#1 Georgia vs #3 TCU

14Red

Well-known member
Who did TCU play that was truly good? Texas and Oklahoma aren't anywhere close to what they use to be. Who did TCU play out of conference?
Kansas State took TCU to overtime and should have won. Kansas State then got boat raced by Alabama. TCU struggled with most of their schedule. The big 12 would be a perfect fit for the big 10 west this year.
And the big ten east sans OSU/ Michigan and Penn St.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
How good was Michigan? I think their weak schedule came back to bite them in the end.
Fair question, but then by that token how good was Ohio State? The whole college football season and building the Playoff in general is an inexact science because no one plays the same schedule. Ohio State went down to the wire with Georgia, but lost to Michigan. Michigan lost to TCU, but beat Ohio State. TCU was killed by Georgia. None of it makes sense.

Ohio State's schedule didn't have them prepared for that game. OSU adjusted and prepared for the Semi-finals better than Michigan did.
That's fair. Ohio State had a great game plan and between Day's calls and Strong's execution they played about as well as they could against Georgia, but Georgia also didn't play great. I wouldn't say that Michigan's schedule didn't prepare them, but moreso their arrogance thought they were already penciled in for a rematch with Georgia in the Championship Game. By the time they realized that TCU was good enough to beat them, it was too late. The hole was too big.
TCU played a weaker schedule than OSU or Michigan. I would take OSU, Michigan and Penn State to go undefeated against TCU's schedule.
Did they though? The Notre Dame finish to the season certainly helped because for most of the season that didn't look like a very good win. Michigan's schedule was really bad. And Penn State's wasn't much better. They all benefited from playing each other of course, but outside of that round robin, the others on their scheduled weren't good either. I would probably give Ohio State the best chance to run the table against TCU's schedule, but not Michigan or Penn State. I also don't believe OSU would actually run the table, they likely would have been 12-1, same record as TCU heading into the Playoff.
Alabama destroyed Kansas State in their bowl game. The same Kansas State that took TCU to overtime in their conference championship game. You think Alabama would have had a problem with TCU?
Alabama would probably be favored, as Michigan was against TCU. I'm of the opinion that TCU played it's worse game of the season last night and Georgia played on of their most complete games last night. I think Alabama probably beats TCU head-to-head, but not in the way Georgia did last night. Hell I don't think Georgia would beat them again like that if they played, they would win and likely cover that 12-13 spread but 65-7, no.

That doesn't mean the committee got the wrong teams in or that they screwed up the seeds though. Let's be honest with ourselves, they're not picking the best four teams based on talent or perception, etc. They're picking the four best/most deserving based on how the season played out. In that regard, they got it right no matter how many want to whine about last night's result.
 

cjb5656

Well-known member
I think most of the midwest feels this way. Now I want to add to this that Fox carries the big ten games, so anything you get from Joel Klatt, Fox Sports, Colin Cowherd, etc. it's slanted to the big ten.
Okay, and the same can be said about ABC/CBS/ESPN about the SEC.
 

utsherman

Well-known member
I’ve got USC winning the Pac 12 title, and I think Penn State will beat Wisconsin in the Big Ten title game.

I agree about Florida State and Texas. I’m undecided on the SEC.

I’ve got Notre Dame, USC and two SEC teams between UGA, Bama and Tennessee in the playoff.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
You may want to rethink that Pac 12 prediction, as Lincoln Riley has now confirmed he will retain Alex Grinch as DC.
Will Ferrell Lol GIF
 

adselder09

Well-known member
Yeah, following your logic I guess Ohio State or Michigan could have won the SEC.

Here’s how it went. AEW is right. The Buckeyes gagged against Michigan. I was never a believer in Michigan the entire season, so it was especially galling to watch the Buckeyes lose to that hot garbage. But they did, so UM earned their way into the playoffs. TCU, though? As soon as they lost to KSU, after a year of squeezing out wins in a mediocre league, they should have dropped out in favor of Bama. That TCU vs Michigan game looked and felt JV compared to UGA vs OSU, which looked and felt like a heavyweight bout.
What? No way. 12-0 regular season, losing by 3 in OT to Kansas State? Not a chance in hell they should have dropped out. I certainly didn't get the feeling that it was JV to Varsity watching those two games. 51-45 and 42-41, neither really showcased dominate defensive performances.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
Curious to hear which league other than the SEC is better than the Big Ten?

