Lets talk 2007 Ohio vs USA Challenge

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DLSfanNW

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Are you ready for some football?

Starved high school fans won't wait long this season for quality games.

The Ohio vs. USA Challenge kick starts the national schedule during Labor Day weekend in Cincinnati and Canton, Ohio, with 10 matchups likely involving multiple teams in USA TODAY's Super 25 preseason rankings.

Event coordinator Josh Johnston is negotiating to televise some of the games nationally.

• Sept. 1, at Fawcett Stadium, Canton: Grove City (Ohio)-Central Catholic (Pittsburgh); Glenville (Cleveland)-Poly (Long Beach, Calif.); Canton McKinley-Union (Tulsa); and Cardinal Mooney (Youngstown, Ohio)-Gateway (Monroeville, Pa.).


At University of Cincinnati's Nippert Stadium: LaSalle (Cincinnati)-Brother Rice (Birmingham, Mich.); St. Xavier (Cincinnati)-Cathedral (Indianapolis); Moeller (Cincinnati)-Mission Viejo (Calif.); and Elder (Cincinnati)-Independence (Charlotte).

• Sept. 2, Nippert Stadium: Clayton (Ohio) Northmont-DeMatha (Hyattsville, Md.); Colerain (Cincinnati)-Hoover (Ala.); and Trotwood (Ohio) Madison-Highlands (Fort Thomas, Ky.).

DeMatha, which returns 15 starters from a conference championship squad, welcomes the tough early season test. "It's unusual (for DeMatha) to have so many experienced players back," DeMatha coach Bill McGregor said. "Games like this might expose any weaknesses we'll need to shore up."

The Sept. 1 quadruple-header at Nippert features all four members of the Greater Cincinnati Catholic League South.

"I'll put our league against any one in the nation," St. Xavier coach Steve Specht said of four Division I schools, Ohio's largest classification. "The Challenge showcases Ohio football against some of the country's best. It raises the bar for all teams."

Elder, the Division I state champions in 2002 and '03, tackles a formidable foe, Independence, which enters the season with a 108-game win streak (second all-time).

In 2006, the Challenge pitted Ohio's top teams against nine from the eight different states. The out-of-state teams won five of the nine games. Four teams would eventually wind up in the Super 25 final rankings in December.

Almost 42,000 fans attended sessions last years in Cincinnati and Massillon. Large crowds and a quality opponent enticed 74-year-old coaching legend Al Fracassa of Michigan powerhouse Brother Rice. Fracassa, 365-99-7 in 47 years, played in the Big Ten at Michigan State in the 1950s.

"It's well-known Ohio fans really get out for games, especially against teams from other states. It'll be the first of two straight weekends we'll play in Cincinnati," said Fracassa, whose team also playsMoeller.
 
 
I think Ohio is a great football state, and I was very impressed with the Ohio teams I saw at the Herbie last year, but I'd like each quadrupleheader to have maybe one all-Ohio game, two Ohio vs. non-Ohio games, and one non-Ohio vs. non-Ohio game.

Maybe Independence vs. DeMatha and McKinley vs. Moeller and Colerain vs. Hoover and Xavier vs. Mission Viejo or something like that.

I imagine the all non-Ohio game would be a big draw and the all-Ohio game would be a big draw, too, and there would still be two games with the other format.
 
Chicago said:
I think Ohio is a great football state, and I was very impressed with the Ohio teams I saw at the Herbie last year, but I'd like each quadrupleheader to have maybe one all-Ohio game, two Ohio vs. non-Ohio games, and one non-Ohio vs. non-Ohio game.

Maybe Independence vs. DeMatha and McKinley vs. Moeller and Colerain vs. Hoover and Xavier vs. Mission Viejo or something like that.

I imagine the all non-Ohio game would be a big draw and the all-Ohio game would be a big draw, too, and there would still be two games with the other format.
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thats not a bad idea..allthough i am not so sure that an all non-ohio game would be that big of a draw...the colerain-hoover game will be the biggest draw imho.
 
I agree that Colerain vs. Hoover will be huge.

I think as you go down through the Ohio teams, and down through the non-Ohio teams, the match-ups tend to get a little worse, because Ohio, as good as it is, is not quite as deep (it's Ohio vs. 49 states after all).

So you give some of the non-Ohio teams better match-ups in terms of quality and national recognition, and some of the Ohio teams better match-ups in terms of rivalries, evenly-matched opponents, a lot of fans at the game from each side, and that sort of thing.
 
o i agree with your idea..its just that its a holiday weekend i believe and some of the games are on sunday..this could be asking too much of people to come out and see a game with 2 teams they know little of..and other than the smaller division teams who have won titles and dream of playing some of the d1 powers there arent alot of "matchups" that would be so rare..the big school powers here in ohio do a good job of scheduling each other, in fact several teams involved in the ohio vs usa play each other this season...im not talking league play in the GCLS (moeller st.x lasalle and elder)..st.x plays st.i and glenville and there are others that play big games this year in state.
 
