2022 GCYL Football

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Footballjunkieky said:
That’s ridiculous- The radius from which CovCath draws is actually smaller than Elder and X. The overall student population of CCH is significantly less. You’re just butt hurt bc the Ky boys are blessed with a talented class. Get over it, coach your kids up and quit whining.
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I will bite even though I know you are just stirring the pot. Cov Cath is drawing from all over NKY. They have a top team of 4th and 6th grade players. Pony and Reserve levels have 16-20 kids dressing for the top teams so substitution is never a problem for them. They also have 2 other teams at those levels and they place those teams in the lowest of the 3 divisions. By Varsity they go to just 1 team and things tend to even out. Either leave the league or divide the teams up evenly. It's a major advantage at the younger levels with what Cov Cath is doing. There is a reason they do great at the younger levels and can never win at the high school level vs the Elder's and Xs of the world. The pony and reserve teams are a combined 14-0 because of how they are manipulating the process.

Not to mention the controversy they created by having the most dominant player of the Reserve team weigh in week 1 and never again. Thankfully Visi and Victory called them on it and the player didn't even show up to their game last week because he can't make weight.

If you have a special class like Jude reserve does that's one thing, but to do it the way Cov Cath is doing it is wrong.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
1. Is it that much different from what St James or other schools that combines 5+ schools are doing?
2. I have no problem with the Little Panther program taking the best players. My problem is that they don't have open tryouts until 7th and 8th grade, and everything before that is hand-picked by dads and they never open it up outside of the feeders. I don't see a parallel here, in fact, it's the opposite.
3. There have been numerous people here complain about Cov Cath. I don't remember if they call it cheating, but that's what they're implying.
4. I'm not Footballjunkieky
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If the westside schools decided to get together and make All Star teams for the Pony and Reserve levels and stick the rest of the kids on a combo team at the worst level you can play you would lose your mind.
 
JElder said:
If the westside schools decided to get together and make All Star teams for the Pony and Reserve levels and stick the rest of the kids on a combo team at the worst level you can play you would lose your mind.
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Exactly. He’s always b1tching about development, and how kids in grade school are “anointed” studs before HS. What the hell does he think an All Star team of the feeder kids would do? He’s either a moron or a troll.
 
CC certainly is a club team playing in what all of us feel is a club league or at least turning into one. There are others who fit the same structure and have been for years. I would agree somethings need to be looked at before next year. If more kids are playing with all the grade level only teams, maybe some of those schools need to evaluate if they can unmerge or reset the parish mergers in place. James, Mikes, SMOY-Columban to name a few.
 
JElder said:
If the westside schools decided to get together and make All Star teams for the Pony and Reserve levels and stick the rest of the kids on a combo team at the worst level you can play you would lose your mind.
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In a new model, this could potentially work. The current problem is the model, not Cov Cath. St. Mikes does it. St. James does it. Why is Cov Cath singled out?

As the other poster's comment about the league needing to re-evaluate the mergers, he's spot on.

Would it be the worst thing to have an A and a B team? The best kids make the A team, and the other kids actually get to play. Why is football immune to that concept when that's how it works with every other sport? Especially with BOL mergers coming, you'll have enough kids for multiple teams.
 
Budda said:
CC certainly is a club team playing in what all of us feel is a club league or at least turning into one. There are others who fit the same structure and have been for years. I would agree somethings need to be looked at before next year. If more kids are playing with all the grade level only teams, maybe some of those schools need to evaluate if they can unmerge or reset the parish mergers in place. James, Mikes, SMOY-Columban to name a few.
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Bingo.
 
JElder said:
I will bite even though I know you are just stirring the pot. Cov Cath is drawing from all over NKY. They have a top team of 4th and 6th grade players. Pony and Reserve levels have 16-20 kids dressing for the top teams so substitution is never a problem for them. They also have 2 other teams at those levels and they place those teams in the lowest of the 3 divisions. By Varsity they go to just 1 team and things tend to even out. Either leave the league or divide the teams up evenly. It's a major advantage at the younger levels with what Cov Cath is doing. There is a reason they do great at the younger levels and can never win at the high school level vs the Elder's and Xs of the world. The pony and reserve teams are a combined 14-0 because of how they are manipulating the process.

Not to mention the controversy they created by having the most dominant player of the Reserve team weigh in week 1 and never again. Thankfully Visi and Victory called them on it and the player didn't even show up to their game last week because he can't make weight.

If you have a special class like Jude reserve does that's one thing, but to do it the way Cov Cath is doing it is wrong.
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This summarizes all the stuff I have been hearing. I have no problem with them crafting their teams that way, but they should find a league that does that as a whole.

