Canfield Cardinals Schedule and Outlook for 2023
- Thread starter simkon
- Start date
That’s definitely what’s going on.
topperbounce
Defend the Hill
Odd that Steubenville wouldn’t agree to a home and home during that timeframe. They agreed to a home and home with Chardon in ‘98 and ‘99, and then again in ‘00 and ‘01. Why for Chardon and not Canfield? Something seems off.
‘97-‘00
Targeting!
Well-known member
Because it likely didn’t happen.
bulldogcountry
Well-known member
As someone with no dog in this fight who watched both of those teams in 05 I can say with absolute certainty that 15-0 DIII champ Steubenville was capable of beating Canfield and I probably would have given them a slight edge with Collaros at QB. Would have been a great matchup for sure. Canfield was great and if Babbaro doesn’t get hurt in the title game they probably win.
YTOWN
Well-known member
I don't know if it happened or not but I do know that by 2005 Steubenville had played Boardman in the regular season 13 times and they also played Ursuline in the regular season starting in 2003 so that part is incorrect. They had not scheduled Mooney yet though so he is correct on that.
simkon
Well-known member
Well somehow Steubenville had 8 home games all 3 years that Canfield was interested in scheduling Steubenville. So although they have played Ursuline and Boardman, it was likely a contract biased in Steubenville's favor or else they wouldn't manage to have 8 home games. The only way to get 8 home games is have biased contracts, including but not limited to one year contracts and three year contracts in Steubenville's favor. You can't dispute the fact that Steubenville often has had 7 or 8 home games over the years, and that doesn't happen if you have 2 year home and home contracts.
simkon
Well-known member
Incidentally, Canfield ended up scheduling Chardon I think instead of Steubenville. Also back then Steubenville generally only played home and homes with a few teams on their schedule so they could still get 8 home games. I think they played a home and home with Zanesville back then and one or two other teams.
Like what happens to Massillon, schools will schedule Steubenville when the schools think they have a team that could beat Big Red. They don't want them on the schedule on a down year.
simkon
Well-known member
Canfield was a top 5 team in D-II at the time, so I am sure there was some truth to that. Steubenville was the State Champion in D-III however some of those years as well. The projection systems had Canfield favored all the years in question, with further supports your statement.
Millennium Falcon
Active member
I think there are alot of reasons why a school wouldn't want to play Big Red post 2012.
I always thought Massillon, Fitch, Boardman and Harding should form a football only league and they could still get 7 or 8 home games in their season if they want.
Dover, Canfield, Louisville and Steubenville could do the same.
Makes too much sense
simkon
Well-known member
Canfield would definitely have no problem being in a league with Dover, Louisville, Boardman, Howland. But wouldn't be in a league with Steubenville, Fitch, WGH and obviously Massillon would destory them.
I wasn't thinking all the schools in the same league, just 4 teams but I like the idea of Howland and Boardman added. Funny how Boardman, Dover, Louisville, Canfield and Howland play each other but why they don't think to form a league.
Crimson and Black
Well-known member
Im sure canfields had a team or two that could beat Steubenville. But I’d say over the years Big Red beats Canfield 90% of the time.
Crimson and Black
Well-known member
Probably because at that time Chardon had cemented itself as a state power and those were marquee games. What is Canfields record over the last 40 years or even 20 years? It’s one thing to have a few really good talent cycles and produce some outstanding teams. It’s a complete different thing to show year after year of very good teams and go into every year as a potential contender. We have, on average over 40 years, played in the title game once every 4 years. And, on average play in the final 4 every 2 years. I’ll take that kind of consistency over producing a great team a few times over the long haul.
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Redzone Blitz
Active member
Crimson and Black
Well-known member
In the last 40 years, by quick count in my head Canfield has lost 185 games and Steubenville has lost 83. And during that time The Big Red played 98 playoff games and won 70 of them. A 70-28 playoff record. Again, 90% of the time Big Red takes Canfield to the woodshed.
Big Red 410-83……..493 games….10.25 wins/yr
Canfield 261-185…… 446 games….6.5 wins/yr
I count 3 maybe 4 years that Canfield MIGHT have won in the last 40 years. It could very well have been 38-2 in favor of The Mighty Big Red!!
Big Red 410-83……..493 games….10.25 wins/yr
Canfield 261-185…… 446 games….6.5 wins/yr
I count 3 maybe 4 years that Canfield MIGHT have won in the last 40 years. It could very well have been 38-2 in favor of The Mighty Big Red!!
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BHSspartans13
Well-known member
What is going on with all the administrative shake ups in Canfield right now?
The district has everything right going for it, but are there issues brewing? Especially with the huge levy/bond that they're struggling to pass.