And don't say Big 12, because TCU, while they had a nice season, finishes fourth in the Big Ten East. They could have won the Big Ten West this year.

Also don;t say the PAC 12, because as I posted months ago, Penn State would win the Pac 12, as shown in their bowl demolition job.

So please tell us. Is it the MAC?
Pac 12 and it wasn't really close. B1G 3rd. Big 12 4th and ACC 5th.
 

bob99

Well-known member
Did they though? The Notre Dame finish to the season certainly helped because for most of the season that didn't look like a very good win. Michigan's schedule was really bad. And Penn State's wasn't much better. They all benefited from playing each other of course, but outside of that round robin, the others on their scheduled weren't good either. I would probably give Ohio State the best chance to run the table against TCU's schedule, but not Michigan or Penn State. I also don't believe OSU would actually run the table, they likely would have been 12-1, same record as TCU heading into the Playoff.
Other than Michigan, who did TCU beat that were that good? Who on TCU schedule do you think would have beat OSU? That is not saying OSU played a good schedule. They didn't. TCU just had an easier schedule.
 

Yappi

Go Buckeyes
How much was the weather a factor for Ohio State and Stroud? Cold/bad weather against Michigan and he struggled. Climate control and he may be the best in college football.

When we get away from the vacation bowl system and get back to real football with teams hosting games, it will be interesting to see if the power dynamics return to the North. There is a reason why USC hosts Notre Dame in November and Notre Dame hosts USC in October. Fear of the cold is a real thing for the warm-weather schools.
 

AEW Champion

Well-known member
How much was the weather a factor for Ohio State and Stroud? Cold/bad weather against Michigan and he struggled. Climate control and he may be the best in college football.

When we get away from the vacation bowl system and get back to real football with teams hosting games, it will be interesting to see if the power dynamics return to the North. There is a reason why USC hosts Notre Dame in November and Notre Dame hosts USC in October. Fear of the cold is a real thing for the warm-weather schools.
Wasn’t it around 50 degrees and calm for this year’s Michigan-OSU game?

USC is at the whim of the Pac 12 for when they play at Washington, Wazzu, Oregon, Oregon State and Colorado, so they’re probably not the best example to use for teams who duck cold weather.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
 

cjb5656

Well-known member
How much was the weather a factor for Ohio State and Stroud? Cold/bad weather against Michigan and he struggled. Climate control and he may be the best in college football.

When we get away from the vacation bowl system and get back to real football with teams hosting games, it will be interesting to see if the power dynamics return to the North. There is a reason why USC hosts Notre Dame in November and Notre Dame hosts USC in October. Fear of the cold is a real thing for the warm-weather schools.
To be fair, the USC vs ND and Stanford vs ND series are scheduled at times desirable for the visiting team fans to make the road trip.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
Other than Michigan, who did TCU beat that were that good? Who on TCU schedule do you think would have beat OSU? That is not saying OSU played a good schedule. They didn't. TCU just had an easier schedule.
Other than Penn St, who did Ohio State beat that were that good?

TCU had road trips to Texas, Baylor, Kansas and West Virginia. Those are all tougher places to play than Northwestern and Maryland this year, maybe even Michigan St this year too. If I had to pick one, probably Texas. If not Texas, maybe Baylor. TCU also did play 6 true road games, compared to Ohio State's 4. And typically, when Ohio State does drop a game, it's usually on the road.
 

bob99

Well-known member
Other than Penn St, who did Ohio State beat that were that good?
Check out the final standings for 2022. TCU played beat and then lost to #14 Kansas State and #25 Texas. Osu played #3 Michigan #7 Penn State and #18 Notre Dame. OSU could have sleep walked through TCU's schedule.
TCU had road trips to Texas, Baylor, Kansas and West Virginia.
#25 Texas with an 8-5 record. 😮 Scary road game.🤣
Name one team that TCU played during the regular season that was any good.
It took 2 overtimes for TCU to beat 7-6 Oklahoma State. The same Oklahoma State who got beat by Wisconsin. The same Wisconsin that got slammed by OSU. The same Oklahoma State that finished with the 5th best record in conference play compared to Wisconsin with the 8th best record in the Big 10 conference.
 

