The Official 2022 Cincinnati Reds Thread

How about those Reds, eh? The Reds grouped their entire offensive output into one inning last night, the 9th vs. the Yankees closer - a guy who's been barely touched this season. Votto, Naquin and India got big hits and the Yankee catcher muffed a sure DP.

Most importantly, Ashcraft was touched up early, but settled in and kept us in the game, only giving up 3, and the bullpen...yes, the bullpen provided 4 innings of 2 hit, shutout baseball.
 
oldpolecat said:
Two hit batsmen and a walk? by Holmes (was he "high"?) set the table for that crazy good 9th. Wild.
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Crazy 9th, so Holmes, who has been nearly perfect this season, nearly hits Pham leading off the 9th with his first pitch. Was a sign of things to come as he walks Pham on 5 pitches. Votto takes a first pitch strike - a tad off the plate - and drills the next pitch up the middle for a single. Stephenson was next and on the 2nd or 3rd pitch, he gets drilled in the middle of the back with a breaking ball, now bases are loaded. Farmer up and about the 3rd or 4th pitch, he gets hit and it's 3-1. Holmes gets yanked. Solano hits an 0-2 one hopper back to the mound and amazingly, the catcher double clutches a nearly sure DP ball and they only get the force at home.
Then Senzel hits the first pitch to Donaldson at 3rd who was pulled in, he did have to go to his left some, but could had gone to 2nd and tried for the DP. He opts to throw home and they only get the force out.
India, fouls off an 0-2 pitch, then bloops the next pitch, about 6 inches outside, over the 2nd baseman's head, with 2 out Solano scores easily from 2nd.
 
D4fan said:
No, not a believer. Votto is definitely not playing well this season, but the Reds are not winning because he is out, probably has more to do with pitching lately and level of competition from the American league East.

They will come back to earth once the schedule moves on from the AL East teams, Votto or no Votto.
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The REDS without Votto following that dismal start also won games. A lot more than they lost. I would state that the REDS without Votto this season is about 10 over .500 That is multiple times during the season and not just recently.... this also is true in previous years as well.
 
vamp2syd said:
The REDS without Votto following that dismal start also won games. A lot more than they lost. I would state that the REDS without Votto this season is about 10 over .500 That is multiple times during the season and not just recently.... this also is true in previous years as well.
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God bless your simple, simple mind.
 
Orin Swift said:
if troyboy and polecat are liking your posts you know you’re saying something stupid.
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I never can tell who left what message? There are likes, laughs etc. and then the names beside them, I can tell someone thought it was funny, but who?
 
Orin Swift said:
God bless your simple, simple mind.
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It is a very simple statistic. Winning percentage. Now, wouldn't a manager put in the players that give them the best winning percentage? Votto's career statistics do not mean squat when it does not equate to wins.

What would RED fans prefer.... Reds going 90-72 and making the playoffs with No Votto ... or, Reds going 72-90 with Votto having an MVP season???
 
vamp2syd said:
It is a very simple statistic. Winning percentage. Now, wouldn't a manager put in the players that give them the best winning percentage? Votto's career statistics do not mean squat when it does not equate to wins.

What would RED fans prefer.... Reds going 90-72 and making the playoffs with No Votto ... or, Reds going 72-90 with Votto having an MVP season???
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Yes, and judging a single player in team sport based on winning percentage is something stupid, simple people do because they are simple and stupid.
 
How do you watch a sport for, and I’m just guesstimating here so correct me if I’m off by a couple of years, 50 years and not understand judging a pitcher by their teams win loss record is moronic let alone an infielder? I am honestly shocked, impressed, perplexed there are people who dedicate years of their lives watching a sport and still don’t understand the absolute basics of the sport.
 
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Votto is having a bad year, but his OPS+ of 89 is still above those of Moustakas and Moran, who are both in the 70s.

Hopefully next year the Reds move Stephenson to 1B (I won’t hold my breath), find a new catcher, and use Votto mostly as a platoon DH and occasional 1B when Tyler needs a rest. That would be an appropriate usage of him in what is certain to be his final season as a Red.

2019 and 2022 are the only seasons in which Votto has had a below-league-average OPS, despite vamp’s whining.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
 
AEW Champion said:
Votto is having a bad year, but his OPS+ of 89 is still above those of Moustakas and Moran, who are both in the 70s.

Hopefully next year the Reds move Stephenson to 1B (I won’t hold my breath), find a new catcher, and use Votto mostly as a platoon DH and occasional 1B when Tyler needs a rest. That would be an appropriate usage of him in what is certain to be his final season as a Red.

