D7 R25 2024

CasualFan24 said:
Here's the thing - our levy failed numerous times which caused all sorts of bad for the district. Our district is split between 2 counties - 1 county would always pass it, the other would fail it. The way they eventually got it to pass was on an income tax levy instead of your traditional property tax levies. The elderly don't have a problem voting yes for this type of levy because a good amount of them don't make enough to file income tax returns, so it has virtually no effect on them.

Here's my gripe - and I'm all for having new facilities for the kids etc....but my wife and I do fairly well and I have to write a check every tax season to the school district for 1% of our gross annual household income. This is public school education - why do I have to pay more for the same education for my kids than someone making much less per year?! In what world is that fair?! In reality it works the same way with property taxes as well ($500k house v. $100k house) - but this as a whole is what's wrong with school funding. It shouldn't be tiered or percentage based - it should be a flat amount that everyone that lives in the district has to pay. It would be a lot more transparent, and easier to understand when it did comes time to pass a levy as well (this levy will cause your school district fee to increase by $100/year etc.)

Anyways, you caught me during tax season so the wound is still fresh. Just chaps my ash that I have to pay more than most for my kids to get the same education and amenities as everyone else - if I have to pay more, shouldn't I be getting something more or better?
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Valid complaint, sir.
 
CasualFan24 said:
Here's the thing - our levy failed numerous times which caused all sorts of bad for the district. Our district is split between 2 counties - 1 county would always pass it, the other would fail it. The way they eventually got it to pass was on an income tax levy instead of your traditional property tax levies. The elderly don't have a problem voting yes for this type of levy because a good amount of them don't make enough to file income tax returns, so it has virtually no effect on them.

Here's my gripe - and I'm all for having new facilities for the kids etc....but my wife and I do fairly well and I have to write a check every tax season to the school district for 1% of our gross annual household income. This is public school education - why do I have to pay more for the same education for my kids than someone making much less per year?! In what world is that fair?! In reality it works the same way with property taxes as well ($500k house v. $100k house) - but this as a whole is what's wrong with school funding. It shouldn't be tiered or percentage based - it should be a flat amount that everyone that lives in the district has to pay. It would be a lot more transparent, and easier to understand when it did comes time to pass a levy as well (this levy will cause your school district fee to increase by $100/year etc.)

Anyways, you caught me during tax season so the wound is still fresh. Just chaps my ash that I have to pay more than most for my kids to get the same education and amenities as everyone else - if I have to pay more, shouldn't I be getting something more or better?
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My only retort is you get what you pay for perhaps 🤷‍♂️. Not sure how your school does statewide but often you see the schools that are more heavily funded by the state due to economic reasons of their demographics do very poorly i.e. DPS.

I've spent my entire adult life so far not paying any income tax on my school, but since the passing of the levy now I see tax coming out of my checks and my property taxes got jacked since it was a dual property tax and income tax levy and honestly I haven't bat an eye, since I know the school is a big reason our area stays economically prosperous thereby making me more money. I guess it's just perspective and how you look at it.
 
CasualFan24 said:
Here's the thing - our levy failed numerous times which caused all sorts of bad for the district. Our district is split between 2 counties - 1 county would always pass it, the other would fail it. The way they eventually got it to pass was on an income tax levy instead of your traditional property tax levies. The elderly don't have a problem voting yes for this type of levy because a good amount of them don't make enough to file income tax returns, so it has virtually no effect on them.

Here's my gripe - and I'm all for having new facilities for the kids etc....but my wife and I do fairly well and I have to write a check every tax season to the school district for 1% of our gross annual household income. This is public school education - why do I have to pay more for the same education for my kids than someone making much less per year?! In what world is that fair?! In reality it works the same way with property taxes as well ($500k house v. $100k house) - but this as a whole is what's wrong with school funding. It shouldn't be tiered or percentage based - it should be a flat amount that everyone that lives in the district has to pay. It would be a lot more transparent, and easier to understand when it did comes time to pass a levy as well (this levy will cause your school district fee to increase by $100/year etc.)

