GMC dominance over GGCL continues...

 
User13 said:
Don't forget Mt Notre Dame's four straight state titles (2006-2009). No public school has ever done that.
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Oh, I know about MND. I am a GGCL supporter and currently seeing them take their lumps from the public schools. I just think it is funny that when they win they have an unfair advantage, but when they are losing there is no mention of it. Right now, in Cincinnati, the public schools have better girls basketball programs.....or more talent. Whatever you want to say.....
 
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Ggcl does have an advantage....just bad coaches who don't know how to take advantage of it like the lunatic....notice some of the best players in the gmc started out at mnd. Just sayin'
 
Honor&Glory said:
Ggcl does have an advantage....just bad coaches who don't know how to take advantage of it like the lunatic....notice some of the best players in the gmc started out at mnd. Just sayin'
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So the coaches in the GGCL are subpar? Wow, that is news to me. The pendulum has swung to the public schools right now. I hardly call it a coaching problem.....just sayin'
 
32minutesofpressure said:
So the coaches in the GGCL are subpar? Wow, that is news to me. The pendulum has swung to the public schools right now. I hardly call it a coaching problem.....just sayin'
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If they can't take advantage of their inherent advantage maybe the argument for being above subpar is a fallacy? :)
 
I have coached varsity in both private and public. They both have their pro's and con's. I wouldn't say the ggcl has an advantage. Public school coaches, if they work it correctly, have the advantage of running a complete program from elementary through varsity. They can establish the complete program. The catholic schools don't necessarily know what they are getting now that open enrollment is in the picture. I think that has hurt the ggcl (look at roger bacon. They used to be a DII powerhouse and now they can't even score 20 points a game). I don't see the gmc giving up the grip it has on the ggcl any time soon! And I definitely don't see coaching in the equation. There are some good coaches in the ggcl and there are good coaches in the gmc. They both also do have some weak coaches.
 
bengalsruss said:
I have coached varsity in both private and public. They both have their pro's and con's. I wouldn't say the ggcl has an advantage. Public school coaches, if they work it correctly, have the advantage of running a complete program from elementary through varsity. They can establish the complete program. The catholic schools don't necessarily know what they are getting now that open enrollment is in the picture. I think that has hurt the ggcl (look at roger bacon. They used to be a DII powerhouse and now they can't even score 20 points a game). I don't see the gmc giving up the grip it has on the ggcl any time soon! And I definitely don't see coaching in the equation. There are some good coaches in the ggcl and there are good coaches in the gmc. They both also do have some weak coaches.
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Well said.
 
bengalsruss said:
I have coached varsity in both private and public. They both have their pro's and con's. I wouldn't say the ggcl has an advantage. Public school coaches, if they work it correctly, have the advantage of running a complete program from elementary through varsity. They can establish the complete program. The catholic schools don't necessarily know what they are getting now that open enrollment is in the picture. I think that has hurt the ggcl (look at roger bacon. They used to be a DII powerhouse and now they can't even score 20 points a game). I don't see the gmc giving up the grip it has on the ggcl any time soon! And I definitely don't see coaching in the equation. There are some good coaches in the ggcl and there are good coaches in the gmc. They both also do have some weak coaches.
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Some very good points..... :clap:
 
32minutesofpressure said:
Oh, I know about MND. I am a GGCL supporter and currently seeing them take their lumps from the public schools. I just think it is funny that when they win they have an unfair advantage, but when they are losing there is no mention of it. Right now, in Cincinnati, the public schools have better girls basketball programs.....or more talent. Whatever you want to say.....
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They still do have an advantage, they just don't have the correct people recruiting to run and gun with that advantage! All the better coaches are at public schools right now! And to say public school coaches have an advantage because they can shape and mold younger programs in rediculus. The private schools have that as well. They have grade school feeder schools who have sports programs! They could have those same benefits as the public schools could have when it comes to shapping a program at a young age! They may not know what they are getting, but if they get a gem by surprise I wouldn't think they would be dissappointed. Public schools deal with transfers. Students who are in middle school programs don't always end up at the high school and students who were not in those programs may end up at the school.
 
32minutesofpressure said:
So what's the "inherent advantage" in your opinion? Sounds to me like sour grapes because St. X (private school), owns Colerain in football.....
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It's funny that you say X owns Colerain football. They have definitely had their number the last few years, but a few years before that it was Elder. It is funny how it takes a whole conference to keep a school down. People forget that these "private" schools do have down years too and do not own each other year in and year out, so why is it fair that when Colerain loses to one of them its that Colerain can not handle the GCL. I would guess that if you looked at overall record between the GCL schools and themselves and Colerain and the GCL schools in football over the last decade, Colerain would be right their winning percentage wise as all of them. I would even guess that it would be better than Moeller and Lasalle!
 
All private schools don't exploit their advantage (ability to attract players from a wide area), but some have used it to great success. In addition to MND's success, look at Regina (champs in 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, and 2009). CJ, in Dayton, won a D1 title in 2005. That core of that team began playing together when the girls were in 4th grade. A C-J coach hand picked best players from the greater Dayton area for his Dayton Lady Hoopstars team, and "somehow" they ended up at CJ high school.
 
another advantage i see with the private schools is how their junior high programs do not fall under the iron fist of the OHSAA. They are not limited to the ridiculously low amount of games(16), 6 minute qrts and the 2 player off season rule.

Stay away from school ball, play from october to march, practice and play 50-60 games, then play AAU ball with all your classmates until you get into high school.

I've been around the game along time, and one BIG change I see is how much time kids put into their game. More kids play year round now, you can debate if this is good or bad, but i believe you cant dispute the fact that there are more good players now than 10 years ago. The opportunities are endless, if you want to play/practice there is someplace for this to happen.