The district has everything right going for it, but are there issues brewing? Especially with the huge levy/bond that they're struggling to pass.
simkon
Well-known member
Canfield has been terrible for most of their history, they were also a completely different type of community at different points in their history. Canfield has not had success over the majority of their history. No one will ever make any such claims. However if you just look at the past 25 years or so, you would find that Canfield would have likely won at least half the time if not more, as they have been one of the top 5 teams in D-II and later D-III during that period. Meanwhile Steubenville was mostly in D-IV and for a few years in D-III if I am not mistaken. Steubenville was a perennial title contender in their division for the majority of that time.
And further your analysis is meaningless and inherently flawed and biased and completely worthless. It has no bearing on who would have won in the mid 2000s when Canfield offered to schedule Steubenville in a home and home, when Canfield was one of the top 5 teams in D-II every year, with juggernauts like Central Catholic and other parochials not to mention other very successful programs like Pick North and Pick Central to contend with...
Out of curiosity has Steubenville ever played Pick North, Pick Central, TCC, just to name a few?
Steubenville having success for the past 40 years is well and good but has no bearing on what the head to head results would be any specific year. For the majority if not all of the 80s I am sure Steubenville would have won, and then for early to mid 90s they likely win everyyear and then again from 2010 to 2015 they likely win easily as well. From the late 90s to 2009 and then from 2016 to present, Canfield likely would have won most years.
So from 1980 you have about 25 years of Steubenville winning easily, no contest and then another 15 years where Canfield wins, (some years the game would be close and occasionally Canfield might have won big).
The fact of the matter is that Steubenville is more consistently a state title contender and they have more consistent sucess and more total wins, however Canfield still would have won about 15 times in the past 40 years, including on some occasions where Steubenville was the state champion in their division.
There are divisions for a reason and it is more difficult to win the state championship in D-II then it is in D-IV. Steubenville likely would not have won any state championships in the past 25 years if they had to play in D-I or D-II. Steubenville is nonetheless an excellent school for their size, but they wouldn't be competitive with the top D-II and D-III schools when were a small D-IV school.
Look at D-III this coming year, TCC the defending D-II chanpion will be the team to beat most likely, if you want to claim Steubenville would have beat them last year or will beat them this year, that would just be an absolutely ridiculous claim to make. And as such, since you can't make that claim that just proves the disparity in talent in competition between the larger divisions like D-II and D-III compared to the lower divisions like D-IV and D-V.
I don't believe they are related to the bond/levy issue. From what I hear, one of the staff leaving was because they needed to be closer to home for personal reasons. As for Cochran leaving, I won't speculate. He was a pretty good dude, and I wish him the best. On a football note, the cement is about dry on a bye week, so 9 games it is. Was hoping for a Festivus Miracle on that. Might turn out to be a blessing though.
Crimson and Black
Well-known member
That was a long and tedious read brother. Really makes no sense. And to say Canfield would have won 15 times in the last 40 years flies in the face of logic. If you’d like to keep this going tell me which 15 seasons Canfield beats The Big Red. To flat out say Canfield would have beaten SHS even during their championship seasons is also ridiculous
topperbounce
Defend the Hill
I’m looking forward to his response to this. He basically references The Big Red as a DIV school throughout his rant, but with that said, wasn’t Steubenville DII throughout the 90’s and early 00’s, and then DIII until the last few years? I’m pretty sure on this.
simkon
Well-known member
They were back and forth between D-III and D-IV in the 1990s and then they were D-III from 1999-2005, 2010-2011 & 2019-2021, they were D-IV from 2006-2009, 2012-2018 & 2022-2023. Canfield was always in a division higher than Steubenville with the exception of 2019-2021 they were in the same division (D-III).
topperbounce
Defend the Hill
I’m pretty sure they were DII in the 90’s, but I’ll let @Crimson and Black confirm. I know their State Final appearances in the 80’s against Buchtel they were DII.
simkon
Well-known member
I am pretty sure they were D-II in the 1980s, but I have no way to confirm it either way. At some point in the 1990s they dropped down, because I know they weren't in the same division as Canfield from the mid 90s until present with the exception of 2019-2021. Canfield was D-III in the 1980s and AA back in the days of only 3 divisions. I don't know if Steubenville was AA or AAA, perhaps one of their posters can let us know. Canfield started gaining enrollment/population in the mid 1980s going from a small D-III school to a mid size D-II school by the early 2000s. Canfield also went from being a very rural/ farm community and enrollment to having mostly students from houses in town.
Steubenville conversely started heading in the opposite direction in the late 80s into the early 90s and losing population and enrollment, or even holding steady while many schools in Ohio were growing.
