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serpico said:
It was a question in support of officials, as in, how hard must it make your jobs to be given a rule book and then told to disregard it when an assigner tells you to?

I’m sorry if I’ve offended you in some way, but I absolutely understand the example you gave, believe it or not. The specific halftime-length rule seems to be different, though. I mean, you didn’t say the assigners don’t want it called in blowouts, but don’t want it called at all. I just don’t get that and am curious if there are other rules this happens with…
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No offense taken.... Had a guy tell me last night that my mother was a whore as I walked back to the locker room......
Wasn't offended at that either..... amused ? yes.... offended.... no ;)

My comment about "you" not understanding was a collective "you" (the general public) and not you specifically.

When talking halftime and the bands..... AD's would rather have a root canal without Novocaine rather than to hear it from the band parents...... Those have been my experiences over the years.....

As zebrastripes said..... we do what the boss wants us to do.... If he says ignore it, we ignore it.... If he says flag it, we flag it.... 5yds, delay of game..... (and the band is still on the field ? )
 
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AllSports12 said:
No offense taken.... Had a guy tell me last night that my mother was a whore as I walked back to the locker room......
Wasn't offended at that either..... amused ? yes.... offended.... no ;)

My comment about "you" not understanding was a collective "you" (the general public) and not you specifically.

When talking halftime and the bands..... AD's would rather have a root canal without Novocaine rather than to hear it from the band parents...... Those have been my experiences over the years.....
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You ain't lying about that.
AllSports12 said:
As zebrastripes said..... we do what the boss wants us to do.... If he says ignore it, we ignore it.... If he says flag it, we flag it.... 5yds, delay of game..... (and the band is still on the field ? )
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serpico said:
It was a question in support of officials, as in, how hard must it make your jobs to be given a rule book and then told to disregard it when an assigner tells you to?

I’m sorry if I’ve offended you in some way, but I absolutely understand the example you gave, believe it or not. The specific halftime-length rule seems to be different, though. I mean, you didn’t say the assigners don’t want it called in blowouts, but don’t want it called at all. I just don’t get that and am curious if there are other rules this happens with…
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Think of it this way. Should a police officer pull someone over for going 2 mph over the speed limit? Is it against the law? Yes. Is there some gray area? Yes.
 
bb9 said:
Think of it this way. Should a police officer pull someone over for going 2 mph over the speed limit? Is it against the law? Yes. Is there some gray area? Yes.
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When is the last time you sent a kid off because the American Flag on his sleeve was 2 1/2 in x 3 1/2 in....? Better yet, when is the last time you pulled out a measuring tape to check the sizes of flags or numbers ? ;)

Now, if an official is going to use the strict letter of the rule book, he'd/she'd better be right in how they address the problem and penalize the problem (if there is one).

Assessing a 15yd penalty for unsportsmanlike conduct because the bands played to long (how does an official know "which band played too long"?) is not the right action that should be taken. It's simply not the correct penalty associated with the "foul".
 
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AllSports12 said:
It's the game management segment of the game.
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When it's 58-0 with under a minute left in the game and the team behind has a 12 yard run because their center held a the nose tackle........ We ignore the hold.....

Happens at all levels of play in every sport.

Not one official on here expects you to understand that.
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You mean like an umpire may expand the zone in a 15-0 game. Oh the humanity.
 
thavoice said:
You mean like an umpire may expand the zone in a 15-0 game. Oh the humanity.
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Actually had a parent send video to the state association of me ignoring the pitcher balking..... repeatedly....

I got the the call, asking the details..... ("I know the answer, but I have to ask"....)

23-0
3rd Inning
Pitcher had never pitched before in his life
Not a word by anyone with a brain

Did I know the rule? Yep
Did I ignore the infractions? Yep
Should I have ignored the infractions? Absolutely
 
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AllSports12 said:
Actually had a parent send video to the state association of me ignoring the pitcher balking..... repeatedly....