cjb5656

Well-known member
Only issue with that is the SEC doesn't need any fluff, they are the best conferece and prove it every year.
They are the best conference and have produced the ultimate champion nearly every season, but ESPN clearly uses their voice to hype the SEC even beyond what is warranted. They often overhype mediocre mid-level SEC teams as being great teams that just have the misfortune of beating each other. This non-stop drumbeat often fills the rankings…even of the committee…with mediocre SEC teams so they can justify the favorable high seedings of the top SEC teams.
 

14Red

Well-known member
They are the best conference and have produced the ultimate champion nearly every season, but ESPN clearly uses their voice to hype the SEC even beyond what is warranted. They often overhype mediocre mid-level SEC teams as being great teams that just have the misfortune of beating each other. This non-stop drumbeat often fills the rankings…even of the committee…with mediocre SEC teams so they can justify the favorable high seedings of the top SEC teams.
You are kidding me right now, aren't you????

There was two big ten teams in the final four this year, and there is ALWAYS a big ten team in the playoffs, normally Ohio State. I say this annually. Ohio State is normally placed in the top 3 every single year. They play a pretty soft schedule for 3+ months, so we get to the end of the season and we still really do not know how good they are. Now to their credit, they put it all together vs. Georgia and played a heck of a game and nearly pulled it off. But the Ohio State team we saw all year was clearly not a top team. The SEC teams cannot skate through their conference schedule because there are enough good teams in that league that you can get knocked off. The big ten simply does not have that.

I guess at the end of the day, SEC pundits can just say "scoreboard".
 

adselder09

Well-known member
Check out the final standings for 2022. TCU played beat and then lost to #14 Kansas State and #25 Texas. Osu played #3 Michigan #7 Penn State and #18 Notre Dame. OSU could have sleep walked through TCU's schedule.
Well Ohio State didn't beat Michigan. So that looks like two CFP ranked wins for both TCU and Ohio State. One each with a loss to a CFP ranked team.
Texas with an 8-5 record. 😮 Scary road game.🤣
You laugh at Texas, yet they almost beat Alabama at home. Strong RB, better QB than McCarthy. Then want to beat your chest about 9-4 Notre Dame who lost to Marshall and under .500 Stanford.
Name one team that TCU played during the regular season that was any good.
You already named them above. Their two best wins prior to Michigan were at home vs. Kansas St and at Texas. Now when they beat Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and Kansas, each of those teams were ranked at the time of their loss to TCU, but I won't count those because they weren't ranked in the final poll, which is the data point you used.
It took 2 overtimes for TCU to beat 7-6 Oklahoma State. The same Oklahoma State who got beat by Wisconsin. The same Wisconsin that got slammed by OSU. The same Oklahoma State that finished with the 5th best record in conference play compared to Wisconsin with the 8th best record in the Big 10 conference.
So all this talk about "regular season" and you're going to argue a one-time, bowl game Oklahoma State-Wisconsin result? Where neither team had HALF their players from the regular season. The Cowboys played without their best offensive player in QB Spencer Sanders, but Wisconsin played with their best offensive player RB Braelon Allen. That result tells us nothing.
 

AEW Champion

Well-known member
Curious to hear which league other than the SEC is better than the Big Ten?

And don't say Big 12, because TCU, while they had a nice season, finishes fourth in the Big Ten East. They could have won the Big Ten West this year.

Also don;t say the PAC 12, because as I posted months ago, Penn State would win the Pac 12, as shown in their bowl demolition job.

So please tell us. Is it the MAC?
I think on the whole, the Pac 12 was a good deal better than the Big Ten in 2022.

The Pac 12 went a legit seven deep this year, with Utah, USC, Oregon, Washington, UCLA, Oregon State and Washington State.