Still, I think reserve Vols are going to give them a helluva game on Saturday.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
In a new model, this could potentially work. The current problem is the model, not Cov Cath. St. Mikes does it. St. James does it. Why is Cov Cath singled out?
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No. St. Mike and St. James have fourth-grade and third-grade teams at the Pony level. CovCath has a select 4th-grade team, a combo team with the rest of the fourth grade and some 3rd grade, and they have a 3rd-grade team. That is VERY different.
 
Budda said:
CC certainly is a club team playing in what all of us feel is a club league or at least turning into one. There are others who fit the same structure and have been for years. I would agree somethings need to be looked at before next year. If more kids are playing with all the grade level only teams, maybe some of those schools need to evaluate if they can unmerge or reset the parish mergers in place. James, Mikes, SMOY-Columban to name a few.
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Agreed! Jude, Visi, and Iggy need to be on their own. Victory/Antoninus would be ideal as well. Lourdes,
MickeyMantle said:
This summarizes all the stuff I have been hearing. I have no problem with them crafting their teams that way, but they should find a league that does that as a whole.

Still, I think reserve Vols are going to give them a helluva game on Saturday.
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Jude will beat them especially if their best player is still out due to weight.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
In a new model, this could potentially work. The current problem is the model, not Cov Cath. St. Mikes does it. St. James does it. Why is Cov Cath singled out?

As the other poster's comment about the league needing to re-evaluate the mergers, he's spot on.

Would it be the worst thing to have an A and a B team? The best kids make the A team, and the other kids actually get to play. Why is football immune to that concept when that's how it works with every other sport? Especially with BOL mergers coming, you'll have enough kids for multiple teams.
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Again you have no idea what you are talking about. James and Mikes don’t do that. Nobody beside Cov Cath is fielding all star teams. You want to argue everything Elder out of both sides of your mouth. I agree with some of which u say on certain topics but you lose credibility when you speak out on things you know nothing about ie…. Little Panthers and grade school football.
 
JElder said:
Again you have no idea what you are talking about. James and Mikes don’t do that. Nobody beside Cov Cath is fielding all star teams. You want to argue everything Elder out of both sides of your mouth. I agree with some of which u say on certain topics but you lose credibility when you speak out on things you know nothing about ie…. Little Panthers and grade school football.
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A few questions for you to answer honestly:

1) What rule is Cov Cath breaking? None.
2) Does it not make sense to start to move towards a model that somewhat mimics the BOL consolidation? One would think so, but agree that's more open to opinion and interpretation.
3) Do the little Panthers hand select the top team prior to 7th grade? Yes.
4) Do the little Panthers have legit tryouts for the top team prior to 7th grade? No.
5) Do the little Panthers invite anyone across the city to try out for the top team outside of the feeder kids? No.
6) When they do have legit 7th and 8th grade tryouts, do they invite anyone across the city outside of the feeder kids to tryout? No.
7) Are there a plethora of kids standing on the sidelines each week picking their butts and never getting to play in football games? Yes.

Please tell me what exactly I've gotten wrong. I throw out my opinion on how things should change, and everyone says "they don't do it that way, you have no clue what you're talking about". Doesn't mean I don't understand the current way things are done. People are very non-responsive and evasive with very very easy and direct questions.
 
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And another question - why can't a combined team like Antonius/Teresa play a one-parish team like Visitation or Victory/Dominic? Aren't the numbers pretty close? Not much of the current structure makes much sense, but people will die on the hill for it.

Guestimates on enrollment:

Visitation - 650-700?
Antonius/Teresa - 600?
Victory/Dominic - 700?
 
OnTheLine85 said:
And another question - why can't a combined team like Antonius/Teresa play a one-parish team like Visitation or Victory/Dominic? Aren't the numbers pretty close? Not much of the current structure makes much sense, but people will die on the hill for it.

Guestimates on enrollment:

Visitation - 650-700?
Antonius/Teresa - 600?
Victory/Dominic - 700?
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Antoninus/Teresa are able to do that but they play in the middle division due to the number of kids playing is not large enough to warranty playing in the top league.
 
JElder said:
Antoninus/Teresa are able to do that but they play in the middle division due to the number of kids playing is not large enough to warranty playing in the top league.
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Didn't Lourdes play in the top league when they were by themselves? And aren't they significantly smaller? I'm so confused. Is anything within the model consistent whatsoever?

