DII State Semifinal: Akron Hoban vs. Avon

Who wins?

  • Hoban by 1-8

    Votes: 13 13.7%

  • Hoban by 9-16

    Votes: 38 40.0%

  • Hoban by 17+

    Votes: 16 16.8%

  • Avon by 1-8

    Votes: 24 25.3%

  • Avon by 9-16

    Votes: 1 1.1%

  • Avon by 17+

    Votes: 3 3.2%
  • Total voters
    95
ArmChairCoach said:
A lot forget the good Hoban teams of the early 2000’s with Tyrell Sutton and then the ‘08 team that went to the state semis. One could say Massillon was the definition of average from 1970-2015. Very similar to ND football.
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How dare you knock my NotreDame fighting irish. I am a Hoban grad and never look down any program. The last 8 years Hoban has risen to a state power. They had a couple of teams in the 1960's that qere ranked 5th one year and 8th the next year and had a nice run in the 90's early 2000's under Orsini where they would go 3 or so games deep in the playoffs I think 1 year they mad r to the semi finals but most of the other years were pretty much a 500 winning program.
 
ArmChairCoach said:
A lot forget the good Hoban teams of the early 2000’s with Tyrell Sutton and then the ‘08 team that went to the state semis. One could say Massillon was the definition of average from 1970-2015. Very similar to ND football.
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I guess one COULD say that....they'd look pretty idiotic, much like you do right now....but they could say it.
 
TigerPaw said:
Depth is huge. #3 Pringle was just named District DPOY and is lights out on both sides of ball. Him being out would be a MAJOR blow to most teams, and it's not even a story. #41 Robinson steps up that's all.

Granted a dual threat QB is hard to replace, but others have to step up.
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MassillonTigers3 said:
Maybe the difference was that they’re better this year? Based on your logic Avon should just shut down the program
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They have been undefeated 3 times going into this game and have lost twice to Hoban and once to Massillon. What make's this team so much different? Maybe because you "hope" they will win, not that they are any better. No one said anything about shutting down the program, if that was the case your team would have shut down 50 years ago.
 
Cougarfan22 said:
They have been undefeated 3 times going into this game and have lost twice to Hoban and once to Massillon. What make's this team so much different? Maybe because you "hope" they will win, not that they are any better. No one said anything about shutting down the program, if that was the case your team would have shut down 50 years ago.
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Don’t recall Avon having big time college commits that were veteran players in previous years like they do this year. Maybe that’s why their fans and others felt they were better this year. YOU said that because they didn’t win in previous matchups they wouldn’t this time either. So basically it’s hopeless and they might as well not try.
 
MassillonTigers3 said:
Exactly. Hoban has had a great decade of football but otherwise has been the definition of average yet some of their fans (who have only followed football for 5 years lol) talk down on other programs who have had sustained success for decades
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No one is talking down other programs, just stating our opinion of the current game. And you know nothing of how long anyone has followed football.
 
MassillonTigers3 said:
Don’t recall Avon having big time college commits that were veteran players in previous years like they do this year. Maybe that’s why their fans and others felt they were better this year. YOU said that because they didn’t win in previous matchups they wouldn’t this time either. So basically it’s hopeless and they might as well not try.
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Amazing how much you know about Avon suddenly? I would be concerned with Andersen first. No one said hopeless or shouldn't try either, those are your words. All I said is I didn't see them winning. Go read your own game threads where you guys have buried Andersen for the past week. Lol
 
Cougarfan22 said:
No one is talking down other programs, just stating our opinion of the current game. And you know nothing of how long anyone has followed football.
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YOUR post was the definition of talking down on a program. You said it didn’t matter who they had they were gonna lose and since they lost the last couple times in the semis they would lose again and then talked about Hoban’s record
 
MassillonTigers3 said:
YOUR post was the definition of talking down on a program. You said it didn’t matter who they had they were gonna lose and since they lost the last couple times in the semis they would lose again and then talked about Hoban’s record
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Again, go read your own game thread where you do the same thing. See you next Thursday.
 
Cougarfan22 said:
Amazing how much you know about Avon suddenly? I would be concerned with Andersen first. No one said hopeless or shouldn't try either, those are your words. All I said is I didn't see them winning. Go read your own game threads where you guys have buried Andersen for the past week. Lol
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Massillon and Avon scrimmage each other EVERY year. We see them a lot as a result and there is a great deal of mutual respect between the programs which leads to fans of each paying attention to the other team.
 
