Toledo Start Point Guard Shot And Killed

eastisbest

Well-known member
No one but his family, friends and the community . Your rhetoric is not intelligent, funny or called for. Your race is showing.
does that mean so is yours? It's not his "race" showing but thanks for lumping a bunch of people in together with him. smh. It's his idiocy showing. Yours too. 🤷 Maybe should have stopped after the second sentence.


Prayers for those close to the young man. The community is shaken I've no doubt.
 

Chop Stix

Well-known member
This happened literally a couple hundred feet from the college house I lived in for 2 years at UT. Another young man, 20 y/o, was stabbed to death just a couple blocks away earlier today.

Seems like Toledo has had quite a rough year with violence like many other places nationwide.
 

D1nwobb

Active member
Over 40 murders in Toledo so far this year including 5 teenagers in the past 5 weeks. It's gut-wrenching.
 

Smalls

Well-known member
I would like to think that some of this stuff could be avoided if kids were in school. As society has changed there is far more value to schooling than just the education.

I know of 3 kids who have been shot, shot at or witnessed a shooting in the last 6 months. Up until this year I didn't know anyone personally who was in that situation.

Do what you need to protect older teachers who are high risk, but get these kids back in school. PLEASE!!!!!
 

nwwarrior09

Well-known member
Thoughts and prayers to the young man's family and friends.

To the notion that kids need to be in school...I'd have to agree. With all of the chaos and seemingly increasing violence in many of our communities, school provides better safety and structure than learning from home.
 

Caleb

Well-known member
This is a tragedy but I've got to ask the question. Where was he? The article just said he was in a house.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
How is this being connected to the school situation? Not happening during school hours. In many cases, these are not kids actually going to school.
 

CC Track Fan

Active member
I would like to think that some of this stuff could be avoided if kids were in school. As society has changed there is far more value to schooling than just the education.

I know of 3 kids who have been shot, shot at or witnessed a shooting in the last 6 months. Up until this year I didn't know anyone personally who was in that situation.

Do what you need to protect older teachers who are high risk, but get these kids back in school. PLEASE!!!!!
Exactly to me it it is borderline criminal of these school board having these intercity schools still closed. Many of these kids were behind to begin with and this is just putting them further behind as the private schools and suburban/small town schools are back to in person classes.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
I'm not seeing urban news filled with people objecting to the handling. Maybe those running those schools are responding to the populations they serve? There are a lot of players making these decisions I have to imagine. But, not seeing any pressure in the news to change.
 

4GX

Active member
No one but his family, friends and the community . Your rhetoric is not intelligent, funny or called for. Your race is showing.
Your first sentence is (almost certainly) correct... your second is not— and, at the risk of getting off track, I will refrain from comment on your third sentence... perhaps the previous poster should have said “No widespread public demonstrations will ensue,”— my question would then be: “Why NOT?”
 

4GX

Active member
I'm not seeing urban news filled with people objecting to the handling. Maybe those running those schools are responding to the populations they serve? There are a lot of players making these decisions I have to imagine. But, not seeing any pressure in the news to change.
If I take the charitable view, I would say that the black community has seen that they are far more at risk from corona virus than the population as a whole— and thus are not eager to resume in-person schooling, taking that fact into account...

If I am LESS charitable, I might suggest that the lack of pressure to change suggests a lack of eagerness of another kind that is less understandable...
 

Smalls

Well-known member
How is this being connected to the school situation? Not happening during school hours. In many cases, these are not kids actually going to school.
I am connecting it to the school situation based on what a friend told me, what teachers have told me and what I have read in the paper.

A teacher told me that in the spring she only had about 20% of her class participating on a daily basis, participation is up considerably in the fall (kudos to the effort TPS has made), but no where near what it was when in person.

I was also told the following by a friend who is engaged more than most, but is a single dad and works during the day.

His kids were;
Encouraged to take fewer classes and open up their 1st and/or last period since they were still on course to graduate
Encouraged to take easier classes since additional help/tutoring is more difficult when done remote
Were not able to participate in extra curricular activities or watch their peers participate
Struggled with internet connection at times or use a "connection issue" as an excuse to drop off of a class when they are bored (he put a stop to that)

The result is they are spending less than 1/2 their normal time on their education, because of taking fewer classes, easier classes and until recently didn't have extra curricular activities to fill their time. Idle minds.......

