Springfield Wrestling
- Thread starter MAROON&GOLDBLOOD
- Start date
Chinwip,
I guess I'd just like to ask, that you talk to the people within the Wrestling program, again if you have to, state your concerns and find out the direction they are going. They went through a big change last year and now that many of the kinks have been worked out, I'd think it will get better. I don't think that anyone would agree with you, that 2 youth Wrestling programs is good for us. Talk to them in a mature manner, offer suggestions and/or offer help to make things better for the kids, but don't degrade them in public if they don't input all of your suggestions immediately.
I can tell you, purchasing unis/singlets is no easy matter for any youth group so I applaud them for that. My guess is, next year are more things in store. jmo
I guess I'd just like to ask, that you talk to the people within the Wrestling program, again if you have to, state your concerns and find out the direction they are going. They went through a big change last year and now that many of the kinks have been worked out, I'd think it will get better. I don't think that anyone would agree with you, that 2 youth Wrestling programs is good for us. Talk to them in a mature manner, offer suggestions and/or offer help to make things better for the kids, but don't degrade them in public if they don't input all of your suggestions immediately.
I can tell you, purchasing unis/singlets is no easy matter for any youth group so I applaud them for that. My guess is, next year are more things in store. jmo
chinwhip
Active member
cant tell if you mistyped or not but I dont think two wrestling teams is good for us. Lets all just hope for a name brand guy who knows more than my 9 year old. Although wrestling is not so much a team sport (more induvidual) we have enough youth talent to contend for a youth state title, but all the kids have "jumped ship" and thats a shame...
OK here is my 2 cents on the youth wrestling...
Mat rooms should be split between allstars and varsity/fighting for varsity kids there is no doubt, they can warm up and drill (to a degree) together but when its time to go live and work takedowns and moves they need split, no reason that a kid who has wrestled for years and is expected to go deep into districts or states should have to work/beat-up a first year kid it absolutely hurts the experienced wrestler more than it helps the newer wrestlers who also can be discouraged by a nightly beating at practice and thus has no fun and does not come back... I being involved with the program in the past not as a coach but as a parent who spent years working in concessions and all that mat moving crap that goes on to hold a tourney to raise funds for the kids thinks the varsity-allstar split should of happened years ago the better programs all do it because it works.
I know little of whats going on in the program now but hear things from family that is still there, a powerstruggle is the last thing the program needs lots of experienced good wrestlers are leaving to wrestle elsewhere and that opens the floodgates for those kids to leave Springfield. Let the HC make the decisions and live with them.
I know chinwhip and I know the people running the youth wrestling program, all are good people but as Irish said there is a division in this community for what ever reason and it just kills me because lets be honest when we were all kids here we had each others backs here in Springfield as the kids do now but as adults we just seem to stab each others backs and it makes me sick.... it has happened to me with my daughter in SLAA and I still cant get her to play softball again (her best sport IMO) because of that kind of back stabbing see my letter to the editor Suburbanite in 08'...
ha!
this township needs a cultural change but I dont know how to make that happen I think about it more than I probably should its frustrating... IMHO the only thing that can bring Springfield together is winning. look what a whopping 6-4 season did for thm last year... hope was back for a short time and the community was coming out to support the team. call me ignorant call me a bad person but damit I am tired of losing and so are the kids they should not expect to lose because they are from Springfield but sometimes I think they do expect it.
Mat rooms should be split between allstars and varsity/fighting for varsity kids there is no doubt, they can warm up and drill (to a degree) together but when its time to go live and work takedowns and moves they need split, no reason that a kid who has wrestled for years and is expected to go deep into districts or states should have to work/beat-up a first year kid it absolutely hurts the experienced wrestler more than it helps the newer wrestlers who also can be discouraged by a nightly beating at practice and thus has no fun and does not come back... I being involved with the program in the past not as a coach but as a parent who spent years working in concessions and all that mat moving crap that goes on to hold a tourney to raise funds for the kids thinks the varsity-allstar split should of happened years ago the better programs all do it because it works.
I know little of whats going on in the program now but hear things from family that is still there, a powerstruggle is the last thing the program needs lots of experienced good wrestlers are leaving to wrestle elsewhere and that opens the floodgates for those kids to leave Springfield. Let the HC make the decisions and live with them.
