people filling coolers, the Holiday Inn next door calling to bitch about our guests using their pool. Fun times. Only the skiers were worse...

Eh. Soccer kids!!

I didnt realize the price gouge for hotels until I booked a room last second for another family member. Asked the hotel and the manager let me in on the dirty details!

The TDs urge the parents book rooms far in advance, much further out than they release the schedule. Games start wednesday? Well, not knowing when ya play so some book Tues night.
I got smart on the whole thing after the above incident. I dont book until I see the schedule, only get the appropriate nights, never book the Saturday night and always use my own discount codes.

Call me cheap, I dont care. I prefer to call it being smart and not a sheep and feeding the TDs pocketbook

 

[Thavoice]

So, with this 7-8U team, do they get complimentary juice boxes after each game to go with the team membership?

 

[green_genes]

So, with this 7-8U team, do they get complimentary juice boxes after each game to go with the team membership?

I know a guy who's been posting pics and videos of his kid's team competing in the 8U World Series down in Florida and, at the same time, rips youth coaches for letting their kids throw curve balls. No sense of irony, whatsoever, about putting his kid on an 8U "Elite" travel team 75 miles away that plays tournaments all over the country and criticizing other coaches for "prioritizing winning over development."

Seems to me like you could put your kid on a 9U or 10U team and let him play down the street if he's that advanced rather than traveling 1,000 miles away looking for "the best 8U competition."

 

[Thavoice]

I know a guy who's been posting pics and videos of his kid's team competing in the 8U World Series down in Florida and, at the same time, rips youth coaches for letting their kids throw curve balls. No sense of irony, whatsoever, about putting his kid on an 8U "Elite" travel team 75 miles away that plays tournaments all over the country and criticizing other coaches for "prioritizing winning over development."

Seems to me like you could put your kid on a 9U or 10U team and let him play down the street if he's that advanced rather than traveling 1,000 miles away looking for "the best 8U competition."

8 year olds shouldnt be doing much of their own pitching as it is, let alone curveballs.
Hell, our local Little League doesnt even allow curveballs. Our little podunk peewee D3 baseball town has 8 little league teams, and 3 pony league teams. LL it is the same as we did 40 years ago and the pony league it is more than we ever had. Local baseball is still strong in some areas, thankfully, and just allows kids to play the game of baseball. It is just that, a game. Parents are running off too many kids at a young age in search for that 8U championship ring!

 

[green_genes]

8 year olds shouldnt be doing much of their own pitching as it is, let alone curveballs.
Hell, our local Little League doesnt even allow curveballs. Our little podunk peewee D3 baseball town has 8 little league teams, and 3 pony league teams. LL it is the same as we did 40 years ago and the pony league it is more than we ever had. Local baseball is still strong in some areas, thankfully, and just allows kids to play the game of baseball. It is just that, a game. Parents are running off too many kids at a young age in search for that 8U championship ring!

Yep. He's upset about curveballs, but not about his kid throwing 3 or 4 innings as an 8 year old in tournament games. And my larger point is - why do you think some of these kids are being taught to throw curve balls/change ups/etc. at such a young age? Maybe because the parents paid $2,000 for "access to professional coaching, indoor training over the winter, etc." and are spending $500+ every weekend in hotel rooms/restaurants/Top Golf? If you're getting run-ruled every game because the other team's been hitting off the 70 MPH pitching machine all winter the parents are going to be unhappy.

 

[Thavoice]

Yep. He's upset about curveballs, but not about his kid throwing 3 or 4 innings as an 8 year old in tournament games. And my larger point is - why do you think some of these kids are being taught to throw curve balls/change ups/etc. at such a young age? Maybe because the parents paid $2,000 for "access to professional coaching, indoor training over the winter, etc." and are spending $500+ every weekend in hotel rooms/restaurants/Top Golf? If you're getting run-ruled every game because the other team's been hitting off the 70 MPH pitching machine all winter the parents are going to be unhappy.

Locally where i moved to had some fall ball (played in august) where they played 2 4 inning games in the same day. PItchers were only allowed to throw 2 innings a game.
Good.
Buuuuuuuut.....they allowed them to pitch 2 innings in each game that night and most teams threw two pitchers 2 innings in each game. Dumb.
Last weekend was a tournament and if ya made it to the finals ya played three games.
So, know what the coach did? PItched the best kid 2 innings....in all 3 games that day....and caught the other innings.

