2023 Northern Buckeye Conference

[chs1971]

Oh yes. The mighty spread!

Jerry Rutherford was pretty successful when Eastwood was Run-and-Shoot.

I understand the new coach said he wants to pass the ball, but spread doesn't necessarily mean pass. It could mean option, it could mean four backs in the backfield. And the passing game can vary depending upon what the QB is capabled of.

You gotta coach what you know.

 

[BGSUGrad]

I would think the QB front runner would be Caden Donnell, he ran then JV team offense last year.
of course they would get the transfer back from Whitmer now that they are a spread offense lol

 

[NLLBEST]

I think every team in the NBC is some version of spread now…I’m sure each will have their own identity and unique nuances but I’ve gotta say if I was Oak Harbor, Maumee or Rossford I’d be pretty happy with the changes at Genoa and Eastwood the last few years. I always thought their physicality and style of play made them a tough matchup and going spread you tend to lose some of that identity.

 

[chs1971]

I think every team in the NBC is some version of spread now…I’m sure each will have their own identity and unique nuances but I’ve gotta say if I was Oak Harbor, Maumee or Rossford I’d be pretty happy with the changes at Genoa and Eastwood the last few years. I always thought their physicality and style of play made them a tough matchup and going spread you tend to lose some of that identity.

You think AW is less physical since they've changed HC's and switched from wing-T to spread?

I think they are more physical.

 

[TIITA]

Cotterman became an assistant Kregals first year as head coach at Perrysburg and was with him till the end. My guess is you will see a very similar philosophy as his mentor. Cotterman being a college lineman and offensive line coach, I see spreading the field to run the ball.

 

[irish_buffalo]

I think every team in the NBC is some version of spread now…I’m sure each will have their own identity and unique nuances but I’ve gotta say if I was Oak Harbor, Maumee or Rossford I’d be pretty happy with the changes at Genoa and Eastwood the last few years. I always thought their physicality and style of play made them a tough matchup and going spread you tend to lose some of that identity.

I am not saying Genoa and Eastwood were not physical because they were but they were a tough match-up because it is difficult to prepare for them because you do not see those offenses anymore. Six weeks of playing spread teams and then one week to prepare for a well oiled winged-T type is not easy to do.

 

[irish_buffalo]

Cotterman became an assistant Kregals first year as head coach at Perrysburg and was with him till the end. My guess is you will see a very similar philosophy as his mentor. Cotterman being a college lineman and offensive line coach, I see spreading the field to run the ball.

I'd imagine the same. It is what Kregel ran, it is what Brungard runs, and what Whitmer has done since 2006. Spread the defense looking for mismatches and run the ball (RB, HB, Slot, QB). IMO it is the best HS offense.

I heard an old coach say it really does not matter what offense you run as it is the defense that matters most. New Albany made it to the DI Final 4 last year running the winged-T. They had a stout defense.

As an aside, all things considered, I think Eastwood got a great football coach. Wrestling coach too.

 

[BGSUGrad]

Any team can be physical, I think the biggest difference is the number of possessions. If you are running the wing T well, the other team may only get the ball 7-8 times a game. Even running the spread well you might need to play defense 10-12 times.
If you stop the other team half the time 21 points versus 35 points is a big difference to have to outscore.

 

[NLLBEST]

I'd imagine the same. It is what Kregel ran, it is what Brungard runs, and what Whitmer has done since 2006. Spread the defense looking for mismatches and run the ball (RB, HB, Slot, QB). IMO it is the best HS offense.

I heard an old coach say it really does not matter what offense you run as it is the defense that matters most. New Albany made it to the DI Final 4 last year running the winged-T. They had a stout defense.

As an aside, all things considered, I think Eastwood got a great football coach. Wrestling coach too.

I agree, you can run anything and be successful if you do it well and the wing-t is a difficult and unique offense to prepare for. I think it’s harder to establish an identity as a physical team from the spread unless you use an H/FB/Wing/TE combination most plays. Anthony Wayne, Central and Perrysburg most years all run what I’d consider a power spread, splitting out a couple athletes for spacing and then running to set up the pass. A true 4 wide offense is more of what I would refer to when I say spread leads to more of a finesse identity for your team in my opinion.

 

[chs1971]

Any team can be physical, I think the biggest difference is the number of possessions. If you are running the wing T well, the other team may only get the ball 7-8 times a game. Even running the spread well you might need to play defense 10-12 times.
If you stop the other team half the time 21 points versus 35 points is a big difference to have to outscore.