I know chinwhip and I know the people running the youth wrestling program, all are good people but as Irish said there is a division in this community for what ever reason and it just kills me because lets be honest when we were all kids here we had each others backs here in Springfield as the kids do now but as adults we just seem to stab each others backs and it makes me sick.... it has happened to me with my daughter in SLAA and I still cant get her to play softball again (her best sport IMO) because of that kind of back stabbing see my letter to the editor Suburbanite in 08'...
ha!this township needs a cultural change but I dont know how to make that happen I think about it more than I probably should its frustrating... IMHO the only thing that can bring Springfield together is winning. look what a whopping 6-4 season did for thm last year... hope was back for a short time and the community was coming out to support the team. call me ignorant call me a bad person but damit I am tired of losing and so are the kids they should not expect to lose because they are from Springfield but sometimes I think they do expect it.
chinwhip
Active member
OK here is my 2 cents on the youth wrestling...
Mat rooms should be split between allstars and varsity/fighting for varsity kids there is no doubt, they can warm up and drill (to a degree) together but when its time to go live and work takedowns and moves they need split, no reason that a kid who has wrestled for years and is expected to go deep into districts or states should have to work/beat-up a first year kid it absolutely hurts the experienced wrestler more than it helps the newer wrestlers who also can be discouraged by a nightly beating at practice and thus has no fun and does not come back... I being involved with the program in the past not as a coach but as a parent who spent years working in concessions and all that mat moving crap that goes on to hold a tourney to raise funds for the kids thinks the varsity-allstar split should of happened years ago the better programs all do it because it works.
I know little of whats going on in the program now but hear things from family that is still there, a powerstruggle is the last thing the program needs lots of experienced good wrestlers are leaving to wrestle elsewhere and that opens the floodgates for those kids to leave Springfield. Let the HC make the decisions and live with them.
I know chinwhip and I know the people running the youth wrestling program, all are good people but as Irish said there is a division in this community for what ever reason and it just kills me because lets be honest when we were all kids here we had each others backs here in Springfield as the kids do now but as adults we just seem to stab each others backs and it makes me sick.... it has happened to me with my daughter in SLAA and I still cant get her to play softball again (her best sport IMO) because of that kind of back stabbing see my letter to the editor Suburbanite in 08'...
this township needs a cultural change but I dont know how to make that happen I think about it more than I probably should its frustrating... IMHO the only thing that can bring Springfield together is winning. look what a whopping 6-4 season did for thm last year... hope was back for a short time and the community was coming out to support the team. call me ignorant call me a bad person but damit I am tired of losing and so are the kids they should not expect to lose because they are from Springfield but sometimes I think they do expect it.
VERY WELL PUT 71.
If you are who i think you are, I would certainly love to see mini meatball on the mats next year and possibly in C-bus goin deep on saturday. grade school states are this weekend in youngstown but zach is flat right now, so we will see what happens
thepolster
New member
Never was two. If you are referring to the fantasy wack shack team then yes there was .
Its me JL. Good luck to Zach at Grade School States.
:laugh: Alright, I can't stand it. JL is dead on with the youth program. It was a mess. Those of us that did attempt to have input got slam dunked every time we tried to invest ourselves into the program. I don't feel like the board was objective, open-minded or interested in suggestions or inputs. Seemed like everything was either taken or made personal. CS did a great job having never coached before.
I see some of you, who didn't have kids in the gym, probably finding it hard to believe that it was so dysfunctional, but it was. So much tension. Another year to have to fix imo. Hopefully TL flushes this thing and gets somebody in there that can pull it back together.
Unless you were there, I think anyone on here should hold their comments and critisizm of those who were. This was the worst experience I have ever had in any youth sport program since my sons C-team football coach ran off the field and assulted my brother in law.......
I see some of you, who didn't have kids in the gym, probably finding it hard to believe that it was so dysfunctional, but it was. So much tension. Another year to have to fix imo. Hopefully TL flushes this thing and gets somebody in there that can pull it back together.
