Absolute joke. There's only one reason why they made this decision: Big 12 move.
They retained Fickell. Big-name coach. Big-time salary. AAC sucks as a conference. It's time to make a move. Why else would a coach stay there when he had Mich St on the radar and the B1G? They had this planned for quite some time. The AAC lost UConn earlier. It's been done before that men's soccer takes the fall so that football can benefit.
Hiding behind a pandemic is unethical and dishonest. This has nothing to do with a virus and its "uncertainty." If it was about cutting sports to save money, they'd cut baseball who lost nearly twice as much in the 2019 fiscal year. I'd never advocate for cutting any sports, as these schools have the budgets to operate them all.
Nice feedback. Care to elaborate? Probably not because you have nothing to back it up with.What an uninformed post on nearly every aspect.
Who says conferences aren't expanding?It has zero to do with the Big 12 move as conferences aren't expanding.
Baseball lost over $1.3m, they've kept their program. It has NOTHING to do with success on (or off) the field. There's no return on investment in most sports, that's a lousy argument.It has everything to do with the soccer program losing $800k last year and having little success with one year with a winning record this decade. I mean they went a combined 8-25-2 in the last two years. There is no return on investment. It's a garbage program.
Nowhere did I say that the decision was "solely because of the virus." But, the statement led off with: "During this time of profound challenges and widespread uncertainty, I have intensified my effort to study and consider the broad spectrum of the UC Athletics Department. This has included a comprehensive and thorough review of our sport offerings and the long-term budget implications of supporting the number of student-athletes currently at UC. "Nowhere does the letter from Cunningham suggest it was solely because of the virus. The virus was the final nail in the coffin especially when there's a chance the university won't be able to rely on the nearly $1m it receives per home game between ticket sales, concessions and parking. Only an idiot would think the University spent less than a month into making the decision to cut the program. This has been looked at for much longer.
Yeah, okay. Go ahead and think that Fickell didn't play a part in this. He cannot wait until FCC leaves Nippert. He despises soccer. Ask anyone that's around the program (UC football or FCC).There are multiple reasons Fickell stayed vs. going to Michigan State and again, has nothing to do with expansion. It has more to do with having a better team, better recruiting class, and his family. It's the same reason he passed on the WVU, Arkansas and other P5 jobs to stay at UC. The same reason he stayed on as OSU's defensive coordinator for 11 years and took a job 90 minutes down the road instead of going further away earlier in his career.
And, because the AAC is falling apart -- plus, it sucks.UConn left the AAC to go to a basketball centered conference (as opposed to a football centered conference) because they dropped football from FBS to FCS since they were losing so much money in football.
Schools can operate all sports. It's how they choose to operate them. Does UC need an $800,000+ budget for a soccer team? NO. No one in college soccer needs that. Just like Ohio State doesn't need a $1+ million budget for their men's soccer program. That doesn't mean they can't operate the sports and they need to be cut. College athletics has become a spending venture. Instead of managing finances better, they want to reshuffle the finances to compete OR be attractive.And finally, athletic departments most certainly do not have the budget to operate all sports. There are only a handful of schools where the athletic department makes money. UC is not one of them, they operate in the red and have to dip into the general university funds. Other students' tuition should not be used to pay the soccer team's expenses.
Who says conferences aren't expanding?
Baseball lost over $1.3m, they've kept their program. It has NOTHING to do with success on (or off) the field. There's no return on investment in most sports, that's a lousy argument.
Nowhere did I say that the decision was "solely because of the virus."
Hiding behind a pandemic is unethical and dishonest.
Of course they've thought about cutting the program to move to the Big 12. It's been done before by other institutions, and it'll continue to be done -- not necessarily just men's soccer being cut. Look at Valpo cutting men's soccer, they claimed some of the same things that UC did.
Yeah, okay. Go ahead and think that Fickell didn't play a part in this. He cannot wait until FCC leaves Nippert. He despises soccer. Ask anyone that's around the program (UC football or FCC).
And, because the AAC is falling apart
Schools can operate all sports.
Guess what...some donors came forward to fund UC men's soccer for 5 years, would cost UC nothing. UC turned them down.
You serious? There has to be traceable moves in the last "5 years" to confirm/deny any expansion? Maryland and Rutgers moved to the B1G in 2014, sorry that's outside your 5-year window...Oh right, I missed the part where the Pac12, Big 12, Big 10, ACC and SEC have added schools in the last 5 years. Good call.
No one said you did.Where did I make the argument that baseball shouldn't be cut too? Right, I didn't.
No. I didn't.lol yes you did:
I love a good "garage program." Programs aren't cut for being "garage." There's ALWAYS an ulterior motive for them. Every school has garbage programs, and guess what...they are kept...routinely.Again, has nothing to do with the Big 12 and you've brought zero evidence to support that claim. It has everything to do with the fact it's a garage program and cost a lot of money. Valpo? Oh, right I forgot they moved to a P5 conference and haven't remained in the MVC and FCS, good comparison.
It's my opinion, and one that is very educated in what's happened -- not just now, but in the recent past. This has been evaluated for numerous years. Especially since 2016 or before when UC was originally rumored to go Big 12.Where did I say Fickell didn't play a part in this? Now you're just making things up lol standard move when you have nothing to support your argument.
