Update - Solved - Trivia Time - Name this famed Mile Relay Foursome Team

JAVMAN83

JAVMAN83

Well-known member
First team under 3:30
Name the team & athletes

Update: Photo credit goes to the Cleveland Plain Dealer, 2 May 1925 edition, pg. 18
 

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Mr. Slippery said:
I'm gonna guess this is Lakewood HS circa 1929.
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YES, wrong year, though.

This is the Lakewood foursome that ran faster than all collegiate teams at the Penn Relays the same year. When the answer is given, there's an interesting story to be had regarding the state meet from the same year as this photo.
 
JAVMAN83 said:
First team under 3:30
Name the team & athletes
Click to expand...
The answer to this history trivia is that this is the famous Lakewood HS foursome who ran 3:28 4/5, the first Ohio HS team to run sub-3:30 for the mile relay. This was accomplished at the famed Penn Relays on 25 April 1925. The athletes, reading left-to-right were:

Julius Winkel (So), Norman Saxer (Sr), Clay Mueller (Jr), and Bill Kastler (Sr)

This foursome was coached by the famed Mr. George Corneal.

The previous Ohio HS best had been 3:31 by the same school, Lakewood, in winning the state Class A title in 1923 (also featuring Bill Kastler), the last state meet ever conducted at the old Ohio Field in Columbus (was located on the SW corner of Lane & High).

Later at the 1925 state meet, this same Lakewood foursome would run 3:32.5 in winning the Class A at Ohio Stadium. However, and this is where the interesting and sad historical interjection comes in - all performances at the 1925 state meet, both running AND FIELD EVENTS, were deemed not acceptable for record consideration by the meet referee (corrected), who I believe was Ed Cook (Chillicothe, 1906), the 1908 co-gold medalist in the Olympic pole vault and then HC at Oakwood. The reason: Excessive Winds. Bill Kastler's 49.0 winning time in the 440 was thereby nullified, the first HS Ohioan to run sub-50 for the 440. Many other records that day were nullified as well, including those in the shot put & discus throw! Needless to say, this decision did not sit well, and in historical review, is extremely arbitrary to say the least. When reviewing the results from immediately after the meet, the new meet records in those events not affected by the wind are noted within newspapers like the Cleveland Plain Dealer. However, when reviewing meet records after the 1926 meet, there was no mention of records set in the 1925 meet. As an additional footnote, wind gauges did not appear at the state meet until 1956.

In light of this information, I am endeavoring to set the historical record straight in both the State meet project I have been working on, and also in updating the late Craig Whitmore's event record progressions for Ohio HS boys. Bill Kastler will be noted as the 1st sub-50 sec. 440 runner for a 1-turn race (that was featured at many meets and was standard up until the 1950s). Kastler's 440 record was broke 3 years later by the World Interscholastic record peformance of Columbus Central's Herbert Moxley (Sr) in running 48.2 seconds around the 1-turn race at Ohio Stadium during the 1928 state Class A meet.

UPDATE: In honor of the 1925 State meet winners, I will be releasing the results of the Class A & B meets from that meet next May on the 100th anniversary of that meet. There were ties in 3 of the field events in Class A, one of which was a 15-way split for 5th place in the Class A high jump. I'm endeavoring to resolve scores listed in various newspaper accounts with the results as known.
 
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JAVMAN83 said:
The answer to this history trivia is that this is the famous Lakewood HS foursome who ran 3:28 4/5, the first Ohio HS team to run sub-3:30 for the mile relay. This was accomplished at the famed Penn Relays on 25 April 1925. The athletes, reading left-to-right were:

Julius Winkel (So), Norman Saxer (Sr), Clay Mueller (Jr), and Bill Kastler (Sr)

This foursome was coached by the famed Mr. George Corneal.

The previous Ohio HS best had been 3:31 by the same school, Lakewood, in winning the state Class A title in 1923 (also featuring Bill Kastler), the last state meet ever conducted at the old Ohio Field in Columbus (was located on the SW corner of Lane & High).

Later at the 1925 state meet, this same Lakewood foursome would run 3:32.5 in winning the Class A at Ohio Stadium. However, and this is where the interesting and sad historical interjection comes in - all performances at the 1925 state meet, both running AND FIELD EVENTS, were deemed not acceptable for record conideration by the meet director, who I believe was Ed Cook (Chillicothe, 1906), the 1908 co-gold medalist in the Olympic pole vault and then HC at Oakwood. The reason: Excessive Winds. Bill Kastler's 49.0 winning time in the 440 was thereby nullified, the first Ohioan to run sub-50 for the 440. Many other records that day were nullified as well, including those in the shot put & discus throw! Needless to say, this decision did not sit well, and in historical review, is extremely arbitrary to say the least. When reviewing the results from immediately after the meet, the new meet records in those events not affected by the wind are noted within newspapers like the Cleveland Plain Dealer. However, when reviewing meet records after the 1926 meet, there was no mention of records set in the 1925 meet. As an additional footnote, wind gauges did not appear at the state meet until 1956.