Anyways, you caught me during tax season so the wound is still fresh. Just chaps my ash that I have to pay more than most for my kids to get the same education and amenities as everyone else - if I have to pay more, shouldn't I be getting something more or better?
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You think it's bad now . . . wait until you're older, making more and your kids are grown and gone. Situations like that are why Cheech & Chong are making a killing on edibles right now . . .
 
State2013-1 said:
My only retort is you get what you pay for perhaps 🤷‍♂️. Not sure how your school does statewide but often you see the schools that are more heavily funded by the state due to economic reasons of their demographics do very poorly i.e. DPS.

I've spent my entire adult life so far not paying any income tax on my school, but since the passing of the levy now I see tax coming out of my checks and my property taxes got jacked since it was a dual property tax and income tax levy and honestly I haven't bat an eye, since I know the school is a big reason our area stays economically prosperous thereby making me more money. I guess it's just perspective and how you look at it.
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That going towards building a new high school?
 
StateChampion2012 said:
That going towards building a new high school?
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Eventually yes, in the current phase it is an addition to the elementary school. More classrooms, bigger cafeteria, moving the admin offices and reallocation the current admin space to more classrooms. It is also taking some of the amenities (dont quote me on which ones) from the current high school and moving them over there. Phase two is adding on the high school and that is a few years down the road. I believe the plan is to also keep part of the existing high school for some sort of capacity kind of like what Versailles has.
 
State2013-1 said:
My only retort is you get what you pay for perhaps 🤷‍♂️. Not sure how your school does statewide but often you see the schools that are more heavily funded by the state due to economic reasons of their demographics do very poorly i.e. DPS.

I've spent my entire adult life so far not paying any income tax on my school, but since the passing of the levy now I see tax coming out of my checks and my property taxes got jacked since it was a dual property tax and income tax levy and honestly I haven't bat an eye, since I know the school is a big reason our area stays economically prosperous thereby making me more money. I guess it's just perspective and how you look at it.
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Precisely - but that applies to everyone in the district, yet, I have to pay more towards keeping that district nice than others - and some don't have to pay anything at all yet still reap the benefits of living in the district (mostly seen through property values.) Again, I am all for having a successful school district with new facilities etc.....just make everyone pay the same amount for it, that all I ask!

If I want to pay more for my kids schooling than others in the district, I'll send them to private where I can for the most part also then say they are getting a better education for it!
 
CasualFan24 said:
Precisely - but that applies to everyone in the district, yet, I have to pay more towards keeping that district nice than others - and some don't have to pay anything at all yet still reap the benefits of living in the district (mostly seen through property values.) Again, I am all for having a successful school district with new facilities etc.....just make everyone pay the same amount for it, that all I ask!

If I want to pay more for my kids schooling than others in the district, I'll send them to private where I can for the most part also then say they are getting a better education for it!
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I mean I get your point but there are obvious reasons as to why that doesn't work since some people make a lot less money than you I presume. If you make people all pay the same then it's a bigger drop in the bucket for a poor person compared to yourself. I actually like how the school districts do it because it's a flat percentage of your taxable income. It isn't like the federal government where it's a progressive system and you pay a higher percentage the more you make, so if you think about it you are all technically paying the same percentage of your income in.
 
CasualFan24 said:
Here's the thing - our levy failed numerous times which caused all sorts of bad for the district. Our district is split between 2 counties - 1 county would always pass it, the other would fail it. The way they eventually got it to pass was on an income tax levy instead of your traditional property tax levies. The elderly don't have a problem voting yes for this type of levy because a good amount of them don't make enough to file income tax returns, so it has virtually no effect on them.

Here's my gripe - and I'm all for having new facilities for the kids etc....but my wife and I do fairly well and I have to write a check every tax season to the school district for 1% of our gross annual household income. This is public school education - why do I have to pay more for the same education for my kids than someone making much less per year?! In what world is that fair?! In reality it works the same way with property taxes as well ($500k house v. $100k house) - but this as a whole is what's wrong with school funding. It shouldn't be tiered or percentage based - it should be a flat amount that everyone that lives in the district has to pay. It would be a lot more transparent, and easier to understand when it did comes time to pass a levy as well (this levy will cause your school district fee to increase by $100/year etc.)

