Midwest Athletic Conference 2023

Who Wins The MAC in 2023?

  • Total voters
    211
Bruce Monnin said:
It was never about making the playoffs!

It was done to provide relief to the bottom teams in the league. The extra Harbin's points were an extra selling point but not the main driver.
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bigkat said:
we have had this discussion before... and you have talked to people and i have talked to people... I'll go by what i have heard in the past...
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Whether it's about making the playoffs or relief for the bottom of the league; I don't think the scheduling system is particularly necessary.

As others have said, with 16-teams per region now the playoff point is now a moot point. Teams are making the postseason with losing records (i.e. St Henry this season). OHSAA is unlikely to change this despite the many, many complaints on Yappi about it.

In terms of relief, what relief is actually happening? Speaking of that St Henry team, they finished this regular season 3-7 (2-6). The team they didn't play? Delphos St. John's, and the Blue Jays finished 4-6 (2-6). Seems as though both teams would've benefitted from playing one another given that they were both near the bottom of the MAC league standings. Also this year, Coldwater 9-1 (7-1) and Minster 8-2 (6-2) not playing. Back in 2021, Versailles 9-1 (7-1) and Coldwater 8-2 (6-2)... and again in 2021 at the bottom of the league standings, Fort Recovery 3-7 (1-7) and Minster 1-9 (0-8). All of these teams should've played one another, but didn't due to the limitations of the MAC scheduling system. I simply think that the two-year dead period is too slow to react and football programs bounce back (or fade away) quicker, and for reasons other than who they did or didn't play.

On the plus side, the MAC scheduling system does create some compelling week 2 match-ups, and we don't have to see the slaughter that would be Marion Local-Parkway. Yet, all those years of Parkway dodging Marion Local clearly hasn't resulted in their program bouncing back. Probably because there are more significant variables other than who you do or do not play one singular week of a football season. :LOL:
 
tucson said:
Whether it's about making the playoffs or relief for the bottom of the league; I don't think the scheduling system is particularly necessary.

As others have said, with 16-teams per region now the playoff point is now a moot point. Teams are making the postseason with losing records (i.e. St Henry this season). OHSAA is unlikely to change this despite the many, many complaints on Yappi about it.

In terms of relief, what relief is actually happening? Speaking of that St Henry team, they finished this regular season 3-7 (2-6). The team they didn't play? Delphos St. John's, and the Blue Jays finished 4-6 (2-6). Seems as though both teams would've benefitted from playing one another given that they were both near the bottom of the MAC league standings. Also this year, Coldwater 9-1 (7-1) and Minster 8-2 (6-2) not playing. Back in 2021, Versailles 9-1 (7-1) and Coldwater 8-2 (6-2)... and again in 2021 at the bottom of the league standings, Fort Recovery 3-7 (1-7) and Minster 1-9 (0-8). All of these teams should've played one another, but didn't due to the limitations of the MAC scheduling system. I simply think that the two-year dead period is too slow to react and football programs bounce back (or fade away) quicker, and for reasons other than who they did or didn't play.

On the plus side, the MAC scheduling system does create some compelling week 2 match-ups, and we don't have to see the slaughter that would be Marion Local-Parkway. Yet, all those years of Parkway dodging Marion Local clearly hasn't resulted in their program bouncing back. Probably because there are more significant variables other than who you do or do not play one singular week of a football season. :LOL:
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One cannot deny the results in the last 15 years and this scheduling platform is absolutely one piece of the puzzle.
 
Thavoice said:
Versailles had been playing VW for quite a few yrs before the MAC, I think longer than msml.
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Coldwater and V have been playing football much longer than Marion Local however Flyers and Tigers have played each other every year since the late 50's early 60's (defunct TCL) except for a couple of years because of the MAC rotating schedule. Coldwater was in the WBL before the MAC and looking at the record books (cavfootball) Coldwater and V never played each other in the 60's.
 
