RECRUITING!!!!

[HippyDippy]

What about two equally qualified candidates for a promotion at work? There is one spot. Leaders have these choices all the time and it stinks as someone will be unhappy. The kid who sat (Who is not going to earn money in Basketball) has a choice to make. That choice happens probably daily in adulthood. He/She cannot control being placed on the bench. But how they respond, or more importantly learn to respond, will define their adult hood.

We aren't talking about adults at work. We are talking about children participating in an extracurricular.

but if you want to consider playing HS athletics employment, HS football would be banned as a hazardous occupation detrimental to the health of the kids.

 

[HippyDippy]

Life isn't fair. Good life lesson.

Of course, if he was that good the coach would have found playing time for him. Possibly another position.

"Life isn't fair". I have heard those very words were spoken to a high school football player who was benched as a senior by a coach who promised a state championship in three years to a bunch of morons whose live revolve around their high school football team winning a state championship, 6 yeears ago and has never delivered. he also screwed a whole class of seniors his first year playing sophomores as his strategy to win in his third year, but failed miserably because he is a mediocre coach who knows nothing of clock management among other things. The guys an idiot and will never win a State championship unless he recruits from the entire NE Ohio region especially Akron.

He was hired a week after promising his team which had just won two state championships in a row, that he was "here to stay" in the SW part of the State in a league that gets all its talent from recruiting, because he had a big name player on his team whose father recruited a stable of horses to support his kid, and then took a bribe to take another job, abandoning the kids. His wife could have coached the team to a State championship with the talent he had on the team but he took a bribe and dropped them like a bad habit.

He has gotten mercy clocked in two state finals games because he chokes in the clutch. He never applied for this job. The 26 guys who did apply for the job were told: Life isn't fair. Sucks to be You.

This guy will never win a State Championship where he is. He now promotes himself as improving the academics performances and getting a lot of financial aid (not full rides) for his players since he will never win a State Championship, being a mediocre idiot and choke artist.

The teachers in his school give answers to tests to his players so they appear to be doing well academically.

 

[yakyak]

We aren't talking about adults at work. We are talking about children participating in an extracurricular.

but if you want to consider playing HS athletics employment, HS football would be banned as a hazardous occupation detrimental to the health of the kids.

View attachment 15177

We better stop the marching band then. This individual had an asthma attack marching. Clearly, lets stop the band from marching and save lives.
https://www.dailynews.com/2005/10/18/student-dies-after-collapsing-during-band-competition/

Your posted law reference is invalid. It is clearly talking about the employee - employer relationship for minors. That is dramatically and almost comically different than the relationship between a student and a school. After this last post, you clearly are a moron. Good day. I am not responding to this vomit any longer.

 

[HippyDippy]

We better stop the marching band then. This individual had an asthma attack marching. Clearly, lets stop the band from marching and save lives.
https://www.dailynews.com/2005/10/18/student-dies-after-collapsing-during-band-competition/

Your posted law reference is invalid. It is clearly talking about the employee - employer relationship for minors. That is dramatically and almost comically different than the relationship between a student and a school. After this last post, you clearly are a moron. Good day. I am not responding to this vomit any longer.

nonsense. the asthma wasn't caused by playing drums. LOL if the kid has asthma maybe he should take up concert band instead.

You compared participating in an extracurricular to an employment situation. I denied any similarity, but simply opined that if participating in an employment situation *was* applicable, the occupation would be banned in the first place.

now you want to get insulting and personal. tsk tsk tsk. that means you lost.

 

[winbypin]

nonsense. the asthma wasn't caused by playing drums. LOL if the kid has asthma maybe he should take up concert band instead.

You compared participating in an extracurricular to an employment situation. I denied any similarity, but simply opined that if participating in an employment situation *was* applicable, the occupation would be banned in the first place.

now you want to get insulting and personal. tsk tsk tsk. that means you lost.