Cougarfan22 said:
Go read your own game threads where you guys have buried Andersen for the past week.
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Comprehension ain't your thing, is it?

Most of the comments on that thread (as well as the overwhelming poll vote) acknowledge that Massillon is the favorite. However, there are multiple cautionary notes and little of the disrespectful fanboi bravado that you spew. Massillon fans realize they could lose on Friday. You don't even consider an Avon win a possibility and disparage their program in the process. That's not objectivity; that's arrogance.

Ya know, most Massillon fans would like to see Avon win this week irrespective of who they were playing (unless it were Massillon). That is, they aren't nearly as concerned with Hoban as you think they are. Certainly not as much as you're concerned with Massillon.

Finally, it's Anderson with an "o".
 
Footballguy00005 said:
I agree the Oline is the best they will see from a size perspective. However, disagree with best schematically. Watching Hoban for years since TT took over…. It’s very obvious he’s taken the KISS (keep it simple stupid). They rarely pass the ball 80-90% run. The run schemes are simple schemes that rely on strength and size to lean on the other teams. Overall, from my perspective they have a very elementary system but the Jimmy and Joes make it all work.
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Then you haven't paid close enough attention. They obviously have a core set of run plays that they run a lot, have mastered and execute at a high level. But when the line is healthy, they will move guys all over the place to exploit matchups and keep defenses unsure of what they're seeing. They started getting back into that vs Barberton, and continued vs Walsh. One of the things Tyrrell and his staff have excelled at over the years is adding a few wrinkles for the playoffs that they haven't put on film. The oline position versatility started in the 2017 playoffs with Rumler and RJ Kelly moving around at times, and when they think they have the guys with the talent and athleticism to execute it and understand the responsibilities of each OL spot, it can truly be a weapon in the run game.
 
Redwing said:
Then you haven't paid close enough attention. They obviously have a core set of run plays that they run a lot, have mastered and execute at a high level. But when the line is healthy, they will move guys all over the place to exploit matchups and keep defenses unsure of what they're seeing. They started getting back into that vs Barberton, and continued vs Walsh. One of the things Tyrrell and his staff have excelled at over the years is adding a few wrinkles for the playoffs that they haven't put on film. The oline position versatility started in the 2017 playoffs with Rumler and RJ Kelly moving around at times, and when they think they have the guys with the talent and athleticism to execute it and understand the responsibilities of each OL spot, it can truly be a weapon in the run game.
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Yeah idc what people want to say about Tyrell but they scheme up some great stuff to attack perceived weaknesses of the defense and put players in positions to be successful
 
Oil Filter said:
Comprehension ain't your thing, is it?

Most of the comments on that thread (as well as the overwhelming poll vote) acknowledge that Massillon is the favorite. However, there are multiple cautionary notes and little of the disrespectful fanboi bravado that you spew. Massillon fans realize they could lose on Friday. You don't even consider an Avon win a possibility and disparage their program in the process. That's not objectivity; that's arrogance.

Ya know, most Massillon fans would like to see Avon win this week irrespective of who they were playing (unless it were Massillon). That is, they aren't nearly as concerned with Hoban as you think they are. Certainly not as much as you're concerned with Massillon.

Finally, it's Anderson with an "o".
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Please spare us. Your thread is littered with running it down there throat and winning by 3-4 scores and that's fine. You should be confident in your team at this point. They are undefeated and playing at a very high level. But don't come on here and tell us how we are over confident. I was thinking of Andersen windows. lol.
 
Cougarfan22 said:
Please spare us. Your thread is littered with running it down there throat and winning by 3-4 scores and that's fine. You should be confident in your team at this point. They are undefeated and playing at a very high level. But don't come on here and tell us how we are over confident.
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No. There are lots of comments about how and why Massillon might have the advantage over Anderson. Some might be hyperbolic, but most are based on reasoned analysis. Come 9:30 Friday night, maybe every bit of that is wrong. What you don't see is what you've said: they don't even belong in the game because they don't deserve any respect.
 