2019 and 2022 are the only seasons in which Votto has had a below-league-average OPS, despite vamp’s whining.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
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This sounds like a good plan, I feel you'll likely see Stephenson as the teams full time first baseman in 2024, not next season. I think Stephenson wants and likes to catch, and that's something to consider. Also, I don't think Joey wants to DH full time. Now you'll say well they don't have a choice but let's face it, it's 2022. Players have more power - especially star players than ever before.
The thing that gets me on the negativity on Votto is it's mostly driven by what he makes. There is a mindset that for the highest paid player on the team, it's championship or bust. Not taking into account that in baseball, one individual, especially a position player has the least amount of control over a team's success in all the team sports.
Joey Votto will go down as one of the Reds all time greats.
 
AEW Champion said:
Broccoli Bob would never let his sole All-Star be traded before the All-Star Game.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
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Good point, I wonder if Severino's injury puts the fire under the Yankees? Do they feel they have enough high quality starters to win it all? I think they are a team that just relies on mashing. Generally come playoff time pitching and defense become more important.
 
Orin Swift said:
How do you watch a sport for, and I’m just guesstimating here so correct me if I’m off by a couple of years, 50 years and not understand judging a pitcher by their teams win loss record is moronic let alone an infielder? I am honestly shocked, impressed, perplexed there are people who dedicate years of their lives watching a sport and still don’t understand the absolute basics of the sport.
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I know the basics of baseball. I could easily coach a baseball team just because you disagree with me on Votto does not mean I don't know squat about the game. I believe the game is being played now a days by mostly but that is another debate. I am putting it out there as simple as possible. REDS > without Votto. Imagine no Votto and all the money that could be spent on improving the team where it needs to be improved. The REDS have proven they do not need Votto to win.

The REDS have not been able to win consistently since Votto. They have changed everyone in the lineup over the years but Votto stays put and the REDS losing is consistent.

Do you believe if the REDS could unload Votto and that contract and use it to pick up players on free agency that they would improve as a team? (I know this would depend obviously on who they could get but still.... )

Would you say the +/- statistic in Hockey is useless?
 
vamp2syd said:
I know the basics of baseball. I could easily coach a baseball team just because you disagree with me on Votto does not mean I don't know squat about the game. I believe the game is being played now a days by mostly but that is another debate. I am putting it out there as simple as possible. REDS > without Votto. Imagine no Votto and all the money that could be spent on improving the team where it needs to be improved. The REDS have proven they do not need Votto to win.

The REDS have not been able to win consistently since Votto. They have changed everyone in the lineup over the years but Votto stays put and the REDS losing is consistent.

Do you believe if the REDS could unload Votto and that contract and use it to pick up players on free agency that they would improve as a team? (I know this would depend obviously on who they could get but still.... )

Would you say the +/- statistic in Hockey is useless?
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That is not what is happening here lol I am making fun of you for using W/L record to determine the value for a first baseman. To suggest I am doing anything else is being dishonest. And if someone uses W/L record to determine the value for a first baseman, no they do not understand the basics of the sport.

Not to mention - what have the Reds done in the last 10 months that gives you confidence they’d spend Vottos $25m in a way that improves the team? Recent history tells us they are more likely to spend a couple million on a bench player back up and pocket the rest.
 
vamp2syd said:
I know the basics of baseball. I could easily coach a baseball team just because you disagree with me on Votto does not mean I don't know squat about the game. I believe the game is being played now a days by mostly but that is another debate. I am putting it out there as simple as possible. REDS > without Votto. Imagine no Votto and all the money that could be spent on improving the team where it needs to be improved. The REDS have proven they do not need Votto to win.

The REDS have not been able to win consistently since Votto. They have changed everyone in the lineup over the years but Votto stays put and the REDS losing is consistent.

Do you believe if the REDS could unload Votto and that contract and use it to pick up players on free agency that they would improve as a team? (I know this would depend obviously on who they could get but still.... )

Would you say the +/- statistic in Hockey is useless?
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Confirmed:
- Team W/L percentage for any single baseball player is meaningless - although it is a bit more useful for a starting pitcher
- plus/minus is also not very meaningful in hockey. it is so reliant on how the goalie and teammates are playing.
----- The best player on a bad team will have a big minus number because he is on the ice the most
----- It disregards goals scored on the power play

By the way Votto had the clutch go ahead RBI hit with 2 outs in the 8th inning last night. Bullpen gave up the lead. Votto then also had the go ahead RBI in the 10th. But you would blame the loss on Votto if the bullpen lost that lead also. You are just a hater...
 
I was being to wonder if anyone really wanted to win last nights game. First it is NY that tries to give it to the Reds and then the Reds give it right back. You can't beat NY in any part of the game of baseball once they gave the lead back to the Reds try as the RED did NY refuse to let it happen and the Reds get the win and lost the game of losing. Think about that one. Maybe the Reds can make up for their mistakes trying to lose in NY and take one on the chin tonight in St Louis.
 
vamp2syd said:
I know the basics of baseball. I could easily coach a baseball team just because you disagree with me on Votto does not mean I don't know squat about the game. I believe the game is being played now a days by mostly but that is another debate. I am putting it out there as simple as possible. REDS > without Votto. Imagine no Votto and all the money that could be spent on improving the team where it needs to be improved. The REDS have proven they do not need Votto to win.