Extracurriculars are to augment the education of the kids. Hard work, dedication, teamwork, etc. He wasn't saying HS sports are work. He was saying they help prepare you for adulthood. Life has disappointments....losing playing time in HS will help prepare you for these disappointments when you get passed over for a promotion. Hence....life isn't fair.

Time to move on.

 

[HippyDippy]

Extracurriculars are to augment the education of the kids. Hard work, dedication, teamwork, etc. He wasn't saying HS sports are work. He was saying they help prepare you for adulthood. Life has disappointments....losing playing time in HS will help prepare you for these disappointments when you get passed over for a promotion. Hence....life isn't fair.

Time to move on.

get moving then and let him explain his own remarks.

he doesn't need you to do it for him.

get moving. move on. you're done here.

stick a fork in yourself: you're done. in other words

 

[belied dat]

and there is a much larger part of the community, that has no interest in interscholastic athletics, even in the most rabid "fanbase" school districts

in the great majority of all school districts, the following consists of parents and grandparents, and a few hundred more. There is no database of attendance at interscholastic competitions but you know as well as I know that at most contests, 5000 is considered a to be a huge crowd..

I mean, depending on where you are, 5000 is great and amazing for the community. That number alone would be 1/3 of the whole county where I grew up. Impacting 33% of a county is a big impact.

Other areas have much more attendance.

Again, I have my own issues with the scholastic/athletic union. It serves a purpose. It's not overly expensive. The same can be done privately, but potentially at more expense (as is shown with club soccer, club hockey, gymnastics, volleyball, etc.).

 

[HippyDippy]

I mean, depending on where you are, 5000 is great and amazing for the community. That number alone would be 1/3 of the whole county where I grew up. Impacting 33% of a county is a big impact.

Other areas have much more attendance.

Again, I have my own issues with the scholastic/athletic union. It serves a purpose. It's not overly expensive. The same can be done privately, but potentially at more expense (as is shown with club soccer, club hockey, gymnastics, volleyball, etc.).

with all due respect, you cannot know the true expenses incurred for all sports. if you think transportation isn't a big expense I've got news for you and another thing: playing venues aren't cheap and every school thinks it has to have a home field.

the other part is medical expenses which all get transferred out from the entity and activities that are causing them onto the public or employer paid healthcare system which in the end we all pay for one way or the other. factor those costs in and it gets VERY expensive.

the great majority of interscholastic events draw less than 1000 and I would guess less than 500 all told -- but again -- go try to find a database of attendance statewide. there are none.

 

[belied dat]

with all due respect, you cannot know the true expenses incurred for all sports. if you think transportation isn't a big expense I've got news for you and another thing: playing venues aren't cheap and every school thinks it has to have a home field.

the other part is medical expenses which all get transferred out from the entity and activities that are causing them onto the public or employer paid healthcare system which in the end we all pay for one way or the other. factor those costs in and it gets VERY expensive.

the great majority of interscholastic events draw less than 1000 and I would guess less than 500 all told -- but again -- go try to find a database of attendance statewide. there are none.

With all due respect, when you work in the realm of interscholastic athletics, intercollegiate athletics, and privatized athletics you do know the true expenses incurred.

 

[David H21]

It's up to them and their families why they go to certain high schools. Not for you to decide.

So, a coach with the blessing of a high school #1 identifies a really talented player at high school #2. Said coach approaches the player/parents of high school #2. Says come to high school number #1. We will win a ton of a games and don’t worry about tuition. We will figure that out.
Yeah, that’s a balanced approach. Shows great, sound thinking on part of high school #1. Come on!

 

[winbypin]

So, a coach with the blessing of a high school #1 identifies a really talented player at high school #2. Said coach approaches the player/parents of high school #2. Says come to high school number #1. We will win a ton of a games and don’t worry about tuition. We will figure that out.
Yeah, that’s a balanced approach. Shows great, sound thinking on part of high school #1. Come on!

