Status of 2007 Herbie

B

Bordertown

New member
Heard that McDonald's was not renewing the sponsorship of the Classic. Rumor on a Texas Board (National Board) was travel reimbursement for out of state participants was in question. I doubt many of the schools (ie Evangel) can come without financial reimbursement. What is being said in Ohio?

While the classic is great in concept, I am not sure it generates the interest necessary to support the cost. My experience is based on the Texas High participation last fall. I heard Texas High had a $40,000 travel allowance (which did not cover all the costs). The game attracted fewer than 1,000. I doubt the later Colerain/O'Hara game attracted 6,000.

Personally I think the sponsors "grew" too quickly in having 7 games. Personally 3 or 4 games at one location on a Saturday might would be better. While it is great to have "name teams", I think the out of state teams need to travel. That is a difficult task for a high school team. I Texas I think their are only a handful of quality teams that could bring 1,000 to the Herbie due to the affluency of their community (Southlake Carroll, Highland Park, Austin Westlake, & The Woodlands).

The end result might be the Herbie is based on play with neighboring states and one "marque" matchup such as DLS vs Colerain.
 
 
There are several threads about the 2007 Herbie on the Yappi Ohio board. The Herbie is over (at least as it was last year).
 
Massillon withs ohios biggest fan base has just dropped the herby so it def wont be around next season
 
Is SLC vs. Miami Northwestern in DFW still on?

Without Massillon there, will anyone in Texas even want to go to the game?

The Herbie may not happen, but I didn't realize that Massillon could drag it down by itself. The only reason I even heard of Massillon before looking at this board is because I read the book on the 1980 Moeller season, and they beat Massillon 30-7 for the state championship (Massillon scored right at the end, by the way). Massillon has never even won a state playoff title. On the other hand, there have only been state playoffs in Ohio for 35 seasons.

Massillon is currently the SLC of, well, Massillon, Ohio.
 
Chicago said:
Is SLC vs. Miami Northwestern in DFW still on?

Without Massillon there, will anyone in Texas even want to go to the game?

The Herbie may not happen, but I didn't realize that Massillon could drag it down by itself. The only reason I even heard of Massillon before looking at this board is because I read the book on the 1980 Moeller season, and they beat Massillon 30-7 for the state championship (Massillon scored right at the end, by the way). Massillon has never even won a state playoff title. On the other hand, there have only been state playoffs in Ohio for 35 seasons.

Massillon is currently the SLC of, well, Massillon, Ohio.
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Hey Chicago...What are you obsessed with SLC or something?!
 
murphy13 said:
Massillon withs ohios biggest fan base has just dropped the herby so it def wont be around next season
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Cincy could have one themselves, which is what they should have done in the first place. Outside of Massillon no one up in the north brings enough fans to support and event like this. If they keep it to 4-5 games in one day in Cincy it would work. Anything other than that, a la last year, will fail.
 
Chicago said:
Is SLC vs. Miami Northwestern in DFW still on?

Without Massillon there, will anyone in Texas even want to go to the game?

The Herbie may not happen, but I didn't realize that Massillon could drag it down by itself. The only reason I even heard of Massillon before looking at this board is because I read the book on the 1980 Moeller season, and they beat Massillon 30-7 for the state championship (Massillon scored right at the end, by the way). Massillon has never even won a state playoff title. On the other hand, there have only been state playoffs in Ohio for 35 seasons.

Massillon is currently the SLC of, well, Massillon, Ohio.
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hey the Massillon site was the only one that made a profit...
so you were saying? i could careless what rock you lived under concerning ohio high school football im sorry if you ignore the fact that they have won more games on the field than any other not to mention near the top in regional titles. so your going to tell me Massillon dropping out wouldnt cripple it?
 
BuckeyeJon2006 said:
Cincy could have one themselves, which is what they should have done in the first place. Outside of Massillon no one up in the north brings enough fans to support and event like this. If they keep it to 4-5 games in one day in Cincy it would work. Anything other than that, a la last year, will fail.
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i agree with you there about maybe only 4-5 teams thing
but on the fan issue i think mck draws a pretty nice crowd aswell when expected to do well
 
Chicago said:
Are some games in Ohio not played on the field?
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what are you talking about? they have won more games than anyone in ohio and i believe are in the top 5 nationally in win total so yeah get your facts straight for once and stop making it up as you go
 
You said "they have won more games on the field than any other."

