winbypin
Well-known member
Who cares? They need us much more than we need them. I am sure if they are invaded again in the future we will come to their defense.
President Trump Eyes a New Real-Estate Purchase: Greenland
- Thread starter Yappi
- Start date
Why should Trump be pissed at Putin? Are you stoked for a nuclear war? Sure we need to keep an eye on Russia and yes they'll cause trouble where they can but unlike the Soviet Union Russia is not looking to dominate the world. And last I looked the Germans are going all in to be completely dependent on Putin & Russia for their energy needs. Do you see a conflict of interest there?
The FACT remains that China is our biggest full spectrum threat going forward. The ONLY threat Russia represents is nuclear annihilation. So as long as we and the Russkies don't do anything stupid and blunder into Nuclear War then Putin is nowhere near a big threat to us. That's why some of us are amazed that your side would demonize Russia and try to prop them up as some kind of threat. I guess ANYTHING is justified in your attempt to get Trump!
There's no reason that within our spheres of influence we can't get along. Of course that means we have to recognize that the Russians have a sphere of influence which is something the never Trump neo-cons refuse to do. NATO is obsolete and needs to be replaced with something smaller, leaner and more appropriate for the threats facing the US in the 21st century. Why this is resisted boggles my mind.
Bigscarletandgrey
Member
Get along with a dictator that kills his political enemies? He's unstable and controls the 2nd largest arsenal of nuclear weapons. We should be putting as much economic pressure on him as possible in order to make him conform or be ousted by his own people.
Trump just can't stand up to bullies. I guess we are OK with Kim from NK running around while Trump gets his "love" letters?
Your side.... What the hell is that?You mean the majority of Americans who don't like Trump? Finally some uneducated whites are in the minority.
If one outcome of Trump's presidency is the dismantling of NATO I suspect that it would be in the long term interests of the USA. What use is this alliance? It expanded to incorporate nations that couldn't win a war with the sisters of the poor and it's full of members who won't even spend the agreed upon minimum for their own defense. Yet we're supposed to trade NYC for Riga in a nuclear war with Russia over the Baltic States?
Even worse the 2nd largest economy in NATO unilaterally decides that it will buy Russian NG making themselves dependent on Russia in the process. Yet supposedly it's Russia that justifies NATO's existence becasue it's Europes biggest threat.
NATO has served it's purpose. But it's time has past. We need to develop strategic & military relationships that makes sense in the TWENTY FIRST CENTURY. That means we need leaders who seriously look at whether NATO is viable going forward. Sometimes alliances do need to be destroyed, particularly when they go from symbiotic to parasitic.
Bigscarletandgrey
Member
You missed the point, not surprised....
Simply put.... He is pissed at NATO countries for not paying their fair share to help protect all of us from the likes of Russia. But he loves Russia...
Happygoluckky
Well-known member
He won't stand up to the NRA, the Russians, KJU of the Saudis. But, by God, he is willing to take a stand on the Danes.
Gee whiz, it's not like Putin is the only thug dictator out there. We deal with all sorts of unsavory leaders who murder their own people. It's called the real world and it can be a nasty place.
You say Putin controls the 2nd largest nuclear arsenal and then throw out that we should be putting economic pressure on him so he stops hurting his people? Well for the record:
* Ultimately it's not our business to be risking nuclear war to help out Russian dissidents. I know that sounds harsh but it is what it is.
* And for the record Trump is putting economic pressure on the Russians - it's called DRILL BABY DRILL. American production of oil & natural gas has cut the price of those commodities by almost half. NOTHING hurts the Russian economy as much as that. But your side refuses to acknowledge that Trump's energy policies are putting enormous pressure on Putin's economy because then your Russian collusion narrative collapses under it's own ridiculousness.
And please are you seriously trying to pin the Kim family and NK on Trump? That mess is the work of pure bipartisanship. Trump is doing what he can to try to fix it. Though maybe he should just kick that can down the road like his previous 10 predecessors did.
"Your side" means the left and democrat party. Unfortunately it probably is half the country but that's a problem not a feature. Or are you going to claim that you're not a leftist but a moderate?
Bigscarletandgrey
Member
I'm a realist....
And by left do you mean I care about social programs, education and the ability to raise a family safely? Yep....
