LeBron's Flagrant Foul
- Thread starter Yappi
- Start date
Orin Swift
Well-known member
I think there’s good odds Stewart gets a bigger punishment than LeBron for his multiple efforts to fight LeBron. LeBron will get star treatment that Stewart won’t.
Raider6309
Well-known member
LeBron will somehow be the victim
14Red
Well-known member
cheap shot by Lebron, he'll be punished. Stewart went bonkers, he'll be suspended more. Simply cannot act like that, even if it was intentional. And he was square face up with Lebron and had a shot at him and just stood there and yelled.
Absolutely amusing clip. NBA teams have 18 assistant coaches and they couldn't restrain the guy, couple of guys got tossed aside in the melee. Kudos to Cade Cunningham, he was the only player who consistently tried to stop the guy.
On a serious note though, at what point do you hit they guy with a stun gun to get him to back off.
Absolutely amusing clip. NBA teams have 18 assistant coaches and they couldn't restrain the guy, couple of guys got tossed aside in the melee. Kudos to Cade Cunningham, he was the only player who consistently tried to stop the guy.
On a serious note though, at what point do you hit they guy with a stun gun to get him to back off.
eastisbest
Well-known member
How much do you fine a victim?
When blood starts flowing across an eye and down a face I can forgive a guy for going a bit bonkers. The guy that started that flow with an intentional hit to the face? Not so much.
When blood starts flowing across an eye and down a face I can forgive a guy for going a bit bonkers. The guy that started that flow with an intentional hit to the face? Not so much.
cabezadecaballo
Well-known member
Yup.
IMHO, I believe James - as he swung elbow, quickly looked at and lined up on dude's face with the pinkie side of his fist. Their eyes met and dude knew the score. That's part of why he flipped out, I'd guess. Making some people bleed can be a really bad thing, too. It goes beyond mere pain, even without pain. Some people have a different switch that flips.
cabezadecaballo
Well-known member
Somebody in that league will study LBJ and Stewart interactions, IF they have ANY integrity over there.
cabezadecaballo
Well-known member
Screamin' A Smiff just said Stewart needs a longer booting. Maybe so. If other young men think they can go Cro-Magnon, too, well, maybe the NBA dies. Or goes full Rollerball.
James needs a vacation. A long one.
eastisbest
Well-known member
In James' defense, he thought he was playing Laimbeer. Getting a bit long in the tooth. "Vacation" needed for sure
OldSoulon
Well-known member
James missing games is a downer for the race baiters in the media.
Laimbeer would've cleaned his clock
eastisbest
Well-known member
Everythings electronic these days but if James has a clock, I suppose. Laimbeer could clean it after he picked himself out from between the floor boards. The bad boys were some of my favorites but Laimbeer never won a fight. He just picked them.
Yappi
Go Buckeyes
LeBron - 1 game suspension
Stewart - 2 game suspension
After thinking about it, if the roles were reversed, I really think LeBron would have been getting alot of support in the media/NBA/players for going after the "dirty" player that punched him. They would be saying, "what do you expect LeBron to do when that dirty player punched him and blood was draining down his face?"
If Stewart had punched LeBron in the face, he would be getting a 10 game suspension. The media would be all over him for a clearly dirty play. There would be no sympathy and there would be calls for Detroit to cut him because he shouldn't be allowed on the basketball court with that type of dirty play.
Personally, I think Stewart's suspension was reasonable. He was well past the acceptable line in response to a clearly dirty play that caused a serious injury. For LeBron, anything less than 5 games for a sucker-punch is way too low. Maybe he has never been a dirty player but as his skills continue to erode, this might be his path forward. He's not the freak basketball player anymore. He is still an excellent player but others have passed him and he's not accustomed to not being at the top. But his stardom and power caused the NBA to cower yet again. I can never fully embrace the NBA because of their different standards for players.
Stewart - 2 game suspension
After thinking about it, if the roles were reversed, I really think LeBron would have been getting alot of support in the media/NBA/players for going after the "dirty" player that punched him. They would be saying, "what do you expect LeBron to do when that dirty player punched him and blood was draining down his face?"
If Stewart had punched LeBron in the face, he would be getting a 10 game suspension. The media would be all over him for a clearly dirty play. There would be no sympathy and there would be calls for Detroit to cut him because he shouldn't be allowed on the basketball court with that type of dirty play.
