SWOH D1 Thread

Doublehelix said:
If we're being honest, this is a very pedestrian District final game. Typically you're seeing much better teams at this point in the bracket.
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The GWOC had 6 teams all on pretty similar levels, and then the rest of the Dayton area was several levels below that. I think we're seeing that the GWOC just wasn't that good this year. Nobody appeared to play any defense in that league. They are in for a struggle when they play teams that can guard and know how to run half court offense. Not sure I like Centerville's chances against Middletown if this is all the GWOC has.

Elder is also a very good team this year. You Elder guys constantly underrate yourself. Johnson and Williams are both studs; they just really know how to play. Brass is also an insane athlete.
 
JBaller said:
The GWOC had 6 teams all on pretty similar levels, and then the rest of the Dayton area was several levels below that. I think we're seeing that the GWOC just wasn't that good this year. Nobody appeared to play any defense in that league. They are in for a struggle when they play teams that can guard and know how to run half court offense. Not sure I like Centerville's chances against Middletown if this is all the GWOC has.

Elder is also a very good team this year. You Elder guys constantly underrate yourself. Johnson and Williams are both studs; they just really know how to play. Brass is also an insane athlete.
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FYI: He's not an Elder guy.
 
JBaller said:
The GWOC had 6 teams all on pretty similar levels, and then the rest of the Dayton area was several levels below that. I think we're seeing that the GWOC just wasn't that good this year. Nobody appeared to play any defense in that league. They are in for a struggle when they play teams that can guard and know how to run half court offense. Not sure I like Centerville's chances against Middletown if this is all the GWOC has.

Elder is also a very good team this year. You Elder guys constantly underrate yourself. Johnson and Williams are both studs; they just really know how to play. Brass is also an insane athlete.
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The region is way down. These are district final games and it feels like a game that would typically happen in the sectionals.

Elder isn't nearly as good as they were the last 3 years and they're making this look easy. Centerville and Elder from last year are light years better than any teams in the region this year. It's just a very down year.
 
Doublehelix said:
The region is way down. These are district final games and it feels like a game that would typically happen in the sectionals.

Elder isn't nearly as good as they were the last 3 years and they're making this look easy.
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Southwest is also, at worst, the 2nd best region in Ohio in D1. It might be the best. None of the 4 Columbus teams remaining are any better than these GWOC teams. Northwest Ohio is terrible. Northeast Ohio has like 3 good teams (one of which will be coming through Northeast Ohio in Garfield Heights).
 
Doublehelix said:
The region is way down. These are district final games and it feels like a game that would typically happen in the sectionals.
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The districts requires 3 Cincinnati-Dayton matchups. Cincinnati was just the better area this year. I told you that Wayne wasn't any better than Lakota West.

Also, there are simply no Centerville of the last 3 years or Moeller from 2017-2019 caliber teams in this region. There are several good teams though.
 
JBaller said:
The districts requires 3 Cincinnati-Dayton matchups. Cincinnati was just the better area this year. I told you that Wayne wasn't any better than Lakota West.
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I didn't disagree. But this Wayne team is not a district finalist worthy team in typical years. Not even close.

Elder picked a fantastic path. Any of the remaining teams would have given them a game. They're going to win an easy district title with the worst team they've had in 5 years.
 
Doublehelix said:
I didn't disagree. But this Wayne team is not a district finalist worthy team in typical years. Not even close.

Elder picked a fantastic path. Any of the remaining teams would have given them a game.
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That path is getting them their boogeyman one round earlier though.
 
JBaller said:
That path is getting them their boogeyman one round earlier though.
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You saw what Moe can do when they extend their defensive pressure with their length. That doomed Elder twice already this year.

Elder simply can't score against Moeller. They might have to win 25-24.
 
Doublehelix said:
You saw what Moe can do when they extend their defensive pressure with their length. That doomed Elder twice already this year.

Elder simply can't score against Moeller. They might have to win 25-24.
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Bigger college court will help with some passing lanes against those traps. Moeller also did not appear to be able to adjust to shooting with the arena backdrop. They need to make it one of the most GCL kind of games possible to win.
 
Doublehelix said:
I didn't disagree. But this Wayne team is not a district finalist worthy team in typical years. Not even close.

Elder picked a fantastic path. Any of the remaining teams would have given them a game. They're going to win an easy district title with the worst team they've had in 5 years.
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How many times have you seen Wayne play this season?
 
Doublehelix said:
The region is way down. These are district final games and it feels like a game that would typically happen in the sectionals.

Elder isn't nearly as good as they were the last 3 years and they're making this look easy. Centerville and Elder from last year are light years better than any teams in the region this year. It's just a very down year.
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D2 in southwest Ohio is way down also this year. No powerhouse city schools and the GCL schools (outside of maybe Alter) are not nearly as good as they’ve been in the past.
 
JBaller said:
Centerville is doing a great job of speeding Middletown up early. How did they lose any GWOC games again?
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In my opinion, they shouldn't have.

I said Middletown could beat Centerville if they could shoot like they did against WW. Shooting has been eh, but more importantly, they are letting Centerville get way too easy baskets. Announcer said it perfectly. Centerville is just way more efficient on offense. Middletown has to work way too hard for everything.
 