The Big Ten was probably a bit stronger at the very top, but really only went four deep with Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State and Illinois.

I wouldn’t call the Rose Bowl a demolition. It was a one-score game when Cam Rising got hurt and Utah couldn’t sustain much offense after losing the QB. (FWIW, I consider USC the Pac 12’s best team … they had Utah looking in big trouble in the Pac 12 title game before Caleb Williams popped his hamstring and could no longer move, thus totally altering the rest of that game.)

I can’t ignore Washington taking Michigan State to the woodshed and Washington State going into Madison and beating Wisconsin.

Iowa lost to Big 12 cellar dweller Iowa State. Big Ten West champion Purdue lost to Syracuse. Nebraska lost to Georgia Southern. There just wasn’t any quality depth at all in the Big Ten this year, mainly due to absolutely dismal QB play and lack of offense in general plaguing much of the league.

The Big Ten had one star QB (Stroud) and a couple solid ones (McCarthy, Tagovailoa). On the whole, that group was outshined by the Pac 12’s QB play when you consider Heisman winner Caleb Williams being joined by Cam Rising, Michael Penix, Dorian Thompson-Robinson and Bo Nix.

A lot of years the Big Ten is better than the Pac 12, but not 2022. Blame Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan State, Minnesota, Northwestern for crapping the bed offensively and leaving the Big Ten without a credible middle class this year. And credit USC for a huge Pac 12 boost, plus upswings at Oregon, Washington and Oregon State.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
 

bob99

Well-known member
Well Ohio State didn't beat Michigan. So that looks like two CFP ranked wins for both TCU and Ohio State. One each with a loss to a CFP ranked team.

You laugh at Texas, yet they almost beat Alabama at home. Strong RB, better QB than McCarthy. Then want to beat your chest about 9-4 Notre Dame who lost to Marshall and under .500 Stanford.

You already named them above. Their two best wins prior to Michigan were at home vs. Kansas St and at Texas. Now when they beat Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and Kansas, each of those teams were ranked at the time of their loss to TCU, but I won't count those because they weren't ranked in the final poll, which is the data point you used.

So all this talk about "regular season" and you're going to argue a one-time, bowl game Oklahoma State-Wisconsin result? Where neither team had HALF their players from the regular season. The Cowboys played without their best offensive player in QB Spencer Sanders, but Wisconsin played with their best offensive player RB Braelon Allen. That result tells us nothing.
Overall the big 12 stinks. With Oklahoma and Texas joining all the teams that left in the past, the big 12 will not be a power 5 conference. Overall they weren't this year either. The Pac will be on the back burner when USC and UCLA leave. Ohio State and Michigan would go undefeated playing TCU schedules. TCU couldn't.
 

cjb5656

Well-known member
I think on the whole, the Pac 12 was a good deal better than the Big Ten in 2022.

The Pac 12 went a legit seven deep this year, with Utah, USC, Oregon, Washington, UCLA, Oregon State and Washington State.

The Big Ten was probably a bit stronger at the very top, but really only went four deep with Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State and Illinois.

I wouldn’t call the Rose Bowl a demolition. It was a one-score game when Cam Rising got hurt and Utah couldn’t sustain much offense after losing the QB. (FWIW, I consider USC the Pac 12’s best team … they had Utah looking in big trouble in the Pac 12 title game before Caleb Williams popped his hamstring and could no longer move, thus totally altering the rest of that game.)

I can’t ignore Washington taking Michigan State to the woodshed and Washington State going into Madison and beating Wisconsin.

Iowa lost to Big 12 cellar dweller Iowa State. Big Ten West champion Purdue lost to Syracuse. Nebraska lost to Georgia Southern. There just wasn’t any quality depth at all in the Big Ten this year, mainly due to absolutely dismal QB play and lack of offense in general plaguing much of the league.

The Big Ten had one star QB (Stroud) and a couple solid ones (McCarthy, Tagovailoa). On the whole, that group was outshined by the Pac 12’s QB play when you consider Heisman winner Caleb Williams being joined by Cam Rising, Michael Penix, Dorian Thompson-Robinson and Bo Nix.