Anyways, you caught me during tax season so the wound is still fresh. Just chaps my ash that I have to pay more than most for my kids to get the same education and amenities as everyone else - if I have to pay more, shouldn't I be getting something more or better?
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Why is it fair that you make money than someone else living in a district? Are you just that hard of a worker compared to them that you deserve more. Percentage makes it more equitable. This idea that individuals should only pay for what they use is ludicrous in a functioning society. I only drive a minute to work everyday. Why should should my taxes go to roads when Joe Construction Company Owner uses the roads much more with heavier vehicles then me? The list can go on and on of people that benefit in one way from taxes and others that don't.
 
We'reAllWashedUp said:
Why is it fair that you make money than someone else living in a district? Are you just that hard of a worker compared to them that you deserve more. Percentage makes it more equitable. This idea that individuals should only pay for what they use is ludicrous in a functioning society. I only drive a minute to work everyday. Why should should my taxes go to roads when Joe Construction Company Owner uses the roads much more with heavier vehicles then me? The list can go on and on of people that benefit in one way from taxes and others that don't.
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Your points are valid but equity in this sense is a made up buzz word. You're looking for equal.
 
We'reAllWashedUp said:
Why is it fair that you make money than someone else living in a district? Are you just that hard of a worker compared to them that you deserve more. Percentage makes it more equitable. This idea that individuals should only pay for what they use is ludicrous in a functioning society. I only drive a minute to work everyday. Why should should my taxes go to roads when Joe Construction Company Owner uses the roads much more with heavier vehicles then me? The list can go on and on of people that benefit in one way from taxes and others that don't.
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Because typically - if you pay additional funds for something you get more....

If you and I go to dinner and I order a 9 ounce Filet and you order a 9 ounce Sirloin and our totals are the same when the check comes out - I bet you're going to have some questions right?
 
We'reAllWashedUp said:
Why is it fair that you make money than someone else living in a district? Are you just that hard of a worker compared to them that you deserve more. Percentage makes it more equitable. This idea that individuals should only pay for what they use is ludicrous in a functioning society. I only drive a minute to work everyday. Why should should my taxes go to roads when Joe Construction Company Owner uses the roads much more with heavier vehicles then me? The list can go on and on of people that benefit in one way from taxes and others that don't.
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So what you're saying is I should be penalized for making more money than a retired person living on social security?

My point is - everyone enjoying the benefits of any particular school district should should pay the same amount as everyone else enjoying those same benefits. It should have nothing to do with how much money someone makes or how big their house is.....each kid gets the same education and amenities at those schools, everyone should pay the same for them...
 
CasualFan24 said:
So what you're saying is I should be penalized for making more money than a retired person living on social security?

My point is - everyone enjoying the benefits of any particular school district should should pay the same amount as everyone else enjoying those same benefits. It should have nothing to do with how much money someone makes or how big their house is.....each kid gets the same education and amenities at those schools, everyone should pay the same for them...
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I don't mean to argue, definitely don't want it to be political and am on the side that we are taxed way to much but I'm failing to understand how it's not fair to you.

Example 1 which is how it currently is:
You have a taxable income amount of 300,000 and joe down the street has 60,000. It's a 1% taxing district. You pay in 3000 and he pays in 600 and you both get to "keep" 99% of your income if we ignore federal and state taxes for simplicity.

Example 2 we put in your idea of making everyone pay in the same:

Same numbers you put in 3000 and joe puts in 3000. Now you get to keep 99% and joe gets to keep 95%. That doesn't sound fair personally.

As for seniors with no taxable income. The taxes for the school are based off of your Ohio AGI plus any business deduction addback and social security is not taxed by OH. Your school district tax base can not be higher than your OH AGI unless you got the business deduction. They also paid in for years while they were working and eventually you won't have earned income to tax depending on what type of retirement you are pulling when you get to that age so no tax for you as well. I just don't see how it isn't fair. Flat tax rates are about as fair as you can get.
 
State2013-1 said:
I don't mean to argue, definitely don't want it to be political and am on the side that we are taxed way to much but I'm failing to understand how it's not fair to you.

Example 1 which is how it currently is:
You have a taxable income amount of 300,000 and joe down the street has 60,000. It's a 1% taxing district. You pay in 3000 and he pays in 600 and you both get to "keep" 99% of your income if we ignore federal and state taxes for simplicity.
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A lot to unpack here....I don't find it argumentative for what it's worth....