And NK isn't on trump, but he says that he is a lovely man.. For god sakes you can't tell me that is good.
I suspect that Trump believes that if NATO has any use in the 21st century it's to wage war on Islamic radicalism. And maybe someday to confront China in Africa. I bet he would place Russia as 3rd on any list of threats.
And for the record Trump doesn't love Russia. If he did he would be touting Cliamte Cahnge, signing the Paris Accord and limiting extraction of American oil & NG. Then with oil at $120 per barrel Russia would be making all kinds of money. In other words he would be implementing Obama's & Hillary's policies - which makes you wonder at who really loves Putin & Russia. Of course several Russian oligarchs have been very, very generous to the Clinton Family Foundation. And who else would pay Bill Clinton $500,000 for a 15 minute speech?
A lot of people not on the left care about those things. The difference is those of us on the right don't want to steal other peoples money to solve them. Nor do we want to implement solutions to the problems that leave people dependent and in the end don't even solve the problems.
And if we can crack the nut that is NK and come away with a demilitarized Korean peninsula I don't care if Trump writes Kim love letters calling him a saint. if all it takes is cheap flattery to solve one of the 20th century's biggest problems I'm all for it.
winbypin
Well-known member
He's been pretty hard on Russia.
Raider6309
Well-known member
winbypin
Well-known member
Didn't they train in Afghanistan? And where was Al Qaeda?
If you consider pushing to let Russia re-join the G7 as "pretty hard"... then he's really taking them to task. Coincidentally, the United States will host next year's summit. Maybe he & Vladdy can finally hit that spa at Bedminster.
winbypin
Well-known member
No, these things.
- The Trump Administration has implemented a wide array of sanctions and other punitive actions against Russia for their destabilizing actions and provocations against the U.S. and its allies.
- In response to Russian interference in the 2016 election and other malfeasance, the Trump Administration has sanctioned Russian oligarchs and intelligence entities.
- Throughout 2017 and 2018, the U.S. sanctioned numerous Russian actors for violating non-proliferation laws by supporting weapons programs in Iran and Syria, and supporting North Korea's development of weapons of mass destruction.
- The Trump Administration has issued sanctions against more than one hundred Russian actors and firms for Russia's destabilizing actions in Ukraine and its ongoing occupation of Crimea.
- In March 2017, in response to Russia's use of a military-grade chemical weapon in the United Kingdom, the Trump Administration ordered multiple Russian consulates in the United States closed and expelled 60 Russian intelligence officers.
- Due to sanctions imposed by the Trump Administration, the Russian economy and Russian geo-economic projects have been severely constrained.
- In 2018, as Russian investors reacted to new sanctions, the Russian Ruble made its biggest fall in over three years, and, as of July 2018, is down nearly nine percent against the dollar.
- As a part of its sanctions against Russia, the United States has prevented numerous companies from partnering with Russian offshore oil projects, denying these projects access to capital and key resources.
- The Trump Administration has also opposed Russian President Vladimir Putin's largest geo-economic project, the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline, which could generate hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue for Russia.
- In the wake of Russian provocations, President Trump has exercised U.S. military power and worked to bolster U.S. allies in Europe.
- In 2017, President Trump approved the sale of lethal weapons to Ukraine addressing the country's vulnerability to Russian-backed separatists in its eastern provinces.
- Under the Trump Administration, Russian mercenaries and other pro-Syrian regime forces attacking U.S. troops in Syria were killed.
- The U.S. has increased troops and its military capability in Eastern Europe and dramatically increased training and drills with its NATO partners.
- In 2018, the U.S. Department of Defense increased its spending as part of the European Deterrence Initiative by $1.4 billion dollars.
- Due to pressure from President Trump, U.S.' NATO allies have increased defense expenditures by five percent.
Energy, energy and more energy or as the deplorable's say "Drill baby, Drill!". Trump's pro fossil fuel policy's have done real and lasting damage to Russia's economy. If Trump was truly a Putin puppet then he would be implementing Barack Obama & Hillary Clinton's climate change and energy policies. This is so obvious that it amazes me how the left refuses to see it.
Happygoluckky
Well-known member
It is a good think we have the "Best People" on the ground to manage this diplomatic crisis in Denmark.
