Hate to do this

SLCDad said:
Usually is forfiet is due to a team breaking the rules in some way. If you break the rules you don't get credit for any win.

52-6 is correct.
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51-7 on the field IS ALSO CORRECT

usually that means an ineligible player (sometimes a third stringer who gets in for 2 plays)

both are correct

52-6 and 51-7 on the field
 
SLCDad said:
Usually is forfiet is due to a team breaking the rules in some way. If you break the rules you don't get credit for any win.

52-6 is correct.
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It was the St. Eds game in 2004. The first game of Specht's career. I don't think the ineligable player had any effect on the game at all, but rules are rules.
 
consumerman said:
agree

glenville is an example of St X awesome schedule

a team from cali traveled 2000 miles (one guy whined about St X having to travel 200 miles) that is certainly not considered at this time an elite team in california and beat glenville (8-2) by 8

X beat them by 15

moeller is an example of st x awesome schedule

a team from cali traveled 2000 miles (ditto to the whiner) that is 3-2-1 in cali and beat moeller (6-3) by 4

X beat them by 14

de matha (8-1) i guess is st x top opponent this year

they beat a weak 3-4 team 7-6

X beat them by 21

st ignatius (8-2) is an example of st x awesome schedule

it took st x 3 overtimes to squeak out a 17-14 win against a team that had lost to a third team 38-17

X won. Period.

ask armstrong about those FACTS

that is why st x was degraded several spots in a couple of polls for less than stellar victories
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Those are the FACTS. Name one team that has a harder schedule, and give me some FACTS about their schedule before you go ahead and say that X's SOS is weak again.
 
WestSideBomber said:
It was the St. Eds game in 2004. The first game of Specht's career. I don't think the ineligable player had any effect on the game at all, but rules are rules.
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Exactly.

Perhaps I shouldn't bring this up, but the most blatant example is the Florida 6A title game last year. The star running back should have been suspended for having sex with a 14 year-old band member in a school bathroom. Even after the problem became public and the principal was indicted on two felony counts for hindering the police investigation and the entire coaching staff was fired, nothing was done about the football game itself. Sad.
 
WrongPerson said:
Those are the FACTS. Name one team that has a harder schedule, and give me some FACTS about their schedule before you go ahead and say that X's SOS is weak again.
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I guarentee that consumerman's post (without looking at it) is about how he want's you to show him exactly where he said X's SOS was "weak".
 
for someone that wants to ignore my posts you are doing a pretty good job of including me in all of your 1-2 sentence smartass posts, just a little bit of a contradiction wouldnt it seem

can you say get some therapy for your obsessive-compulsive disorder?

_____________________________________

i guess after giving up on legitimate debating, then crying out that I challeneged your manhood, then loading up with personal insults, now it is obsessive-compulsive

the trend is going in a very bad direction

_________________________
again all this from someone who entered the thread by making 4-5 excuses for why St x took 3 overtimes to beat a team that had previously lost by 21 and then ended his first thread with a smartass comment
 
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I dont care to make excuses for X, but Ill give you my opinion as to why they went three overtimes with Ignatius. Ignatius is a very solid team with one of the top run defenses in the state. Iggy is one of the favorites to come out of region 1 and possibly make a title run which will be no easy task. Their 21 pt. loss that you speak of was to another region 1 favorite Mentor who probably has the most potent offensive attack in the state as they run the spread offense to near perfection. Ignatius was coming off of a couple of cupcake victories prior to the Mentor game and wasnt ready for their attack. The Ignatius pass defense has since improved making their overall defense hard to score on if you dont have a very creative offense. Regardless of the fact that Ignatius is not currently nationally ranked (although they were ranked regionally by prepnation in the beginning of the season before their loss to Mentor), they are a top team in the state of Ohio and could easily compete with most nationally ranked teams, just as there are plenty of Cali teams that arent ranked who could still compete with the nations best.

Another factor was that the X/Iggy game took place in Cleveland and was the farthest X has had to travel all year after having to travel to Columbus the weekend before that for a game. The long back to back roadtrips, coupled with playing a state contender, makes for a tough game situation.

Both teams were also playing with soph. QB's who couldnt provide much of an aerial attack with the stout defenses that both teams had. The game had all the makings for a close, low scoring matchup.
 
consumerman said:
st x playsed the toughest schedule in the nation is more ohio propoganda than anything
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Enough said?

oh wait, there is more.

glenville is an example of St X awesome schedule

a team from cali traveled 2000 miles (one guy whined about St X having to travel 200 miles) that is certainly not considered at this time an elite team in california and beat glenville by 8


moeller is an example of st x awesome schedule

a team from cali traveled 2000 miles (ditto to the whiner) that is 3-2-1 in cali and beat moeller by 4


de matha i guess is st x top opponent this year

they beat a weak 3-4 team 7-6

st ignatius is an example of st x awesome schedule

it took st x 3 overtimes to squeak out a 17-14 win against a team that had lost to a third team 38-17
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You showing 'specific' examples that X's schedule is not up to par


you took 3 overtimes to beat SI

and SI lost previously

what was the score of the SI loss (not St X)

you beat what everyone agrees is a so-so Moeller team by 14

not as impressive as you are trying to make it
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Again, you degrading their strength.