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Thavoice said:
Versailles had been playing VW for quite a few yrs before the MAC, I think longer than msml.
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Van Wert and Versailles have never played an actual game, they have scrimmaged for many, many years. Van Wert has played Bryan for 60+ years, week 1. WBL has played a 9 game conference schedule for decades, would have to go back to at least the 60s, but then you start getting into the 9 game season of days gone by.
 
ctown14 said:
Van Wert and Versailles have never played an actual game, they have scrimmaged for many, many years. Van Wert has played Bryan for 60+ years, week 1. WBL has played a 9 game conference schedule for decades, would have to go back to at least the 60s, but then you start getting into the 9 game season of days gone by.
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I think voice meant to type CW not VW.
 
ctown14 said:
Stirred not Shaken said:
I think voice meant to type CW not VW.
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Van Wert and Versailles have never played an actual game, they have scrimmaged for many, many years. Van Wert has played Bryan for 60+ years, week 1. WBL has played a 9 game conference schedule for decades, would have to go back to at least the 60s, but then you start getting into the 9 game season of days gone by.
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Mean CW.
Yeah...damn small keypad on My jitterbug phone.
 
Sorry Marion Local we came up short. Just uncharacteristic to give up 3 passing TDs by one of the corners. He is usually the most reliable. OLB just missed picking a ball off that was a TD for them. So close yet so far away.
 
bigkat said:
we have had this discussion before... and you have talked to people and i have talked to people... I'll go by what i have heard in the past...
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dude was in the room where it happened, and you're still like "nope, i trust what i heard at the wooden shoe".
 
*67 said:
and the other opinion is from the guy the league asked for his advice on how to fix the problem he claims was the issue.
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I imagine he was more the mind behind the numbers/process, not necessarily the fixer of the problem.

I have a theory, maybe it was not discussed when he was present as a motivating factor because it was a given that issues making the playoffs were present and case in point was 8-2 Parkway and 7-3 Anna missing the playoffs.

Some schools voicing displeasure and possibly wanting to leave likely did make the league have a cause for concern, but to ignore the playoff implications of NOT having the 2 OOC games is absurd. That was at the forefront of everyone's minds, no doubt about that.


Past is past. League saw a problem. Fixed it, and the league took that next step with assistance of an extra division and with teams in 3 diff divisions at times it gives us an advantage. However, many leagues have teams in 2 diff divisions so many have a chance to do what the MAC does and get multiple titles, yet very few do.
 
Weiskittle said:
I would think SH would be a good gig, weren’t they young this year?
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Yes, they were young and appear to have some good grades stacked together at the junior high level as well. I would expect significant interest in this job. Tradition, community buy in, new athletic complex, etc. There's a lot to like about that job.
 
PW4Ever said:
Yes, they were young and appear to have some good grades stacked together at the junior high level as well. I would expect significant interest in this job. Tradition, community buy in, new athletic complex, etc. There's a lot to like about that job.
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I'm telling you......
Ex CW QB and current Celina O-Coordinator....
Would he dare go to the Red/White of ST Henry?!?!?!?!@?!
 
Thavoice said:
Quick history lesson as to why this rotating scheduled started. Granted, now with 16 making the playoffs it shouldnt be a big a deal but here is the skinny for those who dont know.

2001: MAC added Versailles to go to an uneven 9 teams.
------This forced the league to have have an OOC game all season and it was nuts to get them later in the year so........
2006: Anna was added to make it an even 10, and playing 1 OOC team and 9 league games.
2007: 8-2 Parkway missed the playoffs, as did a 7-3 Anna, but most notably PW.
-------That season PW won their only OOC game, against a 5-5 team so it wasnt like their lone OOC game was a complete dog.
-------PW only lost to 15-0 MSML, and 14-1 CW teams that were both State Champions.


Also around this time some of the smaller schools were grumbling that the most recent schools added, (Anna, Versailles) were bigger and it was tougher to compete.

The MAC saw that PW debacle, an 8-2 team missing the playoffs, as unacceptable, and foresaw instances like that happening again moving forward so because of that, and the grumblings, they went to the current format in 2 year cycles.

I wholeheartedly this allowed programs like Ft Rec, New Bremen, Minster et all to be able to make resurgances and win state titles.
It allowed the less fortunate schools to find a team they could compete with, win, garner Harbins, make the playoffs, and build their programs. It alllowed the better teams to attempt to 'schedule up' and play some better teams, and in turn improve and increase harbins.


At times some rivalries have had to take a pause, but I think the results since then is undeniable with Anna, Ft Rec, NB getting their first state titles, Minster coming back onto the scene, and so on.

