Enquirer Coaches Poll

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SwimReporter

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I would like to call out the boys swim coach who failed to vote for St. Xavier in the Enquirer Coaches Poll. Each week, area coaches have an opportunity to vote on-line for the top 10. The votes are anonymous, so there is no transparency or accountability. Most coaches, I imagine, use good judgment and vote based on their knowledge of the rosters, etc. However, there is nothing to prevent a coach from manipulating the vote and the outcome. Last week, for example, five coaches participate in the poll. The results are below, with first place votes in parenthesis.

1. Mason 40
1. St. Xavier (4) 40
3. Sycamore 30
4. Anderson (1) 29
5. Moeller 28
6. Lakota West 25
7. Lakota East 17
8. Milford 11
9. Turpin 9
10. LaSalle 8
10. Loveland 8

Since St. Xavier received four first place votes and 40 points, it is clear that the fifth voter failed to include St. Xavier on their ballot. That voter listed Anderson as #1. In prior weeks, I have also noticed that Mason was left off of a ballot completely.

I would like to call out the coach that voted for Anderson and ask if they truly believe that St. X is not one of the best 10 teams in the city. If so, could they provide the meet entries that would lead Anderson to a dual meet victory over St. X or the other top 5 legitimate teams in the city.
 
 
I believe that Fairfield should be in there. Michael Drake and Mitchell Ellis will be factors at Districts and State. These two swimmers lead the Fairfield boys swim team who should be Top 10 in the City.
 
OhioSwimming said:
I believe that Fairfield should be in there. Michael Drake and Mitchell Ellis will be factors at Districts and State. These two swimmers lead the Fairfield boys swim team who should be Top 10 in the City.
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Erm... Ross Westrick leads the Fairfield team and is the only person there who seems likely to be a state qualifier (as he was last year). Drake and Ellis are both very good swimmers but they would need monster time drops to get out of the SW districts this year. As far as the top 10 in the city who knows... Fairfield has a dual with Lakota East coming up this week I believe so that should help them to know where they stack up within the GMC (and just accepting they'd fall behind X, Moe and Anderson). I saw both LaSalle and Loveland when they visited Mason this past weekend and I think Fairfield would compete just fine with them.

And the OP is obviously correct... this anonymous voting is shameful. Everyone knows who the top team in the city is and to leave them (or Mason) off of this ballot entirely is a disgrace. But at the end of the day it's like all polls... meaningless... they will all get their chance to sort it out in the pool next month.
 
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The polls are a joke. The majority of coaches don't even vote. You can't take them seriously. Also it's hard to vote for a team. Are you voting for best in a dual meet or who would do best in a large invitational? Two totally different things in my opinion.
 
BigSwimFan said:
The polls are a joke. The majority of coaches don't even vote. You can't take them seriously. Also it's hard to vote for a team. Are you voting for best in a dual meet or who would do best in a large invitational? Two totally different things in my opinion.
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+1 . I can't believe this is even an issue.
 
Although Fairfield has a few good swimmers, they have no depth. Kings, and Talawanda belong on this list before loveland, lasalle and fairfield. St X without a doubt should be the unanimous #1 no disrespect to mason
 
ThatOneGuy10 said:
Although Fairfield has a few good swimmers, they have no depth. Kings, and Talawanda belong on this list before loveland, lasalle and fairfield. St X without a doubt should be the unanimous #1 no disrespect to mason
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Can't disagree with that assessment at all TOG10. and that is no disrespect at all towards Mason... they are a very good, very young team... X is a perennial national power and are head and shoulders better than anyone in SW Ohio (and likely the entire state). And the earlier point by BigSwimFan is spot on... dual meets and championship meets are two different things. Sure X is the best in either format but for most other teams it makes all the difference. Mason has a large, deep, but young team. They will beat all but the very best of Ohio's programs in a dual meet format but will suffer come championship season as they don't currently have that solid core of elite upperclassman who will score big against the other top dogs in the state. In a couple of years that may change, but for now they'll have to take their lumps.
 