Overall, the matchups are pretty abysmal again.

While Colerain/Hoover and Moeller/Mission Viejo are extremely enticing, there are so many fantastic Ohio and USA teams missing out on playing the caliber of team that they should.

Some thoughts:

1. Grove City is an awful representative of Division I football in Ohio, and will play a perennial powerhouse in Pittsburgh Central Catholic. Why not insert Cleveland St. Ignatius here and make it an Intrastate Holy War? Irish Catholics, drinking, Cleveland v. Pittsburgh on yet another level, and HS football? Can you say fantastic? Sign me up for two car bombs and a Jameson neat, Seamus.

2. Clayton Northmont has had some recent success with Dayton area teams, but generally get bombarded by a Cincinnati team in the playoffs. They would fit the mold of playing a team like Highlands, although I do think the Trotwood-Madison/Highlands matchup should be decent. DeMatha is way too strong a program to be playing Northmont. I hope the rumors are true that the matchups are not finalized yet, and DeMatha actually gets to play St. Xavier.

3. Indy Cathedral is another team which has had recent success in 4A competition in Indiana, but is totally overmatched against St. Xavier in this venue. These teams have had some good games lately, but based on X's thumping of Cathedral last year, and the fact that the Irish lose almost all of their offense in William Stubbs, plus that X returns 8 defensive starters, this game shouldn't be close. As stated before, X should be playing DeMatha.

4. Elder, regardless of what has happened the past few years, will be a formidable opponent for Independence. I truly believe that this team (and their winning streak) is a complete anomaly. This team should never be mentioned in the same breath as DLS, and I hope it's manifested in this matchup.

5. Glenville/Poly may be the most exciting game of the entire event from an unattached fan's perspective. With so much speed, athleticism, and D1 potential, this bout could preview some of the future NFL's best in their raw stages.
 
DLSfanNW said:
What Ohio teams are supposed to be "up" this year?
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Colerain and X seem to be the cream of the crop again. It's too bad Ignatius isn't playing in this event. Elder fans will tell you they're up, but to me, it's the same team your boys smashed last year. Cardinal Mooney is a smaller team who will fly under the radar (because they're not Division I), but they can compete with anyone.
 
They claim to have a signed contract, but as to today no one from the Herbie has been in contact with them. I smell a dead skunk that's been run over in the Herbie office. If I were Kirk, I would have my name taken off of it.
 
Bordertown said:
They claim to have a signed contract, but as to today no one from the Herbie has been in contact with them. I smell a dead skunk that's been run over in the Herbie office. If I were Kirk, I would have my name taken off of it.
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Considering it seems the MHSAA may prevent Brother Rice from participating, Evangel could be back in it. However, it would be a lot more expensive to have Evangel in it, than a team from Michigan, Indiana, or Pennsylvania. So, I'm not sure if the economics will work out for Evangel.
 
I understand Brother Rice's issues. But understand if you look at the Ohio vs USA website they show "14 teams already solidified for the 2007 Ohio vs USA Challenge". The list shows Evangel and not Brother Rice, Cathederal, Independence, Highland or Gateway. One team is dropped and are added. If the travel expense is an issue why was Independence added?

I understand Independence will be a bigger draw than Evangel, but I think the integrity of the Challenge is at stake. The worst part is we are at the end of April and Evangel thinks, as of yesterday, they are in the Herbie. If they are not, I suspect they will have a whole in their schedule.

I suspect the contract between the Herbie and Evangel already spell out the financial responsibilties of the travel.

I predict if it occurs this will the final year of the event. Great idea, but poorly planned and supported.
 
Price_Hillbilly said:
Overall, the matchups are pretty abysmal again.

While Colerain/Hoover and Moeller/Mission Viejo are extremely enticing, there are so many fantastic Ohio and USA teams missing out on playing the caliber of team that they should.

Some thoughts:

1. Grove City is an awful representative of Division I football in Ohio, and will play a perennial powerhouse in Pittsburgh Central Catholic. Why not insert Cleveland St. Ignatius here and make it an Intrastate Holy War? Irish Catholics, drinking, Cleveland v. Pittsburgh on yet another level, and HS football? Can you say fantastic? Sign me up for two car bombs and a Jameson neat, Seamus.

2. Clayton Northmont has had some recent success with Dayton area teams, but generally get bombarded by a Cincinnati team in the playoffs. They would fit the mold of playing a team like Highlands, although I do think the Trotwood-Madison/Highlands matchup should be decent. DeMatha is way too strong a program to be playing Northmont. I hope the rumors are true that the matchups are not finalized yet, and DeMatha actually gets to play St. Xavier.