Kid couldnt pick up a ball for weeks and weeks after that. Even a month later it was tough to throw a football.

Complete garbage.

all to win a stupid youth county wide fall ball tournament.


IM done ripping what has become of youth baseball. I do so because I see, and know, there is a better way than a family paying thousands and thousands of dollars to be a part of a team and playing baseball., thankfully the fleecing is done for this team for the year. I see a lot of HS baseball and you would think all of this would make some uber super teams and I just dont see it any better than it was 30 years ago. Fundamentals and team baseball are much worse off, taht is for sure.

I sure hope the 7-8u team does very well and makes their 'daddy' a lot of money. Feed the machine. Feed. The. Machine.

 

[OHIOVSTW419]

I know a guy who's been posting pics and videos of his kid's team competing in the 8U World Series down in Florida and, at the same time, rips youth coaches for letting their kids throw curve balls. No sense of irony, whatsoever, about putting his kid on an 8U "Elite" travel team 75 miles away that plays tournaments all over the country and criticizing other coaches for "prioritizing winning over development."

Seems to me like you could put your kid on a 9U or 10U team and let him play down the street if he's that advanced rather than traveling 1,000 miles away looking for "the best 8U competition."

Ball is life though, especially for a Hit Dawg...

We probably have the same "kind of" friend. A lot of smoke blown by these guys. And then they wonder why their 15 year old cant brush his teeth in July when hes thrown 80-100 innings since April. But at least they can post their stats on facebook.

 

[Thavoice]

I am waiting to see on Facebook where parents start posting about being 1-3 in pool play and getting beat in a consolation game (that cost them an extra $175 because they had to stay an extra night in the hotel) and how they are 'so proud of their kids'.

 

[green_genes]

Ball is life though, especially for a Hit Dawg...

We probably have the same "kind of" friend. A lot of smoke blown by these guys. And then they wonder why their 15 year old cant brush his teeth in July when hes thrown 80-100 innings since April. But at least they can post their stats on facebook.

Spot on with the Facebook stats. We are probably talking about the same guy.

I am sure his kids are good, but I'm always amused when he mentions how many "earned runs" they allowed.

 

[green_genes]

I am waiting to see on Facebook where parents start posting about being 1-3 in pool play and getting beat in a consolation game (that cost them an extra $175 because they had to stay an extra night in the hotel) and how they are 'so proud of their kids'.

I wonder how much Facebook and Instagram has fueled the growth of the youth sports industry? There is definitely a "brand name" factor that I've noticed - especially around soccer. Parents seem like they'd rather their kids played for the "B" or "C" team for some clubs (paying premium prices and getting coached in games by college kids or dads) rather than finding a club that's more at their kids' level.

 

[GCPRO]

State ACME tournament offered candy to kids returning baseballs...works very well!

Wonder what the requirements will be fke this super duper 8u team....sliding oven mitt thing, arm and ankle guard, 4 bats...

Every single kid on Badin's team last year had the oven mitt and ankle guard, many had the elbow guard as well. Not to mention the Oakleys during a night game. Their team was very good but my goodness.

 

[GCPRO]

Has the coach ever responded to the cost involved? The winter workouts are key.

 

[Thavoice]

Every single kid on Badin's team last year had the oven mitt and ankle guard, many had the elbow guard as well. Not to mention the Oakleys during a night game. Their team was very good but my goodness.

Its all about trying to look cool. If it all about safety.....hitters would wear a full face guard and pitchers a facemask.

But those don't look. "Cool"

 

[irish_buffalo]

State ACME tournament offered candy to kids returning baseballs...works very well!

Wonder what the requirements will be fke this super duper 8u team....sliding oven mitt thing, arm and ankle guard, 4 bats...

The problem with my situation was the bat boy was simply taking our baseballs out of our bucket and handing them in for slushies.

 

[irish_buffalo]

8 year olds shouldnt be doing much of their own pitching as it is, let alone curveballs.
Hell, our local Little League doesnt even allow curveballs. Our little podunk peewee D3 baseball town has 8 little league teams, and 3 pony league teams. LL it is the same as we did 40 years ago and the pony league it is more than we ever had. Local baseball is still strong in some areas, thankfully, and just allows kids to play the game of baseball. It is just that, a game. Parents are running off too many kids at a young age in search for that 8U championship ring!