The formation doesn't matter. Run the ball. Don't pass.

On the other hand, if you have to play defense 10-12 times because you're scoring 10-12 TD' every game, well that's a problem most coaches would love to have.

 

[irish_buffalo]

I agree, you can run anything and be successful if you do it well and the wing-t is a difficult and unique offense to prepare for. I think it’s harder to establish an identity as a physical team from the spread unless you use an H/FB/Wing/TE combination most plays. Anthony Wayne, Central and Perrysburg most years all run what I’d consider a power spread, splitting out a couple athletes for spacing and then running to set up the pass. A true 4 wide offense is more of what I would refer to when I say spread leads to more of a finesse identity for your team in my opinion.

Findlay was the first real big bog school in NWOhio to run the spread under Cliff Hite IMO. They spread the ball around well and were the first team to really utilize the "bubble" screen game. Is what they did not do was have designed run plays for their QB, but who can blame them when they had guys like Roethlisberger and Johann at the helm. Since then, guys like Mayzes, Boles, Rios, and Palka established a power run attack from the spread with the ability to pass fairly easily when needed. Kregel, Brungard, and Dempsey have all adapted something similar. Perrysburg under Kregel did a really good job of using an HB and moving him all over the place (TE, slot, wing, off-set FB) as an extra blocker in order to create mismatches in the run game. Central was still running I formation through 2010. Dempsey is no dummy, he caught on a copied the system, even pulling good assistants from some of these aforementioned teams. The spread systems simply prevent teams from loading the box like you can against a winged-T team and when you add the QB to the playbook you can create some serious imbalance and mismatches.

Is what they all did/do very well is run the QB. Some more than others but it causes fits for a defense to have to account for 6 instead of 5 in the run game.

Football will never change and if you want to win ball games you have to establish the run. I do not care if it is the winged-T or the spread, you must run the ball in order to win.

 

[BGSUGrad]

The formation doesn't matter. Run the ball. Don't pass.

On the other hand, if you have to play defense 10-12 times because you're scoring 10-12 TD' every game, well that's a problem most coaches would love to have.

Haha well ya, scoring 70 a game will make you a winner. But we have seen for years the only “spread” teams that win state are the very best. Can Eastwood be the very best? Perhaps?
but it’s way more likely they score a lot of points, beat most teams with having better athletes and when they play the best teams they struggle (perhaps like a rossford)

 

[cometrules]

Rossford will never be great because they can't play defense. They're soft.

 

[chs1971]

Haha well ya, scoring 70 a game will make you a winner. But we have seen for years the only “spread” teams that win state are the very best. Can Eastwood be the very best? Perhaps?
but it’s way more likely they score a lot of points, beat most teams with having better athletes and when they play the best teams they struggle (perhaps like a rossford)

Eastwood lost in the state finals to a team that ran the ball as well as Eastwood but could also pass the ball.

Eastwood doesn't want to pass the ball and is very limited, and their pass defense had two big holes in it.

 

[chs1971]

Findlay was the first real big bog school in NWOhio to run the spread under Cliff Hite IMO. They spread the ball around well and were the first team to really utilize the "bubble" screen game. Is what they did not do was have designed run plays for their QB, but who can blame them when they had guys like Roethlisberger and Johann at the helm. Since then, guys like Mayzes, Boles, Rios, and Palka established a power run attack from the spread with the ability to pass fairly easily when needed. Kregel, Brungard, and Dempsey have all adapted something similar. Perrysburg under Kregel did a really good job of using an HB and moving him all over the place (TE, slot, wing, off-set FB) as an extra blocker in order to create mismatches in the run game. Central was still running I formation through 2010. Dempsey is no dummy, he caught on a copied the system, even pulling good assistants from some of these aforementioned teams. The spread systems simply prevent teams from loading the box like you can against a winged-T team and when you add the QB to the playbook you can create some serious imbalance and mismatches.

Is what they all did/do very well is run the QB. Some more than others but it causes fits for a defense to have to account for 6 instead of 5 in the run game.

Football will never change and if you want to win ball games you have to establish the run. I do not care if it is the winged-T or the spread, you must run the ball in order to win.

I'm getting old and can't remember exactly.

Hite was Findlay's HC form '96 -'06. Were they spread in '96? I know they were on '99 because I remember watching Roethlisberger in the playoffs.

