Region 4 Semi-Finals: Elder(10-2) vs. Lakota West(12-0)

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Pantherontheporch said:
To follow up on Purple Reign, I'm no expert on football, so please explain to me what I am missing.
Let's say you have a kid who has all the D-I or even Power 5 (for now) measurables. Not only that but he is eminently coachable, is very disciplined on the field in that he always sticks to his assignments and never free lances, has great instincts, and is a great teammate in the locker room. He is a quick learner and works hard off the field, lifts like a madman. He says "Sir" and "Ma'am." So not only does he have great physical attributes, great talent, and a great attitude, he is not a prima donna.
How would several or even more of these kinds of players be detrimental to a team as a whole?
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Most of these D1 guys are not disciplined, don't work very hard, are complete prima donnas, and it's all about them. That's why they are detrimental. What you are describing is EXTREMELY rare.
 
And to follow up, it looks like Taft right now has 7 guys with FBS offers that I found really quick. By all the chatter on here about the importance of D1 athletes, Taft should absolutely dominate Elder, because Elder has 1 player with FBS offers I do believe. If you don't think Taft waxes Elder, then you truly don't believe that D1 talent is truly that important.

Football is a team game, it's not basketball where 1 guy can carry your team to state.
 
cincifbfan said:
And Elder has 2 Dlineman that are about the same build as him. If your wanting D-1 recruits, then I'd be asking why doesn't Elder have very many...... They have dudes that pass the "eye" test with their size. They have numerous guys that are 6'4" and over. Is the coaching staff not developing them enough? Is the weight program lacking? Is the staff getting these boys out to camps? Or is it maybe I'm right in that teams with loads of D-1 recruits wind up being detrimental to the team as a whole.

The schools with probably the most recruits in the area are Winton Woods and Withrow, and guess what, both are at home like Elder. And both would have gotten beat way, way worse than Elder did in any of Elder's losses.

Getting a few D-1 guys doesn't suddenly turn you in to a state champ. Sorry, that's simply not how it works. It takes a whole team buying in, great coaching, and quite a bit of luck, especially in Region 4.
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If what you say is true then Elder wouldn't be sitting at home this week. West had many more D1 players last week, especially defensively and it showed. Didn't seem to be a detriment to their team last Friday, but I'm sure if they lose tomorrow night you'll come back here and somehow claim that it did.
 
adselder09 said:
If what you say is true then Elder wouldn't be sitting at home this week. West had many more D1 players last week, especially defensively and it showed. Didn't seem to be a detriment to their team last Friday, but I'm sure if they lose tomorrow night you'll come back here and somehow claim that it did.
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So Elder is at home due to lack of D1 talent.... Got it.
 
cincifbfan said:
So Elder is at home due to lack of D1 talent.... Got it.
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I didn't say that, but it definitely didn't help them that they didn't have any. But you're just being obtuse for no reason whatsoever. Just like you were with the running game/passing game argument. Just like you were with the literal definition of contender earlier.

Elder is at home because they ran into a better team. West was better than Elder in all three facets of the game. The most glaring advantage outside of the kicking game was West's defense. The unit with four defensive backs committed to play D1 football.

I understand your idea that highly ranked recruits CAN be detrimental to a team. Just because it can, doesn't mean it will. St X had two QBs the one year that were going to B1G schools. Guess what, both played large roles in their Playoff run and they ended up as state champions. St Edward is one of the most talented teams in the state year in and year out, with many D1 recruits. They've also been a mainstay in the State Championship Game for the majority of the last 10+ years.
 
adselder09 said:
Elder is at home because they ran into a better team. West was better than Elder in all three facets of the game. The most glaring advantage outside of the kicking game was West's defense. The unit with four defensive backs committed to play D1 football.
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Well said.
 
cincifbfan said:
And Elder has 2 Dlineman that are about the same build as him. If your wanting D-1 recruits, then I'd be asking why doesn't Elder have very many...... They have dudes that pass the "eye" test with their size. They have numerous guys that are 6'4" and over. Is the coaching staff not developing them enough? Is the weight program lacking? Is the staff getting these boys out to camps? Or is it maybe I'm right in that teams with loads of D-1 recruits wind up being detrimental to the team as a whole.

The schools with probably the most recruits in the area are Winton Woods and Withrow, and guess what, both are at home like Elder. And both would have gotten beat way, way worse than Elder did in any of Elder's losses.