All in all, it has been a blessing and I realize with 16 it may not be needed, but I prefer it this way and 2 OOC games (even tho they are tougher to find at times). I would rather have been playing the likes of Hartley, Bellefontaine, Clinton Massie, Valley View, the Cincy schools, etc, than the 2nd lowest MAC team.
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with the new 16 teams being allowed to get into the tournament... having ONE non-conference game is not as big as a factor as back as was when there was there was just 8 teams allowed in. I hope they drop it back to 8 teams( as the coaches want). but it was clear back in 2007 when BOTH a 8-2 and a 7-3 teams in the MAC didn't make the playoffs because they didn't have enough computor points....

i would imagine BOTH those teams would have liked to have had a EXTRA non conference game to possibility of them putting them into the playoffs....
 
Thavoice said:
I'm telling you......
Ex CW QB and current Celina O-Coordinator....
Would he dare go to the Red/White of ST Henry?!?!?!?!@?!
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who is the coach you are talking about? heck one of Minster's best players of all time became the HC of the Steiners..... a assistant BB coach( and former player of Minster) went over and became the HC of the Cards... this has happened all the time in the MAC...
 
*67 said:
dude was in the room where it happened, and you're still like "nope, i trust what i heard at the wooden shoe".
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Thavoice said:
I imagine he was more the mind behind the numbers/process, not necessarily the fixer of the problem.

I have a theory, maybe it was not discussed when he was present as a motivating factor because it was a given that issues making the playoffs were present and case in point was 8-2 Parkway and 7-3 Anna missing the playoffs.

Some schools voicing displeasure and possibly wanting to leave likely did make the league have a cause for concern, but to ignore the playoff implications of NOT having the 2 OOC games is absurd. That was at the forefront of everyone's minds, no doubt about that.


Past is past. League saw a problem. Fixed it, and the league took that next step with assistance of an extra division and with teams in 3 diff divisions at times it gives us an advantage. However, many leagues have teams in 2 diff divisions so many have a chance to do what the MAC does and get multiple titles, yet very few do.
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and BM is a NUMBERS/Process type guy....
 
bigkat said:
with the new 16 teams being allowed to get into the tournament... having ONE non-conference game is not as big as a factor as back as was when there was there was just 8 teams allowed in. I hope they drop it back to 8 teams( as the coaches want). but it was clear back in 2007 when BOTH a 8-2 and a 7-3 teams in the MAC didn't make the playoffs because they didn't have enough computor points....

i would imagine BOTH those teams would have liked to have had a EXTRA non conference game to possibility of them putting them into the playoffs....
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I always bring up Parkway (9th in harbins) because they only lost to 2 State Champions that year and won their only OOC game against a 5-5 team and Anna did lose to PW.
However, if we look close at Anna (10th in harbins), their only OOC game was a win vs 7-3 team so yea they have a complaint as well!

Parkway would have been facing Fairbanks, a 9-1 team in a weak league and traditionally does not do much come playoff time.
Anna woulda faced a Miami East team that MSML beat in the first round 37-0. Anna/MSML was 35-6 that year but I would like my chances of both of those teams moving on if we had 16 getting in.

I would like to keep the 2 OOC games even though its tough to find that second one. I am hoping more teams are open to playing and not afraid to pick up a MAC team because a loss isnt gonna hurt much anymore.
 
Thavoice said:
I always bring up Parkway (9th in harbins) because they only lost to 2 State Champions that year and won their only OOC game against a 5-5 team and Anna did lose to PW.
However, if we look close at Anna (10th in harbins), their only OOC game was a win vs 7-3 team so yea they have a complaint as well!

Parkway would have been facing Fairbanks, a 9-1 team in a weak league and traditionally does not do much come playoff time.
Anna woulda faced a Miami East team that MSML beat in the first round 37-0. Anna/MSML was 35-6 that year but I would like my chances of both of those teams moving on if we had 16 getting in.

I would like to keep the 2 OOC games even though its tough to find that second one. I am hoping more teams are open to playing and not afraid to pick up a MAC team because a loss isnt gonna hurt much anymore.
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I would think that the MAC has a pretty good winning percentage in that 2nd Non-conference game...
 
Thavoice said:
I'm telling you......
Ex CW QB and current Celina O-Coordinator....
Would he dare go to the Red/White of ST Henry?!?!?!?!@?!
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I know exactly who you're talking about and the only question I would have is he ready for that big of a job yet? He seems mature beyond his years and his Dad is one of the greatest human beings there are. I was hoping the black and gold would reach out to him but I would imagine his advisors, mainly his Dad, would tell him to stay as far away from that as possible. What if he took the red and white job only to get him ready for the orange and black job in a few years when Otten retires?
 
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