Are you a true West Sider??

polar panther

Well-known member
Just wait until the Amazon hub opens in 2025. Then it'll really get loud. I love planes though so it doesn't bother me one bit.

we moved into Delhi back in the late ‘80’s, planes flew lower, came in at many more angles, and the engines themselves were much louder than ones of today. Nothing will be as loud as it was then!
 

Sig Hansen

Well-known member
Damn! It’s not open yet?
Their 1 million square foot sorting facility on the south side of the airport next to DHL is opening in a few months. Up until now Amazon has been using DHL's sorting facility during the day while DHL operates mostly at night; the new facility will allow Amazon to handle most of that volume themselves. Eventually they will open an even larger facility between the north/south runways next to the passenger terminal. Right now I think Amazon has about 60-70 takeoffs/landings per day, by 2025 they plan to have 250.

CVG_Master_Plan_Overview.png
 

Sig Hansen

Well-known member
we moved into Delhi back in the late ‘80’s, planes flew lower, came in at many more angles, and the engines themselves were much louder than ones of today. Nothing will be as loud as it was then!
What's crazy is a 777 now is quieter than the old DC-9's that Comair and Delta flew back then, despite being like10 times bigger than a DC-9.
 

EHS 2001

Moderator
What's crazy is a 777 now is quieter than the old DC-9's that Comair and Delta flew back then, despite being like10 times bigger than a DC-9.
Yeah. A 747-800 flew over our house the other night and was quieter than an older 767-300 that came a few minutes later.
 

Vincent and Regina

Well-known member
Just wait until the Amazon hub opens in 2025. Then it'll really get loud. I love planes though so it doesn't bother me one bit.
I wonder why they put it at CVG? If they did it up at the Wilmington Air Park, they could have had that airport to themselves and been a short drive to Cincy, Columbus, and Dayton.
 

Sig Hansen

Well-known member
I wonder why they put it at CVG? If they did it up at the Wilmington Air Park, they could have had that airport to themselves and been a short drive to Cincy, Columbus, and Dayton.
Better access to highways, multiple runways, it's right next to Amazon's other warehouses in NKY, and most importantly it's easier to find employees in the Cincinnati metro versus Wilmington
 

Rush Limbaugh

Well-known member
A couple of points:

When the Amazon air hub opens (probably next year) the air traffic will double and possibly triple by 2025.

DHL tried to do their hub in Wilmington in the early 2000's and it was a massive failure. They had to bus people from everywhere and they never had enough staffing to make it work

DHL and Amazon lease airplanes from the same companies (ABX Air, Southern Air, etc...) and those companies have upgraded their fleets to the newer models and they are not nearly as loud as some of the older planes that the passenger carriers fly.
 

cincifbfan

Well-known member
I wonder why they put it at CVG? If they did it up at the Wilmington Air Park, they could have had that airport to themselves and been a short drive to Cincy, Columbus, and Dayton.
From what I have been told by people I know who work at the airport and someone who actually bid on a portion of the Amazon project at CVG is that Wilmington Air Field doesn't have the infrastructure.

Also, the big draw to CVG is I have been told that Cincy is going to be their hub for most of the US East of the Mississippi River. Cincy is within very short distance to many cities.
Think about it to go from Cincy to......
Dayton 1 hour
Lexington 1.5 hours
Louisville 1.5 hours
Indianapolis 1.5-2 hours
Columbus 2 hours
Toledo 3 hours
Knoxville 3.5-4 hours
Cleveland 4 hours
Detroit 4 hours
Nashville 4 hours
St. Louis 5 hours

And the list goes on, but you get the point. While the air traffic will be very noticeable, that won't be the biggest issue. The huge issue that nobody is talking about is the semi traffic on the interstates all because of Amazon. It will be unbearable starting in 2025. Just be prepared for that headache in a few years.
Pittsburgh 4.5 hours
Chicago 4.5 hours
 

Vincent and Regina

Well-known member
From what I have been told by people I know who work at the airport and someone who actually bid on a portion of the Amazon project at CVG is that Wilmington Air Field doesn't have the infrastructure.