Getting a few D-1 guys doesn't suddenly turn you in to a state champ. Sorry, that's simply not how it works. It takes a whole team buying in, great coaching, and quite a bit of luck, especially in Region 4.
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West & Moeller still playing defeats your argument. You don’t need “loads” of D1 players, but you need some high level talent.
 
If Elder wants to start trying to get a couple difference makers a year from CPS (and I have no idea if they do) one of the best ways to do that in my opinion would be to try and get someone on the staff who has ties to those schools and their youth programs. Obviously you would want someone who would be a good fit as well.
 
cincifbfan said:
And Elder has 2 Dlineman that are about the same build as him. If your wanting D-1 recruits, then I'd be asking why doesn't Elder have very many...... They have dudes that pass the "eye" test with their size. They have numerous guys that are 6'4" and over. Is the coaching staff not developing them enough? Is the weight program lacking? Is the staff getting these boys out to camps? Or is it maybe I'm right in that teams with loads of D-1 recruits wind up being detrimental to the team as a whole.

The schools with probably the most recruits in the area are Winton Woods and Withrow, and guess what, both are at home like Elder. And both would have gotten beat way, way worse than Elder did in any of Elder's losses.

Getting a few D-1 guys doesn't suddenly turn you in to a state champ. Sorry, that's simply not how it works. It takes a whole team buying in, great coaching, and quite a bit of luck, especially in Region 4.
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Who does Elder have that is 6’4” with the size and speed of him? Seriously this is beyond dumb to be arguing about. I can have two kids the same exact size and weight but it doesn’t mean they are both going to be equal. Kids at that level are born with it. Yes they have to work hard and all that stuff but you can’t just make a kid into a D1 player with hard work etc.

Lakota West and Moeller have just as much D1 talent as WW and more than Withrow. They also have kids around them that can play D2 or NAIA and D3 if they want. The other schools don’t have that. And WW just won state last year.
 
cincifbfan said:
Most of these D1 guys are not disciplined, don't work very hard, are complete prima donnas, and it's all about them. That's why they are detrimental. What you are describing is EXTREMELY rare.
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Who do you know personally that is a D1 player to make such a statement?
 
Bolden’s teams are so undisciplined, it’s disgraceful. That’s why that joker will never win a state title
 
This Moeller - LW game has had some excellent plays.......but for the most part it's been sloppy as hell. I've completely lost count of the number of unsportsmanlike conduct penalties. There's been a couple of times LW could have been called for taunting and the refs let it go.
 
E82 said:
This Moeller - LW game has had some excellent plays.......but for the most part it's been sloppy as hell. I've completely lost count of the number of unsportsmanlike conduct penalties. There's been a couple of times LW could have been called for taunting and the refs let it go.
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Was it sloppy on both teams?
 
Omar said:
Mostly West, Bolden’s teams have no discipline
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Very true. Neither does he. I have no idea how he doesn't get thrown out of every game. Seriously no other coach could get away with how he berates officials the entire game nor how he's always at least 5 yards on the field at all times.
 
cincifbfan said:
Was it sloppy on both teams?
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There were a lot of penalties on both teams.... In the first half it seemed like every other play had a penalty.

Lots of stupid unsportsmanlike conduct penalties on extra points by LW which left them in horrible field position after Moeller kickoffs.

Moeller dominated the line of scrimmage on offense and defense. I think Bolden was sacked a half dozen times or more.
 
cincifbfan said:
Very true. Neither does he. I have no idea how he doesn't get thrown out of every game. Seriously no other coach could get away with how he berates officials the entire game nor how he's always at least 5 yards on the field at all times.
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I did not understand how Elder got a sideline warning last week and West did not. Elder was always back and West was always close.
 
cincifbfan said:
Very true. Neither does he. I have no idea how he doesn't get thrown out of every game. Seriously no other coach could get away with how he berates officials the entire game nor how he's always at least 5 yards on the field at all times.
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The fact he didn’t win state with the ‘18 Colerain team should’ve been a red flag.
 
Another thing with Bolden, his teams do not know how to handle pressure in big games. They can dominate in the regular season, but come the playoffs when they get behind, they self destruct
 
Both teams were sloppy with penalties. It wasn't just Lakota West. Moeller has had a lot of penalties all season. It's just how they play.
 
Omar said:
Another thing with Bolden, his teams do not know how to handle pressure in big games. They can dominate in the regular season, but come the playoffs when they get behind, they self destruct
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They beat the piss out of your team Omar, shut up god bless
 
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