Personally, I think Stewart's suspension was reasonable. He was well past the acceptable line in response to a clearly dirty play that caused a serious injury. For LeBron, anything less than 5 games for a sucker-punch is way too low. Maybe he has never been a dirty player but as his skills continue to erode, this might be his path forward. He's not the freak basketball player anymore. He is still an excellent player but others have passed him and he's not accustomed to not being at the top. But his stardom and power caused the NBA to cower yet again. I can never fully embrace the NBA because of their different standards for players.
eastisbest
Well-known member
James got frustrated and let go with what without a little luck could have been a career ender. I'm not alright with a guy who didn't throw a punch, who was a victim getting anytime just because he couldn't control himself after being attacked and left bleeding. What exactly was Stewart's crime here? Presumption of what he would have done if not blocked?
I'm not alright with the perpetrator getting just one. NBA messed this one up IMO.
I'm not alright with the perpetrator getting just one. NBA messed this one up IMO.
Raymo
Well-known member
Hey,he did go to a Catholic high school didn't he...BAM!
14Red
Well-known member
I think the punishment was correct. While it looked intentional, LeBron has a very clean slate when it comes to issues like this. First time offender, I see why 1 game makes sense. I'm kind of surprised Stewart only got 2 games. I don't blame him for the first flare up. You get hit like that blindsided and there's going to be an immediate reaction. However, he clearly lost it. He was way out of line knocking down assistant coaches and teammates? I mean what was he going to do if no one grabbed him? This bordered on scary. This is a large man who could not be constrained by several people. What happens if he actually gets ahold of someone around the neck? An assistant coach?
And just to provide some levelness here, it's known that Michael Jordan punched teammates in practice, with full knowledge of the team, coaches and administration and it was just "competitiveness". True it was a different time, but let's not act like these things never happen. Remember the scary incident in LA with Kermit Washington and Rocket player Rudy Tomjanovich. Tomjanovich nealry died when Washington hit him full MMA punch to the nose, fracturing many bones in Tomjanovich's face. As I recall neither player was really the same after that incident. There was routinely flare ups in the 70's and 80's. Bill Laimbeer, Dennis Rodman, I think Reggie Miller squared off with someone one time, Larry Bird and Julius Erving squared off in an exibition game one time. Charles Oakley...I mean there were a few fights every year. The malice in the Palace really kind of put an end to all that as the NBA really cracked down on player behavior and security around the court.
EagleFan
Fan of Eagle
Is there a comparable situation to back this up?
I have no idea, but throwing an elbow, followed by an open hand scrape and clinch of someone's face is not a basketball move ever.
Orin Swift
Well-known member
Ron Artest had a somewhat similar situation, except he didn’t try to hide it under the guise of a basketball play like LeBron did. Gave Harden an elbow to the back of the head running down the court together. He got 7 games. However, he had a looooong history of suspensions, fines, other punishments as opposed to LeBron who has had 1 other suspension. So not really an apples to apples comparison.
eastisbest
Well-known member
let me poke you in the eye, see how you do with that?
I'm firmly in the camp than when attacked to the point your bleeding like a stuck pig, measured response is a movie idiom. No punishment mitigates future fear and flight. After looking at the vid, I'll go BS on any belief the hit wasn't intentional and past record means nothing.
This was a small measure from taking Stewart's career. You don't punish luck. You punish the action. James should be sitting a week. Stewart made a clean play, something the extent of his punishment now inhibits knowing you can't respond to being cold cocked. Stewart fined maybe.
eastisbest
Well-known member
I see James looking at the defender instead of the ball. These are on-review penalties not in-game penalties. Whether something was or was not called during game I don't think matters in this judgment?
Come-on, let me poke you in the eye? Get a little blood moving. Just as a ... social experiment. On this I'm very consistent with my general postings in threads discussing when people are defending themselves on the street from attack. It's a mentally built by slow-motion replay and hollywood movies to expect even the most moral person to be able to accurately predict their response to violent attack. A composed response one-day can be an out-of-the-mind response the next. Whether that attack happens to you or happens to a loved one gets judged differently. That's absurd.
Viewing that replay, my feeling (which is all anyone can go on) is that James hit Stewart up high, in the face with intent. It was no accident.
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