Is there a good or service that you can think of that Joe and I could obtain and get exactly the same service or product where I pay $3000 and he pays $600? I understand what you're saying, about the percentages and how you can deem that fair.....that's not my point....my point is, Joe's kid and my kid get exactly the same thing in return....only Joe has to pay $600 for it, and I have to pay $3000. The fact of the matter is, if Joe and I walked into say a grocery store, and we each walked up to the counter with a loaf of bread and the clerk said "Joe, that'll be $1.50" then looked at me and said "Casual, you make more money than Joe, so that'll be $10" I think everyone sees the problem here right?!

Your example can be applied to anything real world. If "Joe" and I each buy the same $30,000 car......and the terms and payments are the same but I make more than him - obviously the payment is going to be higher percentage of his income. The fact of the matter is, Joe chose to buy the same car as me (chose to live in the school district). If he wants to stretch his dollar, maybe he should buy a $20,000 car instead (choose to buy in a different district)? Based on your example and logic, you think Joe and I should both buy the same car, and I should just pay more for it because I make more....that shouldn't sit well with anyone...
State2013-1 said:
Example 2 we put in your idea of making everyone pay in the same:

Same numbers you put in 3000 and joe puts in 3000. Now you get to keep 99% and joe gets to keep 95%. That doesn't sound fair personally.
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In order to get premium things in life, you have to pay for them. You have to make a choice.....it's sort of like the real estate market. You have $200,000 budget for buying a home.....do you want to spend the $200k on the biggest mansion in an awful neighborhood or school district? Or do you want to buy the smallest home in the best neighborhood or school district for the same $200,000? It works the same....if Joe wants to be in a situation where he gets to keep 99% of his income much like myself, then he should choose a school district with cheaper school taxes.....because like everything in life, you get what you pay for!
State2013-1 said:
As for seniors with no taxable income. The taxes for the school are based off of your Ohio AGI plus any business deduction addback and social security is not taxed by OH. Your school district tax base can not be higher than your OH AGI unless you got the business deduction. They also paid in for years while they were working and eventually you won't have earned income to tax depending on what type of retirement you are pulling when you get to that age so no tax for you as well. I just don't see how it isn't fair. Flat tax rates are about as fair as you can get.
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The problem with this is that the person that no longer has to pay taxes in retirement still gets a vote/say on what the taxes are! That's the issue! Someone not paying income tax should have ZERO say on passing a levy which causes a hardship on everyone that IS still paying taxes...they get the benefit of having new facilities/schools but contribute nothing toward that benefit.
 
CasualFan24 said:
A lot to unpack here....I don't find it argumentative for what it's worth....

Is there a good or service that you can think of that Joe and I could obtain and get exactly the same service or product where I pay $3000 and he pays $600? I understand what you're saying, about the percentages and how you can deem that fair.....that's not my point....my point is, Joe's kid and my kid get exactly the same thing in return....only Joe has to pay $600 for it, and I have to pay $3000. The fact of the matter is, if Joe and I walked into say a grocery store, and we each walked up to the counter with a loaf of bread and the clerk said "Joe, that'll be $1.50" then looked at me and said "Casual, you make more money than Joe, so that'll be $10" I think everyone sees the problem here right?!

Your example can be applied to anything real world. If "Joe" and I each buy the same $30,000 car......and the terms and payments are the same but I make more than him - obviously the payment is going to be higher percentage of his income. The fact of the matter is, Joe chose to buy the same car as me (chose to live in the school district). If he wants to stretch his dollar, maybe he should buy a $20,000 car instead (choose to buy in a different district)? Based on your example and logic, you think Joe and I should both buy the same car, and I should just pay more for it because I make more....that shouldn't sit well with anyone...

In order to get premium things in life, you have to pay for them. You have to make a choice.....it's sort of like the real estate market. You have $200,000 budget for buying a home.....do you want to spend the $200k on the biggest mansion in an awful neighborhood or school district? Or do you want to buy the smallest home in the best neighborhood or school district for the same $200,000? It works the same....if Joe wants to be in a situation where he gets to keep 99% of his income much like myself, then he should choose a school district with cheaper school taxes.....because like everything in life, you get what you pay for!