Yep. He's upset about curveballs, but not about his kid throwing 3 or 4 innings as an 8 year old in tournament games. And my larger point is - why do you think some of these kids are being taught to throw curve balls/change ups/etc. at such a young age? Maybe because the parents paid $2,000 for "access to professional coaching, indoor training over the winter, etc." and are spending $500+ every weekend in hotel rooms/restaurants/Top Golf? If you're getting run-ruled every game because the other team's been hitting off the 70 MPH pitching machine all winter the parents are going to be unhappy.

I had the displeasure of seeing an 8U game once. Just an AWFUL product. Pitchers struggle to get the ball over the plate let alone throw strikes. Batters have trouble even holding a bat up properly let alone swinging the thing. Kids attention spans in the field is non existent which is usually exacerbated due to their pitcher thronging ball after ball after ball. 8U "World Series" is a F%^&ing joke in and of itself.

 

[irish_buffalo]

Locally where i moved to had some fall ball (played in august) where they played 2 4 inning games in the same day. PItchers were only allowed to throw 2 innings a game.
Good.
Buuuuuuuut.....they allowed them to pitch 2 innings in each game that night and most teams threw two pitchers 2 innings in each game. Dumb.
Last weekend was a tournament and if ya made it to the finals ya played three games.
So, know what the coach did? PItched the best kid 2 innings....in all 3 games that day....and caught the other innings.

Kid couldnt pick up a ball for weeks and weeks after that. Even a month later it was tough to throw a football.

Complete garbage.

all to win a stupid youth county wide fall ball tournament.


IM done ripping what has become of youth baseball. I do so because I see, and know, there is a better way than a family paying thousands and thousands of dollars to be a part of a team and playing baseball., thankfully the fleecing is done for this team for the year. I see a lot of HS baseball and you would think all of this would make some uber super teams and I just dont see it any better than it was 30 years ago. Fundamentals and team baseball are much worse off, taht is for sure.

I sure hope the 7-8u team does very well and makes their 'daddy' a lot of money. Feed the machine. Feed. The. Machine.

My days in this realm are done. We have talked at length and are very aligned in our feelings on the demise of what was once a great game at the little league level.

It would be great to see some parents say F this and get together with several other like minded communities and agree to play each other all summer. The sales pitch should be that "travel" has become a money grab joke and we can save you money and time while getting your kid more quality instructions and reps. After all, it is more about reps than anything else. I do not care if it is only 6 teams playing each other all of the time. Get kids reps at multiple positions. Get them a bunch of at bats without traveling all over and paying a whack of cash. You can actually develop a pitcher who has potential but needs that development. Have the HS coaches from the communities buy in and endorse and possibly attend games. Dads are more likely to stay if they know the HS coach is involved and paying attention. Make sure games are set in stone so people can plan accordingly. Have games every Tues and Thurs night from May through July with double headers every other Saturday morning so families (and the kids) do not have to waste every weekend of their summers traveling to these miserable "travel" tournaments never getting a chance to be kids and enjoy swimming and boating and camping, etc. That would be 36 games in good weather. Add a season ending tournament and you would get in at least 40 games (which is PLENTY) in good weather. Most travel leagues start in mid-March these days and play in AWFUL weather. Most leagues are done by July 4. Complexes sit empty the majority of July which offers great baseball weather. This is VERY possible through 12U IMO.

The problem with this is newbie parents simply have a tough time understanding all of the above before it is too late. It takes one idiot dad to blow the whole thing up with his mantra that this is a pattycake league and in order for all of the boys to play MLB they need to get out and play "elite" competition.

 

[mry]

Took my kid to a tryout. They hit 5 pitches, fielded 5 balls from short, two balls at 3rd, and caught 5 fly balls in the outfield. Every kid. Sent ‘‘em home, picked a team from that. In all honesty, they all looked the same- everyone caught the fly balls and a couple kids couldn’t manage the ground balls, but those kids hit lights out in their at bat. I think it’d be a helluva 30 and over softball team. People are going to pay for this team to “travel”.

 

[Thavoice]

Bo Jackson's Elite Bo dome is holding a 2022 college developement camp. Popped up on my facebook.

Someone asked how much and they responded to click on their link.

$100 for pitcher only
$300 for positional player.
$375 for combination player.

Prices are, well, the prices.

What I thought was 'interesting' was they state Due To NCAA Regulations, no discounts are available or applied.