Yea, that's not even close to what I said.

 

[David H21]

Here here!

You've nailed it. Coaches exploit kids for Coach's benefit, not for kid, not for school district, in fact they screw over the family that has been in the school district and had their kid in the "system" for years, who is displaced by the recruit.

This teaches the kid that loyalty and hard work mean nothing, when the Coach will bring in mercenaries for Coach's benefit,

The biggest problem is the brain dead public who think their high school football team is a professional club and stand idly by, allowing the insult to their neighbor.

Warped is exactly right.

Exactly. It’s HS sports for gosh sake. These parents act like it’s the pros. Stop recruiting. If a kid moves or legit transfers that’s one thing. If coaches out recruiting kids to win games that’s nuts. Bad lesson all the way around. And the kids who have been there from the start only to get passed over because Coach has a shinny new nickel he/she recruited from another high school is wrong. I see people say life isn’t fair. Absolutely. There are differing levels of athletic ability. But maybe high school life should be fair when it comes to not recruiting kids. Again, priorities out of order.

 

[David H21]

Yea, that's not even close to what I said.

That’s what whoever started this recruiting forum was talking about??? My example is what goes on. At a number of HSs. So what are you talking about big boy? Maybe start another forum

 

[winbypin]

That’s what whoever started this recruiting forum was talking about??? My example is what goes on. At a number of HSs. So what are you talking about big boy? Maybe start another forum

It happens at SOME high schools. The most play by the rules. But whatever the reason a kid changes schools, it's not your concern. Unless it's your kid that is.

Why would I start another forum? I like yappi's just fine.

 

[HippyDippy]

Exactly. It’s HS sports for gosh sake. These parents act like it’s the pros. Stop recruiting. If a kid moves or legit transfers that’s one thing. If coaches out recruiting kids to win games that’s nuts. Bad lesson all the way around. And the kids who have been there from the start only to get passed over because Coach has a shinny new nickel he/she recruited from another high school is wrong. I see people say life isn’t fair. Absolutely. There are differing levels of athletic ability. But maybe high school life should be fair when it comes to not recruiting kids. Again, priorities out of order.

You're spot on.

 

[HippyDippy]

With all due respect, when you work in the realm of interscholastic athletics, intercollegiate athletics, and privatized athletics you do know the true expenses incurred.

No, in the interscholastic setting there is no way to track all expenses to any sport. You might have an idea how much a helmet costs, or athletic tape, but all the extraneous expenses are not tracked. You don't know how much transportation expenses are incurred for a sport, across all schools in a district, down to the last quart of oil, all the expenses for drivers including fringe benefits.

Fund accounting doesn't provide for such accurate accounting of all expenses. In fact the word "athletic" as in Athletic Department does not even occur in any audit of any public school in Ohio. Expenses are not even tracked at the "department" level, separating athletic out from music, for example.

Expenses for coaches, who are usually paid as "other administrators" are not included in the extracurriculars line item: those costs are in "administrative" Transportation for athletics isn't in extracurriculars either: it's in pupil transportation line. and on and on. utilities? water for showers? heat? electricity? not tracked. medical expenses for injuries caused by participation? nowhere to be found.

So don't even try to pull the "when you work in the realm of" card. you have no idea the true costs of interscholastic athletic competitions.

 

[David H21]

It happens at SOME high schools. The most play by the rules. But whatever the reason a kid changes schools, it's not your concern. Unless it's your kid that is.

Why would I start another forum? I like yappi's just fine.

It is my concern. When my kids high school has to play a high school who tries to stack a team every year it’s an unfair advantage. Not to mention the real insult to the kids, who are good players at the recruiting high school who get passed over so the coach can install “his guys”. Be careful how you admonish. What’s right is right and what’s wrong is wrong. You one of those people who are flexible on right and wrong to suit your purposes? Win an argument? What else you got for me swizzle sticks? Want me to give you the finer points of the 10 Commandments? The golden rule?

