Obi-Wan Kenobi Series

It's humorous watching people question the dialogue in Obi-Wan Kenobi, and then watch videos of Alec Guiness, Mark Hamill and Harrison Ford absolutely rip the dialogue from A New Hope apart, to George Lucas' face.
Still nothing like the prequels:

Simpson's had a field day with this and the horrible pacing Lucas had as a director:

What stinks is if you watch American Graffiti you can see that Lucas had it in him as the dialogue and directing in this film are right on, something happened to him as he never captured that magic again.
 
Interesting that they originally envisioned Obi-Wan to be a trilogy of movies.

Wonder if you could expand around it to turn it into 3 seasons. Or even just 2 so there's less filler. Taking Obi-Wan on the journey to becoming the man who sacrifices himself for the bigger picture in A New Hope.


"Right, so not at all, none. I wrote the film that they based the show on. So, yeah. I spent like a year, year-and-a-half working on it. And then, when the decision was made not to make any more spin-off films after Solo came out, I left the project and went on to other things. Joby came on and took my scripts and turned it from two hours into six. So, I did not work with them at all, I just got credit for the episodes because it was all my stuff."

"So when I pitched my Obi-Wan story to Lucasfilm, I said, 'There's actually three stories here. Because there's three different evolutions that the character has to make in order to go from Obi-Wan to Ben.' And the first one was the first movie, which was the show, which was, 'Surrender to the will of the Force. Transport your will, surrender your will. Leave the kid alone.' So then, the second [movie] was thinking about where Kenobi ends up. And one of the most powerful and probably the most powerful moment in all of Obi-Wan's story is that moment where he sacrifices himself in A New Hope. Great moment, you know, makes you cry. But, if you stop and think about it, it's a pretty sudden thing, to just kind of go be fighting a guy, to see Luke and go, 'I'm gonna die.' You know, that to me, that required forethought. That required pre-acceptance that this was going to happen."
"So again, it's one of those universal things we all struggle with, to come to terms with our own mortality. So, that was the second step of the evolution for me, that Obi-Wan now has to come to terms with his own mortality, somehow in a prophecy, or Qui-Gon telling him, 'There's going to come a moment where you're gonna have to sacrifice yourself for the good,' And then [Obi-Wan] is like, 'What? No, no, no, no, I'm here to help... I can't, no.' And get him to that point where Obi Wan has accepted the idea that he's going to die, and that he's going to die willingly at a crucial moment, and you will know when that moment presents itself. So that when that moment comes up in [A New Hope], you understand. He's recognizing he's been on this journey already, and he's waiting for this moment, and that's how he's able to make it so easily. To do this [sacrifice], and die. So that to me was the second evolution, the second film, the second story. So for me, if I have anything to do with the second season of Obi Wan, that's the character evolution that I would take him on. That, to me, is really interesting. And like I said, universal."

"Oh absolutely. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, Ewan was on board, everyone. We were like, 'Yeah, ready to go.' And we were so excited about it, too... It's a great story to tell, right? It's such a fitting character and Ewan is just so fantastic at it. And he's the perfect age, everything.


"It just was dying to be done. You know, unfortunately, it's just, it was Solo that changed the direction of the system. I like Solo, personally, but it hadn't made a lot of money. It is crazy in some ways to think about it how it [was directed by] of the best filmmakers working today. But, just because it didn't hit a certain number, they just had to rethink. And, again, way above my paygrade, but it certainly crushed us. Devastated, absolutely devastated. But, that's the business, you know, highs and lows. I'm glad it got made. I'm glad the show got made. I'm proud of my story that [got] told. I'm glad my characters are all through it. And I'm glad I got credit for it. I wish, I wish they'd been able to make my movies."

"No, just the first. Because they hadn't hired me to do the others yet, 'cause I was busy working on the first one."
 
Watched the first two episodes and thought they were terrible. With only four episodes left in the 1st season I have little hope that they can right the ship. My biggest issues:

* The production values and special effects were shoddy. Visually this was the least interesting of the live Star Wars series.

