If you don’t think one coach or player won’t make that claim 10 years from now you’re nuts. If that post is trolling than guilty. Sorry facts don’t have feelings. My opinion is they would lose by 30 week 11 again. Enjoy the undefeated season against the stiff competition that was scheduled.
Undefeated Gibsonburg Could Miss OHSAA Football Playoffs...See Why
- Thread starter radiodaveagain
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Thavoice
Well-known member
LetsGoQuakers
Well-known member
Using current harbins this is what the playoffs would look like if it was top 32
D1
Region 1:11 (+3)
Region 2:6 (-2)
Region 3:10 (+2)
Region 4:5 (-3)
D2
Region 5:6 (-2)
Region 6:7 (-1)
Region 7:7 (-1)
Region 8:12 (+4)
D1
Region 1:11 (+3)
Region 2:6 (-2)
Region 3:10 (+2)
Region 4:5 (-3)
D2
Region 5:6 (-2)
Region 6:7 (-1)
Region 7:7 (-1)
Region 8:12 (+4)
I have no idea who West Jefferson nor do I care, intimating that Gibsonburg is classless enough to pull some shenanigans to make a ridiculous claim of state champions is....smh
Thavoice
Well-known member
Chill dude. It was a dig at West Jefferson.
but if you want me to add Gibsonburg to the list of those whom I routinely own then I presume I can find a reason.
I think your assumptions to judge the values of others is an adequate reflection of your own.
Own in what way?
LetTheDogEat
New member
interesting. Seems like every division has one region that is overloaded points-wise. Might bring credence to what another poster said about some regions have more point opportunity than others which makes top 32 maybe less advantageous
LetsGoQuakers
Well-known member
D3
Region 9:10
Region 10:7
Region 11:9
Region 12:6
D4
Region 13:6
Region 14:11
Region 15:6
Region 16:9
D5
Region 17:9
Region 18:10
Region 19:7
Region 20:6
D6
Region 21:10
Region 22:4
Region 23:11
Region 24:7
D7
Region 25:7
Region 26:8
Region 27:8
Region 28:9
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eastisbest
Well-known member
Fair enough, you're an idiot for other reasons. First is creating an account just to derail a thread. That's some small dck move there boy. Second is not backing up your statements with reason. Be civil. Not a difficult concept.
I asked you to give "facts" to back up your claim they would lose to anyone in play-offs by 30. Even giving room for hyperboli, the Margaretta score is strong they would be competitive with anyone in R22, mostly favored in the game let alone lose by 30. That is the debate of the thread; harbins, region assignment, scheduling....
It's been civil until you brought your hurt here. Why you would be so upset that anyone would think the currect system that sits an undefeated (with their fairly normal, non-manipulated schedule) home isn't clear to me but be civil, you'll get civil. Be reasoned, you'll get reasoned.
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MassillonK1D330
Well-known member
I understand were your coming from bro but my thing is this when it comes to football somebody is gonna win an someone has to lose tbh with I actually like the Harbin system. To me it's simple win your games have a half decent schedule an you are in. I'm a big Massillon guy but I'm real back in 2011 Massillon went 7-3 an missed the playoffs and I was not mad at the system I was mad at the team an the coaches that year we lost Glenoak, Steubenville and Canton McKinley 3 best teams on our schedule that year we didnt show up in the big games you kno so I feel like the system is fine just gotta take care of business.
Sunuvaditchdigger
Member
First, where is the closest conference accepting D6 schools that isn't the TAAC or SBC? GMC? N10? Second, you do understand that league affiliations often take three-to-five years to implement, but the state Regional assignments come out in July or August, correct? And, this school has never been assigned to the traditional-southwest region, correct? So, the statement 'knowing what region you are in, you have to be better with scheduling' makes absolutely no logical sense.
Thank you for using sound reasoning. I can’t agree with you more!
So you have no facts to backup that they would compete except by assuming because of the Margaretta game but when I assume based on their schedule and past playoff blowouts it doesn't count.... I give two rips about Gibsonburg and just opened up the thread because it was on the football thread. I am familiar with them and the murderers row they played this year and MY opinion is missing the playoffs lets them end on a positive note and not a dose of reality. Maybe the stars will align and that 3% chance will happen and they can "compete" against one of these guys week 11.... LEt me know which team on this list isnt a running clock based on your facts.... (hint - none of them)
Liberty Center ....
LCC
Coldwater
Anna
Archbold
Minster
TOMtheBUSDRIVER
New member
The league they jumped to is on a death spiral to being an 8 man league. They had a chance to put a really good league together involving some taac teams and others in the area (a whole other thread on this) and they chose the easy route to bolt to the SBC. They are reaping what they sow. They will be a 10-0 8 seed at best or out in any year from here on out. Congrats on the 10-0 season. No matter how weak the schedule is/was and it was, you still have to win em. Take the euphoria from that and enjoy it. Week 11 would have definitely soured that. A running clock in the playoffs isn’t fun.