Also, the big draw to CVG is I have been told that Cincy is going to be their hub for most of the US East of the Mississippi River. Cincy is within very short distance to many cities.
Think about it to go from Cincy to......
Dayton 1 hour
Lexington 1.5 hours
Louisville 1.5 hours
Indianapolis 1.5-2 hours
Columbus 2 hours
Toledo 3 hours
Knoxville 3.5-4 hours
Cleveland 4 hours
Detroit 4 hours
Nashville 4 hours
St. Louis 5 hours

And the list goes on, but you get the point. While the air traffic will be very noticeable, that won't be the biggest issue. The huge issue that nobody is talking about is the semi traffic on the interstates all because of Amazon. It will be unbearable starting in 2025. Just be prepared for that headache in a few years.
Pittsburgh 4.5 hours
Chicago 4.5 hours
I agree you have a bigger worker pool in Cincy than Wilmington, but the location is about the same.

Sure it is father to Nashville, but it is closer to Cleveland. St Louis is father, but Detroit is closer. To me those are all pushes.

I just think the allure of having the airport to yourself with no competition from passenger airlines would be a big draw. Infrastructure can always be built.

DHL was a failure because they were trying to compete with UPS and FedEX. UPS has World Hub at Louisville and FedEX has their big hub in Memphis. Who does Amazon directly compete with with a service that they provide head to head? Any other place you order from has to use UPS, FedEx, or USPS to get your stuff there. Amazon is all one business. But then again that is why I don't run Amazon or UPS.

Wilmington would provide less air noise for the folks of the WestSide.
 

cincifbfan

Well-known member
I agree you have a bigger worker pool in Cincy than Wilmington, but the location is about the same.

Sure it is father to Nashville, but it is closer to Cleveland. St Louis is father, but Detroit is closer. To me those are all pushes.

I just think the allure of having the airport to yourself with no competition from passenger airlines would be a big draw. Infrastructure can always be built.

DHL was a failure because they were trying to compete with UPS and FedEX. UPS has World Hub at Louisville and FedEX has their big hub in Memphis. Who does Amazon directly compete with with a service that they provide head to head? Any other place you order from has to use UPS, FedEx, or USPS to get your stuff there. Amazon is all one business. But then again that is why I don't run Amazon or UPS.

Wilmington would provide less air noise for the folks of the WestSide.

I completely understand what you are saying. I could be way off base here and am just spit-balling..... but can Wilmington Airfield physically handle the amount of air traffic that Amazon will command. CVG can with its runways, remember, it used to have multiple terminals. Also, it could be something that the FAA wouldn't allow????

Lastly, I really think the I-275 corridor and 71/75 being joined in NKY has a lot to do with it. It streamlines shipping, yet also gives you more options.

I honestly don't know, you bring up a great point with being the sole occupier of Wilmington Airfield being an attractive option.
 

ogealbhain

Well-known member
I completely understand what you are saying. I could be way off base here and am just spit-balling..... but can Wilmington Airfield physically handle the amount of air traffic that Amazon will command. CVG can with its runways, remember, it used to have multiple terminals. Also, it could be something that the FAA wouldn't allow????

Lastly, I really think the I-275 corridor and 71/75 being joined in NKY has a lot to do with it. It streamlines shipping, yet also gives you more options.

I honestly don't know, you bring up a great point with being the sole occupier of Wilmington Airfield being an attractive option.

Is there only 1 terminal now?
 

EHS 2001

Moderator
Even though there's only one terminal now, there are still two concourses. Concourse A is used by Air Canada, Allegiant, Frontier, Southwest, and United. Concourse B is used by American and Delta. Back in its heyday, Delta had all of concourses A and B along with Comair in Concourse C (which was also demolished in 2016).
 

Ehs 2005

Well-known member
When the Amazon air hub opens (probably next year) the air traffic will double and possibly triple by 2025.
I wouldn't be surprised if it is earlier than that. They've recently been putting down the blacktop for employee parking. It is pretty amazing how quickly they are working.
 

Sig Hansen

Well-known member
I agree you have a bigger worker pool in Cincy than Wilmington, but the location is about the same.

Sure it is father to Nashville, but it is closer to Cleveland. St Louis is father, but Detroit is closer. To me those are all pushes.

I just think the allure of having the airport to yourself with no competition from passenger airlines would be a big draw. Infrastructure can always be built.

DHL was a failure because they were trying to compete with UPS and FedEX. UPS has World Hub at Louisville and FedEX has their big hub in Memphis. Who does Amazon directly compete with with a service that they provide head to head? Any other place you order from has to use UPS, FedEx, or USPS to get your stuff there. Amazon is all one business. But then again that is why I don't run Amazon or UPS.