 

[winbypin]

It is my concern. When my kids high school has to play a high school who tries to stack a team every year it’s an unfair advantage. Not to mention the real insult to the kids, who are good players at the recruiting high school who get passed over so the coach can install “his guys”. Be careful how you admonish. What’s right is right and what’s wrong is wrong. You one of those people who are flexible on right and wrong to suit your purposes? Win an argument? What else you got for me swizzle sticks? Want me to give you the finer points of the 10 Commandments? The golden rule?

It is not your concern on where any parents send their kids for schooling. Sorry, but you're just plain wrong here.

The rest of your post is just low-level rant material. Hope you feel better.

 

[soccerdad72]

So, a coach with the blessing of a high school #1 identifies a really talented player at high school #2. Said coach approaches the player/parents of high school #2. Says come to high school number #1. We will win a ton of a games and don’t worry about tuition. We will figure that out.
Yeah, that’s a balanced approach. Shows great, sound thinking on part of high school #1. Come on!

If the bolded part is true, the school needs to be sanctioned (e.g. Walsh Jesuit). I agree with others, though, it's not a common occurrence - especially since transfers have to sit out half a season when they switch schools, so it's only really helpful to school #2 the next year, since the transferred player can't help them in the playoffs.

 

[David H21]

It is not your concern on where any parents send their kids for schooling. Sorry, but you're just plain wrong here.

The rest of your post is just low-level rant material. Hope you feel better.

Nothing u said has an example or fact. People can’t argue opinion. I’m sure with your intellectual prowess your aware of this. I’ll bet your a big Hillary Clinton supporter no? I also bet your worse than my 7th grader. Always have to have the last word. So go ahead. I’ll let you have it

 

[winbypin]

Nothing u said has an example or fact. People can’t argue opinion. I’m sure with your intellectual prowess your aware of this. I’ll bet your a big Hillary Clinton supporter no? I also bet your worse than my 7th grader. Always have to have the last word. So go ahead. I’ll let you have it

So you're waving the white flag because you know what happens in someone else's family isn't your concern?

The hildabeast? Get out of here. She wouldn't be in favor of families deciding for themselves what is best for them. She would be all about government telling you what you need to do.

 

[HippyDippy]

So you're waving the white flag because you know what happens in someone else's family isn't your concern?

The hildabeast? Get out of here. She wouldn't be in favor of families deciding for themselves what is best for them. She would be all about government telling you what you need to do.

The issue here isn't your family's decision.

The issue is that corrupts will reach out and use measures or promises to entice a family to change it's mind.

It's not what the family decides that is the issue: it is what is done by self interested parties to entice them.

The other issue is who is harmed by the self interested parties' interference.

Nobody GAF what you or anybody else does if there is no outside interference in your decision, but the public does have an interest in public employees manipulating and exploiting children in their OWN self interest. Public employees have no business interfering in anybody's life in order to further their own careers. (there is no benefit to the school district to have a "winning" team in any interscholastic competition: there also is no loss to a school district if it has NO "winning" teams.

THAT is the topic.

 

[David H21]

What schools are the worst offenders at talking kids from other schools into switching to win state championship?

 

[BASESWIMPARENT]

There have been some private, parochial schools in the last few years that have been caught giving tuition assistance to athletes. Thinking of Walsh and Alter. And interestingly enough not necessarily football and basketball. Another SWO parochial school that really focuses on athletics is suspected of "encouraging" athletes to transfer to it and one SWO parochial school has special scholarships that seem to disproportionally get awarded to athletes. Kettering an Walsh got caught. The other two I mentioned are what have been brought up in this thread and others. Many on this board basically are saying if these schools are breaking the rules or even the spirit of the rules then they should be punished according to the rules that they signed up to abide by. Otherwise we should quit accusing them of things that as of now are unproven speculation.