Sunuvaditchdigger
Member
OK, I'm going to clip the negative comment, and give you a chance, because I'm intrigued at your statement here. The TAAC has had, for most of its existence, a brutal reputation for being among the weakest small-school football conferences in the state. The post-MAL SRL was not much better. I'm interested to see where you think that a "really good league" would arise in this area.
Mainly, I'm interested because in the progressive collapse of the SLL, MAL, and old-SBC, I was thinking of something similar. With the knowledge that the TAAC was dangerously unstable, geographically, looking like a dumbbell, two far to the west in Williams County, two the west of the river in metro-Toledo, two the east of the river, and one far to the east, Gibsonburg becoming the second; it only held because of the symmetry of the comical shape. Once Montpelier started looking, and Stryker started to make plans to form a team, the shape was about to go from 2-2-2-2 to 4-2-2-2, and restructuring was going to be inevitable. Foreseeing this possibility, during the collapse, I recommended a "TAAC-East" and "TAAC-West", picking up any and all GMC, BBC, NWOAL, SLL, SBC, and MAL schools feeling pressure to make a change. It would've given a ready reserve of schools within the same established organization to restructure around if smaller schools became unable to field teams, 8-man not being a "thing" a few years ago. I think that this arrangement would be more stable than what existed then, and certainly what exists now, but I don't see how any combination of these schools would've made for a particularly strong football conference. None of these schools have very good, understatement, post-season histories. And, as far as being a death spiral to 8-man, I think that a lot of small-school conferences are going to have to come to grips with that, including both the SBC and TAAC; which is why I think it'd've been better to have them all under one roof, rather than being left to try to pilfer from one another.
You claim that changing conferences represented an "easy route", but I see neither the panacea "greater TAAC" conference, nor a route to get there.
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RollingTrain
Well-known member
It's a shame the old MAL broke up. Everyone was close, there were alot of rivalries and there was parity. With a few exceptions here and there, there were lots of schools that won league titles. Ironically, They had a chance to add Gibsonburg and Elmwood to the league, but they didn't garner enough votes. Shortly after Carey, Mohawk and Seneca East left. Sandusky St. Mary had a chance to then enter the league, but farted around and by the time they came around, everyone had gone their separate ways.
TOMtheBUSDRIVER
New member
A lot to tackle here. First off.....cutting and pasting what you deem a negative just because it’s a different view point is typical of many todays issues. Just because I don’t feel the same as you doesn’t make it negative imho. I digress. It was widely known that there was a tentative league set up that included Gburg, Elmwood, Woodmore, Northwood, Stritch, Ottawa Hills, North Baltimore, and either Fremont St. Joe or Toledo Christian. North Baltimore got cold feet at the last second due to a board member and I quote.....worrying about the weather up north in Toledo.......uh huh. That started the demise. Ottawa Hills had a bit of an issue but they are Ottawa Hills and who knows. Strike two. Gburg was wishy washy. This would have been a pretty good football league, a decent basketball league and a really good baseball league. 2 past state champions in it. Soon after this, the TAAC began its demise as they got dumb and admitted every red headed step child in western Ohio. League is destined to be a premier 8 man league here soon. Geographic nightmare and the big kid on the block Northwood will pummel them all into submission. Northwood has gotten drunk on the open enrollment teet and has ballooned their enrollment to now be called Waite East. Look for an announcement here soon that they will jump ship and join a league that will shock people. Especially their own parents. Yikes. Good luck to them. They are teetering on a Gburg issue as well. Doing well and barely making the playoffs or not at all. And even if they did, getting pummeled. That’s my piece. Peace.
eastisbest
Well-known member
Here's a fact
Changing your argument to a specific set of teams after getting called out on your stupidity isn't making a supportive argument for any point whatsoever. Now I'm going to slow up a bit here because this takes reading skills, something you've not displayed; part of this debate (not mine) was GBurg's regional assignment and how in a different definition of "most qualified," they would get into play-offs.
:slaps head:
That's a pretty strong "fact" that their win against Margaretta was by a wider margin THEN ENTIRE 22 REGION. Their schedule gives absolutely no information on how they would compete against the 23 region because as you so adequately pointed out, they didn't play anyone of that caliber. They won what they played, handedly but that is neither information on whether they would win or lose against competition they didn't play. Is that too hard for you to understand? You are strongly making the point opposed to your argument. Last statement; do we really have to count for you the number of teams that have won state-championships after having been blown out of play-offs in previous seasons? What happened last year, is not relevant.
As others have acknowledged, particularly in the small school divisions a team can be of drastically different caliber based on a few players matriculating up to varsity or to graduation.