So if Visitation or Ignatius has small numbers playing football on a certain level, they can move down? Are there not rules that defines all of this because it seems like teams do whatever they want.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
A few questions for you to answer honestly:

1) What rule is Cov Cath breaking? None.
2) Does it not make sense to start to move towards a model that somewhat mimics the BOL consolidation? One would think so, but agree that's more open to opinion and interpretation.
3) Do the little Panthers hand select the top team prior to 7th grade? Yes.
4) Do the little Panthers have legit tryouts for the top team prior to 7th grade? No.
5) Do the little Panthers invite anyone across the city to try out for the top team outside of the feeder kids? No.
6) When they do have legit 7th and 8th grade tryouts, do they invite anyone across the city outside of the feeder kids to tryout? No.
7) Are there a plethora of kids standing on the sidelines each week picking their butts and never getting to play in football games? Yes.

Please tell me what exactly I've gotten wrong. I throw out my opinion on how things should change, and everyone says "they don't do it that way, you have no clue what you're talking about". Doesn't mean I don't understand the current way things are done. People are very non-responsive and evasive with very very easy and direct questions.
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1 - They are not breaking a rule, but they are also not using common sense. They will be out of the league or will need to reconfigure their teams to continue to participate. The rules will be updated. It would be the same if Visi or Ignatius decided to keep their top 16/18 guys and throw everyone else on a combo team. It would still not be as bad as Cov Cath due to the huge numbers they can draw from (private or public) for just 1 team.
2 - I really don't have an opinion on #2 other than I think there is a better way to combine schools athletically speaking.
3 - little Panther teams typically start in 2nd grade. I saw on FB that the 2nd grade team had evaluations to choose 2 teams recently. There are 2 Little Panther Teams in the 3rd grade and they play in the same division and are equally talented. Same can be said for the 4th grade teams. 5th grade they have tryouts after each year and definitely have a top team. 6th grade has multiple teams and none of them play in the top league because they don't split off into a top team etc etc.
4 - Why would they invite kids from all over the city? How would they even go about doing that? It's not AAU, it's a winter team that plays roughly 18 games a season to offset some of the grade school stuff. If it was an AAU program with funding I would agree with opening it up all over the city.
5 - There are 30+ kids playing for the Panthers in both 7th and 8th grade. I have no idea how many more teams you would like for them add.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
Didn't Lourdes play in the top league when they were by themselves? And aren't they significantly smaller? I'm so confused. Is anything within the model consistent whatsoever?

So if Visitation or Ignatius has small numbers playing football on a certain level, they can move down? Are there not rules that defines all of this because it seems like teams do whatever they want.
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Iggy and Visi will never have small numbers or a need to play down. Lourdes used to play in the top league but their enrollment numbers have plummeted. you're trying to fit everything into a nice compact box but it doesn't work that way. School sizes are shrinking and within that problem some individual grades are very small for boys. Lourdes is down to 1 basketball team in some grades. The price hill schools have only had 1 team per grade as well. Antoninus 5th grade will have 1 hoops team this year.
 
MickeyMantle said:
This summarizes all the stuff I have been hearing. I have no problem with them crafting their teams that way, but they should find a league that does that as a whole.

Still, I think reserve Vols are going to give them a helluva game on Saturday.
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Every dog has his day.
 
Lourdes has not had high enrollment numbers for over a decade, maybe even longer. They were in the top league not that long ago by themselves.

And what do you mean open up AAU teams to the whole city? That's exactly what AAU teams do. They publicize tryouts and anyone can come. Wouldn't you agree that's a great way to get some outside interest into Elder? How are the Panthers teams not AAU? They play in the AAU league don't they? So in essence, yes, they don't want outsiders taking up spots for the path that leads to playing at Elder.

Does Shining Star or any other AAU program only send their tryout invite to kids in certain schools?
 
JElder said:
Iggy and Visi will never have small numbers or a need to play down. Lourdes used to play in the top league but their enrollment numbers have plummeted. you're trying to fit everything into a nice compact box but it doesn't work that way. School sizes are shrinking and within that problem some individual grades are very small for boys. Lourdes is down to 1 basketball team in some grades. The price hill schools have only had 1 team per grade as well. Antoninus 5th grade will have 1 hoops team this year
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Certain areas are seeing a huge increase home builds and growth but I was under impression that the schools are not growing at the rate football is over the last two years. SMOY-Columban has 53 or so kids on varsity with new kids to program. SASeas has 8 new players and CPS has over 50 on varsity I believe. This area is only seeing growth in bandit ball.
 
Patchwork said:
Certain areas are seeing a huge increase home builds and growth but I was under impression that the schools are not growing at the rate football is over the last two years. SMOY-Columban has 53 or so kids on varsity with new kids to program. SASeas has 8 new players and CPS has over 50 on varsity I believe. This area is only seeing growth in bandit ball.
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What on earth is the point of having 50 kids on a team in grade school?

Someone please explain to me why you couldn't have two teams divided equally from a talent perspective? You absolutely could, but the daddy's with the good kids say "over my dead body". That's a daddy issue not a league issue. Grown adults can't figure this out?
 