Unless you were there, I think anyone on here should hold their comments and critisizm of those who were. This was the worst experience I have ever had in any youth sport program since my sons C-team football coach ran off the field and assulted my brother in law.......
I remember that... what a scene at Mogadore right? I wont comment on the youth wrestling anymore because I had an absolute pleasent experiance when I was there but JC was there then and he was the leader nobody questioned (even ED) his decisions or way of doing things he got the job done. the kids had fun, worked hard and learned the basics sounds like they need him back he is a great silent type leader.
I'll assume this comment was directed at me so I'll respond. My comments were to offer suggestions on the mature and professional way to handle your frustrations. Its your choice on how you want to handle things, but I can tell you, nothing will get solved by posting crap on a message board. Just saying. All it does is give our community a bad name. But, whatever.....I tried.
So how do you get the right guy in there, and keep him there? I can say that I don't believe that person is currently in the system. We have a very young HS team, some talent in the Jr Hi and this year 7 district/2 state qualifiers at the youth gym. Get JL's boy back and thats another one. Not all of the kids that followed ES to StV,Garfield,Hoban are going to stay there. They will come back to Springfield, and they will need to be coached at a high level. These kids will bring a lot to the program. Is the program prepared to keep these kids challenged? Am I the only one that thinks about this stuff, or do we think we can send kids to states working 1/2 nelsons and single leg dumps for the whole practice.
The Dark Hawks gym at Sawyerwood has some very high level instruction happening, along with work ethic, academic expectations, and an emphasis on all the things we want our kids to develop to become leaders on and off the mats. I just don't understand why this community based effort was attacked and turned into some kind of threat. I realize the timing of it was a little inconvenient, but do we want our kids running to StV or Hoban to get additional experience, or do we want to try to keep these kids in this community. I don't think there is another community around that has access to something like this. We actually have kids from other programs coming HERE!! In this gym OUR kids are the focus, not some wrestling partner/dummy for the other kid.
I have been solicited many times for my son to come wrestle for the AG's. I say no more. I'm tired of watching it happen. We now have in our community the ability to bridge the seasonal programs at all levels for our kids. Lets take advantage of it.
I also think these kids are going to have a higher expectation of themselves, which will bleed into their seasonal programs. I would hate to see them feeling like they are taking a step backward when the wrestling season starts. I think these kids really feel like they are part of something great. Isn't that what we are striving for? Or do we want them to accept mediocraty? (that's a rhetorical question of course)
The Dark Hawks gym offers a unique opportunity for the HS, JrHi, and youth wrestlers to work out in the same gym, for a common program, and develop interest in each other. The open tournaments offer age and weight classes for everyone, and when the team competes, the little guys love seeing the bigger kids from THEIR team wrestling. I think the HS wrestlers this year were encouraged to get involved with the youth, and I love that concept. It really motivates the younger ones, like putting on your C-team jersey and going to the HS football games.
We really really need to get the right person/people involved. Sorry to see CS leaving, but happy for him to start a new chapter in his life. I believe he had the wrestling skill set to do the job. Watching him go from a wrestler to a coach was cool to see. The kids respect a man with his name on the State Placers board.
So where does it go from here. I don't think it can move forward with the current structure, and I was a HUGE advocate for setting it up this way. I thought it would take the pressure off the young coach, and create a checks and balances system, where no one person was overwhelmed with responsibility. I mean, football, baseball/softball leagues operate this way, right, so why wouldn't it be the way to go with this? Right game, wrong players maybe? I do believe that it needs a ton of attention, and those that were involved hopefully are able to step back and see maybe how they could have done things differently to keep it from getting to the point that it did. It's funny that EVERYONE says they're in it for the kids, but EVERYONE seems to have different opinions on what that is. I think harmony would be a good place to start.
GO SPARTANS!!!!!
The Dark Hawks gym at Sawyerwood has some very high level instruction happening, along with work ethic, academic expectations, and an emphasis on all the things we want our kids to develop to become leaders on and off the mats. I just don't understand why this community based effort was attacked and turned into some kind of threat. I realize the timing of it was a little inconvenient, but do we want our kids running to StV or Hoban to get additional experience, or do we want to try to keep these kids in this community. I don't think there is another community around that has access to something like this. We actually have kids from other programs coming HERE!! In this gym OUR kids are the focus, not some wrestling partner/dummy for the other kid.