The debate here isn't whether they would win state-championship but whether a different system would better reflect who are the top 32 and whether or not the present regional assignment was poorly designed or even gerrymandered.
Maybe Twitter is more your speed? I'm sure you have some valid points to make. If only you could consider finding a civil means to make them.
eastisbest
Well-known member
We don't disagree, I also like the Harbin-regional assignment method. Every system is going to have strengths, weaknesses and loopholes worth looking at from fresh perspectives. If that's not the approach, we're still driving covered wagons.
Sunuvaditchdigger
Member
Yes, this seems like a version of the dual-tier SLL during the Rossford-expansion debates. Genoa offered what was supposed to be a unattainable bargain in which a two-tier league would be considered, if and only if Elmwood and Gibsonburg could come up with six(!) schools interested in D6 and D7 in one month, and they were allowed to fill in their designer D5 and D6 league, and they got to keep Rossford and Fostoria, who had actually been the small-schools preference for the original SLL opening. Your list matches all of the known players at the time (and I believe that it was both Toledo Christian and St. Joe, but not Woodmore, who wanted to stick it out). I'm not sure how serious that the proposal was. My impression at the time was that it a gambit from Gibsonburg and Elmwood to try to convince big schools that they were going to get stuck at seven while convincing Woodmore that it'd've been worth it. I remember that NB, and the TAAC schools, had no (actual) interest; but I'm certain that Gibsonburg would not have been wishy-washy about it, as presenting themselves as deadly serious was the only way to convince the other schools that it'd be better to negotiate Fostoria instead of Rossford, or even Fostoria and Rossford, rather than risk blowing up the world. The big schools called the bluff, and said that whether the interest was there or not, the deal was off; Elmwood and Gibsonburg applied, and were refused, to the MAL, and on we go.
How much better would this group have been for either Northwood or Gibsonburg had it existed all these years? They played each other for several years in the TAAC, and in several years one eliminated the other from the playoff field because, well, there were TAAC-level points, and only one team could ever get in. I don't see any other big points teams in that group that would qualify this grouping as a pretty good football conference. Probably more stable that what we have now.
I'd be interested to see what Northwood might be thinking. They pretty consistently get into the playoffs, except when knocked out as above, and have a less than stellar record once there. Their other sports have been pretty mediocre, I wouldn't think that they'd want to make a move to a much bigger league, but that's just me.
algernonsidney
Well-known member
I am curious to know why this happened. Do you have any theories on why it did?
The best way for smaller schools to get more points is to play bigger schools. If you have a lot of bigger schools around you, this is easy. If you don't, it is hard. Some big schools also the problem of having very few big schools nearby, so they end up playing down.
Now that Ohio has seven divisions, I suspect many teams play more games out of their division than in it. That also means they don't play very many games in their region.
And considering that teams are changing regions all the time, I don't see how this can be the case.
algernonsidney
Well-known member
Please tell us why Gibsonburg does not deserve a playoff spot while a 5-5 team does.
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algernonsidney
Well-known member
OHSAA can get rid of the regions and just give every team a trophy when they get to the semi-finals.
algernonsidney
Well-known member
They would lose by 30 to the 5-5 teams who will get into the playoffs?
algernonsidney
Well-known member
So, you are saying that without regions, some teams will be in the playoffs will not have a shot at state titles? How exactly does having regions give "everyone from around the state" a shot while no regions does not?
Nobody makes these complaints about the playoffs in West Virginia--where they have never had regions since the playoffs began in the late 1940's.
How do you know that teams like facing locals? How do you know that teams like having rematches?
I do not hear any of this outrcy about travel during the West Virginia playoffs. Of course, teams do have more flexibility in scheduling.
Of course, minimizing travel is the only argument that I have heard that can possibly defend the region system. All the other arguments that have been posted have been nonsense.
MassillonK1D330
Well-known member
You go 10-0 playing a weak schedule and go into week 11 an get blew out by 30 plus what's the point of getting into the playoffs? You do realize St X went 5-5 an won the D1 state championship right??? ?
queencitybuckeye
Well-known member
They sure could, but it would be stupid. Nearly as stupid as ignoring the fact that a raw score in region X is not equivalent to the same raw score in region Y.
It’s not even remotely accurate to compare the gaggle of 4-5 to 5-4 region 22 teams to a 5-5 St X. Come on man.
Previous seasons have absolutely no bearing on the outcomes of this seasons games. I’m still waiting for objective evidence of 30+ pt deficits.
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PSHSBulldog
Active member
Play up and traditionally good schools if you want to improve your chances in future years. Any anger should be directed to your school's athletic department for scheduling. This is like in college an undefeated MAC team who played no one in non-conference games complaining about not being picked for the CFB playoffs.
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