Need I go further?


Again, X has the hardest schedule AND they pulled out of it 10-0. That is a lot more than any other school can say.
 
Let me get this straight: X's having to travel a "long" way and play on the road against a team (IGGY) that, schematically, was geared to play against a team like them, are reasons for an OT struggle to win. Meanwhile, Lakeland traveling a long way to play on the road against a team that, schematically, was geared to play against a team (St. X) like them, are merely excuses for an OT struggle to win. Do I have it correct? Seems like a double standard to me.
 
skyway28 said:
Let me get this straight: X's having to travel a "long" way and play on the road against a team (IGGY) that, schematically, was geared to play against a team like them, are reasons for an OT struggle to win. Meanwhile, Lakeland traveling a long way to play on the road against a team that, schematically, was geared to play against a team (St. X) like them, are merely excuses for an OT struggle to win. Do I have it correct? Seems like a double standard to me.
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There are no excuses, a win is a win...I'd like to quote my good friend.

"Ask any racer. Any real racer. It don't matter if you win by an inch or a mile. Winning's winning."

The only reason why X is getting any credit for those specific wins is because of the strength of the teams they played.
 
first of all consumerman, in regards to your "obsessive compulsive" comment directed to another poster, I think you need a little self-awareness reflection time today. In regards to this pointless thread (as in no one will ever do anything but butt heads), St. X based on a computer has the toughest SOS (you cannot argue with that). That rating does not account for the human factor, so one day St. X might be awful, but its not a one day rating, its an overall rating. Day in and day out St. X is getting wins. Their style of play does not lead to high scoring games, so using this scoring transitive property (team A beat team B by 24 and team C beat team A by 45, thus team C will beat team A by 69) is worthless.

The Bitter Award goes to consumerman who can't seem to except that a team might just have a better ranking than his team because of a harder schedule, in a harder league.
 
JuniorVarsityHughes said:
first of all consumerman, in regards to your "obsessive compulsive" comment directed to another poster, I think you need a little self-awareness reflection time today. In regards to this pointless thread (as in no one will ever do anything but butt heads), St. X based on a computer has the toughest SOS (you cannot argue with that). That rating does not account for the human factor, so one day St. X might be awful, but its not a one day rating, its an overall rating. Day in and day out St. X is getting wins. Their style of play does not lead to high scoring games, so using this scoring transitive property (team A beat team B by 24 and team C beat team A by 45, thus team C will beat team A by 69) is worthless.

The Bitter Award goes to consumerman who can't seem to except that a team might just have a better ranking than his team because of a harder schedule, in a harder league.
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1) I dont disagree St X has a harder OVERALL schedule than DLS or other top schools, but that does not prove St X is the best team nationwide

2) I would bet you would not disagree that DLS closest game so far being 28 points, and St X winning by as few as 3 in 3 overtimes over a 3 loss team, does not prove DLS is better than ST X

one team has played a harder schedule
one has won more convincingly

to say one trumps the other is nothing but opinion
 
WrongPerson said:
Enough said?

oh wait, there is more.



You showing 'specific' examples that X's schedule is not up to par




Again, you degrading their strength.


Need I go further?


Again, X has the hardest schedule AND they pulled out of it 10-0. That is a lot more than any other school can say.
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Again It is not a a test to see who can survive a gauntlet

X has gone 10-0 but has not been stellar in all 10 games

winning by 3 points in 3 overtimes against a 3 loss team does not get pushed under the bed because X went 10-0 against a great schedule

performance in all games count

I would bet without knowing for sure that DLS has scored more points in the first half of its first 8 games than St X has scored in the entire 4 quarters of its first 8 games
 
DLS score by quarters

first 7 games


1 2 3 4 TOTAL
DLS 89 118 90 35 - 332
opp 7 7 35 28 - 77

avg 47-11

game 8 was DLS 31-0 at half and 45-14 final

so DLS has scored 238 points in the first half of its first 8 games
 
St X has scored 265 points TOTAL in its first 8 games and if it wasnt for a blowout of St Eds, the total St X points would be very close to what DLS put up in just the first half in the same number of games

BTW, the supposed tough schedule featuring De Matha took another hit as De Matha who barely beat a losing team 7-6 2 games ago, LOST this past weekend
 
Also, in regards to the Calpreps league rankings. The GCL South is comprised at 4 schools. I think you should complain to Calpreps to include size of league as a factor in determining the rankings if you feel that # of teams makes a conference harder. However, when you say "what if 2 teams were in a league", this statement is hypothetical. The fact of the matter is that maybe DLS's conference is the best 7-10 team conference, but the rankings aren't suited to include how many teams there are. It may very well be unfair that the GCL South only has 4 teams but it is the reality, and I challenge you to make a better system. How would you rate the leagues? I think when you make a thread named "Hate to do this" you are really just creating a forum where you can spout off hypothetical "facts" in order to bash other teams.
 