I have been solicited many times for my son to come wrestle for the AG's. I say no more. I'm tired of watching it happen. We now have in our community the ability to bridge the seasonal programs at all levels for our kids. Lets take advantage of it.
I also think these kids are going to have a higher expectation of themselves, which will bleed into their seasonal programs. I would hate to see them feeling like they are taking a step backward when the wrestling season starts. I think these kids really feel like they are part of something great. Isn't that what we are striving for? Or do we want them to accept mediocraty? (that's a rhetorical question of course)
The Dark Hawks gym offers a unique opportunity for the HS, JrHi, and youth wrestlers to work out in the same gym, for a common program, and develop interest in each other. The open tournaments offer age and weight classes for everyone, and when the team competes, the little guys love seeing the bigger kids from THEIR team wrestling. I think the HS wrestlers this year were encouraged to get involved with the youth, and I love that concept. It really motivates the younger ones, like putting on your C-team jersey and going to the HS football games.
We really really need to get the right person/people involved. Sorry to see CS leaving, but happy for him to start a new chapter in his life. I believe he had the wrestling skill set to do the job. Watching him go from a wrestler to a coach was cool to see. The kids respect a man with his name on the State Placers board.
So where does it go from here. I don't think it can move forward with the current structure, and I was a HUGE advocate for setting it up this way. I thought it would take the pressure off the young coach, and create a checks and balances system, where no one person was overwhelmed with responsibility. I mean, football, baseball/softball leagues operate this way, right, so why wouldn't it be the way to go with this? Right game, wrong players maybe? I do believe that it needs a ton of attention, and those that were involved hopefully are able to step back and see maybe how they could have done things differently to keep it from getting to the point that it did. It's funny that EVERYONE says they're in it for the kids, but EVERYONE seems to have different opinions on what that is. I think harmony would be a good place to start.
GO SPARTANS!!!!!
nice post LFD lots of info I had no clue about about the Dark Hawks waht days are their practices?... Springfield has a great wrestling history (really) and I'm hoping and doing what I can with wrestlers currently not participating at HS that I have direct contact with to get them back into it I am for sure that my son will be returning to the team next year and I working on another one who can be a key to success. I hope it returns with all the young kids all returning to wrestle for SHS if that happens we should see some nice things happening for the HS program in the next couple years..
headhunter34
New member
The wrestling program will be fine. Its great to see the enthusiasm in the sport but dividing a program when the times are tough are not in the best interest of Spartan athletics.
The case in which Sawyerwood school is playing a part in helping the children in the community is fine to a point. I hope the issues concerning the safety and the financial situation is taken seriously and not misleading the community.
Do your homework!!!!!! Don't forget, Springfield starts new construction this spring.
The case in which Sawyerwood school is playing a part in helping the children in the community is fine to a point. I hope the issues concerning the safety and the financial situation is taken seriously and not misleading the community.
Do your homework!!!!!! Don't forget, Springfield starts new construction this spring.
Ok, help me understand something since I am not involved. The Youth Wrestling Program decided to create more structure in its Program by implementing checks and balances, correct? This was totally new to the program. As with anything, it takes time to work out the kinks and really see the progress being made. Why is it, everyone wants to scrap this already? What solutions do people have to offer? We can all sit here and say we want to keep kids from leaving, but what are the answers to that? It just seems, everyone is on different pages and yet nobody can come up with a solution. Wrestling goes through coaches like an Irishman goes through his Guinness(thought it was fitting 
) HS included. Why dont you start there and work up? Get behind the coach(es) and allow them to give direction on what they would like to see. Or has that already been done?
) HS included. Why dont you start there and work up? Get behind the coach(es) and allow them to give direction on what they would like to see. Or has that already been done?You and anyone else who weren't there. I believe the point was that mature and professional comments and suggestions were made and handled in an immature and unprofessional manner. That's kinda how we got to this point. You imply that you think the parents were the ones that lacked the ability to handle themselves properly, but again, not being there....