I was wondering why you qualified it. That's all.
 
"what are you talking about? they have won more games than anyone in ohio and i believe are in the top 5 nationally in win total so yeah get your facts straight for once and stop making it up as you go"

:clap: Hello Mcfly... let's loosen the belt a little bit.
 
BuckeyeJon2006 said:
Cincy could have one themselves, which is what they should have done in the first place. Outside of Massillon no one up in the north brings enough fans to support and event like this. If they keep it to 4-5 games in one day in Cincy it would work. Anything other than that, a la last year, will fail.
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Not true.

The Canton McKinley vs North Canton Hoover game was played the same night as the Herbie, and that game drew a bigger crowd.

Remember that most of the better NEO football teams are in leagues, and just can't fill the Herbie schedule at the last minute. As a matter of fact, St Ignatius is an independent school but their AD said that they will NOT attend the Herbie. Of the remaining independent football programs in NEO, that leaves just Eds and Massillon.
 
Blacknblue said:
Not true.

The Canton McKinley vs North Canton Hoover game was played the same night as the Herbie, and that game drew a bigger crowd.

Remember that most of the better NEO football teams are in leagues, and just can't fill the Herbie schedule at the last minute. As a matter of fact, St Ignatius is an independent school but their AD said that they will NOT attend the Herbie. Of the remaining independent football programs in NEO, that leaves just Eds and Massillon.
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I forgot about Mckinley, I was only talking about the teams who were in the Herbie last year and forgot Mckinley wasn't in it. Ignatius and Ed's don't have big enough fan bases though, maybe during Iggy's hay day in the 90's, but recently no. When I went up to Cleveland for the X Iggy game 2 years ago X brought more fans then them. If they could get just Mckinley and Massillon at one site together (that could get ugly) then that could be succesful. Realistically though too many games were scheduled for last year which piled up the travel expenses. Not to mention spreading out the Cincy games to 3 sessions it really hurt neutral fans from attending. If they're going to make another one then they really need to fix some things if they intend to make it sucessful.
 
How Many at the Herbie???

Bordertown said:
Heard that McDonald's was not renewing the sponsorship of the Classic. Rumor on a Texas Board (National Board) was travel reimbursement for out of state participants was in question. I doubt many of the schools (ie Evangel) can come without financial reimbursement. What is being said in Ohio?

While the classic is great in concept, I am not sure it generates the interest necessary to support the cost. My experience is based on the Texas High participation last fall. I heard Texas High had a $40,000 travel allowance (which did not cover all the costs). The game attracted fewer than 1,000. I doubt the later Colerain/O'Hara game attracted 6,000.

Personally I think the sponsors "grew" too quickly in having 7 games. Personally 3 or 4 games at one location on a Saturday might would be better. While it is great to have "name teams", I think the out of state teams need to travel. That is a difficult task for a high school team. I Texas I think their are only a handful of quality teams that could bring 1,000 to the Herbie due to the affluency of their community (Southlake Carroll, Highland Park, Austin Westlake, & The Woodlands).

The end result might be the Herbie is based on play with neighboring states and one "marque" matchup such as DLS vs Colerain.
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Bordertown, did you mean that Texas had less than 100 supporters who traveled? I was there, and that Tex game was the first game Fri eve. I would est that at the beginning, there were at least 6K in the house, and it grew steadily, with the Collerain sea of red arriving. I would est that eventually, there were betw 15 and 20 in the house. Same deal the next day. Byrnes people told us they traveled about 3200 people. We at DLS traveled over 1000 people.
 
Plaindriver said:
Bordertown, did you mean that Texas had less than 100 supporters who traveled? I was there, and that Tex game was the first game Fri eve. I would est that at the beginning, there were at least 6K in the house, and it grew steadily, with the Collerain sea of red arriving. I would est that eventually, there were betw 15 and 20 in the house. Same deal the next day. Byrnes people told us they traveled about 3200 people. We at DLS traveled over 1000 people.
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15 to 20,000 for the Colerain vs. Tyler Lee game?... I don't think it was... but maybe somebody could find the numbers? :shrug: :help: :shrug:

I was thinking more around 10 to 15,000 myself.
 