They bill it as a camp and a chance to be recruited and some colleges will be there.


So.......where do NCAA regs come in to what they can fleece, I mean, charge for this camp?

Or did they include that verbiage to convince the sheep to not even bother to ask for a discount?

Just curious.....

 

[green_genes]

Took my kid to a tryout. They hit 5 pitches, fielded 5 balls from short, two balls at 3rd, and caught 5 fly balls in the outfield. Every kid. Sent ‘‘em home, picked a team from that. In all honesty, they all looked the same- everyone caught the fly balls and a couple kids couldn’t manage the ground balls, but those kids hit lights out in their at bat. I think it’d be a helluva 30 and over softball team. People are going to pay for this team to “travel”.

Yeah. I wouldn't pay $50 for those guys to coach my kid.

I do think there's value in the travel model if you find the right program, but it's such a crapshoot that you almost have to luck into the right situation. 95% of these organizations are a money grab or disgruntled dads creating a place for their kids to play every inning at "premium" positions.

 

[Thavoice]

Yeah. I wouldn't pay $50 for those guys to coach my kid.

I do think there's value in the travel model if you find the right program, but it's such a crapshoot that you almost have to luck into the right situation. 95% of these organizations are a money grab or disgruntled dads creating a place for their kids to play every inning at "premium" positions.

First two summers of fleecing ball a couple of dad's tried to do this and wanted me to come along and coach. Hence, since then I kept my distance from any of the dads because it always became a toxic situation.

 

[Philly_Cat]

First two summers of fleecing ball a couple of dad's tried to do this and wanted me to come along and coach. Hence, since then I kept my distance from any of the dads because it always became a toxic situation.

Say what you want, but without dads and moms volunteering to coach youth teams, you would see a complete collapse of all youth sports

 

[OnTheLine85]

95% of these organizations are a money grab or disgruntled dads creating a place for their kids to play every inning at "premium" positions.

Definitely.

In all honesty, the same amount of "true" select teams probably still exist today as it did 20 years ago. Everything else is daddy ball and paid hotel pool parties. Travel sports, unless you're truly competing for a college spot, which is very few, has basically tuned into summer fraternities and sororities for kids and parents.

 

[OnTheLine85]

Took my kid to a tryout. They hit 5 pitches, fielded 5 balls from short, two balls at 3rd, and caught 5 fly balls in the outfield. Every kid. Sent ‘‘em home, picked a team from that. In all honesty, they all looked the same- everyone caught the fly balls and a couple kids couldn’t manage the ground balls, but those kids hit lights out in their at bat. I think it’d be a helluva 30 and over softball team. People are going to pay for this team to “travel”.

My favorite is when they charge for the tryout knowing 95% of their team is already picked.

50 kids show up at $20 per kid and they know they're only taking 1-2 more kids.

 

[Thavoice]

Say what you want, but without dads and moms volunteering to coach youth teams, you would see a complete collapse of all youth sports

That is for sure. Without them, the whole system collapses. We are specifically speaking about dads who get mad that lilt timmy isnt playing the position he wants and starts his own team, hence watering down the system once again with more and more. and more. and more. and more. teams.

 

[umpire16]

Say what you want, but without dads and moms volunteering to coach youth teams, you would see a complete collapse of all youth sports

But dont these uber travel grand master select teams pay big time D1 college players and ex MLB all star hall of famers to coach?

 

[Philly_Cat]

But dont these uber travel grand master select teams pay big time D1 college players and ex MLB all star hall of famers to coach?

Some, but a very small few have paid coaches. Those that do have paid coaches are 99% true select teams. On the other hand, those with a parent head coach are a 50/50 chance, at best, of being a true select team.

With that being said, a team could be a parent coached team, not a truly select team, and still be run by parents with proper intentions and not simply disgruntled and wanting more playing time for their kid. The problem is the snowball effect of so many kids leaving local leagues for greener pastures. At some point, even if you're kid isn't elite, the community league has gotten so dry of talent, you're put in a position to move your kid to travel ball even if he's just average or a little better than average, just to get him around half decent competition.

In my opinion, 80% of all travel ball kids should be playing in their local league, instead of "traveling" and playing against the same kids they would play if they were all at home. The cost to play youth baseball would fall dramatically, and would make the sport more accessible to a lot of talented kids that are priced out right now. Kids that could contribute significantly to the sport, but are instead finding homes at more welcoming sports.