One Conservative's Case Against Donald J. Trump

Omega

Omega

Well-known member
First some definitions:

Conservatism:

The holding of political views that favor free enterprise, private ownership, and socially traditional values. Conservatism champions a strong national defense, secure borders, fiscal responsibility, along with individual freedom through smaller government.

Megalomania:

The obsession with the exercise of power, especially in the domination of others. Along with the delusional belief that one is important, powerful, or famous, as a form or symptom of mental disorder.

Demagogue:

A political leader who seeks support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of ordinary people rather than by using rational argument.

I cannot support Donald J. Trump simply because he cannot deliver on his promises or rhetoric. As Obama (ACA) and Team Biden (Green New Deal) has shown, change in America is ushered in through legislation. It is my opinion that Trump's megalomania and accompanying demagoguery will not allow him to work with Congress to accomplish conservative change for America. Trump thrives on chaos and combativeness. He would rather pick a fight than find a solution through compromise with Congress. Trump's first term did get three years of conservative results.Yet America needs permanent conservative solutions, not executive orders that can be reversed in an instant by a new administration. A second Trump term would simply be a rinse, wash, and repeat of the chaos of his first.
 
 
If you honestly believe it would be a repeat of the first, you are delusional. It would be 10 times more corrupt, chaotic, and damaging.
 
Omega said:
First some definitions:

Conservatism:

The holding of political views that favor free enterprise, private ownership, and socially traditional values. Conservatism champions a strong national defense, secure borders, fiscal responsibility, along with individual freedom through smaller government.

Megalomania:

The obsession with the exercise of power, especially in the domination of others. Along with the delusional belief that one is important, powerful, or famous, as a form or symptom of mental disorder.

Demagogue:

A political leader who seeks support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of ordinary people rather than by using rational argument.

I cannot support Donald J. Trump simply because he cannot deliver on his promises or rhetoric. As Obama (ACA) and Team Biden (Green New Deal) has shown, change in America is ushered in through legislation. It is my opinion that Trump's megalomania and accompanying demagoguery will not allow him to work with Congress to accomplish conservative change for America. Trump thrives on chaos and combativeness. He would rather pick a fight than find a solution through compromise with Congress. Trump's first term did get three years of conservative results.Yet America needs permanent conservative solutions, not executive orders that can be reversed in an instant by a new administration. A second Trump term would simply be a rinse, wash, and repeat of the chaos of his first.
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He did get 3 years of conservative results...but he can't deliver 🤣
 
y2h said:
He did get 3 years of conservative results...but he can't deliver 🤣
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But was there any permanence of his results? Getting things done through EOs and his indomitable will is one thing. Getting his agenda codified into law is another.
 
Omega said:
As Obama (ACA) and Team Biden (Green New Deal) has shown, change in America is ushered in through legislation.
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The ACA was passed in the middle of the night using parliamentary parlor tricks with a strictly partisan vote.

You couldn't have come up with a crappier example.

lmao
 
Omega said:
But was there any permanence of his results? Getting things done through EOs and his indomitable will is one thing. Getting his agenda codified into law is another.
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His remaking of the Judiciary will long outlive him and may be his greatest accomplishment. It's the only thing holding this country together until the adults are back in control soon.

Please make a note of this.
 
Gulliotine said:
His remaking of the Judiciary will long outlive him and may be his greatest accomplishment. It's the only thing holding this country together until the adults are back in control soon.

Please make a note of this.
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And who picked Roberts and Alito? Not trump. Any GOP POTUS is going to pick conservatives and why it is important for the GOP to nominate a candidate who can win next fall.
 
Gulliotine said:
The ACA was passed in the middle of the night using parliamentary parlor tricks with a strictly partisan vote.

You couldn't have come up with a crappier example.

lmao
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The ACA was not even formally voted on, just deemed to be passed by Pelosi. Yet it became law of the land that stands 13 years later.