MassillonTigers3 said:
Yeah idc what people want to say about Tyrell but they scheme up some great stuff to attack perceived weaknesses of the defense and put players in positions to be successful
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My beef with Tyrell is the amount of penalties his team has every game especially giving teams 1st downs jumping offsides multiple times all the time. I do give him credit. He prepares his team very well, makes good in game adjustments and does scheme up some nice plays in the playoffs. 8thAlso he has done his best coaching in the state semis and finals. Usually has his bad coaching during the regular season and earlier in the playoffs. He gets away with it most of the time because he has a large talent advantage
 
Oil Filter said:
No. There are lots of comments about how and why Massillon might have the advantage over Anderson. Some might be hyperbolic, but most are based on reasoned analysis. Come 9:30 Friday night, maybe every bit of that is wrong. What you don't see is what you've said: they don't even belong in the game because they don't deserve any respect.
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Reasoned analysis ok right. 😂 I did not say any of the above, those are your words. I said I didn't see Avon winning and that IMO this team wasn't different from the previous undefeated teams that Hoban and Massillon defeated. Until they win this game and the championship they will not be any different. Not being disrespectful, just a fact.
 
Redwing said:
Then you haven't paid close enough attention. They obviously have a core set of run plays that they run a lot, have mastered and execute at a high level. But when the line is healthy, they will move guys all over the place to exploit matchups and keep defenses unsure of what they're seeing. They started getting back into that vs Barberton, and continued vs Walsh. One of the things Tyrrell and his staff have excelled at over the years is adding a few wrinkles for the playoffs that they haven't put on film. The oline position versatility started in the 2017 playoffs with Rumler and RJ Kelly moving around at times, and when they think they have the guys with the talent and athleticism to execute it and understand the responsibilities of each OL spot, it can truly be a weapon in the run game.
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I’ve played plenty of close attention. He handed the ball off to one player over 40 times in last years state championship game. That’s so diverse and genius…. He lost badly to Winton Woods and made little to no adjustments. TT hasn’t “mastered” any special scheme. He has however, “mastered” getting genetic freaks to come be a Knight and run ISO 50 times right at you per game, punt the ball and play defense. It’s been a winning formula there’s no doubt but I wouldn’t call it anything special or game changing. The Knights simply have better players across the board than 97% of teams they play.
 
Oil Filter said:
Do you even listen to yourself? Until and unless a program wins a title, they're trash. And you're not being disrespectful? GTFO.
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Again, your words not mine, I said they wouldn't be different than the other team that fell short of winning it all. That doesn't mean they were trash, or anything else. It simply means that didn't achieve their ultimate goal. That's a fact, not being disrespectful at all. Sorry you don't like the truth. They have a great program but have not been able to win it all yet. Similar to someone else we all know.
 
Footballguy00005 said:
I’ve played plenty of close attention. He handed the ball off to one player over 40 times in last years state championship game. That’s so diverse and genius…. He lost badly to Winton Woods and made little to no adjustments. TT hasn’t “mastered” any special scheme. He has however, “mastered” getting genetic freaks to come be a Knight and run ISO 50 times right at you per game, punt the ball and play defense. It’s been a winning formula there’s no doubt but I wouldn’t call it anything special or game changing. The Knights simply have better players across the board than 97% of teams they play.
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Guess you didn't watch the 2015-2018 title games. Long TD passes, strong running game and great defenses. 2017 game freshman QB threw for 4 TD's in first half alone. Blocked punts for TD, fake Punts. The past few years they have relied on the run primarily and you see what happened. Those first 4 teams were not genetic freaks, they were complete teams with mixture of talented players who bought in and set the standard. I would argue that the more recent teams have more raw talent but not the team mentality of the earlier championship squads
 
Oil Filter said:
And you took issue when someone mentioned flexible admissions standards. Nice to see your tacit admission. :D
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You flip on a dime to suit your agenda but that's fine. How does raw talent = flexible admission standards? Explain in your own words what you are implying?
 
Cougarfan22 said:
Guess you didn't watch the 2015-2018 title games. Long TD passes, strong running game and great defenses. 2017 game freshman QB threw for 4 TD's in first half alone. Blocked punts for TD, fake Punts. The past few years they have relied on the run primarily and you see what happened. Those first 4 teams were not genetic freaks, they were complete teams with mixture of talented players who bought in and set the standard. I would argue that the more recent teams have more raw talent but not the team mentality of the earlier championship squads
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He schemes up passes to throw over defenses’ heads when you have high school football players selling out to try to stop rumler, Dickerson, chip (osu) RB. I’m sorry, but he doesn’t get to be a great coach in my book after losing those last two state titles with teams with way more talent than their opponent. The TCC game was borderline hilarious couldn’t scheme up a single passing yard with a D1 QB.
 
This is a tough one for me. Got Matty Rich on one side and Mike Elder on the other. Best of luck to both of you. Let the winner, win it all.
 
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