Career -Carla Sands U.S. Ambassador to Denmark - WIKI
Sands started a career in acting in 1987, starring in different episodes of the TV Series "The Bold and the Beautiful".[8][9] From 1988 to 1990 she starred in several movies, and was best known for her work in Deathstalker and the Warriors from Hell.[10]
Following her graduation, Sands then started her career working as chiropractor in private practice from 1990 to 1999. Sands had been active in her husband's businesses throughout his career and in 2015, following his death, Sands became the chair and CEO of Vintage Capital Group, which has around $150 million in assets, and of Vintage Real Estate.[7][11] In 2016, Sands served on President Trump's Transition Finance Committee and the Economic Advisory Council.[6][12][13] Sands was the 2016 California Delegate for the 33rd Congressional District to the 2016 Republican National Convention.[6][14]
She was blindsided by Trumps tweets....Only the best people
Career -Carla Sands U.S. Ambassador to Denmark - WIKI
Sands started a career in acting in 1987, starring in different episodes of the TV Series "The Bold and the Beautiful".[8][9] From 1988 to 1990 she starred in several movies, and was best known for her work in Deathstalker and the Warriors from Hell.[10]
Following her graduation, Sands then started her career working as chiropractor in private practice from 1990 to 1999. Sands had been active in her husband's businesses throughout his career and in 2015, following his death, Sands became the chair and CEO of Vintage Capital Group, which has around $150 million in assets, and of Vintage Real Estate.[7][11] In 2016, Sands served on President Trump's Transition Finance Committee and the Economic Advisory Council.[6][12][13] Sands was the 2016 California Delegate for the 33rd Congressional District to the 2016 Republican National Convention.[6][14]
She was blindsided by Trumps tweets....Only the best people
Harrycrane
Well-known member
Link ?
Harrycrane
Well-known member
You realize Trump wanted to get rid of the Obama late 2016 sanctions right? Ask Mike Flynn . This notion that Trump is always treating Russian like a foreign adversary is crap. He only praises Putin , takes his position over his own intelligence people who he hired and treats him with more respect than Americans who disagree with him or point out his obvious huge flaws . you can hear audio tape of Trump pre-election saying thatr he would look into LESSENING SANCTIONS, , Trump's cabinet which is dwindling and is completely different n most posts is responsible for any Russia sanctions. Remember most conservatives decried Obama 's sanctions as being too stringent . Go back and check the right wing media's coverage of the last minute Russian sanctions and how they disagreed with them . This was at the same time Flynn was lying to the feds about actually talking with Russian about this very thing .
What's Flynn doing now ? This notion that Trump is very anti Russiaand holds them accountable ? Anything they have been held accountable for in any real way is hardly because Trump is in favor.
What's Flynn doing now ? This notion that Trump is very anti Russiaand holds them accountable ? Anything they have been held accountable for in any real way is hardly because Trump is in favor.
Carrot & stick Harry. Or maybe Trump realizes that sanctions often don't work or cause more problems then they solve?
Trump's energy policies have done more harm to Russia's economy and Putin's bank account then all our sanctions put together times 1,000. Even better Trump's energy policies have also had the valuable side effect of helping our economy. This is a fact as plain as the nose on your face.
Harrycrane
Well-known member
That's
That's YOUR take on his method or thought process . The mental gymnastics you always far right Trumpers go through is amusing. I mean you actually act as if the guy is disciplined , is running a well oiled machine like administration , doesn't constantly flip flop , utter nonsensical incoherent things daily, is truthful , has a real plan and his nonsense is just setting up smart courses of action .
I realize why republicans in office stay mute and don't point out his obvious instability , lack of historic perspective, lack of any discipline or real ideology besides thinking of himself at all times . Its about their jobs which doesn't make it OK but is understandable . Not sure what others motivation is to ignore the obvious and not only that assign strengths to this guy he doesn't have and assume some kind of brilliant smart thought process that in no way exists . Look at his erratic business career . His lack of paying people { Contractors } would usually have actual right wing people whoa re in that line of work hating the guy. Not so for some of the people i know , which tells me there is a cult thing happening and they actually agree with his rhetoric and his wanting to divide the country and aren't the people i thought they were.