* The decision to veer away from what looked to be a Ben & Luke story to one involving a young Leia was a dumb move IMO. You have to wonder at the continued marginalization of the Luke Skywalker character by Kathleen Kennedy and company. First the abysmal treatment of Luke in the last trilogy and now seemingly relegating the character to oblivion to focus on a princess Leia story. Doesn't Disney already have enough spunky princesses in their catalog? Mark Hamil must have pissed Kennedy off or something.

* I don't get the praise for the actress playing the young Leia character. She was horrible in the role. The two scenes where she runs away from people chasing her resemble Benny Hill or the keystone cops. I could walk faster then this kid can run. And isn't she supposed to be 10 years old? She looks 5 in the show. Is the kid giving off a Padme vibe supposed to be a good thing? Padme was one of the weakest characters in the 2nd trilogy coming out barely ahead of Jar Jar Binks.

* And for the record baby Yoda has nothing to worry about from baby Leia. Where baby Yoda was a truly original idea baby Leia is simply another in a long line of Disney Princesses. The Frozen girls have nothing to worry about.

* The rest of the cast is pretty pedestrian. Owen showed promise but is he even going to have a big role in the show? Obi Wan acts as if he had a lobotomy and sleep walks through his scenes. The villains are uniformly boring or comical. Third Sister is especially bad. For crying out loud can't they find a women that can act for the role?

I really do hope it gets better but I'm not holding my breath.
I just finished watching the series and skimming this thread tonight and I think you pretty much nailed it after two episodes.
 
I just finished watching the series and skimming this thread tonight and I think you pretty much nailed it after two episodes.

I don’t see his complaint about using Leia over Luke. How exciting would it have been to see Obi-Wan and Luke roam around Tatooine for six episodes? Leia provided an opportunity to explore the galaxy a bit and I’m glad they took it.

The continuity constraints on using Luke are a lot higher than Leia as well.
 
I don’t see his complaint about using Leia over Luke. How exciting would it have been to see Obi-Wan and Luke roam around Tatooine for six episodes? Leia provided an opportunity to explore the galaxy a bit and I’m glad they took it.

The continuity constraints on using Luke are a lot higher than Leia as well.
Who said Luke would even be all that involved? They could have focused on Obi-Wan protecting Luke from behind the scenes as Imperial forces sniffed around and uncle Owen opposed any interactions between Ben & Luke. They could have created all sorts of close calls where Luke's life was almost snuffed out if not for Obi Wan. And they could have sent Obi Wan out into the galaxy to head off threats to the most important character in the Star Wars universe. Instead we get to focus on a bratty 10 year old girl being chased by a really low grade villain who can't act worth a damn.

But then focusing on Luke would have taken imagination, something the latest Star Wars movies/series involving Kathy Kennedy and the rest of the woke mob sorely lack (with the honorable exception of Jon Favreau).

And sorry but what JJ Abrams and Kennedy have done to the Luke Skywalker character has been an abomination. Again with the exception of Favreau who allows the character to maintain some dignity.
 
Who said Luke would even be all that involved? They could have focused on Obi-Wan protecting Luke from behind the scenes as Imperial forces sniffed around and uncle Owen opposed any interactions between Ben & Luke. They could have created all sorts of close calls where Luke's life was almost snuffed out if not for Obi Wan. And they could have sent Obi Wan out into the galaxy to head off threats to the most important character in the Star Wars universe. Instead we get to focus on a bratty 10 year old girl being chased by a really low grade villain who can't act worth a damn.

But then focusing on Luke would have taken imagination, something the latest Star Wars movies/series involving Kathy Kennedy and the rest of the woke mob sorely lack (with the honorable exception of Jon Favreau).

And sorry but what JJ Abrams and Kennedy have done to the Luke Skywalker character has been an abomination. Again with the exception of Favreau who allows the character to maintain some dignity.

Your ideas for a series sound boring and lack any type of imagination. They are also similar to the premise of the first Obi-Wan project that got deep sixed.

What did JJ have to do with Luke? He didn’t write or direct the Last Jedi. I get the whole Kathleen Kennedy is the boogeywomen but Abrams not so much.
 