A lot of years the Big Ten is better than the Pac 12, but not 2022. Blame Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan State, Minnesota, Northwestern for crapping the bed offensively and leaving the Big Ten without a credible middle class this year. And credit USC for a huge Pac 12 boost, plus upswings at Oregon, Washington and Oregon State.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
That is a pretty fair assessment. I remember being pizzed at MSU, Wisky and Iowa for dropping those early OOC games.

I really like Washington to rule the PAC 12 in 2023. Penix is at least the equal of Williams, if not better.
 

bob99

Well-known member
You already named them above. Their two best wins prior to Michigan were at home vs. Kansas St and at Texas. Now when they beat Oklahoma, Oklahoma State and Kansas, each of those teams were ranked at the time of their loss to TCU, but I won't count those because they weren't ranked in the final poll, which is the data point you used.
I said regular season
Name one team that TCU played during the regular season that was any good.
Kansas St 10-4 and gets clobbered by Alabama. Texas 8-5. Weak league weak schedule.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
I think on the whole, the Pac 12 was a good deal better than the Big Ten in 2022.

The Pac 12 went a legit seven deep this year, with Utah, USC, Oregon, Washington, UCLA, Oregon State and Washington State.

The Big Ten was probably a bit stronger at the very top, but really only went four deep with Ohio State, Michigan, Penn State and Illinois.

I wouldn’t call the Rose Bowl a demolition. It was a one-score game when Cam Rising got hurt and Utah couldn’t sustain much offense after losing the QB. (FWIW, I consider USC the Pac 12’s best team … they had Utah looking in big trouble in the Pac 12 title game before Caleb Williams popped his hamstring and could no longer move, thus totally altering the rest of that game.)

I can’t ignore Washington taking Michigan State to the woodshed and Washington State going into Madison and beating Wisconsin.

Iowa lost to Big 12 cellar dweller Iowa State. Big Ten West champion Purdue lost to Syracuse. Nebraska lost to Georgia Southern. There just wasn’t any quality depth at all in the Big Ten this year, mainly due to absolutely dismal QB play and lack of offense in general plaguing much of the league.

The Big Ten had one star QB (Stroud) and a couple solid ones (McCarthy, Tagovailoa). On the whole, that group was outshined by the Pac 12’s QB play when you consider Heisman winner Caleb Williams being joined by Cam Rising, Michael Penix, Dorian Thompson-Robinson and Bo Nix.

A lot of years the Big Ten is better than the Pac 12, but not 2022. Blame Wisconsin, Iowa, Michigan State, Minnesota, Northwestern for crapping the bed offensively and leaving the Big Ten without a credible middle class this year. And credit USC for a huge Pac 12 boost, plus upswings at Oregon, Washington and Oregon State.

It’s true, it’s true. Trust me …
Well said. Spot on.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
Overall the big 12 stinks.
Why's that? Because Texas or Oklahoma didn't play in the Big 12 title game? Big brand bias. The B1G as an entire conference was BARELY better than the Big 12 this year.
With Oklahoma and Texas joining all the teams that left in the past, the big 12 will not be a power 5 conference. Overall they weren't this year either.
LOL of course they were. TCU just won a Playoff game. Kansas State made the Sugar Bowl. Non-Power 5 Conferences don't send a team to the Playoff AND a major NY6 bowl. The conference will be fine without Texas and Oklahoma. Behind the SEC and B1G, no doubt. But I would take the new Big 12 over the ACC and over the Pac 12 without UCLA and USC.
Ohio State and Michigan would go undefeated playing TCU schedules. TCU couldn't.
No they wouldn't. Going undefeated is HARD. We just wrapped up Year 9 of the CFP. How many of those 36 teams entered the Playoff undefeated?