Wilmington would provide less air noise for the folks of the WestSide.
None of that matters if you can't find employees to unload the planes and drive forklifts at the warehouse or load trucks. Nobody in Dayton or Cincinnati wants to drive to Wilmington every day for the $15/hour that those jobs typically pay. NKY is within 30 mins for most if the Cincinnati metro.
 

Sig Hansen

Well-known member
From what I have been told by people I know who work at the airport and someone who actually bid on a portion of the Amazon project at CVG is that Wilmington Air Field doesn't have the infrastructure.

Also, the big draw to CVG is I have been told that Cincy is going to be their hub for most of the US East of the Mississippi River. Cincy is within very short distance to many cities.
Think about it to go from Cincy to......
Dayton 1 hour
Lexington 1.5 hours
Louisville 1.5 hours
Indianapolis 1.5-2 hours
Columbus 2 hours
Toledo 3 hours
Knoxville 3.5-4 hours
Cleveland 4 hours
Detroit 4 hours
Nashville 4 hours
St. Louis 5 hours

And the list goes on, but you get the point. While the air traffic will be very noticeable, that won't be the biggest issue. The huge issue that nobody is talking about is the semi traffic on the interstates all because of Amazon. It will be unbearable starting in 2025. Just be prepared for that headache in a few years.
Pittsburgh 4.5 hours
Chicago 4.5 hours
Something like 60% of the US population can be reached within a one day drive from here, which is why

FedEx has hubs in Memphis and Indianapolis
UPS in Louisville, Chicago/Rockford and Columbus
DHL/Amazon in Cincinnati and Chicago/Rockford

It's the same deal with trucking companies. Midwest is a great place to do business.
 

Vincent and Regina

Well-known member
I completely understand what you are saying. I could be way off base here and am just spit-balling..... but can Wilmington Airfield physically handle the amount of air traffic that Amazon will command. CVG can with its runways, remember, it used to have multiple terminals. Also, it could be something that the FAA wouldn't allow????

Lastly, I really think the I-275 corridor and 71/75 being joined in NKY has a lot to do with it. It streamlines shipping, yet also gives you more options.

I honestly don't know, you bring up a great point with being the sole occupier of Wilmington Airfield being an attractive option.
When it was just the Air Force base they only had one runway. When DHL came in they built a second. But with DHL gone they closed the "newer" runway. Looking at Google maps It could easily be opened again.

The workforce pool is what would do Wilmington in. If you drive down 73 from the fair ground to Wal-Mart it is dying a slow death.

When the Pandemic started last March and April Wilmington made a few extra bucks by parking air craft up there. I have family that lives in Clinton County and they told me about it so I drove by one time. I counted 80+ aircraft from airlines like Delta and Southwest. I even saw the New England Patriots plane up there.

My brother-in-law works for R&L Trucking and they are right there on 71. They use 71 a lot, but they also use 68 and 35 a lot. 35 is basically interstate. The thing that is going to hurt Cincy is the BS bridge. IF that gets replaced CVG is well ahead. R&L uses their Wilmington location to service Dayton, Cincy, and Columbus. Going from my sister's house to Dayton is actually easier than driving down to Mason.

As a Campbell County, Kentucky resident, I am happy it is at CVG. I get no noise from the planes, and my state gets tax money.
 

cincifbfan

Well-known member
When it was just the Air Force base they only had one runway. When DHL came in they built a second. But with DHL gone they closed the "newer" runway. Looking at Google maps It could easily be opened again.

The workforce pool is what would do Wilmington in. If you drive down 73 from the fair ground to Wal-Mart it is dying a slow death.

When the Pandemic started last March and April Wilmington made a few extra bucks by parking air craft up there. I have family that lives in Clinton County and they told me about it so I drove by one time. I counted 80+ aircraft from airlines like Delta and Southwest. I even saw the New England Patriots plane up there.

My brother-in-law works for R&L Trucking and they are right there on 71. They use 71 a lot, but they also use 68 and 35 a lot. 35 is basically interstate. The thing that is going to hurt Cincy is the BS bridge. IF that gets replaced CVG is well ahead. R&L uses their Wilmington location to service Dayton, Cincy, and Columbus. Going from my sister's house to Dayton is actually easier than driving down to Mason.