Probably 99% of college soccer programs lose money. Probably 99% of athletic programs (individual programs, not departments) lose money. Many are garbage too. Losing money AND being garbage does not lead to cuts -- especially in a singular program cut. Always more to it.No, because they are a garbage football program and lost money, similar to UC soccer being a garbage program who lost money.
Yeah, you don't know how athletic department budgets work. Okay.Obviously not. The schools give the AD a budget, and only a handful operate in the black or make a profit. It's really not that difficult.
It has nothing to do with losing. It has nothing to do with "waste of athletic department money." It goes WAY beyond both of those. Just like any other program cut across the country does. Balancing budgets is not something schools are great at doing.I really don't care. Maybe the soccer program shouldn't have had 1 winning season the last 10 years and they wouldn't have been in this predicament. Sorry you can't accept it was a waste of athletic department money. Crying about it won't change anything. Luckily you still have a long list of high schools, XU, NKU and FCC to still watch. No one outside the program will miss UC soccer.
You serious? There has to be traceable moves in the last "5 years" to confirm/deny any expansion? Maryland and Rutgers moved to the B1G in 2014, sorry that's outside your 5-year window...
Let's not forget that numerous DII schools have made the transition to DI in the last "5 years" as well. Dixie State, Grand Canyon, Bellarmine, Tarleton State, just to name a few.
To think these conferences aren't trying to expand/strengthen/etc. is definitely a mentality to have. Not saying it's the right one, but it surely isn't how they are thinking.
No one said you did.
No. I didn't.
I love a good "garage program." Programs aren't cut for being "garage." There's ALWAYS an ulterior motive for them. Every school has garbage programs, and guess what...they are kept...routinely.
New Mexico wasn't garbage. They were cut. More athletic programs there were losing MORE money and they were much less successful, yet they were kept.
It's my opinion, and one that is very educated in what's happened -- not just now, but in the recent past. This has been evaluated for numerous years.
Losing money AND being garbage does not lead to cuts -- especially in a singular program cut.
Always more to it.
It has nothing to do with losing. It has nothing to do with "waste of athletic department money." It goes WAY beyond both of those. Just like any other program cut across the country does. Balancing budgets is not something schools are great at doing.
Go ahead and think how you want. You keep moving the goalposts.DII schools moving up to D1 has absolutely nothing to do with the P5 conferences expanding lol. Can't believe you tried to use that as a point for your argument. It's been widely believed that if any conference expansion does happen, the Pac, SEC, ACC and Big 10 will raid the Big 12 and it will dissolve.
Because it makes sense to bring it up. If it were truly about finances, then make a major financial impact in cutting something that loses $500,000 more than men's soccer. Easy.Then why did you bring it up?
That's exactly how the AD led it off, using terminology utilized by all in this pandemic time. Everyone is literally talking about this.Yes you did. "Hiding behind a pandemic."
Because, that's not it. Sorry you can't comprehend that.New Mexico has nothing to do with UC, not sure why you even brought them up. Totally irrelevant. Good for New Mexico for not having a garbage program. UC did, it wasted money, it got axed. Why is this so difficult for you to comprehend?
I didn't state that's the reason it was done, I said it was convenient to do it now and the AD used the terminology.Exactly. Not sure why you blamed "hiding behind a pandemic."
That's small-minded to think it's down to not being successful and losing money. There would be no programs at any school, basically. It's much deeper, always is. Been there, done that too many times.Except when it does lead to a cut, like in UC's case.
Go ahead and think however you want. Programs aren't cut because of lack of success. We'd see cuts all over the place because of that. I'm not a bitter fan. I don't think programs should ever be cut. Opportunities for players at every sport is what I advocate for. I'd be saying the same if this was golf or women's water polo.Sure it does. Until you have proof of otherwise, and using examples from different schools with different situations is not proof despite you continuously trying to make it so, there is no point in continuing with a bitter fan who can't accept realty. I hope you can move on with your life. Enjoy the rest of your week.
Go ahead and think however you want. Programs aren't cut because of lack of success. We'd see cuts all over the place because of that.
-- Yahoo Sports (just one of several reporting the same across all college athletics, and colleges in general).In what is likely a sign of things to come as collegiate athletic departments deal with the financial strain of the coronavirus pandemic, the University of Cincinnati announced Tuesday that it has discontinued its men’s soccer program.
-- Prior AD statement about "prestige" and their motives. The AAC does not do that for them."We want national respect and the ability to play on the biggest stage possible,” Bohn told Fox19 in October 2015. “It’s really fun to be a part of. I feel like this is our time.
How UC funds their athletic downfalls. If they truly wanted to cut budgets, they'd do a lot more than cut a program that only loses $760,000. UC students spend more than twice what other AAC schools (removing UConn) do to fund athletics. Cutting this budget doesn't move that hardly at all ($37 per student -- which they won't refund).UC officials have covered the deficit with student fees and money from the school’s general fund, which is primarily funded by student tuition. For a full-time undergraduate student, the four-year price tag to cover the athletic department’s deficit was almost $4,900, records show.