 

[David H21]

There have been some private, parochial schools in the last few years that have been caught giving tuition assistance to athletes. Thinking of Walsh and Alter. And interestingly enough not necessarily football and basketball. Another SWO parochial school that really focuses on athletics is suspected of "encouraging" athletes to transfer to it and one SWO parochial school has special scholarships that seem to disproportionally get awarded to athletes. Kettering an Walsh got caught. The other two I mentioned are what have been brought up in this thread and others. Many on this board basically are saying if these schools are breaking the rules or even the spirit of the rules then they should be punished according to the rules that they signed up to abide by. Otherwise we should quit accusing them of things that as of now are unproven speculation.

Ahhhh. If u know u know. Sadly the Ohio High School Association only seems to care about making money from the little I know. That may not be fair, just what ive heard a couple people say. I say call the rule breakers out. Sad reality in our world. No one likes truth. People much prefer the narrative. Forget the methods, just win. So what percent of schools does this go on? I guess hard to say because your probably only familiar with schools in ur area. U bring up a good point. I assume football and basketball are the sports where most of shenanigans go on?

 

[BASESWIMPARENT]

Ahhhh. If u know u know. Sadly the Ohio High School Association only seems to care about making money from the little I know. That may not be fair, just what ive heard a couple people say. I say call the rule breakers out. Sad reality in our world. No one likes truth. People much prefer the narrative. Forget the methods, just win. So what percent of schools does this go on? I guess hard to say because your probably only familiar with schools in ur area. U bring up a good point. I assume football and basketball are the sports where most of shenanigans go on?

You would think but ironically enough, Walsh was caught mostly for girls soccer from what I understand and I honestly cannot remember if it was sport specific at Alter. The rules are the rules. if you don't agree, don't sign up for them. No one is forcing these schools to agree to these rules and in some cases, these schools might be better off if they did not and tried a different model. But don't say one thing and then do another and I think that is what gets people so frustrated.

 

[David H21]

You would think but ironically enough, Walsh was caught mostly for girls soccer from what I understand and I honestly cannot remember if it was sport specific at Alter. The rules are the rules. if you don't agree, don't sign up for them. No one is forcing these schools to agree to these rules and in some cases, these schools might be better off if they did not and tried a different model. But don't say one thing and then do another and I think that is what gets people so frustrated.

100%

 

[Cincy_Futbol]

As long as HS sports are around and public and private schools are competing for the same titles this will happen. Which private school the best players go to will shift in cycles as it has the past 10 years. The best players in the city used to go to SCD and now they go to Moeller. In 5 years maybe it’s Elder. Who knows.

its fun and natural for us to try and make someone the enemy or place blame on others. Bottom line, if coaches want players to play for them they have the power to create the environment that will get them to stay or come.

Moeller has created an environment where the best players want to play. Until the OHSAA says they’ve done something wrong with proof it’s all just speculation and hearsay. People need to spend more time watering their own grass instead of looking at other yards.

 

[BASESWIMPARENT]

As long as HS sports are around and public and private schools are competing for the same titles this will happen. Which private school the best players go to will shift in cycles as it has the past 10 years. The best players in the city used to go to SCD and now they go to Moeller. In 5 years maybe it’s Elder. Who knows.

its fun and natural for us to try and make someone the enemy or place blame on others. Bottom line, if coaches want players to play for them they have the power to create the environment that will get them to stay or come.

Moeller has created an environment where the best players want to play. Until the OHSAA says they’ve done something wrong with proof it’s all just speculation and hearsay. People need to spend more time watering their own grass instead of looking at other yards.

And If Moeller has agreed to one set of rules in spirit and letter then abide by them. If they haven't then they should go and try another approach. But I agree with you on one thing, provide proof or quit complaining. The constant complaining about them recruiting and providing benefits for athletics gets old after a while when there is never provided to the authorities hard proof to the contrary.