As a Campbell County, Kentucky resident, I am happy it is at CVG. I get no noise from the planes, and my state gets tax money.
Thanks for the info..... good stuff.

I agree that the Brent Spence is going to be an issue. But, I'm sure if Amazon complains to the federal government, something will get done about it fast.

I honestly don't think our interstates in the tri-state are anywhere near able to handle the volume of trucks that is coming 4 years down the line. I mean, the 75 has been under construction for at least a decade now north of the city, and it's really not any better.
 

Vincent and Regina

Well-known member
Something like 60% of the US population can be reached within a one day drive from here, which is why

FedEx has hubs in Memphis and Indianapolis
UPS in Louisville, Chicago/Rockford and Columbus
DHL/Amazon in Cincinnati and Chicago/Rockford

It's the same deal with trucking companies. Midwest is a great place to do business.
I like logistics so I always look a package tracking numbers. If you get something overnighted here in Cincy from UPS it always takes a truck from Louisville. There comes a point where it is not cost effective to fly it. A lot of our Fed Ex is routed via Indy.

The Creation Museum states that they are "Within a day's drive for two-thirds the US population." So I would guess you are correct about the 60% stat.
 

Vincent and Regina

Well-known member
Thanks for the info..... good stuff.

I agree that the Brent Spence is going to be an issue. But, I'm sure if Amazon complains to the federal government, something will get done about it fast.

I honestly don't think our interstates in the tri-state are anywhere near able to handle the volume of trucks that is coming 4 years down the line. I mean, the 75 has been under construction for at least a decade now north of the city, and it's really not any better.
You must be pretty young. I am 40 and can't remember a time when some part of 75 wasn't being worked on between 275.
 

EHS 2001

Moderator
Not quite 40, close though. I meant the construction going on from downtown up to 275, that has been going on for about 10 or so years.
ODOT has been in the midst of two "mega projects" on I-75 between the Western Hills Viaduct and I-275. The Mill Creek Expressway project has twelve phases most of which are now complete. https://www.transportation.ohio.gov...cts/mega-projects/mega-projects/75-mill-creek
There's also the Thru the Valley project which is further north. https://www.transportation.ohio.gov/wps/portal/gov/odot/projects/projects/82288

I believe that part of the WHV replacement project will include rebuilding the interchange with 75 and the new bridge to supplement the Brent Spence Bridge (if/when that happens) will obviously require significant work on 71 and 75.
 

SMARTY22

Well-known member
I like logistics so I always look a package tracking numbers. If you get something overnighted here in Cincy from UPS it always takes a truck from Louisville. There comes a point where it is not cost effective to fly it. A lot of our Fed Ex is routed via Indy.

The Creation Museum states that they are "Within a day's drive for two-thirds the US population." So I would guess you are correct about the 60% stat.

All your UPS overnight/ next day shipments get flown into Louisville because that’s the location of the UPS Air Hub. Those Packages must be put on a Truck to get to your “local” hub. A good number of UPS Trucks are almost constantly running between Cincy and Louisville everyday of the week.
 

CincyHSfootball

Active member
On a related note. If you have ever stopped at the Shell on River Road before you get to the viaduct it looks like Prime Central. I went there one night to fuel up and I counted 16 Prime delivery vans fueling up. Every time I have stopped there I have seen Prime vans. Must have a contract with them.
 

PantherVOR

Well-known member
On a related note. If you have ever stopped at the Shell on River Road before you get to the viaduct it looks like Prime Central. I went there one night to fuel up and I counted 16 Prime delivery vans fueling up. Every time I have stopped there I have seen Prime vans. Must have a contract with them.
I wonder if the owner knew that Amazon warehouse was coming when he purchased that spot. If not it was incredible luck for them.
 

PantherVOR

Well-known member
we moved into Delhi back in the late ‘80’s, planes flew lower, came in at many more angles, and the engines themselves were much louder than ones of today. Nothing will be as loud as it was then!
I’m not sure where you live in Delhi but where I live in Delhi it’s as loud as it ever was in the past. I’ve lived in the same place for nearly 30 years. I’ve gotten used to it over the years but I have definitely noticed the recent change with the East/West runway closed for maintenance.
 

SMARTY22

Well-known member
The lady in charge of the airport was on the So Cincinnati Podcast a week or so ago talking about all the stuff going on over there for those of you who may be interested.
 
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