Your ideas for a series sound boring and lack any type of imagination. They are also similar to the premise of the first Obi-Wan project that got deep sixed.

What did JJ have to do with Luke? He didn’t write or direct the Last Jedi. I get the whole Kathleen Kennedy is the boogeywomen but Abrams not so much.
Boring to you is interesting to me.

JJ didn't do Luke any favors in The Force Awakens where he was writer, producer & Director. JJ also didn't do Luke any favors in The Last Jedi where he was Executive Producer and must have had a big impact on the direction of that movie given the financial success of Force Awakens. And of course JJ was writer, producer & director of The Rise of Skywalker where Princess Leia fly's through space without a suit!

Kennedy was Producer through all three movies and clearly wanted to displace Luke Skywalker as the central character in the Star Wars universe. And JJ Abrams set the tone for Luke's marginalization in the derivative The Force Awakens.
 
Boring to you is interesting to me.

JJ didn't do Luke any favors in The Force Awakens where he was writer, producer & Director. JJ also didn't do Luke any favors in The Last Jedi where he was Executive Producer and must have had a big impact on the direction of that movie given the financial success of Force Awakens. And of course JJ was writer, producer & director of The Rise of Skywalker where Princess Leia fly's through space without a suit!

Kennedy was Producer through all three movies and clearly wanted to displace Luke Skywalker as the central character in the Star Wars universe. And JJ Abrams set the tone for Luke's marginalization in the derivative The Force Awakens.

Princess Leia goes for a float in the Last Jedi not Rise Of Skywalker.

Luke is not the central character of Star Wars. Anakin Skywalker in all his form’s is unquestionably the central character of Star Wars.
 
Boring to you is interesting to me.

JJ didn't do Luke any favors in The Force Awakens where he was writer, producer & Director. JJ also didn't do Luke any favors in The Last Jedi where he was Executive Producer and must have had a big impact on the direction of that movie given the financial success of Force Awakens. And of course JJ was writer, producer & director of The Rise of Skywalker where Princess Leia fly's through space without a suit!

Kennedy was Producer through all three movies and clearly wanted to displace Luke Skywalker as the central character in the Star Wars universe. And JJ Abrams set the tone for Luke's marginalization in the derivative The Force Awakens.

putting aside the discussion of how you think Luke was treated, why wouldn’t they want to create new characters to carry the franchise?

For Star Wars to continue they needed to move on from Luke in some fashion.
 
putting aside the discussion of how you think Luke was treated, why wouldn’t they want to create new characters to carry the franchise?

For Star Wars to continue they needed to move on from Luke in some fashion.
So far the "creative" folks behind the Star Wars franchise haven't been all that good at giving us compelling new characters with the exception of Jon Favreau's stuff.

And they could have moved on from Luke in a way that respected the character. Instead he barely shows up in the movies and is portrayed as a bitter old man. They would have been better served if Luke's character was seduced subtly by the New Order rather then having him be a hermit on an island.

Contrast Abrams and Kennedy's treatment of the Luke character with Favreau's. I know which one I like best.
 
Princess Leia goes for a float in the Last Jedi not Rise Of Skywalker.

Luke is not the central character of Star Wars. Anakin Skywalker in all his form’s is unquestionably the central character of Star Wars.
In your opinion. But the first two movies, which made the money to enable the franchise to exist and were also by far the best of the Star Wars movies, featured Luke Skywalker front & center. He was the narrative in both those movies.

It was his character's journey that propelled Star Wars into orbit and cemented it as a cultural icon. The decision by Lucas to abandon Luke's and to a lesser extent Han & Leia's narrative in favor of the prequels featuring Anakin was a huge creative mistake IMO. It led to three lousy movies and a steady erosion in profits.
 
To me SW isn't character driven but theme driven, central is the relationship of good and evil with the force being a device to tie the relationship up in a nice package. The problem is that the original three films came out at a time when cinema commercialism was kicking in to the next level so it was at a perfect place and time for packing characters and even props to make a $. I am sure it is not going to happen but maybe it is time for them to take a break or at least limit the releases so that the SW content can be thought out in a more compelling manner.
 