I didn't know this young man other than a couple casual conversations, but a friend of mine knew him well and spoke very highly of him. He is pretty tore up and concerned for other kids like him. Good kids who need the structure and safe haven only an in person education provides.

By all accounts TPS closed much of this divide, but there is still an issue.

 

4GX

Active member
I am connecting it to the school situation based on what a friend told me, what teachers have told me and what I have read in the paper.

A teacher told me that in the spring she only had about 20% of her class participating on a daily basis, participation is up considerably in the fall (kudos to the effort TPS has made), but no where near what it was when in person.

I was also told the following by a friend who is engaged more than most, but is a single dad and works during the day.

His kids were;
Encouraged to take fewer classes and open up their 1st and/or last period since they were still on course to graduate
Encouraged to take easier classes since additional help/tutoring is more difficult when done remote
Were not able to participate in extra curricular activities or watch their peers participate
Struggled with internet connection at times or use a "connection issue" as an excuse to drop off of a class when they are bored (he put a stop to that)

The result is they are spending less than 1/2 their normal time on their education, because of taking fewer classes, easier classes and until recently didn't have extra curricular activities to fill their time. Idle minds.......

I didn't know this young man other than a couple casual conversations, but a friend of mine knew him well and spoke very highly of him. He is pretty tore up and concerned for other kids like him. Good kids who need the structure and safe haven only an in person education provides.

By all accounts TPS closed much of this divide, but there is still an issue.

Your post reminds me of the US president claiming that “football is boring now”— and then constantly agitating that he wants more football (e.g.- the Big Ten restarting play)—if it’s no good, then how does MORE of it help?

You say that the TPS schools are “encouraging“ their students to take fewer classes, easier classes, and drop classes on almost any pretense— yet, your solution to the current problem of violence claiming the lives of some young people in the area is to get them back into this environment of (allegedly) uncaring educators who do NOT (allegedly) have the students’ best interests and welfare as a primary consideration— why would such a (seemingly) callous and uncaring institution be the solution to the problems of violence that you describe? ... It reminds me of an old (Jewish) joke: “The food at this restuarant is terrible!—Yes, and the portions are so small, too!”
 

Smalls

Well-known member
Your post reminds me of the US president claiming that “football is boring now”— and then constantly agitating that he wants more football (e.g.- the Big Ten restarting play)—if it’s no good, then how does MORE of it help?

You say that the TPS schools are “encouraging“ their students to take fewer classes, easier classes, and drop classes on almost any pretense— yet, your solution to the current problem of violence claiming the lives of some young people in the area is to get them back into this environment of (allegedly) uncaring educators who do NOT (allegedly) have the students’ best interests and welfare as a primary consideration— why would such a (seemingly) callous and uncaring institution be the solution to the problems of violence that you describe? ... It reminds me of an old (Jewish) joke: “The food at this restuarant is terrible!—Yes, and the portions are so small, too!”
Do not change my words.

I relayed a 1st hand experience of a family in TPS as told directly to me from a father.

I happen to have great respect for teachers and their impact in the lives of their students beyond the 1,2,3's and A,BC's. That is why I think students need to be in school.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
eastisbest said:
I'm not seeing urban news filled with people objecting to the handling. Maybe those running those schools are responding to the populations they serve? There are a lot of players making these decisions I have to imagine. But, not seeing any pressure in the news to change.
If I take the charitable view, I would say that the black community has seen that they are far more at risk from corona virus than the population as a whole— and thus are not eager to resume in-person schooling, taking that fact into account...

If I am LESS charitable, I might suggest that the lack of pressure to change suggests a lack of eagerness of another kind that is less understandable...
scratches head: how did you go from my post to talking about the "black" community?
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
eastisbest said:
I'm not seeing urban news filled with people objecting to the handling. Maybe those running those schools are responding to the populations they serve? There are a lot of players making these decisions I have to imagine. But, not seeing any pressure in the news to change.
I am connecting it to the school situation based on what a friend told me, what teachers have told me and what I have read in the paper.

A teacher told me that in the spring she only had about 20% of her class participating on a daily basis, participation is up considerably in the fall (kudos to the effort TPS has made), but no where near what it was when in person.
....
I don't see anywhere there you mentioning or supporting public pressure for the urban school to change unless it is in those articles you'v read. I've no doubt there is plenty of personal desires to change but they seem to be keeping it personal. I'd be interested in links to those paper articles. I haven't seen one.
 