I would estimate Texas High had 150, Findlay 600 to 700, and maybe 200 neutral spectators. I was at the game. At the end of the first half, the Colerain supporters arrived. The Colerain game started late so at the end of the first game all the sea of red was in the stadium. No way there were 15,000 for the Colerain game. Nippert holds 35,000. The upper deck which seats 7,000 was not used. The press box side which had Findlay for the first game and Colerain's opponent never had more than 1,000. No one sat in either endzone which I would estimate to be 40% of available seats (12,000). The Texas High/Colerain side 60% at the end of the Texas High game between the 10s. Look at the Nippert seating chart. http://gobearcats.cstv.com/facilities/cinn-facilities-nippert-seating.html I would estimate there are 8,000 seats on either side of the field between the goal lines in the lower deck. I doubt there were any more than 7,000 at the peak of the two games.

My point is the 200 neutral spectators at the early game. I have no doubt the fans of the Cinci schools supported their teams, but the casual high school fans did not show up. Cinci as a city did not embrace the event.

If there were two games on Saturday of say DLS vs Colerain and Lakeland vs St X, I think they would have had more drama. As honored as Texas High was in playing in the Herbie, they were not a drawing card in Ohio other than a catchy name that would draw ire in the "whose state is better debate". They were not SLC or Lufkin, who have a more national reputation. Those 1,000 that attended were able to see arguably the best high school quarterback in the country (Exhibit "A" - Army All American game) in Ryan Mallett. Ohio fans would have had an opportunity to see the quarterback that will be bombing the Buckeyes starting in 2008. Likewise Springdale was like Tyler Lee the year before - a shell of the prior year's team.
 
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Bordertown said:
I would estimate Texas High had 150, Findlay 600 to 700, and maybe 200 neutral spectators. I was at the game. At the end of the first half, the Colerain supporters arrived. The Colerain game started late so at the end of the first game all the sea of red was in the stadium. No way there were 15,000 for the Colerain game. Nippert holds 35,000. The upper deck which seats 7,000 was not used. The press box side which had Findlay for the first game and Colerain's opponent never had more than 1,000. No one sat in either endzone which I would estimate to be 40% of available seats (12,000). The Texas High/Colerain side 60% at the end of the Texas High game between the 10s. Look at the Nippert seating chart. http://gobearcats.cstv.com/facilities/cinn-facilities-nippert-seating.html I would estimate there are 8,000 seats on either side of the field between the goal lines in the lower deck. I doubt there were any more than 7,000 at the peak of the two games.

My point is the 200 neutral spectators at the early game. I have no doubt the fans of the Cinci schools supported their teams, but the casual high school fans did not show up. Cinci as a city did not embrace the event.

If there were two games on Saturday of say DLS vs Colerain and Lakeland vs St X, I think they would have had more drama. As honored as Texas High was in playing in the Herbie, they were not a drawing card in Ohio other than a catchy name that would draw ire in the "whose state is better debate". They were not SLC or Lufkin, who have a more national reputation. Those 1,000 that attended were able to see arguably the best high school quarterback in the country (Exhibit "A" - Army All American game) in Ryan Mallett. Ohio fans would have had an opportunity to see the quarterback that will be bombing the Buckeyes starting in 2008. Likewise Springdale was like Tyler Lee the year before - a shell of the prior year's team.
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Border, maybe youre more accurate. Aint sure, but havent any ammo to argue with. I do know that 8 other DLS supporters and myself enjoyed all 6 games at Nippert. I was under the impression that Nippert holds close to 50K, but youre prob correct. I think security had the upper deck off limits. Sat definately had bigger crowds. We all split right after the X game to get some dinner, and ret during the 3rd qtr of the Bosco came. The mgt cleared the house after the X game anyways. (We all bought our tix early, so the Herb folks sent us all tix for both sessions on Sat.)
In retro, I think the mgmt shoulda just let all those who wanted to just hang for the late games on Sat. Woulda looked better in the photos if the stands were more loaded.
Are you sure you dont think there were at least 15K in the house for the Collerain-Ohara game?
 