3. Indy Cathedral is another team which has had recent success in 4A competition in Indiana, but is totally overmatched against St. Xavier in this venue. These teams have had some good games lately, but based on X's thumping of Cathedral last year, and the fact that the Irish lose almost all of their offense in William Stubbs, plus that X returns 8 defensive starters, this game shouldn't be close. As stated before, X should be playing DeMatha.

4. Elder, regardless of what has happened the past few years, will be a formidable opponent for Independence. I truly believe that this team (and their winning streak) is a complete anomaly. This team should never be mentioned in the same breath as DLS, and I hope it's manifested in this matchup.

5. Glenville/Poly may be the most exciting game of the entire event from an unattached fan's perspective. With so much speed, athleticism, and D1 potential, this bout could preview some of the future NFL's best in their raw stages.
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I agree with your opinion on St Ignatius, however their AD (Dale Gabor) has went on record saying that Iggy is NOT interested in the Herbie.
 
While I'm excited about the Herbie I wish they could switch games between X and Northmont. And add a better Columbus power to replace Grove City like HD or UA or even Desales.
 
Bordertown said:
I understand Brother Rice's issues. But understand if you look at the Ohio vs USA website they show "14 teams already solidified for the 2007 Ohio vs USA Challenge". The list shows Evangel and not Brother Rice, Cathederal, Independence, Highland or Gateway. One team is dropped and are added. If the travel expense is an issue why was Independence added?

I understand Independence will be a bigger draw than Evangel, but I think the integrity of the Challenge is at stake. The worst part is we are at the end of April and Evangel thinks, as of yesterday, they are in the Herbie. If they are not, I suspect they will have a whole in their schedule.

I suspect the contract between the Herbie and Evangel already spell out the financial responsibilties of the travel.

I predict if it occurs this will the final year of the event. Great idea, but poorly planned and supported.
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dude that website hasn't been updated in ages, probably even before last years event.
 
Dude - the Evangel was invited, accepted the invitation, signed a contract and has been excluded. Do contracts not mean anything in Ohio. There was previous banter over an alleged game between Southlake Carroll and De La Salle. DLS apparently never signed a contract. In this case, Evangel supposedly has a contract.

What I expect we find out is that the Herbie sent them a contract and Evangel signed it. But the Herbie sponsors never signed the contract and sent it back. So a contract never existed.

Herbie may be legally okay, but ethically questionable. Sad part they won't "man-up" to Evangel. The Herbie owes me nothing, but the do owe an explanation to Evangel. On the Ohio forum I have linked a "thread" that indicates Evangel as of Thursday thinks they are in the Classic.

So Dude - contrary to the website that is the situation.
 
How is Evangel doing these days? I know there was some coaching changes and the whole dropping to 2a thing. How is that working out?

With John Curtis having an amazing run last year where did ECA rank in the state? Are they projected to be a top 5 team in Louisiana this year?

I hope The Herbie finds a spot for them as they are always fun to watch.
 
Two things have hit Evangel. First there was a split in the leadership of the school and a group went to form Calvary. That split occurred about the same time as the LSHAA said they had to play in their own classification based on enrollment which was 1A. Previously they had been allowed to play 5A with the big boys. West Monroe and other 5A powers tired of being beat by Evangel and got the rule changed. The two factors set the program back. The 5A Louisiana schools refuse to play them in nonconference games. Louisiana politics!!!!!

I think in the last four years they have only beat one Texas team (Texas High 9-2) out of approximately 8-10 games. Other Texas teams they have played are Lufkin, Longview, Southlake Carroll and Texas High.

They claim to be on the rebound and think they will be back on the national scene in 2008. For a school with less than 300 students they are quite salty. This year they will be a 2A school and compete against John Curtis.

They still play a wide open 'gimicky" offense. Biggest problem last year was the QB position.
 
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Booty's dad

Bordertown said:
Two things have hit Evangel. First there was a split in the leadership of the school and a group went to form Calvary. That split occurred about the same time as the LSHAA said they had to play in their own classification based on enrollment which was 1A. Previously they had been allowed to play 5A with the big boys. West Monroe and other 5A powers tired of being beat by Evangel and got the rule changed. The two factors set the program back. The 5A Louisiana schools refuse to play them in nonconference games. Louisiana politics!!!!!

I think in the last four years they have only beat one Texas team (Texas High 9-2) out of approximately 8-10 games. Other Texas teams they have played are Lufkin, Longview, Southlake Carroll and Texas High.

They claim to be on the rebound and think they will be back on the national scene in 2008. For a school with less than 300 students they are quite salty. This year they will be a 2A school and compete against John Curtis.

They still play a wide open 'gimicky" offense. Biggest problem last year was the QB position.
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Any truth to the rumor that Booty's dad had a falling out with the admin. and that is where the problems started?
 
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