OnTheLine85 said:
What on earth is the point of having 50 kids on a team in grade school?

Someone please explain to me why you couldn't have two teams divided equally from a talent perspective? You absolutely could, but the daddy's with the good kids say "over my dead body". That's a daddy issue not a league issue. Grown adults can't figure this out?
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A lot of games during week to make up for lack of playing time this year. I agree with you. Make it work figure it out. This is on the leaders of the organizations and GCYL.
 
Patchwork said:
A lot of games during week to make up for lack of playing time this year. I agree with you. Make it work figure it out. This is on the leaders of the organizations and GCYL.
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All it does is further deteriorate the desire to play football. These are still kids.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
Lourdes has not had high enrollment numbers for over a decade, maybe even longer. They were in the top league not that long ago by themselves.

And what do you mean open up AAU teams to the whole city? That's exactly what AAU teams do. They publicize tryouts and anyone can come. Wouldn't you agree that's a great way to get some outside interest into Elder? How are the Panthers teams not AAU? They play in the AAU league don't they? So in essence, yes, they don't want outsiders taking up spots for the path that leads to playing at Elder.

Does Shining Star or any other AAU program only send their tryout invite to kids in certain schools?
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Little Panthers is not AAU! What is making it so hard for you to realize that? Shining Stars and almost every team on the planet that play AAU don't play in the SWO League that Little Panthers do during basketball season. Panthers play vs Lakota Flight, Hamilton All Stars, and other similar programs that feed into local school districts. Almost all of the teams in this league are made up of players that play locally to the area to where they live. AAU is a different animal made up of players from all across the City. Little Panthers isn't apart of that. The Royals are about the only AAU team that plays in this league and that's because it's run out of Landmark which is where the league is run out of.
 
JElder said:
Little Panthers is not AAU! What is making it so hard for you to realize that? Shining Stars and almost every team on the planet that play AAU don't play in the SWO League that Little Panthers do during basketball season. Panthers play vs Lakota Flight, Hamilton All Stars, and other similar programs that feed into local school districts. Almost all of the teams in this league are made up of players that play locally to the area to where they live. AAU is a different animal made up of players from all across the City. Little Panthers isn't apart of that. The Royals are about the only AAU team that plays in this league and that's because it's run out of Landmark which is where the league is run out of.
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This isn't a discussion about what is and isn't AAU. To be fair, you are right, but everyone uses the moniker AAU to describe these other leagues.

So again, this program is a feeder pool for future Elder basketball players, yet targets only the feeder schools. Would you not agree that this would be a great opportunity to expand Elder to a broader set of people? Or are those spots strictly for westside feeder kids? So really you're admitting what I've been saying all along - the program isn't for outsiders. If that's what it is, why is that so hard to admit?

And if it's not that, can you explain to me what it is?
 
OnTheLine85 said:
I can hear the state champ predictions for these "studs" already. pboy is so excited.

Oh boy, another "special class" coming up. How many D1?
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How many are X or Oak Hills families that Elder won't get? If they are mostly kids headed to Elder and there's some good kids in the other feeders Visitation, Victory, Antoninus, Dominic, Price Hill schools, some Ignatius then that's a great base of talent.
 
OnTheLine85 said:
All it does is further deteriorate the desire to play football. These are still kids.
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Yeah,kinda how life works. I would ask, does it further deteriorate a kids desire for math if he’s not permitted to take the highest level math in 6th grade because he a later developing student?
 
JElder said:
I will bite even though I know you are just stirring the pot. Cov Cath is drawing from all over NKY. They have a top team of 4th and 6th grade players. Pony and Reserve levels have 16-20 kids dressing for the top teams so substitution is never a problem for them. They also have 2 other teams at those levels and they place those teams in the lowest of the 3 divisions. By Varsity they go to just 1 team and things tend to even out. Either leave the league or divide the teams up evenly. It's a major advantage at the younger levels with what Cov Cath is doing. There is a reason they do great at the younger levels and can never win at the high school level vs the Elder's and Xs of the world. The pony and reserve teams are a combined 14-0 because of how they are manipulating the process.

Not to mention the controversy they created by having the most dominant player of the Reserve team weigh in week 1 and never again. Thankfully Visi and Victory called them on it and the player didn't even show up to their game last week because he can't make weight.

If you have a special class like Jude reserve does that's one thing, but to do it the way Cov Cath is doing it is wrong.
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From what I was told the entire league wants them gone not just west side schools. They draw from 17 schools plus also pick an A team. Nobody else in the league does that. Period. Just like you mentioned I heard Visi and Mikes both had huge issues with them this year trying to hide overweight kids for their games. Ill be surprised if they aren’t unanimously voted out of the league.
 
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