To me SW isn't character driven but theme driven, central is the relationship of good and evil with the force being a device to tie the relationship up in a nice package. The problem is that the original three films came out at a time when cinema commercialism was kicking in to the next level so it was at a perfect place and time for packing characters and even props to make a $. I am sure it is not going to happen but maybe it is time for them to take a break or at least limit the releases so that the SW content can be thought out in a more compelling manner.



I'd agree with that to an extent. While I disagree with some on the specific content we've gotten, I do agree with the notion out there that Star Wars has lost it's "special-ness" to a degree.

The first 6, even 7, films were "events". Now, with there being so much content out and coming out, Star Wars has become a bit common place. Not that that's a horrible thing, but it makes it different than what it once was.

And while those first 7 films are by no means perfect, them being an event experience played a part in how they are perceived and loved.
 
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In your opinion. But the first two movies, which made the money to enable the franchise to exist and were also by far the best of the Star Wars movies, featured Luke Skywalker front & center. He was the narrative in both those movies.

It was his character's journey that propelled Star Wars into orbit and cemented it as a cultural icon. The decision by Lucas to abandon Luke's and to a lesser extent Han & Leia's narrative in favor of the prequels featuring Anakin was a huge creative mistake IMO. It led to three lousy movies and a steady erosion in profits.

It’s George Lucases opinion as well.

Why do you continue to watch Star Wars material if all you can do is complain about it?
 
it was never officially cancelled, but I really hope they still go through with Patty Jenkins' "Rogue Squadron" movie.



"Top Gun in space" would be so fun to see. We've gotten space battles in Star Wars, but never a full movie one.
 
Why do you continue to watch Star Wars material if all you can do is complain about it?
I love all things science fiction - books, movies and TV shows. And for better or worse Star Wars & Star Trek drive the direction of a lot of science fiction in movies & series television. I've written off Star Trek and don't watch any of the new movies or series any more. I'm reluctant to take that step with Star Wars particularly since some of that franchise is still quite good.

And where did you get the idea that I complain about all of Star Wars? You need to learn how to distinguish between the concept of "everything" and "some things". For the record I've repeatedly said that Favreau's stuff is excellent with the Mandalorian being one of the best series of any kind on TV. I've also called out the animated series, especially Clone Wars, Rebels & Bad Batch as being outstanding and I think Rogue One is a great movie.

A New Hope & Empire Strikes Back should make anyone's top 10 list of the greatest science fiction movies of all time.

The problem IMO is that the prequels sucked and took Star Wars in the wrong direction and the last trilogy was derivative and seemed to have a woke agenda to grind.
 
it was never officially cancelled, but I really hope they still go through with Patty Jenkins' "Rogue Squadron" movie.



"Top Gun in space" would be so fun to see. We've gotten space battles in Star Wars, but never a full movie one.
I read a lot of science fiction and there are countless compelling stories that could be brought to the big screen & TV that would be great. I just wish we got fewer sequels, prequels and reimaginings of old content and more original material from the enormous reserviour of great stuff just sitting there in the SciFi literature. With today's special effects there isn't a story or concept that couldn't be created.
 
Star Trek, the new show is great, but I wouldn't even but it into the sci-fi category. Star Wars is more Fantasy than Sci-fi. Neither are for people afraid of girls.

Agreed, there is room for new. Seems as if comicbooks are the only safe source but FX is bringing Butler's Kindred to screen. Long overdue. Of course, that will be too "woke" for some, even though written in the 70s. Shame on Sci-Fi for being ahead is its time, lol.

Complaining about the serials, Star or Dune that make the profit that would allow new is counter-productive. As long as the franchises are viable, they'll be made. That money funds more risky efforts.
 
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Why was it hard to get through?
Bored the crap out of me. Nothing built anticipation for the series. Hugely uninteresting dialogue. Made it seem as if it will be mostly story filler. There's no need to try and include bits of everything. Less would have been more here.
 
This series looks interesting. I like trailers of Science Fiction movies/series that don't disclose much plot but dazzle with scenery & special effects.
 
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