Southview was state runner-up in '99. They had been running an essentially one-back offense and I think that was the first year Mayzes put the QB in shotgun, essentially adding a running back. They weren't a zone, zone-read, option, bubble or tunnel screen team though. I can remember the buzz at the state finals about the team that was in shotgun every play.

In 2001 Urban came to BGSU and the football world changed.

 

[irish_buffalo]

I'm getting old and can't remember exactly.

Hite was Findlay's HC form '96 -'06. Were they spread in '96? I know they were on '99 because I remember watching Roethlisberger in the playoffs.

Southview was state runner-up in '99. They had been running an essentially one-back offense and I think that was the first year Mayzes put the QB in shotgun, essentially adding a running back. They weren't a zone, zone-read, option, bubble or tunnel screen team though. I can remember the buzz at the state finals about the team that was in shotgun every play.

In 2001 Urban came to BGSU and the football world changed.

Hite was more I-formation until he made the switch in 98'. In 97' they had a good RB named Ball who I'm pretty sure led the GLL in rushing. If you remember, he put his kid at QB in 98' and had Roethlisberger at WR only to have Big Ben start the following year (99').

You are right about Mayzes as well. He was one of the first coaches in the area to simply put his best athlete at QB and let him run from the gun. Boles did this at Maumee with Schneider and Goatley as well. If you look back at the success of Toledo area teams in the playoffs since 1999 most of them used this model (Southview: Rowe, Whelan, Pidcock - Whitmer: Dottei, Missler, Holley - CC: Clark, Winters, - Rogers: Tucker Bros. - Perrysburg: Slocum, Dimmerling, Hafner, heck when AW made their Final 4 run and their QB got hurt they just moved their RB [Brown] to QB).

And agree, Urban changed the landscape. To this day, his spread run attack offense is my favorite.

 

[Hback]

Eastwood lost in the state finals to a team that ran the ball as well as Eastwood but could also pass the ball.

Eastwood doesn't want to pass the ball and is very limited, and their pass defense had two big holes in it.

Eastwood was better than Wheelersburg in all aspects but the final score that day. Eastwood held them to 200 yards total offense (which a third of those came in the final 120 seconds of the game) and 30 yards rushing. Not sure either teams offense was the reason one lost/won that day.

 

[chs1971]

Eastwood was better than Wheelersburg in all aspects but the final score that day. Eastwood held them to 200 yards total offense (which a third of those came in the final 120 seconds of the game) and 30 yards rushing. Not sure either teams offense was the reason one lost/won that day.

No, they were not. Eastwood did not lose by an odd bounce of the ball or because someone slipped and fell.

 

[cometrules]

If I remember right Eastwood fullback fumbled on a 1st and goal from the 4 in OT. I also thought Eastwood out played them except the last minute in regulation. I think it was a 30 yard screen play.

 

[Hback]

No, they were not. Eastwood did not lose by an odd bounce of the ball or because someone slipped and fell.

Did you follow or watch the game. Go back and watch the last 2 minutes of the game and the OT. Wheelersburg had 3 different “bounces” go their way.

One on play they had a tipped pass that almost resulted in an interception turn into a reception, which then after the reception turned into a fumble that Burg still managed to jump on. They had a Tebow jump pass for a touchdown and also had a fumble recovery inside their own 5 before Eastwood was about it tie it up in OT.

Burg certainly made the plays, but Lady Luck was a Pirate fan that day.

 

[chs1971]

Did you follow or watch the game. Go back and watch the last 2 minutes of the game and the OT. Wheelersburg had 3 different “bounces” go their way.

One on play they had a tipped pass that almost resulted in an interception turn into a reception, which then after the reception turned into a fumble that Burg still managed to jump on. They had a Tebow jump pass for a touchdown and also had a fumble recovery inside their own 5 before Eastwood was about it tie it up in OT.

Burg certainly made the plays, but Lady Luck was a Pirate fan that day.

I was there.

Eastwood didn't cover the widest receiver vs. trips formation. The corners lined up on the 2nd receiver. Both corners, more than once. It was as if they believed no pass could ever be thrown to the widest player. They were, for some big gains.

Eastwood's LB's did a good job of matching up with underneath receivers but gave up two important plays when a back came out of the backfield and was uncovered. As if they had never seen a 5 receiver pattern before and had no idea what to do, twice.

That's not bad luck.

