I'd say it's most likely because of you, coach... considering all those Gales recently running under 4:20, 4:30, 2:00, 9:35, etc.!Trial Conclusions...
> Benefit increases with the length of the race... benefit is small(negligible) for the 800M
> Benefit is greater for faster runners
> Earlier adoption by 3200M runners
...
That is all true if comparing improvement to 10+ years ago but the recent spike from just 2-3 years ago is almost completely due to the shoe technology. New training/coaching and indoor tracks and other things has been around for a few years or more.It's the shoes..
But it's also the availability of training information. The ability of kids to connect with remote coaching year round. The influx of opportunities for kids to run on FAST courses in XC. The growth in high level opportunities on brand-new tracks indoors. The increase in year-round training. The "Milesplit effect" where every kid is obsessed with times, leading to more willing to push their limits to run fast. The increase in attention to high-level performances that social media provides. More connected coaches with more access to information than ever before. . .
Penn State meet tonight perfect example of this with 6 at this indoor meet. Villanova had 3 go not just under 4 sub 3:58. We all know what shoes they were wearing. It reminds me so much of the tech suits swimmers were wearing 15(?) years ago when all records were being crushed weekly and then they ended up banning them.I saw something last summer that since the carbon fiber shoe/spikes introduction the number of college sub 4 miles has exploded.
I agree. These shoes are making a mockery of trying to compare this era's runners to others.
An indoor meet at Boston yesterday for college and post-collegiate athletes. 52 men broke 4:00 for the mile.Sorry, but shoes are making a mockery.
I read that this morning. Wild. The new shoes are dropping 4:05-4:07 runners under 4 minutes now. It appears to be aiding men a little more than women. I'm wondering if this has to do with the fact that men have a higher average body weight and are able to get a better response from the shoe design than women are. Time and data will tell.An indoor meet at Boston yesterday for college and post-collegiate athletes. 52 men broke 4:00 for the mile.
As a side note on miling, you all missed one of the great all-time duals. Mike Hallabrin (Mansfield Malabar / Miami U.) vs. Jeff Johnson (Yellow Springs / U. of Cincinnati). Crowd going wild with both teams driving them on over the Armory Fieldhouse's old 4-turn, 188yd track in February of 1984. Jeff trailed / drove Mike the entire way to an incredible 4:04.4 to 4:05.5 win for Hallabrin on that small, tight track. Hard to describe just how much energy was in the fieldhouse that night watching that race. I can still feel the energy all these years later.
If that race had been on a banked, 200m track with today's shoes, definitely.And probably 3:55-3:56 or faster on the modern tracks with the new shoes
I read that this morning. Wild. The new shoes are dropping 4:05-4:07 runners under 4 minutes now. It appears to be aiding men a little more than women. I'm wondering if this has to do with the fact that men have a higher average body weight and are able to get a better response from the shoe design than women are. Time and data will tell.
I read that the Bearcats (GO BEARCATS) got their first ever sub-4:00 runner last weekend. Tyler Wirth ran 3:59.89 at Notre Dame last weekend for 6th in that meet.
T&F News has updated their list of all sub-4:00 minute guys and sub-4:30 women in the U.S. The guys' list has exploded after the past couple years.
The U.S. Sub-4:00 Miler's Club (Chronologically) - Track & Field News
ALTHOUGH THE MILE is rarely run outside the United States, it remains an immensely popular distance for Americans, particularly indoors.... Read Moretrackandfieldnews.com
Sub-4 / Sub-4:30 - Mile History
Return the Mile to prominence on the American sports and cultural landscape by elevating, celebrating and creating a Mile Movement.bringbackthemile.com
The "science" that exists in the papers I've read say 1-4% benefit from a mechanical standpoint. Not all runners will get the same benefit as their foot striking mechanics are not the same.My personal opinion based on observations in practice and meets is that we have kids running much faster in races in the new spikes than you would expect based on what they are capable of doing in practice compared to kids in the past in the 1600 and 3200. No question in my mind that the spike technology is a 5-7% improvement.
Do runner even wear them for XC? I thought they all just wore "regular" spikes for reasons you mentioned.The "science" that exists in the papers I've read say 1-4% benefit from a mechanical standpoint. Not all runners will get the same benefit as their foot striking mechanics are not the same.
For the high schools runners, I think the tell will be comparing XC and track times (which is not easy to begin with). I'm not sure that you get the shoe benefit in XC because of the uneven surface and surface elasticity properties you would get in track.
College kids wear them for XC and the time comparisons on the same courses are drastically faster. One of the regions had 70-80 runners within 15 seconds of the previous course record with dozens under. i am working from memory so I may not have it exactly right but it was mind-boggling faster. Some were wearing the road shoes in 10K on the track due to excessive benefit compared to spikes, but that has since been banned.Do runner even wear them for XC? I thought they all just wore "regular" spikes for reasons you mentioned.
I would require some hard proof in XC. Yes, on hard surfaces the shoes could provide a benefit, but on bermuda grass with some give, not so much.College kids wear them for XC and the time comparisons on the same courses are drastically faster. One of the regions had 70-80 runners within 15 seconds of the previous course record with dozens under. i am working from memory so I may not have it exactly right but it was mind-boggling faster. Some were wearing the road shoes in 10K on the track due to excessive benefit compared to spikes, but that has since been banned.
Whether it is college or HS, historical comparisons are pretty much obsolete at this point. Much like the buoyancy swimsuits a few years ago that they introduced then banned because a historical comparison had become irrelevant.
My concern is will low income school districts fade from view in HS track as many cannot afford the $250-$350 shoes?
Not sure the level of training hasn't improved over the past few years. I think COVID really allowed some deeper dives on-line. The shoes may be a component, but there are some new approaches to training that have trickled down into HS that may explain some of this as well.That is all true if comparing improvement to 10+ years ago but the recent spike from just 2-3 years ago is almost completely due to the shoe technology. New training/coaching and indoor tracks and other things has been around for a few years or more.
On a dry course with short grass I am sure the shoes would be a big help. I wonder how much help they would be on a muddy course or one with tall grass or very uneven surface? I know Oberlin has a good portion of course on mulch I would think that would decrease the help the new shoes give.College kids wear them for XC and the time comparisons on the same courses are drastically faster. One of the regions had 70-80 runners within 15 seconds of the previous course record with dozens under. i am working from memory so I may not have it exactly right but it was mind-boggling faster. Some were wearing the road shoes in 10K on the track due to excessive benefit compared to spikes, but that has since been banned.
Whether it is college or HS, historical comparisons are pretty much obsolete at this point. Much like the buoyancy swimsuits a few years ago that they introduced then banned because a historical comparison had become irrelevant.
My concern is will low income school districts fade from view in HS track as many cannot afford the $250-$350 shoes?
What would be an example of these "new approaches to training?" What training improvements have you seen?Not sure the level of training hasn't improved over the past few years. I think COVID really allowed some deeper dives on-line. The shoes may be a component, but there are some new approaches to training that have trickled down into HS that may explain some of this as well.