I will give you points on Trumps judicial appointments however.
 
Trump had to defend himself, his whole term, witch hunt after witch hunt. The fix was in for Hillary Clinton, in 2016, but it wasn't enough, to overcome.
The deep state is angry & will stop at nothing to keep the chaos going.
There is no reason to keep attacking Trump, if Biden truly won 2020 & J6 would of never happened.
These attacks are to turn people away from, supporting Trump.
That boat done sailed, the main stream media lost a lot of viewers.
Trump supporters have already made up their mind & can see through all the chaos. That is what keeps Trump going,
If the Trump rallies were like a Biden rally. Trump would realize, he would not have a chance of winning 2024 & not run.
 
Gardiner said:
Trump had to defend himself, his whole term, witch hunt after witch hunt. The fix was in for Hillary Clinton, in 2016, but it wasn't enough, to overcome.
The deep state is angry & will stop at nothing to keep the chaos going.
There is no reason to keep attacking Trump, if Biden truly won 2020 & J6 would of never happened.
These attacks are to turn people away from, supporting Trump.
That boat done sailed, the main stream media lost a lot of viewers.
Trump supporters have already made up their mind & can see through all the chaos. That is what keeps Trump going,
If the Trump rallies were like a Biden rally. Trump would realize, he would not have a chance of winning 2024 & not run.
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Have you been to a Trump rally? A very interesting experience. Almost like an old style tent meeting where the faithful gather for worship and revival. Except the crowd seems to worship Trump rather than God. That makes his rallies problematic for reaching undecided voters during a campaign. It is my opinion that the rallies are held to satisfy Trump's insatiable ego rather than to reach new voters .
 
Omega said:
Have you been to a Trump rally? A very interesting experience. Almost like an old style tent meeting where the faithful gather for worship and revival. Except the crowd seems to worship Trump rather than God. That makes his rallies problematic for reaching undecided voters during a campaign. It is my opinion that the rallies are held to satisfy Trump's insatiable ego rather than to reach new voters .
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Trump rallies the the butt of a joke for most Americans.
 
Gardiner said:
Trump had to defend himself, his whole term, witch hunt after witch hunt. The fix was in for Hillary Clinton, in 2016, but it wasn't enough, to overcome.
The deep state is angry & will stop at nothing to keep the chaos going.
There is no reason to keep attacking Trump, if Biden truly won 2020 & J6 would of never happened.
These attacks are to turn people away from, supporting Trump.
That boat done sailed, the main stream media lost a lot of viewers.
Trump supporters have already made up their mind & can see through all the chaos. That is what keeps Trump going,
If the Trump rallies were like a Biden rally. Trump would realize, he would not have a chance of winning 2024 & not run.
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The judge said the section requires vaginal penetration by a penis while forcible penetration without consent of the vagina or other bodily orifices by fingers or anything else is labeled “sexual abuse” rather than “rape.”

He said the definition of rape was “far narrower” than how rape is defined in common modern parlance, in some dictionaries, in some federal and state criminal statutes and elsewhere.

The judge said the verdict did not mean that Carroll “failed to prove that Mr. Trump ‘raped’ her as many people commonly understand the word ‘rape.’ Indeed ... the jury found that Mr. Trump in fact did exactly that.”

Instead, the proof convincingly established, and the jury implicitly found, that Mr. Trump deliberately and forcibly penetrated Ms. Carroll’s vagina with his fingers, causing immediate pain and long lasting emotional and psychological harm,” Kaplan wrote.

That is who you are defending!!!
 
Omega said:
But was there any permanence of his results? Getting things done through EOs and his indomitable will is one thing. Getting his agenda codified into law is another.
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The SCOTUS is the closest thing to permanence in American politics. And don't forget all those young conservative federal judges.
 
Omega said:
First some definitions:

Conservatism:

The holding of political views that favor free enterprise, private ownership, and socially traditional values. Conservatism champions a strong national defense, secure borders, fiscal responsibility, along with individual freedom through smaller government.