I never saw any attendence figures but I would be shocked if there were more than 10k for both Friday night sessions (I am thinking 7k for the two games). Which side did you sit (Texas High/Colerain or the Findlay/Ohara? I can see if you thought Nippert held 50k how you would have thought 15k. But I checked the U of Cinci website on the capacity.

I really thought it was a nice venue to watch a high school game.

I think maybe they should have had a day pass. I think they probably felt they needed to clear the stadium for the Ohio team seating. If folks from an early game had stayed put, the crowd for the 3rd game would have been unhappy sitting at the 30. I don't think it would have been an issue. If Herbie got a cut of the concessions, it would have made alot of sense.
 
Bordertown said:
I never saw any attendence figures but I would be shocked if there were more than 10k for both Friday night sessions (I am thinking 7k for the two games). Which side did you sit (Texas High/Colerain or the Findlay/Ohara? I can see if you thought Nippert held 50k how you would have thought 15k. But I checked the U of Cinci website on the capacity.

I really thought it was a nice venue to watch a high school game.

I think maybe they should have had a day pass. I think they probably felt they needed to clear the stadium for the Ohio team seating. If folks from an early game had stayed put, the crowd for the 3rd game would have been unhappy sitting at the 30. I don't think it would have been an issue. If Herbie got a cut of the concessions, it would have made alot of sense.
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On Fri, we sat on the Collerain side for both ames. As I remember, they would switch the Ohio teams from one side to the other, alternately. Game 1, Findley had the 'press box' side, game 2, Collerain had the opposite side, Moe had the PB side, as did Centerville. X and Elder had the non-PB side. On Sat, we sat with the Moe folks (fine people), then after several minutes with the obnoxious Lakeland crowd, and those annoying air horns, we reloc to the X side, and were made to feel right at home, even tho we were sporting some DLS apparel/hats. Then For the rest of the Centerville affair, and all the nitecap, we stayed on the PB side. The sun was brutal for the Lakeland people. For the Fri games, and the X games, we were in the uppermost row very close to the 50. For the Elder game, we were maybe 10 rows down from the uppermost seats, and betw the 45-50. I also spent most of the third Q on the field, using a friends press pass. I was extremely impressed with the Elder crowd and their people. We actually visited their campus and stadium Fri prior to the first game. The JV/Frosh coaches took us into their weight room and their offices. Very cordial and hospitable. We were wearing the DLS garb. Everyone in Ohio treated us with respect and dignity. We had a wonderful time. Saw some great football. Two games were instant classics (Moe and X) We all thought Moe got hosed on the XP call where Byrnes was creditied with what surely was a missed XP.
If I ws to rank the teams I saw at the Herbie: 1. Collerain 2. Lakeland and X (tie);3. DLS 4.Byrnes & Moe (tie) 5. Tex 6.Bosco 7.Elder 8. Findley 9,Ohara & Centerville (tie)
Hope it happens again this yr, especially since its sched for 2 wks prior to DLS opener. I would really like to att the event again.
 
Friday night you sat right above my seats, probably 10 rows down. Curious on Texas High #5. Did you see the entire Texas High/Findlay game or arrive late. If I recall Texas High 400 yard offense at half time and shut it down the second half. Not contesting your opinion, just wondering if you saw the entire game?
 