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BigSwimFan said:
The polls are a joke. The majority of coaches don't even vote. You can't take them seriously. Also it's hard to vote for a team. Are you voting for best in a dual meet or who would do best in a large invitational? Two totally different things in my opinion.
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Good point, but I think the point of my initial post has been lost in the shuffle. I didn't intend to start a debate about whether Team A is better than Team B, or whether those teams should be ranked 5th, 6th, 7th, etc.

My intention was to bring attention to the lack of integrity of the voter that failed to list St. X in the top 10. Sure, the poll is meaningless, as noted by TOG and dadX. We all know that things will be decided in the pool at the end of the season. However, many coaches polls do have meaning. As an example, coaches vote for seeding in the post-season tournaments for soccer, basketball, etc. And the Enquirer gives a trophy to the regular season "city champion" in some sports. Coaches also vote for all-league teams in football, etc.

In swimming, we are fortunate that "times" decide all of these things and we are not left to subjective opinions of coaches. Having said that, we should all expect a certain level of integrity from coaches when they do vote. They can certainly choose not to participate in the Enquirer pool - there is no obligation to do so.

By the way, that certain voter this week appears to have ranked Anderson, Amelia, Edgewood and Hamiltion #1-4. Clearly an absurb assessment of the local teams and a mockery of the voting process.

The OP was a topic worthy of discussion, in my opinion. Much more so than whether a swimmer moved out of town or met with some worse fate. In that thread, people should at least spell the name correctly.

Unrelated to my initial point, I agree that Kings and Talawanda are top 10 teams. Both have a minimum of 5-6 excellent swimmers that will compete well at Districts and their relays will contend a State birth. Lasalle and Loveland are very limited.
 
OhioSwimming said:
I believe that Fairfield should be in there. Michael Drake and Mitchell Ellis will be factors at Districts and State. These two swimmers lead the Fairfield boys swim team who should be Top 10 in the City.
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Reality says otherwise...

Lakota East 162
Fairfield 99
 
If those teams were really voted 1-4 by a coach then that is absurd. It would be nice to make the votes public and also tell the coaches to actually vote each week to make it more interesting.

I do know the most ADs are notified when a coach doesn't vote but I would guess that the AD doesn't get too upset with the swim coach.
 
Week 7 Poll
Men
1) Anderson (1) 31
2) St. Xavier (3) 30
3) Sycamore 26
4) Mason 23
5) Moeller 14
6) Lakota West 12
7) Lakota East 11
8) Amelia 9
9) Edgewood 8
10) Hamilton 7

It's sad to envision a HS coach willing to manipulate the voting system so brazenly and have the Enquirer continue to provide them with the oppportunity to do so. Similar silliness in this weeks ladies poll as well. On a brighter note, psyched for the Classic this weekend... should be lots of exciting racing.
 
"Week 7 Poll
Men
1) Anderson (1) 31
2) St. Xavier (3) 30
3) Sycamore 26
4) Mason 23
5) Moeller 14
6) Lakota West 12
7) Lakota East 11
8) Amelia 9
9) Edgewood 8
10) Hamilton 7

It's sad to envision a HS coach willing to manipulate the voting system so brazenly and have the Enquirer continue to provide them with the oppportunity to do so. Similar silliness in this weeks ladies poll as well. On a brighter note, psyched for the Classic this weekend... should be lots of exciting racing"

Moeller should be number 3 behind X and Sycamore
 
We have the same issue with polo polls. Rankings would be more fun if votes were made public. You would not have the issues you have now with them. Until that happens they don't mean anything.

There's not a person that legitimately think X is anything but 1. The debate comes in at 2-5.

Classic this weekend will clear up a lot.
 
OhioSwimming said:
Moeller should be number 3 behind X and Sycamore
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Maybe, maybe not. I'd argue it depends on the format. In a championship meet Sycamore and Moeller would have the better of it due to having more top-end swimmers (As I expect we'll see at the Classic and the upcoming Sectional/District meets). In a dual meet Mason's depth would be hard to overcome for either Sycamore or Moeller. Honestly, you'd probably have to add Anderson to that mix too as they would likely do well in a dual format with these teams as Mukisa alluded to above!
 
Actually, X shouldn't even be included in the Enquirer Poll. They are essentially a junior college that actively recruits swimmers away from public schools. Total BS!
 
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