It has zero to do with the Big 12 move as conferences aren't expanding.
Expansion has already been discussed with Group of 5 schools such as Cincinnati, BYU and Boise State, so adding even bigger name programs to the Big 12 would benefit the conference even more.
CoNfErEnCeS aReN't ExPaNdInG
Schools from the Pac 12 that the Big 12 should consider for expansion
The Big 12 has been centered around conference realignment since 2011 when Nebraska left for the Big 10 and Colorado darted for the Pac 12. The conference once again lost members in 2012 when Misso…longhornswire.usatoday.com
Could be a reality as society looks to travel less as a whole. I would much rather have a tighter geolocated conference than the spreads we have today. Let tournament time be when the cross-regions compete.Getting back to UC and the problem men’s soccer has at many D1 schools...my thought and I know it is probably too simple: let the big revenue generating sports play in the P5 conferences...football and basketball (basketball and soccer for the women)...form more geographically sensible conferences for the rest of the sports...would drastically reduce expenses for the remaining sports. That could make them more feasible for schools to maintain these teams.
Can't say I didn't try to tell everyone this...Absolute joke. There's only one reason why they made this decision: Big 12 move.
They retained Fickell. Big-name coach. Big-time salary. AAC sucks as a conference. It's time to make a move. Why else would a coach stay there when he had Mich St on the radar and the B1G? They had this planned for quite some time. The AAC lost UConn earlier. It's been done before that men's soccer takes the fall so that football can benefit.
Hiding behind a pandemic is unethical and dishonest. This has nothing to do with a virus and its "uncertainty." If it was about cutting sports to save money, they'd cut baseball who lost nearly twice as much in the 2019 fiscal year. I'd never advocate for cutting any sports, as these schools have the budgets to operate them all.
This is one of the biggest misconceptions ever.Colleges dropping non-revenue sports is all about Title IX compliance. These universities have to offer the same number of scholarships for men as women, despite only 1-2 sports per school operating in the black from a revenue perspective. There are no women sports that can compete with men’s football from a scholarship perspective. Therefore they make up the difference by adding women’s sports and cancelling men’s sports that are not self-sufficient or revenue generating to the university. It’s unfortunate as this only hurts the kids. Universities make their money from football, tv revenue and a little bit from basketball home tickets and concessions. These schools don’t even make money from the NCAA Bball tournament … that money goes to the NCAA to fund all of the tournaments for other sports and all divisions. I feel like football should be excluded from Title IX since they do enough already to fund the entire athletic budgets for universities. If you want to offer men’s soccer, then also offer women’s soccer. Men’s baseball? Then offer women’s softball? Same for all other sports … but football is its own animal and funds all the sports for both men and women. Leave them out of the equation.
Keep in mind, that the 2019-20 school year the athletic department operated in the plus. Know what happened that year? Soccer played and baseball didn't. There's also another reason why the athletic department finished in the black (*UC subsidy towards athletics). The original deficit was set at $25+m and that's without any winter sports postseason AND spring sports. Also, in before football makes the department money, because the football team had a $5+m deficit. Men's basketball was $2m in the hole and women's basketball was $2.5m.Cunningham said he and UC President Neville Pinto decided after he "engaged in a comprehensive and thorough review of UC's sports offerings and long-term budget implications of supporting the number of student-athletes currently at UC."
This wasn't an overnight decision to meet Title IX. This has been planned and it took the right people to execute. Ever notice how many changes they've had in the athletic department in the last 5+ years? Not many ADs want that on their résumé, but UC found one that would make the tough call.Men's soccer had a deficit of $642,115 – less than 3% of 2020's $25.2 million athletic deficit, records show.
Just for giggles, "conferences aren't expanding..."Kind of like how you backed your argument with nothing other than pure speculation? lol.
It has zero to do with the Big 12 move as conferences aren't expanding. It has everything to do with the soccer program losing $800k last year and having little success with one year with a winning record this decade. I mean they went a combined 8-25-2 in the last two years. There is no return on investment. It's a garbage program.
Nowhere does the letter from Cunningham suggest it was solely because of the virus. The virus was the final nail in the coffin especially when there's a chance the university won't be able to rely on the nearly $1m it receives per home game between ticket sales, concessions and parking. Only an idiot would think the University spent less than a month into making the decision to cut the program. This has been looked at for much longer.
There are multiple reasons Fickell stayed vs. going to Michigan State and again, has nothing to do with expansion. It has more to do with having a better team, better recruiting class, and his family. It's the same reason he passed on the WVU, Arkansas and other P5 jobs to stay at UC. The same reason he stayed on as OSU's defensive coordinator for 11 years and took a job 90 minutes down the road instead of going further away earlier in his career.
UConn left the AAC to go to a basketball centered conference (as opposed to a football centered conference) because they dropped football from FBS to FCS since they were losing so much money in football.
And finally, athletic departments most certainly do not have the budget to operate all sports. There are only a handful of schools where the athletic department makes money. UC is not one of them, they operate in the red and have to dip into the general university funds. Other students' tuition should not be used to pay the soccer team's expenses.