Plaindriver said:
On Fri, we sat on the Collerain side for both ames. As I remember, they would switch the Ohio teams from one side to the other, alternately. Game 1, Findley had the 'press box' side, game 2, Collerain had the opposite side, Moe had the PB side, as did Centerville. X and Elder had the non-PB side. On Sat, we sat with the Moe folks (fine people), then after several minutes with the obnoxious Lakeland crowd, and those annoying air horns, we reloc to the X side, and were made to feel right at home, even tho we were sporting some DLS apparel/hats. Then For the rest of the Centerville affair, and all the nitecap, we stayed on the PB side. The sun was brutal for the Lakeland people. For the Fri games, and the X games, we were in the uppermost row very close to the 50. For the Elder game, we were maybe 10 rows down from the uppermost seats, and betw the 45-50. I also spent most of the third Q on the field, using a friends press pass. I was extremely impressed with the Elder crowd and their people. We actually visited their campus and stadium Fri prior to the first game. The JV/Frosh coaches took us into their weight room and their offices. Very cordial and hospitable. We were wearing the DLS garb. Everyone in Ohio treated us with respect and dignity. We had a wonderful time. Saw some great football. Two games were instant classics (Moe and X) We all thought Moe got hosed on the XP call where Byrnes was creditied with what surely was a missed XP.
If I ws to rank the teams I saw at the Herbie: 1. Collerain 2. Lakeland and X (tie);3. DLS 4.Byrnes & Moe (tie) 5. Tex 6.Bosco 7.Elder 8. Findley 9,Ohara & Centerville (tie)
Hope it happens again this yr, especially since its sched for 2 wks prior to DLS opener. I would really like to att the event again.
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to bad cant take the lakeland noise. Who gives a you know what. And how do you leave DBP off of that list. The game was supposed give the feel of a home game even tho we were 1200 miles. So air horned away we did.
 
I thought the Xavier, Moeller, Don Bosco, Centerville, DLS, and Elder fans were all very well behaved.

I thought the Byrnes fans were bad (especially the moron in the straw hat or whatever it was prancing around the sideline -- it would have been worth flying to South Carolina for their last playoff game just to see him crying).

And the Lakeland fans were a joke. I went in kind of torn between rooting for Lakeland or rooting for Xavier. We sat on the Xavier sideline to get a little shade, such as it was. It took me about three minutes to start rooting for Xavier. And by the end I detested Lakeland. I couldn't stand the air horns and the sack dances and all that stuff (and my favorite player of all time is Deion Sanders, so I'm not exactly a saint when it comes to that stuff).

My favorite part was when a note went up on the scoreboard saying noisemakers were not allowed. And the Xavier student section started yelling "read the sign." And then the Lakeland fans used the air horns again. And then the Xavier student section started yelling "you can't read." I thought that was pretty funny, and my standards for funny are pretty high.

Having a group of Lakeland football players throw a Coke can next to me after I walked by when they were hanging out after the game on that open concourse they have there was a nice touch, by the way.
 
naughty said:
to bad cant take the lakeland noise. Who gives a you know what. And how do you leave DBP off of that list. The game was supposed give the feel of a home game even tho we were 1200 miles. So air horned away we did.
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Well, how can you be so sure that all those within, say 1500', will equally enjoy your 'air horned-ing' away?? Ever thought about being considerate of your fellow man? Kinda like the people who drive on the streets at 0300, with the amped up exterior speakers pounding, boom-boom. Very inconsiderate.
 
Bordertown said:
Friday night you sat right above my seats, probably 10 rows down. Curious on Texas High #5. Did you see the entire Texas High/Findlay game or arrive late. If I recall Texas High 400 yard offense at half time and shut it down the second half. Not contesting your opinion, just wondering if you saw the entire game?
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Yessir, we were there for the beginning of that game. We were rather impressed with the Findley QB. Had tree stumps for legs. Wasnt impressed when Tx reinserted their starters, and were heaving 40 yd bombs in the final seconds. I guess they were equally concerned with the spread as much as the W. After the game, we thought Tx was really something, but as the games progressed, IMHO, I thought I saw several teams better than Tex. Just my opinion. Im a fan, not an expert!
 
Fair enough. I think our defense was a bit porous myself. I hope you understood the dynamics of the 40 yard bombs. The Texas High coach got pissed at the Findlay coach your continuing to onsides kicks to run up the score against scrubs (not once but twice). I don't think Norton (Texas High coach) had a problem with the Findlay starters in the game late, but the offsides kicks. In Texas in a game like that everyone plays hard, but you just play out the game.

I too was impress by the Findlay QB and kicker. But I seriously wondered about the Findlay coach keeping him in the game. Twice he went to the carpet and you wondered if he would get up.
 
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