Why Does the Pandemic Seem to Be Hitting Some Countries Harder Than Others?

isadore

Well-known member
Yea, he has is willing to learn. Hmmm He is not what he proclaims. You had to observe bath house participants and bar goers? Joke
Yep just the scientific method in action. Its research like that that has provided a cure for the STDs caught by people at this site.
 

lotr10

Well-known member
scientists
Peter Ben Embarek Who’s top expert on zoonotic diseases with two decades of experience and Marion Koopmans, an expert on virology
Read a little history man. All sorts of respectable scientists, journalists and intellectuals visited Joe Stalin's Soviet Union during the 1930's. And were they impressed. With few exceptions they came back and told us how great it was. A regular workers paradise on earth. Meanwhile Uncle Joe was murdering millions of Ukrainians and making deals with Hitler.

What's the term that described people like you during the Cold War? Oh that's right they were called "useful idiots".
 

MoeDude

LIVE FREE OR DIE!
you push the China Hoax that have lead to attacks on Asian Americans
Violent attacks went up in a lot of places last year. In LA County in 2020 there were 15 anti-Asian hate crimes filed while there were 57 anti-Hispanic hate crimes but yea let's just focus on the anti-Asian crimes because it fits you TDS and hate. Another thing you ignore is that several of the videos being shown of elderly Asians be attacked were attacked by black assailants. But now I'm going to be accused of being a racist for pointing out that little detail. Just like Blacks and Hispanics Blacks and Asians tend to have problems getting along as well. But we're not allowed to talk about these social issues without being labeled a racist. Quit listening to your MP3 messages at night and try going for a walk and get some fresh air.
 

isadore

Well-known member
Violent attacks went up in a lot of places last year. In LA County in 2020 there were 15 anti-Asian hate crimes filed while there were 57 anti-Hispanic hate crimes but yea let's just focus on the anti-Asian crimes because it fits you TDS and hate. Another thing you ignore is that several of the videos being shown of elderly Asians be attacked were attacked by black assailants. But now I'm going to be accused of being a racist for pointing out that little detail. Just like Blacks and Hispanics Blacks and Asians tend to have problems getting along as well. But we're not allowed to talk about these social issues without being labeled a racist. Quit listening to your MP3 messages at night and try going for a walk and get some fresh air.
lol you don't think the anti-Hispanc attacks were based on Trump's speeches and actions against immigrants, you remember his raving about Mexican rapists.
But beside that Asians are a much smaller % of the population than Hispanic throughout the United States, but especially in LA county, a much smaller population to attack, but a marked increase in those attacks
the increase in assailants of Asians whether by Whites, Blacks or Hispanics are pushed by the propaganda that blames Asians for the spread of the "China Disease"
 

isadore

Well-known member
Read a little history man. All sorts of respectable scientists, journalists and intellectuals visited Joe Stalin's Soviet Union during the 1930's. And were they impressed. With few exceptions they came back and told us how great it was. A regular workers paradise on earth. Meanwhile Uncle Joe was murdering millions of Ukrainians and making deals with Hitler.

What's the term that described people like you during the Cold War? Oh that's right they were called "useful idiots".
check a calendar, it ain't 1930
 

Gh0st

Well-known member
Everyone forgets this aspect of human immune response. BTW, T Cells are a much more important part of immunity then antibodies. For one, educating your T Cells to the pathogen can last a lifetime.
Memory cells are B cells, they produce antibodies and T cells. Neither are more important, they're just different and both are needed for an effective immune response along with many other cells and systems.

The immune response is generally in two phases, innate immunity and adaptive immunity. Innate immunity is a general response to something the body recognizes as a pathogen, but non-specific and therefore not totally efficient. The adaptive immune response is a target response to a recognized target that is much more efficient. After the adaptive response, the memory T cells and memory B cells remain in case of reintroduction of the same pathogen to activate the targeted response more quickly and limit exposure to the pathogen.

The purpose of immunization is to mimic what actual infection does and let the body start developing the memory cells without having to become ill. The "side effects" most people experience with vaccination are the immune system creating this response.