I got the the call, asking the details..... ("I know the answer, but I have to ask"....)

23-0
3rd Inning
Pitcher had never pitched before in his life
Not a word by anyone with a brain

Did I know the rule? Yep
Did I ignore the rule? Yep
Should I have ignored the infraction? Absolutely
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2 summers ago there was a similar game at Berliner. I question if the team ever played baseball before. Seriously. And their coaches were no help.. it got so bad the umpire went to the mound and gave the pitcher a tutorial how to pitch because he did. It know what to do and his coaches were worthless. I gave great kudos to that ump.


For a long time we had a JH football ref who would give warnings for first infractions if It was a hold far from the play and had zero bearing on the result.
 
thavoice said:
2 summers ago there was a similar game at Berliner. I question if the team ever played baseball before. Seriously. And their coaches were no help.. it got so bad the umpire went to the mound and gave the pitcher a tutorial how to pitch because he did. It know what to do and his coaches were worthless. I gave great kudos to that ump
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And there are some that would criticize that umpire for "coaching" the kids.
 
A reminder.....

If you want to use this thread as an opportunity to do nothing but bash officials, troll, or start/continue a personal conflict you have with a poster, or just act childish (see reaction below ;) )........... Your posts will be deleted.

I encourage you to open a thread or participate in an already open thread elsewhere. There, you can do the things noted above to your heart's delight.

Thanks....

AS12
 
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AllSports12 said:
Good Question..........

The enforcement by the crew was correct

Rule 8-3 -- Scoring Plays and Touchbacks - Try

ART. 5 . . . If during a successful try, a foul by B occurs, A is given the choice of:

a. Accepting the penalty and replaying the down following enforcement; or
b. Accepting the result of the play and enforcement of the penalty from the succeeding spot.

The succeeding spot is the kickoff.
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I'm a sports reporter and the following happened at a game I covered several years ago.
Offense scores a touchdown and a defensive player is flagged for a 15-yard penalty (might have been unsportsmanlike; I can't remember). Scoring team tells official they'll enforce the penalty on the kickoff.
The PAT is good, and a defensive player is flagged for another 15-yard penalty. Scoring team again tells the official they'll enforce the penalty on the kickoff.
They end up kicking off from 30 yards farther down the field than usual ... and crushing it through the end zone.
Don't know why the didn't try to squib or pooch it at that point.
 
FossyWriter8 said:
I'm a sports reporter and the following happened at a game I covered several years ago.
Offense scores a touchdown and a defensive player is flagged for a 15-yard penalty (might have been unsportsmanlike; I can't remember). Scoring team tells official they'll enforce the penalty on the kickoff.
The PAT is good, and a defensive player is flagged for another 15-yard penalty. Scoring team again tells the official they'll enforce the penalty on the kickoff.
They end up kicking off from 30 yards farther down the field than usual ... and crushing it through the end zone.
Don't know why the didn't try to squib or pooch it at that point.
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Since the fouls did not occur on the same down, this is not a multiple foul situation. Therefore, the crew correctly enforced both penalties on the kickoff....

We had the same situation 2 weeks ago... and like your game, K chose to kick the ball into next week.?‍♂️ (we set up ready for the on-side from the 30 that never happened)
 
I think you covered this some time past but I would like a repeat. Just finished watching a replay of the Ole Miss - Arkansas game. Try to win rather than tie, Hawgs go for two. Called for illegal receiver down field. How far is too far?
 
USA70PP said:
I think you covered this some time past but I would like a repeat. Just finished watching a replay of the Ole Miss - Arkansas game. Try to win rather than tie, Hawgs go for two. Called for illegal receiver down field. How far is too far?
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Under NFHS Rules, the neutral zone may be expanded up to 2 yards behind the defensive neutral zone. If a lineman has contacted an opponent in or behind the neutral zone he is not considered to be illegally downfield if he is still within that expanded zone.

In NCAA, the expanded neutral zone is 3 yards....