Nothing will get solved if we aren't aware of what needs fixed.
headhunter, not sure what this means:
The case in which Sawyerwood school is playing a part in helping the children in the community is fine to a point. I hope the issues concerning the safety and the financial situation is taken seriously and not misleading the community.
Curious of what safety concerns are there. I keep an eye out for that kind of stuff and I'm not seeing anything so far.
The case in which Sawyerwood school is playing a part in helping the children in the community is fine to a point. I hope the issues concerning the safety and the financial situation is taken seriously and not misleading the community.
Curious of what safety concerns are there. I keep an eye out for that kind of stuff and I'm not seeing anything so far.
Ok, help me understand something since I am not involved. The Youth Wrestling Program decided to create more structure in its Program by implementing checks and balances, correct? This was totally new to the program. As with anything, it takes time to work out the kinks and really see the progress being made. Why is it, everyone wants to scrap this already? What solutions do people have to offer? We can all sit here and say we want to keep kids from leaving, but what are the answers to that? It just seems, everyone is on different pages and yet nobody can come up with a solution. Wrestling goes through coaches like an Irishman goes through his Guinness(thought it was fitting
I don't think anyone said they want to scrap the idea of the board. The board WAS the solution that everyone had to offer. In fact I'm the one that suggested it. Knowing that TL had found CS to coach, and knowing how much of a challenge it would be to have to deal with all the administrative/financial/parental/sectional issues and still coach a team of almost 50 6 through 12 year olds, it certainly seemed like the right way to do it. There wasn't 1 guy like a JC that had all the answers that was willing to fill the role, so the board concept was agreed upon. I still think it could work, but it would need to be handled much differently than this year.
Alright, I gotta pack for Grade school states.
A board is only as good as its members. Good luck at Grade School states hope its a long weekend for ya.
Division is not a good thing for many reasons but in this particular sport the HS could be very happy with the end result of so many kids training in so many different rooms and the ultimate result of that. A couple of our past State Champs trained at other programs while in youth (NA). I do feel that all of that can be provided under one Springfield based team and I hope the new school can facilitate the youth program as they do now and dont get all wishy washy about using the facilities, this program is important to the HS team they need to realize that and not look at it as a nuecense(sp).
Here is a jab:
if the Band was having issues like this, things would of already been hashed out, with the school and boosters bringing all resources to bare.
chinwhip
Active member
Ok, help me understand something since I am not involved. The Youth Wrestling Program decided to create more structure in its Program by implementing checks and balances, correct? This was totally new to the program. As with anything, it takes time to work out the kinks and really see the progress being made. Why is it, everyone wants to scrap this already? What solutions do people have to offer? We can all sit here and say we want to keep kids from leaving, but what are the answers to that? It just seems, everyone is on different pages and yet nobody can come up with a solution. Wrestling goes through coaches like an Irishman goes through his Guinness(thought it was fitting
Springfield youth wrestling has ran smoothly without a "board" succesfully for 15 years? Sounds like irish has a horse in the race (maybe a drinking buddy or a personal friend (speculating here)? I can tell you that I hear rumor that T.L is going to scrap the "board". Man i hope so... I can also tell you that the only way Z.L will return to Springfield youth wrestling is if there is an "--- BUSTING" coach that wants to take him to the "promise land" (state champ). That is exactly where he is headed. The kid works way to hard to let a group of parents hold him back. I have heard these "board" members freak out when a head and arm is hit or a 3/4 nelson is taught, "that wont work in high school" is what i hear. Well i watched the iron man at walsh this year and saw the #1 kid in the country win the championship with a head and arm and watched 3 high school matches won with a 3/4 nelson. The point is "sit down in a chair, shut your pie hole and let these kids learn EVERYTHING. the bigger the arsenal the more dangerous the wrestler... As a matter of a fact come to youngstown on sat, and i will promise you that Z.L will win his 1st championship round match with one of those moves (dedicated to the nay sayers). Listen to spartan 71, he has alot of knowledge in the sport and is probably buddies with some of these cats on the board and he will tell you that splitting the room and letting the coach run the show is a must!!! He just has a more politically correct way of putting it (sorry i dont posses those filters). I hope that football is ran better, z wants to play this year and i think he will be a BEAST, but im getting a little nervous... In short, "DOWN WITH THE SYW BOARD"!!! :grouphug:
Listen,
I have no horse in this race. I was simply trying to offer up suggestions on how to express your concerns, without tearing our community apart. Do what you will. My kids don't wrestle and never will so forgive me for trying to help. Good luck.