The REDS have not been able to win consistently since Votto. They have changed everyone in the lineup over the years but Votto stays put and the REDS losing is consistent.

Do you believe if the REDS could unload Votto and that contract and use it to pick up players on free agency that they would improve as a team? (I know this would depend obviously on who they could get but still.... )

Would you say the +/- statistic in Hockey is useless?
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One single baseball position player has very little to do with a teams success. The Reds had 40 plate appearances last night, Votto 5. That's 12.5% of the time he had a DIRECT impact on the game offensively. And that doesn't account that the opposing pitcher can work around him.
Yes, the Reds have not won consistently with Votto, but it's a bit of a stretch to say he's mostly responsible for that. I'm sure he would admit he wants to win more. My feelings are that most of the players that have hit around Votto has benefitted tremendously from him being in the lineup. When he's on deck, you pitch to the batter differently, when he's batting you defer to the guy hitting behind him.
Remember that Joey's original contract was for what he had done at the time and what he was going to do and he's largely been a very productive player, up until recently.
Joey also has a no trade clause in his contract, and unless I'm way off, he has no interest in playing anywhere else.
 
19AL63 said:
I was being to wonder if anyone really wanted to win last nights game. First it is NY that tries to give it to the Reds and then the Reds give it right back. You can't beat NY in any part of the game of baseball once they gave the lead back to the Reds try as the RED did NY refuse to let it happen and the Reds get the win and lost the game of losing. Think about that one. Maybe the Reds can make up for their mistakes trying to lose in NY and take one on the chin tonight in St Louis.
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It's incredible how bad the Reds bullpen is. There really isn't one long term reliable arm down there other than possibly Diaz.
 
Joey Votto Smile GIF by Cincinnati Reds
 
14Red said:
One single baseball position player has very little to do with a teams success. The Reds had 40 plate appearances last night, Votto 5. That's 12.5% of the time he had a DIRECT impact on the game offensively. And that doesn't account that the opposing pitcher can work around him.
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OMG. You are absolutely hilarious. Trying to explain something simple, yet you still mess it up.

You said Votto had 5 of 40 plate appearances. That is 1/8. Please explain to everyone how a single player can can have plate appearances more than one out of nine!! Either the Reds cheated or math is not a strong suit for you.

(Hint: you forgot that walks, sacrifices and HBP are plate appearances but not ABs - The Reds had 44 or 45 plate appearances last night).
 
wolves82 said:
OMG. You are absolutely hilarious. Trying to explain something simple, yet you still mess it up.

You said Votto had 5 of 40 plate appearances. That is 1/8. Please explain to everyone how a single player can can have plate appearances more than one out of nine!! Either the Reds cheated or math is not a strong suit for you.

(Hint: you forgot that walks, sacrifices and HBP are plate appearances but not ABs - The Reds had 44 or 45 plate appearances last night).
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That makes it even less of an impact for a single player, but it's Votto's fault, right??
 
wolves82 said:
Confirmed:
- Team W/L percentage for any single baseball player is meaningless - although it is a bit more useful for a starting pitcher
- plus/minus is also not very meaningful in hockey. it is so reliant on how the goalie and teammates are playing.
----- The best player on a bad team will have a big minus number because he is on the ice the most
----- It disregards goals scored on the power play

By the way Votto had the clutch go ahead RBI hit with 2 outs in the 8th inning last night. Bullpen gave up the lead. Votto then also had the go ahead RBI in the 10th. But you would blame the loss on Votto if the bullpen lost that lead also. You are just a hater...
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+/- within the team is important. Not as necessarily when comparing players from different teams. The stat it far from useless. +/- can be adjusted for power plays and pulled goalie situations.

I'm assuming the REDS won that game and to me that is all that matters. You are correct. I do not like Votto and I will hate on him.
 
14Red said:
One single baseball position player has very little to do with a teams success. The Reds had 40 plate appearances last night, Votto 5. That's 12.5% of the time he had a DIRECT impact on the game offensively. And that doesn't account that the opposing pitcher can work around him.
Yes, the Reds have not won consistently with Votto, but it's a bit of a stretch to say he's mostly responsible for that. I'm sure he would admit he wants to win more. My feelings are that most of the players that have hit around Votto has benefitted tremendously from him being in the lineup. When he's on deck, you pitch to the batter differently, when he's batting you defer to the guy hitting behind him.
Remember that Joey's original contract was for what he had done at the time and what he was going to do and he's largely been a very productive player, up until recently.
Joey also has a no trade clause in his contract, and unless I'm way off, he has no interest in playing anywhere else.
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I disagree.
 
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