 

[chs1971]

Hite was more I-formation until he made the switch in 98'. In 97' they had a good RB named Ball who I'm pretty sure led the GLL in rushing. If you remember, he put his kid at QB in 98' and had Roethlisberger at WR only to have Big Ben start the following year (99').

You are right about Mayzes as well. He was one of the first coaches in the area to simply put his best athlete at QB and let him run from the gun. Boles did this at Maumee with Schneider and Goatley as well. If you look back at the success of Toledo area teams in the playoffs since 1999 most of them used this model (Southview: Rowe, Whelan, Pidcock - Whitmer: Dottei, Missler, Holley - CC: Clark, Winters, - Rogers: Tucker Bros. - Perrysburg: Slocum, Dimmerling, Hafner, heck when AW made their Final 4 run and their QB got hurt they just moved their RB [Brown] to QB).

And agree, Urban changed the landscape. To this day, his spread run attack offense is my favorite.

That's on Wikipedia. The whole world knows.

But as I heard Fite explain, he was sleeping with the QB's mom and had no choice.

 

[chs1971]

Haha well ya, scoring 70 a game will make you a winner. But we have seen for years the only “spread” teams that win state are the very best. Can Eastwood be the very best? Perhaps?
but it’s way more likely they score a lot of points, beat most teams with having better athletes and when they play the best teams they struggle (perhaps like a rossford)

I've never seen a mediocre team of any kind win a state championship.

 

[Hback]

I was there.

Eastwood didn't cover the widest receiver vs. trips formation. The corners lined up on the 2nd receiver. Both corners, more than once. It was as if they believed no pass could ever be thrown to the widest player. They were, for some big gains.

Eastwood's LB's did a good job of matching up with underneath receivers but gave up two important plays when a back came out of the backfield and was uncovered. As if they had never seen a 5 receiver pattern before and had no idea what to do, twice.

That's not bad luck.

Literally have no idea what you are talking about.

Those pictures below are their two big pass plays of the last drive in 4th qtr. A 25 yard out that the outside linebacker was a little behind/underneath on. And then a wheel route to the #2 receiver that the outside linebacker couldn't run with. Both great throws by Salyers. And they both happened to be against the same defender. Neither play had any misalignment by the corners.

Yes, on the touchdown play. Both inside LB'ers blitzed which left the free safety one on one with the back out of the backfield.

 

[BGSUGrad]

I've never seen a mediocre team of any kind win a state championship.

So if you have to be the best, would it make more sense to run the offense that 60% of the schools run or the offense that <20% of the schools run.
Clinton-Massie says run the wing T, do it well and the state championship trophies will follow.

 

[BirdDog10]

So if you have to be the best, would it make more sense to run the offense that 60% of the schools run or the offense that <20% of the schools run.
Clinton-Massie says run the wing T, do it well and the state championship trophies will follow.

If you have to be the best, then you run whatever system you know the best and fits your personnel.

Arguing that any system is superior across the board is stupid. The MAC has shown year after year that you can win titles with a spread-based offense. Van Wert just did it 2 years ago with a true spread attack. Divisions 1 and 2 are dominated by teams that run the spread. Yes, they'll mix in some pro-style and some other concepts, but if it was all about running something that teams aren't used to playing against, then Marion Local would never line up in anything other than their I-formation. Good teams run what they are the best at and adjust as needed.

 

[chs1971]

So if you have to be the best, would it make more sense to run the offense that 60% of the schools run or the offense that <20% of the schools run.
Clinton-Massie says run the wing T, do it well and the state championship trophies will follow.

Coach what you know.

 

[chs1971]

Literally have no idea what you are talking about.

OK

 

[Trailsendcustom]

I was there.

Eastwood didn't cover the widest receiver vs. trips formation. The corners lined up on the 2nd receiver. Both corners, more than once. It was as if they believed no pass could ever be thrown to the widest player. They were, for some big gains.

Eastwood's LB's did a good job of matching up with underneath receivers but gave up two important plays when a back came out of the backfield and was uncovered. As if they had never seen a 5 receiver pattern before and had no idea what to do, twice.

That's not bad luck.

The real reason Eastwood lost that game was because their stud defensive lineman got hurt about midway. After that they could not get any pressure on the QB.

That QB also played the second half on a badly broken leg. He posted the X ray online after the game. It was ugly.

 

[chs1971]

The real reason Eastwood lost that game was because their stud defensive lineman got hurt about midway. After that they could not get any pressure on the QB.

I forgot that. That was a big loss.