Spoken like a true gentleman! Why is it that every season in whatever sport that your son or daughter plays in you are involved with a different team or organization? Or, why have I personally heard you say in the middle of a game that you were coaching that you would do whatever it took to win, EVEN IF YOU HAD TO CHEAT!!! If you were so concerned about Springfield maybe you should be one of the people that try to stick around and try to fix things.
spartans87
New member
Easy now fellas. Everyone with an opinion here. Lets try this plan. Let the HS (TL) coach decide how to handle the youth program. I am quite sure he wouldnt care where its ran as long as it is feeding the junior high and high school. As for coaching moves this is my opinion. The arm and head will win some matches in HS. The 3/4 will only work on a bad wrestler in HS. Legs are a mandatory thing to be good at in HS. If you dont believe me watch the good matches and not the preliminaries. You have to be able to get them in and pound the head and control the arms. But most importantly you have to be able to control the lower body of the guy you are wrestling or you will be scrambling all day long. And bad things happen then.
The HS coach has to have the final say no matter who run it or where though. Consult with TL, hire a good coach and let that coach run with it. No need for a board to be involved. Oh and another thing. Shut the damned doors and keep the parents out. Keep the distractions down and outside input from some parents who cant help themselves (not directed at anyone here). And if you get the right youth coaches they will know how to split the room. I know first hand how frustrating it is for everyone involved trying to run everyone together when they are at different levels. But remember learning to be a team in an individual sport like this is hard to teach as well. Patience is the key here. I was there in the beginning of the ES era and know what has happened since then.
The HS coach has to have the final say no matter who run it or where though. Consult with TL, hire a good coach and let that coach run with it. No need for a board to be involved. Oh and another thing. Shut the damned doors and keep the parents out. Keep the distractions down and outside input from some parents who cant help themselves (not directed at anyone here). And if you get the right youth coaches they will know how to split the room. I know first hand how frustrating it is for everyone involved trying to run everyone together when they are at different levels. But remember learning to be a team in an individual sport like this is hard to teach as well. Patience is the key here. I was there in the beginning of the ES era and know what has happened since then.
chinwhip
Active member
...Secondly, we all cheat a little (including yourself). Thirdly, I would love to stick around and try and fix things but i'm not about to waste my time fighting the establishment. as far as the league jumping goes, I tried your league and quickly realized floyds league was more organized and i saw exactly where the money we raised went. On a personal level, I like you and think we had a pretty decent freindship until I brought a team of girls over to your league and was introduced to the business side of R.C. But the cheap shots about something you know little to nothing about are petty and uncalled for. Actually you are one of the few guys in the youth that I dont mind taking a chair in one of my kids matches. But the board is overkill and needs to cease to exist. There needs to be a hard core coach in place that either delegates paperwork or does it himself. You dont have to have a hand in everything, and the worlds not out to get ya!!!
chinwhip
Active member
well said
That is what i am talking about, fighting the establishment. You were gone before the establishment even came about! Try to make yourself look good all you want, you will not fool me. If the other league was so good why are you not in it? I guess that I just do not understand am I an egotistical Dad, or am I acceptable to coach your kid during a match? I guess that it could always be whatever is best for you seeing how that is all you care about!
chinwhip
Active member
Getting sleepy but, done with rec ball, daughter is in travel ball now, that was the destination we were headed for all along. If you remember a few months ago at barberton "battle for the belt" you Did help me coach z in a match and i thanked you for helping out (so yes you are acceptable). This was not a personal shot at you. This was a response to a message on this thread about syw being "fine". It is in shambles and you know it, no one is blaming you. But ppeople are blaming the board. Ive heard from 3 or 4 people that you are headed to A.G next year with your boy (dont blame you). Lets stop with the pissing contest, its ugly and I didnt want it to come to this.