Some pathogens do not change much over time and the immune system very efficiently eliminates it before it can cause any damage (ie measles, mumps, rubella). The result of that is immunity. Some change rapidly and quickly so the response created by the vaccine is more specific than the innate response, but not as efficient as responses to other pathogens. The result is that people don't generally develop full immunity, but vaccination has been shown to reduce disease course, severity, and risk of complications (ie influenza).

We don't know which COVID will be, although early data seems to favor relatively strong immunity. What we are missing is long term data regarding what happens when we expose a virus like COVID to a stimulus like widespread vaccination. We don't yet fully know the mutagenic potential which will determine how often vaccination may need a booster or needs repeating if ever.
 

Indiandad

Well-known member
Memory cells are B cells, they produce antibodies and T cells. Neither are more important, they're just different and both are needed for an effective immune response along with many other cells and systems.

The immune response is generally in two phases, innate immunity and adaptive immunity. Innate immunity is a general response to something the body recognizes as a pathogen, but non-specific and therefore not totally efficient. The adaptive immune response is a target response to a recognized target that is much more efficient. After the adaptive response, the memory T cells and memory B cells remain in case of reintroduction of the same pathogen to activate the targeted response more quickly and limit exposure to the pathogen.

The purpose of immunization is to mimic what actual infection does and let the body start developing the memory cells without having to become ill. The "side effects" most people experience with vaccination are the immune system creating this response.

Some pathogens do not change much over time and the immune system very efficiently eliminates it before it can cause any damage (ie measles, mumps, rubella). The result of that is immunity. Some change rapidly and quickly so the response created by the vaccine is more specific than the innate response, but not as efficient as responses to other pathogens. The result is that people don't generally develop full immunity, but vaccination has been shown to reduce disease course, severity, and risk of complications (ie influenza).

We don't know which COVID will be, although early data seems to favor relatively strong immunity. What we are missing is long term data regarding what happens when we expose a virus like COVID to a stimulus like widespread vaccination. We don't yet fully know the mutagenic potential which will determine how often vaccination may need a booster or needs repeating if ever.
What are your thoughts on the safety of the Covid vaccine?

A lot of people are hesitant to get the vaccine because there is no track record. What do you say to that?
 

Gh0st

Well-known member
What are your thoughts on the safety of the Covid vaccine?

A lot of people are hesitant to get the vaccine because there is no track record. What do you say to that?
What I can say about the vaccine is based on what we have is basically immediate data. The safety profile when looking at the tens of thousands of samples in drug trials and so far with vaccinated individuals is very good. It has met every safety measure for vaccines that the FDA uses. That goes for all brands so far released. Minor side effects (fever, chills, body aches, headaches, arm pain) are fairly common (upwards of 60% for some) and I've personally experienced that. It was worst for me after the second dose and lasted about 12 hours.

The issue of long term data is more complicated. People are reasonably skeptical because we don't have it yet, but everything starts out that way. The more people we vaccinate, the better long term data sample we'll have.
 

lotr10

Well-known member
scientists
Peter Ben Embarek Who’s top expert on zoonotic diseases with two decades of experience and Marion Koopmans, an expert on virology
Are you talking about this Peter Ben Embarek?


The head of the World Health Organization group that investigated the origins of the novel coronavirus says they didn’t get “hard facts or detailed data” on the work done at the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

Peter Ben Embarek, an expert on animal diseases and food safety, also stressed that he remains skeptical of the lab leak hypothesis but that it is “definitely not off the table.”

And check what Embarek said here. This guy is a hack:

“I take it you found no research into SARS-CoV-2 in any of the labs. It’s hard to imagine how it could leak if they don’t even have it," Fisher said.

“Exactly, but of course, as I said, we didn’t do an audit of any of these labs, so we don’t really have hard facts or detailed data on the work done,” Embarek said. “But from what was presented both for and against these hypotheses — mind you, those claiming that it can only be due to a laboratory accident or leak have not been able to put any pieces of evidence on the table, so it’s very difficult to act and plan forward with on claims.”