Under both codes the expanded neutral zone cannot be extended into the end zone,
 
AllSports12 said:
Under NFHS Rules, the neutral zone may be expanded up to 2 yards behind the defensive neutral zone. If a lineman has contacted an opponent in or behind the neutral zone he is not considered to be illegally downfield if he is still within that expanded zone.

In NCAA, the expanded neutral zone is 3 yards....

Under both codes the expanded neutral zone cannot be extended into the end zone,
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The language about being in contact with an opponent is no longer in the rule book. Changed last year?

And this year Oho got a ruling from the NF that the ENZ can be expanded into the EZ.

Subject: FB Bulletin - Week 1; 8/18/21
5. Rule 2-28-2: There have been questions on pass plays from the +1 yard line as it relates to the Expanded Neutral Zone. We consulted with the NFHS office and the definition should say “field” not “field of play”. Thus the expanded neutral zone may extend into B’s EZ.
 
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chs1971 said:
The part about being in contact with an opponent is no longer in the rule book. Changed last year?

And this year Oho got a ruling from the NF that the ENZ can be expanded into the EZ. I'll look for the bulletin about that.
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Yep, (not enough coffee) I failed to add that while the case book still notes that the ENZ may not be expanded, we were told that the FED is interpreting it differently. Had it in my mind, but my brain and fingers aren't on the same page yet.

The case book also still shows a play where the lineman contacts the opponent in the ENZ, which is in contradiction to the clarification of the rule in 2020.

Poor job on my part of communicating the rule, the changes, and the interpretations....

Bottom line, the ENZ is 2 yards ;)
 
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The game I was at last night had two snap infraction penalties announced by the referee. There were also a couple false starts. What’s the difference?
 
serpico said:
The game I was at last night had two snap infraction penalties announced by the referee. There were also a couple false starts. What’s the difference?
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False start means someone on offense moved too early, "simulated action at the snap."

Snap infraction means the snapper did something with the ball, usually starts his snap and then stops it.
 
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This was called targeting. Agree?

Targeting in high school is not an automatic first down, huh? The player was also not ejected. What does it take to eject a player for targeting?
 
Onside kicks: kicking team can’t recover the ball in the air even after it gets >10 yards down the field, right? Has to touch the ground first, yes?
 
oxat622 said:

This was called targeting. Agree?
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I do not.

Targeting is defined under Rule 2-20-2 as...

an act by any player who takes aim and initiates contact against an opponent above the shoulders with the helmet, forearm, hand, fist, elbow or shoulders.

Watch closely..... the contact is initiated in the chest below the shoulders...
 
The Dock said:
Onside kicks: kicking team can’t recover the ball in the air even after it gets >10 yards down the field, right? Has to touch the ground first, yes?
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Correct, any free kick (in or beyond the neutral zone to R's goal line) touched by K before it touches the ground is a foul for Kick Catch Interference.
 
AllSports12 said:
Correct, any free kick (in or beyond the neutral zone to R's goal line) touched by K before it touches the ground is a foul for Kick Catch Interference.
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What is the rule pertaining to what the Kicker can do, and cannot do, on an onside kick regarding making the ball make contact with the ground?
 
TriangleMan said:
What is the rule pertaining to what the Kicker can do, and cannot do, on an onside kick regarding making the ball make contact with the ground?
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A pop-up kick is illegal.

The definition of a pop-up kick is...... (Rule 2-24-10)

a free kick in which the kicker drives the ball immediately into the ground, the ball strikes the ground once and goes into the air in the manner of a ball kicked directly off the tee

This is a dead ball foul for a free-kick infraction. 5yd penalty, re-kick.
 
Team A kicks off. Returner for Team B muffs the kickoff, and the ball rolls out of bounds at Team B's 10 yard line. Is it a penalty on Team A for a kickoff out of bounds, or does Team B take possession at the spot where the muff went out of bounds?
 
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