Of course with any cult following ignorance concerning who the cult leader really is , is paramount to the ignoring of obvious major flaws and lack of stability .
That's YOUR take on his method or thought process . The mental gymnastics you always far right Trumpers go through is amusing. I mean you actually act as if the guy is disciplined , is running a well oiled machine like administration , doesn't constantly flip flop , utter nonsensical incoherent things daily, is truthful , has a real plan and his nonsense is just setting up smart courses of action .
I realize why republicans in office stay mute and don't point out his obvious instability , lack of historic perspective, lack of any discipline or real ideology besides thinking of himself at all times . Its about their jobs which doesn't make it OK but is understandable . Not sure what others motivation is to ignore the obvious and not only that assign strengths to this guy he doesn't have and assume some kind of brilliant smart thought process that in no way exists . Look at his erratic business career . His lack of paying people { Contractors } would usually have actual right wing people whoa re in that line of work hating the guy. Not so for some of the people i know , which tells me there is a cult thing happening and they actually agree with his rhetoric and his wanting to divide the country and aren't the people i thought they were.
Of course with any cult following ignorance concerning who the cult leader really is , is paramount to the ignoring of obvious major flaws and lack of stability .
Last edited:
winbypin
Well-known member
I remember Obama telling us that the 80's called and want their foreign policy back as it relates to Russia. I also remember Obama telling a Russian that after his next election he had more flexibility. And let's not forget that whatever influence Russia had on the election it happened on Obama's watch. And he knew they were trying to interfere and didn't do anything.
But Obama stared at Putin. Oooh. Scary.
He has put more hurt on the Russians than any of his predecessors. Facts matter.
By the way, are you still hammering HIllary for selling out a chunk of our uranium in return for tens of millions of dollars funneled to her shell foundation ...........and Bill for being paid off by the Russians to the tune of $500,000 for a 30 minute speech?
Harrycrane
Well-known member
Getting paid for making speeches isn't illegal or something shady. People get paid what they negotiate , what they know, their influence and their knowledge . How well do they speak , what kind of impact they have. it' called the free market , free enterprise. if someone doesn't want to pay you much , you must not be worth much as a speaker. It's pretty simple . If someone would pay Trump to speak he would cash in . No one except his vapid base likes to hear his gibberish so no one pays him much to come speak . What's he going to talk about to a group ogf business leaders? Stiffing people who do work for you? Creative tax evasion? How to artfully file for bankruptcy?How to bankrupt a casino in 4 easy lessons? How to get foreign banks to give you loans when no one in the United States will ?
zeeman
Well-known member
Does it bother you that the Obamas are buying a 15 million dollar house in Martha’s Vinyard? How much is a POTUS salary? By my reckoning he mad 3.2 million in salary over his eight years in office. Good to have rich friends I guess
Trump insults uses the word "nasty" in talking about the leader of a long time US ally, but wants to invite Russia back in the G8. You know what was nasty Putin's 2014 invasion of the Crimea, that what got him kicked out of the G8 in the first place. The one positive for Denmark and its leader, Donnie in one of his fits of pettiness called off his visit.
cabezadecaballo
Well-known member
Tell us what Trump should do to help Americans raise their families safely ? What are the biggest threats to family safety ?
The word "US ally" is pretty cheap to come by these days. I mean all you have to do is sign up to NATO so the USA can guarantee your survival in the event of a major war. Hell you don't have to have a military worth crap and you can under spend on defense in order to redirect the money to social programs. Then you can climb up on your high horse and criticize the US for not having government paid Health care!
What's the old saying "with friends like these......."
As for Putin, why not invite Russia to the G8? You really want to reignite a cold war with Russia while we're at the start of a cold war with China? A Russian/China alliance against us is not a favorable geopolitical development - even if it does hurt Trump.
As for the Crimea, well it wasn't exactly a nice move by the Russians but you might want to check out Russian history a bit and see where the Crimea fits in. All things being equal, the Crimea belongs more to Russia then the Ukraine. Hell one could argue that the Ukraine kind of belongs to Russia to. But hey I'm sure we'll be okay when the demographics in the American Southwest trigger a demand for their return to Mexico. We would never think to use military means to prevent it.