Megalomania:

The obsession with the exercise of power, especially in the domination of others. Along with the delusional belief that one is important, powerful, or famous, as a form or symptom of mental disorder.

Demagogue:

A political leader who seeks support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of ordinary people rather than by using rational argument.

I cannot support Donald J. Trump simply because he cannot deliver on his promises or rhetoric. As Obama (ACA) and Team Biden (Green New Deal) has shown, change in America is ushered in through legislation. It is my opinion that Trump's megalomania and accompanying demagoguery will not allow him to work with Congress to accomplish conservative change for America. Trump thrives on chaos and combativeness. He would rather pick a fight than find a solution through compromise with Congress. Trump's first term did get three years of conservative results.Yet America needs permanent conservative solutions, not executive orders that can be reversed in an instant by a new administration. A second Trump term would simply be a rinse, wash, and repeat of the chaos of his first.
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First, I take issue with your definition of "Conservative". It's to narrow and lacks any nuance. It reads more like a Chamber of Commerce advertisement.

I don't disagree with your description of Trump. I will be voting for DeSantis in the Ohio Primary. DeSantis then Tim Scott are my preferred candidates over Trump.

But should Trump get the nomination he will get my vote without hesitation. Any true conservative can recognize the damage a 2nd Biden administration will do to this country. It is incomprehensible to me that any conservative would not vote for Trump over Biden.

As for a 3rd party candidate I made the mistake of voting for Perot in 1992 and the result was Clinton in office. So I won't make that mistake again. And the difference between the outcome for America between electing Bush or Clinton is dwarfed by the difference for the country between electing Trump or Biden. My take here is that unless polling shows that a 3rd party candidate has a real chance to win it's a waste to vote for them. This is my opinuion of course.
 
Stirred not Shaken said:
That works both ways, leadership is the ability to work with people with different viewpoints than you have, trump is incapable of doing so. Reagan was a leader trump a wanna be bully.
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Leadership is not caving on principle just to get something done. Why Manchin is a joke. Trump offered bipartisan legislation and Dems and RINOs refused to consider it because he's Hitler or something.
 
Stirred not Shaken said:
Trump expanded big govt. spending by the trillions, did very little to reign in or make changes to SS, Medicare/ Medicaid, welfare, or any entitlements.
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Congress controls spending. Show me the politician with the political will to cut SS/Medicare/Medicaid and I'll show you a unicorn.

You always skip over that he presided over the longest government shutdown in history over spending.
 
Stirred not Shaken said:
And who picked Roberts and Alito? Not trump. Any GOP POTUS is going to pick conservatives and why it is important for the GOP to nominate a candidate who can win next fall.
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Trump's influence over the Judiciary extends well past the SCOTUS.

Cocaine Mitch gets partial credit.
 
Gulliotine said:
Then why did you bring it up as an example of change through legislation when it was actually an abuse of power?
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Because the goal politics is to achieve the power to implement your agenda. How the ACA came about was a horrific abuse of power, but is an example how change in America is created. Legislation, and legislation alone is how agendas are put into action.
 
Omega said:
Because the goal politics is to achieve the power to implement your agenda. How the ACA came about was a horrific abuse of power, but is an example how change in America is created. Legislation, and legislation alone is how agendas are put into action.
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Which is why it's important to vote Republican in Congress as well. A Dem Congress isn't going to do shite for a Republican president.

A Dem president can count not only on fellow Dems but RINOs to get their legislation passed. Which is why conservatives are fed up with the establishment and Trump happened in the first place.
 
Omega said:
Because the goal politics is to achieve the power to implement your agenda. How the ACA came about was a horrific abuse of power, but is an example how change in America is created. Legislation, and legislation alone is how agendas are put into action.
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What?

With a straight face you're criticizing Trump for talking about abusing power while saying Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid abusing power is how change is created?

That's nonsense.
 
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