What was presented? Are you kidding me.
 

lotr10

Well-known member
Memory cells are B cells, they produce antibodies and T cells. Neither are more important, they're just different and both are needed for an effective immune response along with many other cells and systems.

The immune response is generally in two phases, innate immunity and adaptive immunity. Innate immunity is a general response to something the body recognizes as a pathogen, but non-specific and therefore not totally efficient. The adaptive immune response is a target response to a recognized target that is much more efficient. After the adaptive response, the memory T cells and memory B cells remain in case of reintroduction of the same pathogen to activate the targeted response more quickly and limit exposure to the pathogen.

The purpose of immunization is to mimic what actual infection does and let the body start developing the memory cells without having to become ill. The "side effects" most people experience with vaccination are the immune system creating this response.

Some pathogens do not change much over time and the immune system very efficiently eliminates it before it can cause any damage (ie measles, mumps, rubella). The result of that is immunity. Some change rapidly and quickly so the response created by the vaccine is more specific than the innate response, but not as efficient as responses to other pathogens. The result is that people don't generally develop full immunity, but vaccination has been shown to reduce disease course, severity, and risk of complications (ie influenza).

We don't know which COVID will be, although early data seems to favor relatively strong immunity. What we are missing is long term data regarding what happens when we expose a virus like COVID to a stimulus like widespread vaccination. We don't yet fully know the mutagenic potential which will determine how often vaccination may need a booster or needs repeating if ever.
Great summary. Is it true that even if the pathogen mutates if it doesn't drift to far away from the original pathogen the T cell defense can at least take the edge off any resulting illness? That instead of being hospitalized or dying maybe all a patient experiences is mild to moderate symptoms?

Is it reasonable to call it a partial recognition and defense?
 

Gh0st

Well-known member
Great summary. Is it true that even if the pathogen mutates if it doesn't drift to far away from the original pathogen the T cell defense can at least take the edge off any resulting illness? That instead of being hospitalized or dying maybe all a patient experiences is mild to moderate symptoms?

Is it reasonable to call it a partial recognition and defense?
Yes, pathogens don't often drift far enough to render vaccines or immunity useless and remain gentically the same pathogen as before. Influenza is an example of that. Influenza has phenominal mutagenic potential and is why it's been difficult to develop a vaccine that does well at preventing disease entirely. There is certainly evidence that vaccinated indiviuals with influenza are likely to have a shorter disease course, be less likely to develop severe disease, and are less likely to develop complications of the disease. So there is some partial recognition.

One thing that is hard to predict, is that by undertaking mass vaccination, you've exerted a genetic pressure and encourage genetic drift. In this case an artificial one. We exert genetic pressure all the time through natural immunity, but mass vaccination does it more quickly. The options for a pathogen, whether it be bacterial, viral, fungal, or protozoan, is genetic drift or eradication.

We don't know which of these COVID will be. That's where long term, longitudinal observation comes in.
 

lotr10

Well-known member
Yep just the scientific method in action. Its research like that that has provided a cure for the STDs caught by people at this site.
Here's some more on the fake investigation by the WHO of China's role in the covid:


Based on our analysis, and as confirmed by the global study convened by the World Health Organization (WHO) and Chinese authorities, there is as yet no evidence demonstrating a fully natural origin of this virus. The zoonosis hypothesis, largely based on patterns of previous zoonosis events, is only one of a number of possible SARS-CoV-2 origins, alongside the research-related accident hypothesis.

Although the “collaborative” process of discovery mandated by the World Health Assembly in May 2020 was meant to enable a full examination of the origins of the pandemic, we believe that structural limitations built into this endeavor make it all but impossible for the WHO-convened mission to realize this aspiration.

In particular, we wish to raise public awareness of the fact that half of the joint team convened under that process is made of Chinese citizens whose scientific independence may be limited, that international members of the joint team had to rely on information the Chinese authorities chose to share with them, and that any joint team report must be approved by both the Chinese and international members of the joint team.

We have therefore reached the conclusion that the joint team did not have the mandate, the independence, or the necessary accesses to carry out a full and unrestricted investigation into all the relevant SARS-CoV-2 origin hypotheses -whether natural spillover or laboratory/research-related incident.
 
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