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JBaller said:
Sycamore’s guards are their weak link and they couldn’t be playing any worse than they are right now.
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I still don't get this play they run where Burgess touches the ball past the 3 point line. Then goes to the block after handing it off. Hamilton has it covered because you see it a mile away and they run it almost all the time.
 
Philly_Cat said:
I still don't get this play they run where Burgess touches the ball past the 3 point line. Then goes to the block after handing it off. Hamilton has it covered because you see it a mile away and they run it almost all the time.
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They needed Burgess as an outlet at the high post because it’s nearly an automatic turnover otherwise. Can’t win a District title scoring only 32 points.
 
This year was about team play. Eveyone with a single star is gone. It's been said this year that the talent is down across the board. Well maybe this is why single star teams can't flourish. For starters, they don't have any great players around them to help them in any way. Second, those stars are getting overran by lesser players because there are too many of them to fend off. I keep picturing Gulliver getting taken down by a bunch of tiny people lol

gulliver.jpg
 
Philly_Cat said:
This year was about team play. Eveyone with a single star is gone. It's been said this year that the talent is down across the board. Well maybe this is why single star teams can't flourish. For starters, they don't have any great players around them to help them in any way. Second, those stars are getting overran by lesser players because there are too many of them to fend off. I keep picturing Gulliver getting taken down by a bunch of tiny people lol

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Agree - this year it seems most teams in the region have shifted to the GCL style of ball control and low scoring, likely because they all knew they didn't have very good teams. Most teams this year have used this grind it out style. It's likely why there have been so few really good and intriguing games this year. These district final teams aren't nearly as strong as districts in the past. May be one of the worst ever honestly.
 
JBaller said:
They needed Burgess as an outlet at the high post because it’s nearly an automatic turnover otherwise. Can’t win a District title scoring only 32 points.
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But it's not even high post. They give him the ball between the 3 line and halfcourt, then he immediately heads to the block. If he was working the high/low post it would make more sense. What they do seems like a waste of time and makes your best player expend more energy going to spots on the floor where he has no value.
 
It's one of the reasons why Moeller shouldn't play around with teams in the tournament. Kremer should let them loose from tip and have them just go be better. This methodical style of play could bite them if they let an inferior team stick around. It happened today for 3 quarters.
 
Philly_Cat said:
This year was about team play. Eveyone with a single star is gone. It's been said this year that the talent is down across the board. Well maybe this is why single star teams can't flourish. For starters, they don't have any great players around them to help them in any way. Second, those stars are getting overran by lesser players because there are too many of them to fend off. I keep picturing Gulliver getting taken down by a bunch of tiny people lol

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I will say that I thought Sycamore was going to finish 3rd in the GMC this year…..and they were pretty much exactly the team I thought they were going to be. Princeton had injuries and Fairfield decided they just didn’t want to be any good. Sycamore, Middletown, and Hamilton were the 3 GMC teams still playing this weekend because they played the best defense. With the exception of Burgess, none are that talented. We’ll get Moeller-Centerville, the two best teams, unless Elder can upset the apple cart.
 
Philly_Cat said:
But it's not even high post. They give him the ball between the 3 line and halfcourt, then he immediately heads to the block. If he was working the high/low post it would make more sense. What they do seems like a waste of time and makes your best player expend more energy going to spots on the floor where he has no value.
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The intention is to get him the ball at the high post/top of the key and run hand-offs and back cuts off of it. Hamilton did a very good job of forcing him out and then switching on the action.
 
The city has turned into GCL ball. Problem is, these teams don't have the patience, coaching, and discipline to make it work. You have to give kids more freedom to play basketball instead of trying to win every possession from the sidelines.

Just because Schoenfeld and Kremer make it successful doesn't mean everyone can do it. They have 30+ years of experience implementing it, and have kids that don't have issues running it.

Sycamore with 32 points in a district final game?

Start teaching more offensive skills sets! Playing this style only gets you so far unless you're Moeller, who has the talent and athleticism to play any way they want this year.
 
Doublehelix said:
The city has turned into GCL ball. Problem is, these teams don't have the patience, coaching, and discipline to make it work. You have to give kids more freedom to play basketball instead of trying to win every possession from the sidelines.

Just because Schoenfeld and Kremer make it successful doesn't mean everyone can do it. They have 30+ years of experience implementing it, and have kids that don't have issues running it.
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If by GCL ball you mean it's hack attack, I'm going to disagree. If by GCL ball you mean, a lot of motion on offense and patience to get a good shot. That's how most high school teams play across the country. The exception is the ones with a ton of talent where they almost always have 5 kids on the floor that can create their own shot. There were only 2 teams in Cincinnati D1 that I would say could do that, Moeller and Lakota West. West was just too young right now. The rest of the city should be scared of them for the next few years though. Moeller, in my opinion, is bored. You constantly harp on them not playing how you think they should, but I'd argue I'd rather have a team that can play a disciplined half court game and run if they need or want to, than a team that can run but can't play disciplined ball.
 
What a disappointing showing by Sycamore. As I posted on the GMC thread a few weeks ago there's too much fiddlin' and diddlin; with the ball 25 feet away from the basket with no apparent aim to score. Had Sycamore played with a sense of urgency before the last two minutes the outcome might have been different. Burgess looked to be soft. At this point I see him no more impactful in the Big 10 than Maverick Morgan (Springboro and then Illinois) was in the last decade. A JAG (just another guy) averaging about 5 points a game.
 
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