#IWantASeason

[mathking]

One thing that is really concerning me is the strain on some medical personnel that some seem to completely disregard. My youngest son's grandfather on his mothers side was a helicopter mechanic in Vietnam. He has had some issues with PTSD. Another relative was a soldier in WW2 (Many years deceased now) He had very little affect from his time in combat and he was actually in the trenches. It was always an argument about how soft the Vietnam vets were. The WW2 vet would just rip on the Vietnam vet about being soft. Long story short is that the helicopter mechanic in Vietnam saw 10 times the combat that the WW2 Infantry man did. A little more research and we found that WW2 vets in actual combat would probably be in 10 days of battle in a year. Only 10% of those in the military saw any action in WW2. In Vietnam, 60% would see combat and they would be in over 225 days of combat in a year.se.

I'm hearing that some of these ICU doctors and nurses are seeing 10 years worth of trauma and stress in a few months. They might get out of it when this is all said and done.

Interesting point about the amount of experience influencing the effect on people. My father in law was paratrooper in Korea and in the artillery for Vietnam Nam. But he said the fact you could never get away from the possibility of combat made Viet Nam worse. Yeah the effect on medical people is a huge worry to me. It is happening in Italy now, with medical people quitting or taking leaves of absence. I know my niece, cousins and friends are all feeling the strain now. One of my former runners who is a nurse and had two tours in Iraq and Afghanistan (one as a medic and one as a nurse) says the last couple months have been harder. My niece was wounded in Iraq and said the same thing. I hope your son is doing ok.

If current plans go forward I am expecting it to be a problem in schools as well. When students and teachers start going to the ICU it’s going to ramp the stress levels. We will be dealing with the psychological effects for a long time.

 

[psycho_dad]

My son is fine. Thank you. They have taken their hit and as of now, he is not going to leave the hospital he is at to go help other places. They have workable numbers and he is no longer in the ICU but back on his normal rotations. He does still have to admit some of his patients and some end up in the ICU. Friends and colleagues of his have gone to help in NY and other places and he says they are burned out. Like you said, some of them had tours in Iraq and Afghanistan and say this is as bad or worse. It just honestly amazes me that people aren't seeing any of that. I know it's being shown on the news. Has it gotten to the point where things aren't true unless they are shown 500 times. Isn't once or twice enough? Did anyone see the CEO of the Miami hospital that has had to work shifts as an ICU nurse. Doesn't even look like the same person I saw interviewed last week.

I also don't understand that peoples concern for the safety and well being of others is met with such hostility. I want schools open and normal life back as much as anyone. My youngest son has depression issues enough without all of this going on. I think I might be looking at it too much as a United States issue and not just a local issue. Ohio seems to be doing a good job. My area seems ok. Not real happy with peoples reckless and aggressive showing of their first amendment right by not social distancing or wearing of masks. Amendment 9 doesn't seem to apply, and "promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity." seem to take a hit. "Life, Liberty and the persuit of happiness " is somehow translated to ME ME ME ME ME.

 

[cvctrackfan]

News is just in Virginia canceled football. Cross Country will compete. In that state it is considered low risk. But they consider volleyball high risk hmmmm.

 

[mathking]

News is just in Virginia canceled football. Cross Country will compete. In that state it is considered low risk. But they consider volleyball high risk hmmmm.

cvctrackfan, one of the epidemiologists I know says that almost any indoor sport will be higher risk than almost any outdoor sport. She actually says she worries most about XC (she ran for me) at the starting line (15-20 minutes of large groups standing around) and in team camps rather than in races. But also advised having smaller races. Psychodad will like that she recommended dual and tri meets. Also check in at your team camp to avoid standing around at the line. She also thinks if athletes wore masks to race the dangers would be greatly reduced.

 

[Running Man 101]

psycho dad, since I think you are serious about things, wanted to share some additional data with you.

BTW, our county health board just approved XC this fall, but what the governor says will trump that, of course.

Two parts:

• The French and some others are starting to see a correlation of people that have a good titer (roughly corresponds to immune response ability) of the MMR vaccine given to kids and a booster you should get as an adult. One hypothesis why kids may fair so much better than adults and why some adults do better. It doesn’t prevent it, just substantially reduces the immune over reaction from covid.
• HCQ data from France and Switzerland show statistical improvement, see charts below:

 

[mathking]

psycho dad, since I think you are serious about things, wanted to share some additional data with you.