4GX

Active member
scratches head: how did you go from my post to talking about the "black" community?
You said you’re “not seeing the urban news filled with people objecting to the handling...not seeing any pressure in the (urban?) news to change”— if you are not using “urban” as a euphemism for the “black“ community, you are being disingenuous — it has been such for decades (cf.- “urban contemporary music”)— you and I both know what group you were referencing....

Let’s put it another way: what percentage of the TPS “urban” enrollment is black? Do you think it is less than 60%?— in a country that has less than 15% total black population,that is a notably higher concentration of black folk, in the “Urban” population...

—That’s how I got from your post to talking about the black community...
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
You said you’re “not seeing the urban news filled with people objecting to the handling...not seeing any pressure in the (urban?) news to change”— if you are not using “urban” as a euphemism for the “black“ community, you are being disingenuous —
I don't need euphemisms. It's the disengenous that use euphemisms. Hand in hand. Isn't that one purpose of a euphemism? To be disengenuous. ;) So you're saying what? A white person living in the city uses "urban" to refer to black people? Who knew!

lol, no, I'm using it to mean "urban." Urban as opposed to suburban. First meaning listed in the dictionary, not one down the line. I know an awful lot of white people living in the urban. They don't call themselves not-urban. They are urbanites. There goes one now! I waved hello.

So no, you and I did not know what group I was referencing. I did, you (I believe honestly) did not.

So what the heck did you think I meant by "urban news?"
 
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4GX

Active member
I don't need euphemisms. It's the disengenous that use euphemisms. Hand in hand. Isn't that one purpose of a euphemism? To be disengenuous. ;) So you're saying what? A white person living in the city uses "urban" to refer to black people? Who knew!

lol, no, I'm using it to mean "urban." Urban as opposed to suburban. First meaning listed in the dictionary, not one down the line. I know an awful lot of white people living in the urban. They don't call themselves not-urban. They are urbanites. There goes one now! I waved hello.

So no, you and I did not know what group I was referencing. I did, you (I believe honestly) did not.

So what the heck did you think I meant by "urban news?"
1) No, the disINgenuous do not use euphemisms (necessarily)— there is nothing “hand in hand“ there— I said you were EITHER using urban as a (non-pejorative) euphemism—or if you claim that you were not, you ARE being disINgenuous— NOT BOTH.
2) I assumed by “urban news” that you meant media like “The Cincinnati Herald”— and other similar city papers, which are targeting the black audience, exclusively; I’d assume that you ALSO meant things like video vignettes on the local (Toledo metro) stations, which might well have featured black community leaders (e.g.- pastors of local churches, or community organizers like Barack Obama used to be) in news stories discussing what their local communities think about the handling of the viral epidemic.
3) “Urban” has been a by-word or shorthand (or euphemism) for black communities for a LONG time— not only do radio stations use it as a euphemism for a music programming format targeted to black audiences (“urban contemporary”), so do clothing designers (“urban streetwear”), and probably most prominently, originally, the Urban League (The National Urban League, formerly known as the National League on Urban Conditions Among African Americans, is a nonpartisan historic civil rights organization based in New York City that advocates on behalf of economic and social justice for African Americans— founded in 1911).
4) So, when somebody refers to “urban” audiences, they are (generally speaking) referring to black audiences— and by inference, urban news would be news outlets (and stories) targeting black communities. I notice that you studiously (pun intended) avoided answering my question about what the enrollment of TPS looks like— I looked it up— as of 2016 (the most recent year’s data posted on TPS’s website)— the enrollment of TPS was ~43% black and ~10% multi-racial, and only 36% white— and given the trend (every recent year) has been toward increasing black population and decreasing white population, I’d bet that the TPS schools are now up to a 60% black/multiracial contingent and less than 33% white— so, effectively, TPS is a black school district—it’s CERTAINLY a majority minority district— so, THIS urban school district IS basically a black school district— yes, you probably know plenty of white people who LIVE in the city of Toledo— but I’ll bet the majority of them do NOT have children in TPS schools (Either because they are young/childless or older/empty-nesters),
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
1) No, blah blah, drivel spittle...
ah, ok, i get what I'm exchanging with. One of those, "well everyone must think like me, talk like me, grew up like me so if they don't think like me, I'm gonna make up reasons why, burb."