The problem with this is that the person that no longer has to pay taxes in retirement still gets a vote/say on what the taxes are! That's the issue! Someone not paying income tax should have ZERO say on passing a levy which causes a hardship on everyone that IS still paying taxes...they get the benefit of having new facilities/schools but contribute nothing toward that benefit.
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I can agree with the vote/tax thing. The thing that I can disagree with is that education isn't considered a commodity such as say a prime steak at a restaurant or a car. It's a public service that is funded by taxes and not private dollars so it's a little different. Now you're correct that if you went to a private school you're often paying more for a better education but it's not publicly funded so you're getting out what you're putting in. A publicly funded initiative is in place for the betterment of the community as a whole. Unfortunately there are poor people within the community that can't pay in even if they want to so the windfall has to be made up somewhere else. I just don't think you can compare a private purchase such as a car or groceries to a public service because they serve very different purposes. If you go into debt buying a car that's on you but it would be foolish to make someone go into debt for a publicly funded education.
 
Work at a job - get taxed on your income.

Buy goods on your way home - get taxed on the goods you purchased.

Go to the home you paid taxes on the purchase & pay continually increasing property taxes.

This country had a revolution over taxation without representation. You might be able to make the argument that sending money to King George couldn’t be much worse than paying the incompetent jabronis running things now.

(PS - “Hi!” to the alphabet soup agency folks reading this post.)
 
Raylan_Givens said:
Work at a job - get taxed on your income.

Buy goods on your way home - get taxed on the goods you purchased.

Go to the home you paid taxes on the purchase & pay continually increasing property taxes.

This country had a revolution over taxation without representation. You might be able to make the argument that sending money to King George couldn’t be much worse than paying the incompetent jabronis running things now.

(PS - “Hi!” to the alphabet soup agency folks reading this post.)
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Think you’re safe. No mention of Trump.
 
Raylan_Givens said:
Work at a job - get taxed on your income.

Buy goods on your way home - get taxed on the goods you purchased.

Go to the home you paid taxes on the purchase & pay continually increasing property taxes.

This country had a revolution over taxation without representation. You might be able to make the argument that sending money to King George couldn’t be much worse than paying the incompetent jabronis running things now.

(PS - “Hi!” to the alphabet soup agency folks reading this post.)
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Nothing better than listening to that congresswoman saying the moon is made of mostly of gasses and that it is NEARLY impossible to get close to the sun due to its heat instead of saying it IS impossible.
 
State2013-1 said:
I can agree with the vote/tax thing. The thing that I can disagree with is that education isn't considered a commodity such as say a prime steak at a restaurant or a car. It's a public service that is funded by taxes and not private dollars so it's a little different. Now you're correct that if you went to a private school you're often paying more for a better education but it's not publicly funded so you're getting out what you're putting in. A publicly funded initiative is in place for the betterment of the community as a whole. Unfortunately there are poor people within the community that can't pay in even if they want to so the windfall has to be made up somewhere else. I just don't think you can compare a private purchase such as a car or groceries to a public service because they serve very different purposes. If you go into debt buying a car that's on you but it would be foolish to make someone go into debt for a publicly funded education.
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I was raised that you get out of life what you put into it. It's how I'm raising my children, to always work hard and the return will reflect what you put into it. Not to wait for or expect any type of handout.

We are on different sides of the fence on some things - but thanks for keeping it a civil discussion!
hulk hogan agree GIF
 
CasualFan24 said:
I was raised that you get out of life what you put into it. It's how I'm raising my children, to always work hard and the return will reflect what you put into it. Not to wait for or expect any type of handout.

We are on different sides of the fence on some things - but thanks for keeping it a civil discussion!
hulk hogan agree GIF
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Same to you! I operate under the same assumptions as you. Public school taxation is just a little different than your opinion. My full personal opinion is school choice should be fully embraced and public schools need to be fiscally responsible so we aren't held hostage by taxes and have to greatly increase them to fix crumbling infrastructure, these things should be foreseen and the budget accounts for it. But unfortunately these are the cards we have been dealt by the system.
 
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