BTW, our county health board just approved XC this fall, but what the governor says will trump that, of course.

Two parts:

• The French and some others are starting to see a correlation of people that have a good titer (roughly corresponds to immune response ability) of the MMR vaccine given to kids and a booster you should get as an adult. One hypothesis why kids may fair so much better than adults and why some adults do better. It doesn’t prevent it, just substantially reduces the immune over reaction from covid.
• HCQ data from France and Switzerland show statistical improvement, see charts below:

View attachment 8376

I saw this earlier and it was heartening. Particularly in light of the growing evidence that the antibodies are largely gone after a few months. A biochemist friend in Pharma research says a lot of researchers are working on antibody therapies that are trying essentially to replicate and/or power up this effect. Instead of preventing you from becoming infected just dialing down the body's response so the illness is not super serious. He also pointed out that this accounts for something researchers have seen, that COVID-19 is more statistically more dangerous in areas where there there are a lot of unvaccinated kids.

 

[pheesh]

Covid-19: hydroxychloroquine works, a proof ? | FranceSoir

Addendum as of July 16, 2020:On 14 July some people asked about the Swiss data. According to the latter, Switzerland has reclassified some patients. No information is available to date. We had contacted the OFSP without reply to date.

www.francesoir.fr

It was enough the collaboration of three internet users to solve this enigma (see the article “story of a discovery”): the discovery of a strict temporary suspension of the HCQ in Switzerland, the nrCFR * efficiency index of treatments, the observation of a “bump” of ~ 2 weeks in this index for Switzerland, the link with the suspension, and finally the analysis concluding with the statistical significance of this correlation with a very high degree of certainty ( > 99%). All analyzes were made from international data “global time series” “Deaths” and “Recovered” from Johns Hopkins University updated every night.

INTERVIEW EXCLUSIVE : Martin Landray, Recovery - hydroxychloroquine game over UK | FranceSoir

Interview of Professor Martin Landray PhD FRCP Co Head of the UK based Recovery Trial

www.francesoir.fr

On the 5th June, a press release from Recovery, the largest trial in the UK with 11 000 patients, announced that hydroxychloroquine does not work and that it would be removed from the trial with immediate effect. Hence stopping any patients on the treatment and stopping the inclusion of the treatment.

No clinical benefit from use of hydroxychloroquine in hospitalised patients with COVID-19 — RECOVERY Trial

Statement from the Chief Investigators of the Randomised Evaluation of COVid-19 thERapY (RECOVERY) Trial on hydroxychloroquine, 5 June 2020

www.recoverytrial.net

The RECOVERY Trial is a large, randomised controlled trial of possible treatments for patients admitted to hospital with COVID-19. Over 11,000 patients have been randomised to the following treatment arms, or no additional treatment:

 

[Running Man 101]

I saw this earlier and it was heartening. Particularly in light of the growing evidence that the antibodies are largely gone after a few months. A biochemist friend in Pharma research says a lot of researchers are working on antibody therapies that are trying essentially to replicate and/or power up this effect. Instead of preventing you from becoming infected just dialing down the body's response so the illness is not super serious. He also pointed out that this accounts for something researchers have seen, that COVID-19 is more statistically more dangerous in areas where there there are a lot of unvaccinated kids.

It's been a few years ago (3-4), but last time I went in to get my tetanus booster it had a MMR booster as well. I asked him why I was getting it as an adult and he said they had found the immunity of many things they thought lasted a lifetime really wasn't true.

I've always believed in getting the immunity shots. Yes, it probably does harm a few kids, but overall it is better for everyone (which I do see the analogy with masks, but it is a bad analogy). I have a son with autism who was fine until the 18 month shot regime, so this is something I have dug into quite deeply. I have found ZERO compelling data on it. I think there is something there (combined with something else tbd).

Agree with the antibody therapies. They will labeled as vaccines, although not technically true, practically speaking they do essentially the same thing. People may need frequent boosters.

 

[Running Man 101]

Here is a breakdown of the total deaths across the country. Keep in mind that "covid" deaths do not have to be clinically proven, suspected is enough. It can be retroactively done, which is common for diseases and sickness. The key outage here is that the presence of the virus is "not required to be proven", so this is worst case scenario.