In light of this information, I am endeavoring to set the historical record straight in both the State meet project I have been working on, and also in updating the late Craig Whitmore's event record progressions for Ohio HS boys. Bill Kastler will be noted as the 1st sub-440 runner for a 1-turn race (that was featured at many meets and was standard up until the 1950s). Kastler's 440 record was broke 3 years later by the World Interscholastic record peformance of Columbus Central's Herbert Moxley (Sr) in running 48.2 seconds around the 1-turn race at Ohio Stadium during the 1928 state Class A meet.
Click to expand...
Amazing story. Thanks for informing.
 
yj_runfan said:
Amazing story. Thanks for informing.
Click to expand...
You are most welcome. I enjoy relaying stories like this in my journey into Ohio HS t&f history. So much of the past has been forgotten because it was never documented properly and maintained as it should have been, IMHO.
 
JAVMAN83 said:
The answer to this history trivia is that this is the famous Lakewood HS foursome who ran 3:28 4/5, the first Ohio HS team to run sub-3:30 for the mile relay. This was accomplished at the famed Penn Relays on 25 April 1925. The athletes, reading left-to-right were:

Julius Winkel (So), Norman Saxer (Sr), Clay Mueller (Jr), and Bill Kastler (Sr)

This foursome was coached by the famed Mr. George Corneal.

The previous Ohio HS best had been 3:31 by the same school, Lakewood, in winning the state Class A title in 1923 (also featuring Bill Kastler), the last state meet ever conducted at the old Ohio Field in Columbus (was located on the SW corner of Lane & High).

Later at the 1925 state meet, this same Lakewood foursome would run 3:32.5 in winning the Class A at Ohio Stadium. However, and this is where the interesting and sad historical interjection comes in - all performances at the 1925 state meet, both running AND FIELD EVENTS, were deemed not acceptable for record consideration by the meet referee (corrected), who I believe was Ed Cook (Chillicothe, 1906), the 1908 co-gold medalist in the Olympic pole vault and then HC at Oakwood. The reason: Excessive Winds. Bill Kastler's 49.0 winning time in the 440 was thereby nullified, the first HS Ohioan to run sub-50 for the 440. Many other records that day were nullified as well, including those in the shot put & discus throw! Needless to say, this decision did not sit well, and in historical review, is extremely arbitrary to say the least. When reviewing the results from immediately after the meet, the new meet records in those events not affected by the wind are noted within newspapers like the Cleveland Plain Dealer. However, when reviewing meet records after the 1926 meet, there was no mention of records set in the 1925 meet. As an additional footnote, wind gauges did not appear at the state meet until 1956.

In light of this information, I am endeavoring to set the historical record straight in both the State meet project I have been working on, and also in updating the late Craig Whitmore's event record progressions for Ohio HS boys. Bill Kastler will be noted as the 1st sub-50 sec. 440 runner for a 1-turn race (that was featured at many meets and was standard up until the 1950s). Kastler's 440 record was broke 3 years later by the World Interscholastic record peformance of Columbus Central's Herbert Moxley (Sr) in running 48.2 seconds around the 1-turn race at Ohio Stadium during the 1928 state Class A meet.

UPDATE: In honor of the 1925 State meet winners, I will be releasing the results of the Class A & B meets from that meet next May on the 100th anniversary of that meet. There were ties in 3 of the field events in Class A, one of which was a 15-way split for 5th place in the Class A high jump. I'm endeavoring to resolve scores listed in various newspaper accounts with the results as known.
Click to expand...
Can you please write on book on Ohio Track and Field history
 
KingHorn419 said:
Can you please write on book on Ohio Track and Field history
Click to expand...
You don't ask for much, do you? :D

Every school has its own history, and most of them have been forgotten by the schools themselves. Tell you what, the ony way I'd consider such an undertaking is to do a yearly summary in conjunction with the state meet results. I'm planning on releasing the first batch covering the 1908-1929 period sometime next year. I've got enough together now that I think I can do an initial release of the results of those state meets in a format I like. I have a great many of the names & years of graduations documented now from that era, and maybe I can put together a summary of the highlights from those years to go along with it. I've already been considering starting a "This day in Ohio HS Track & Field" series. Let me give it some thought. Thanks for you confidence, anyway!
 
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