I think the euphemisms used by people I grew up with to describe people like you were, "yokel," "rube" "unsophisticated,".... I prefer to just think people don't always use the same words the same way and take them for their word when they explain what they meant. Don't judge books by covers or short visits. Life's too short to doubt everyone's word. But you go girl!
 

4GX

Active member
ah, ok, i get what I'm exchanging with. One of those, "well everyone must think like me, talk like me, grew up like me so if they don't think like me, I'm gonna make up reasons why, burb."

I think the euphemisms used by people I grew up with to describe people like you were, "yokel," "rube" "unsophisticated,".... I prefer to just think people don't always use the same words the same way and take them for their word when they explain what they meant. Don't judge books by covers or short visits. Life's too short to doubt everyone's word. But you go girl!
Yokel, rube, and unsophisticated are NOT euphemisms— you need some work on both your spelling (the word is “disingenuous” NOT ”disengenuous”, as you spelled it TWICE, even despite the automatic spell-checking function on this site—as if to underline the fact that you didn’t know how to spell it) AND your word choices... which then suggests that your use of those three words to describe me indicates BOTH a lack of self-awareness AND a lack of appreciation for irony.

If you think that ”urban“ is not a synonym (and a positive one— and thus actually a “euphemism”) which clearly implies black communities, I’m certainly willing to let you labor on in ignorance—it’s NOT some kind of ”dog whistle” term... I didn’t start by challenging your use of the word “urban”— Instead, it was you who chose to challenge my (eminently logical) inference that Toledo’s black community is the one most specifically affected by whatever policies the TPS leadership is employing, in handling this viral epidemic.

This squabble over word meanings has lost any usefulness, when it comes to exploring my original comment prompted by your original post— about “I'm not seeing urban news filled with people objecting to the handling. Maybe those running those schools are responding to the populations they serve?”— If you can’t see and/or don’t acknowledge that PRECISELY the people you are/were referencing in your original comment ARE people who identify as black (when ~60% of the TPS is composed of black/multi-racial students), then further dialogue with you (at least on this matter) is pointless... I’ll leave the floor to you, M’am.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
Yokel, rube, and unsophisticated are NOT euphemisms—and a bunch of other stuff
:ROFLMAO: OK you are obviously REALLY desperate for a win, I've had my share in life to be comfortable so ok, you must be right. My understanding of my understanding of the word "urban" must be wrong. I don't understand it the way I thought I understand it. My accepting that you may understand it a different way and that that is ok, must also be wrong. You win, this is for you.1600387562824.jpeg

Now maybe we can offer condolences to this kid's poor family and friends. (I do not understand those words to be euphemisms for "black," I mean exactly, his family and his friends even if they live in an urban neighborhood.)
 

irish_buffalo

Well-known member
EIB just give him the trophy please. Save me from any more old Jewish proverbs. :LOL:

Am I even allowed to say "Jewish" anymore? Can someone please check if I'm ok in the context of usage?

I actually tend to agree with Smalls from the sense that inner-city kids (Wait, can I say "inner-city"? - or am I inferring race? - is it known to me or subconscious? Oh dear God what do I do? Someone check if it is ok, please.)...anyway...inner-city kids especially have nothing to do and youth with nothing but idle time is a bad recipe. School and guidance of any kind would at the very least help.

In all seriousness, too many young talented kids getting shot and I'm sure it was over something extremely petty. No one should have to bury their kid or grandkid.
 

4GX

Active member
EIB just give him the trophy please. Save me from any more old Jewish proverbs. :LOL:

Am I even allowed to say "Jewish" anymore? Can someone please check if I'm ok in the context of usage?

I actually tend to agree with Smalls from the sense that inner-city kids (Wait, can I say "inner-city"? - or am I inferring race? - is it known to me or subconscious? Oh dear God what do I do? Someone check if it is ok, please.)...anyway...inner-city kids especially have nothing to do and youth with nothing but idle time is a bad recipe. School and guidance of any kind would at the very least help.

In all seriousness, too many young talented kids getting shot and I'm sure it was over something extremely petty. No one should have to bury their kid or grandkid.
Why do “inner-city kids especially have nothing to do”?
 

irish_buffalo

Well-known member
Why do “inner-city kids especially have nothing to do”?
Did the pools opens this summer? Are the gyms open? How about the country club? Tennis club? When mom or dad works do they have means to go places? Burbs and rural kids have more at their disposal to fulfill their restlessness and idle time.
 
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