We've seen Clemson lose one game in a crappy ACC. We've seen Ohio State lose one game to a middling B1G team. We've seen 1-loss SEC teams. We've seen 1-loss Oklahoma. You cannot sit here and tell me that both Michigan and Ohio State would have finished undefeated with TCU's schedule when we KNOW that TCU beat Michigan. We also KNOW Ohio State has finished undefeated in the regular season exactly ONE time in the CFP era, 2019 (I'm not counting their 5-0 Covid season in 2020). And most years it's the conference that slips them up:
2014 - 35-21 L to Virginia Tech
2015 - 17-14 L to Michigan St
2016 - 24-21 L to Penn St
2017 - 55-24 L to Iowa
2018 - 49-20 L to Purdue
2021 - 42-27 L to Michigan
2022 - 45-23 L to Michigan

By the same token Oklahoma - who has been the most consistent Big 12 team in the CFP era - has finished the regular season undefeated ZERO times.
2014 - 8-4
2015 - 11-1 (lost to Texas)
2016 - 10-2 (undefeated in Big 12 play)
2017 - 12-1 (lost to Iowa St)
2018 - 12-1 (lost to Texas)
2019 - 12-1 (lost to Kansas St)
2020 - 8-2 (lost to Kansas St & Iowa St)
2021 - 10-2 (lost to Baylor & Oklahoma St)

So no. Ohio State and Michigan would not walk over TCU's schedule undefeated. And TCU wouldn't have gone undefeated against theirs either.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
I said regular season

Kansas St 10-4 and gets clobbered by Alabama. Texas 8-5. Weak league weak schedule.
TCU beat Kansas St and Texas in the regular season. Those are the games I named. Those were their best regular season wins yes.

Kansas St beat TCU in OT and lost another close one. Texas beat Kansas St handily. Texas should have beat Alabama. Alabama crushes Kansas St. What does that tell us? You can't use the transitive property in football.
 

bob99

Well-known member
TCU beat Kansas St and Texas in the regular season. Those are the games I named. Those were their best regular season wins yes.

Kansas St beat TCU in OT and lost another close one. Texas beat Kansas St handily. Texas should have beat Alabama. Alabama crushes Kansas St. What does that tell us? You can't use the transitive property in football.
Apparently Marcus Freeman agrees with me. I think he knows more than you and me put together.(y)
Marcus Freeman left TCU out of the top four in his final Coaches Poll
 

bob99

Well-known member
So no. Ohio State and Michigan would not walk over TCU's schedule undefeated. And TCU wouldn't have gone undefeated against theirs either.
I disagree. TCU didn't play one decent team in the regular season. Michigan took TCU too lightly in the semi and still almost came back to beat them. Play that game again and Michigan would easily beat them. Georgia and Alabama showed how bad the Big 12 was this year.

Kansas St beat TCU in OT and lost another close one. Texas beat Kansas St handily. Texas should have beat Alabama. Alabama crushes Kansas St. What does that tell us? You can't use the transitive property in football.
That tell us that the Big 12 is a mediocre league with mediocre teams. It was hard for real Power 5 schools to take them seriously.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
I disagree. TCU didn't play one decent team in the regular season. Michigan took TCU too lightly in the semi and still almost came back to beat them. Play that game again and Michigan would easily beat them. Georgia and Alabama showed how bad the Big 12 was this year.
That's fine you can disagree, but the bolded statement is flat out wrong per the committee and probably - because I didn't look at his entire coaches poll - your buddy Marcus Freeman. Again Texas was ranked. And Kansas State was ranked and also won the Big 12. So that's just factually inaccurate.
That tell us that the Big 12 is a mediocre league with mediocre teams. It was hard for real Power 5 schools to take them seriously.
Wrong again. TCU won a Playoff game. Period. Kansas State also won the Big 12 and made the Sugar Bowl.

If the Big 12 was a mediocre league, then the same can be said about the B1G as a league. Which is what AEW and 14Red have been saying for months.
 

bob99

Well-known member
If the Big 12 was a mediocre league, then the same can be said about the B1G as a league. Which is what AEW and 14Red have been saying for months.
Other than Michigan, Ohio State and Penn State the Big was a mediocre league. The Big 12 from top to bottom was mediocre. College football overall was mediocre compared to past years. So many teams with 6-6 records in bowl games. That is mediocrity. The Big 12 championship with a 10-4 record.:ROFLMAO: They wouldn't win any of the other power five championships. They probably wouldn't even qualify to play in any of them.
 
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