I think the majority of the large enrollment schools(numbers) gain an advantage now becasue they have more girls to choose from. They start specializing in one sport in junior high, they have enough good kids/numbers to fill out the other teams. Schools with smaller numbers dont have that luxury, if the schools best athlete gives up hoops for soccer, they dont have enough bodies to make up for this loss.

And I agree CJ, MND and Regina are good examples of private school advantage.
 
I just find it funny that none of the GGCL Scarlet (McAuley, St. Ursula, Mercy, Seton, Ursuline, and MND) had success last year (minus McAuley maybe) and this year are getting thumped by the GMC and the best explanation that anyone can come up with is poor coaching in the GGCL....the trend has changed whether people want to accept that or not, at least in the Cincinnati area, it has changed.....
 
32minutesofpressure said:
Oh, I know about MND. I am a GGCL supporter and currently seeing them take their lumps from the public schools. I just think it is funny that when they win they have an unfair advantage, but when they are losing there is no mention of it. Right now, in Cincinnati, the public schools have better girls basketball programs.....or more talent. Whatever you want to say.....
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Did you mean to say Suburban public schools? Cinti Public schools probably won't dominate unless they begin to offer basketball at the elementary age level. Withrow's girls hoop team is probably the best Cinti Public School team in Cincinnati.
 
never seen a coach win big with avg to below avg players, coach can only do so much, but the players have to have ability.

But I ahve seen good players with above avg ability not excel do to poor coaching/preparation.

I dont think thats the case in the GGCL, i just think the GMC has better players, line up the players, and if you were picking teams, how many girls would select over a GMC kid???

How many DI/DII college players does the gmc have compared to the GGCL???

When MND won all those state championships how many college players and transfers did they have??? They didnt win it with soccer and volleyball players, they won it with dedicated players who played year round.

The GMC has this more than the GGCL now.

Look at Cincys Finest list for Finest 15 the last 2 years, thats 30 girls, and ONLY 2 girls from GGCL, and that was last season, GGCL has ZERO this year, and GMC has 12 out of the 15.

Now the GGCL will not back down, they will play HARD and compete like no other because they are really good kids, who listen, play well together and like to compete, but at the end of the day talent wins out the majority of the time.

This is a good topic
 
bengalsruss said:
I have coached varsity in both private and public. They both have their pro's and con's. I wouldn't say the ggcl has an advantage. Public school coaches, if they work it correctly, have the advantage of running a complete program from elementary through varsity. They can establish the complete program. The catholic schools don't necessarily know what they are getting now that open enrollment is in the picture. I think that has hurt the ggcl (look at roger bacon. They used to be a DII powerhouse and now they can't even score 20 points a game). I don't see the gmc giving up the grip it has on the ggcl any time soon! And I definitely don't see coaching in the equation. There are some good coaches in the ggcl and there are good coaches in the gmc. They both also do have some weak coaches.
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Suburban Public Schools (Mason, Lakota, Colerain, Sycamore, Oak Hills, Princeton, etc) have an advantage because they offer sports at the elementary level....those kids are then taught the system at an young age so once they get to high school, they know it well.Cinti Public schools dont have that luxury so most kids dont start basketball until jr high unless they go to Friars or a local center...
 
I think its a stretch to say its bad coaching in the GGCL-I think it goes in cycles and the past 2 years its been the GMC thats ruled the basketball landscape in cincinnati. I do think that the GGCL will have its turn in the next few years, and then it will swing back to the GMC!!!! If you look at the tenure of the coaches in the GGCL they are fairly new in terms of the years of service at their respective schools(other than Mary Jo).
 
whiteshadow said:
never seen a coach win big with avg to below avg players, coach can only do so much, but the players have to have ability.

But I ahve seen good players with above avg ability not excel do to poor coaching/preparation.

I dont think thats the case in the GGCL, i just think the GMC has better players, line up the players, and if you were picking teams, how many girls would select over a GMC kid???

How many DI/DII college players does the gmc have compared to the GGCL???

When MND won all those state championships how many college players and transfers did they have??? They didnt win it with soccer and volleyball players, they won it with dedicated players who played year round.

The GMC has this more than the GGCL now.

Look at Cincys Finest list for Finest 15 the last 2 years, thats 30 girls, and ONLY 2 girls from GGCL, and that was last season, GGCL has ZERO this year, and GMC has 12 out of the 15.

Now the GGCL will not back down, they will play HARD and compete like no other because they are really good kids, who listen, play well together and like to compete, but at the end of the day talent wins out the majority of the time.

This is a good topic
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:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
 
whiteshadow said:
never seen a coach win big with avg to below avg players, coach can only do so much, but the players have to have ability.

But I ahve seen good players with above avg ability not excel do to poor coaching/preparation.

I dont think thats the case in the GGCL, i just think the GMC has better players, line up the players, and if you were picking teams, how many girls would select over a GMC kid???

How many DI/DII college players does the gmc have compared to the GGCL???

When MND won all those state championships how many college players and transfers did they have??? They didnt win it with soccer and volleyball players, they won it with dedicated players who played year round.

The GMC has this more than the GGCL now.

Look at Cincys Finest list for Finest 15 the last 2 years, thats 30 girls, and ONLY 2 girls from GGCL, and that was last season, GGCL has ZERO this year, and GMC has 12 out of the 15.

Now the GGCL will not back down, they will play HARD and compete like no other because they are really good kids, who listen, play well together and like to compete, but at the end of the day talent wins out the majority of the time.

This is a good topic
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Great points. In the end it is mostly about talent.
 
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