JuniorVarsityHughes said:
Also, in regards to the Calpreps league rankings. The GCL South is comprised at 4 schools. I think you should complain to Calpreps to include size of league as a factor in determining the rankings if you feel that # of teams makes a conference harder. However, when you say "what if 2 teams were in a league", this statement is hypothetical. The fact of the matter is that maybe DLS's conference is the best 7-10 team conference, but the rankings aren't suited to include how many teams there are. It may very well be unfair that the GCL South only has 4 teams but it is the reality, and I challenge you to make a better system. How would you rate the leagues? I think when you make a thread named "Hate to do this" you are really just creating a forum where you can spout off hypothetical "facts" in order to bash other teams.
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if you would read and COMPREHEND I noted early in the thread that St X poor performance against ST Ig cost them several spots in a couple of polls

I wondered of beating Moeller by 14 would do the same

those werent hypotheticals

the scores were real as were the drops in the rankings

they were not caused by me "thinking" or "spouting off"
 
JuniorVarsityHughes said:
Also, in regards to the Calpreps league rankings. The GCL South is comprised at 4 schools. I think you should complain to Calpreps to include size of league as a factor in determining the rankings if you feel that # of teams makes a conference harder. However, when you say "what if 2 teams were in a league", this statement is hypothetical. The fact of the matter is that maybe DLS's conference is the best 7-10 team conference, but the rankings aren't suited to include how many teams there are. It may very well be unfair that the GCL South only has 4 teams but it is the reality, and I challenge you to make a better system. How would you rate the leagues? I think when you make a thread named "Hate to do this" you are really just creating a forum where you can spout off hypothetical "facts" in order to bash other teams.
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someone pointed out how IMPRESSIVE it was that GCL this year were 21-5 in non-league games

I compared that to the West Catholic League in Norcal where at the time the combined records of the 7/8 teams in non-league games was like 29-3-1

and we know since then

De Matha lost AGAIN

Independence lost AGAIN

St Iggy lost AGAIN

I think the GCL teams are great as is Cincinnati football

I just dont think a league with 4 teams is worthy of consideration as the best league in the country on that 1 factor (too few teams)
 
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WestSideBomber said:
That is the only other game DeMatha has been held under 22 points all season.

I'm still wondering what your logic is here. So X gave up a single TD in 48 minutes of football (on a VERY short field no less), to a team that has only been held under 22 points one other time all season. Yet because they only beat a weak team by 1 point (DeMathe still won), X is not that great of a team and is not deserving of the national attention?

Please help me out!
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De Matha that awesome power LOST again

LMAO
 
Consumerman, what specific school has the toughest schedule in America? Please feel free to use your, team A beat team B by 14, examples to justify your response.
 
JuniorVarsityHughes said:
Consumerman, what specific school has the toughest schedule in America? Please feel free to use your, team A beat team B by 14, examples to justify your response.
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having the toughest schedule does not automatically get you the #1 team ranking

especially if it takers three overtimes to beat a 3 loss team
 
consumerman said:
Again It is not a a test to see who can survive a gauntlet

X has gone 10-0 but has not been stellar in all 10 games

winning by 3 points in 3 overtimes against a 3 loss team does not get pushed under the bed because X went 10-0 against a great schedule
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You're absolutely right, X did not play their best that game, BUT THEY STILL WON. They won, and they will continue to win against tough teams, no matter what the score...everyone will tell you a W is a W is a W.
 
In my opinion, and in the opinion of the computer based rankings, going undefeated while having the toughest schedule in America merits the #1 position. According to the computers, the highest SOS belongs to St. X (I'm still waiting for consumerman's response as to what team has the toughest schedule).
 
JuniorVarsityHughes said:
In my opinion, and in the opinion of the computer based rankings, going undefeated while having the toughest schedule in America merits the #1 position. According to the computers, the highest SOS belongs to St. X (I'm still waiting for consumerman's response as to what team has the toughest schedule).
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Not true of the computer rankings. Mater Dei, prior to their recent loss to Lutheran, was rated #1 last week despite having a lower SOS than St. Xavier. There are other factors that figure into calpreps overall rank value.
 
JuniorVarsityHughes said:
In my opinion, and in the opinion of the computer based rankings, going undefeated while having the toughest schedule in America merits the #1 position. According to the computers, the highest SOS belongs to St. X (I'm still waiting for consumerman's response as to what team has the toughest schedule).
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SOS is NOT the ONLY factor in determining rankings

as previously pointed out

a high rated SOS contributes, so does dominating wins

how many times do we have to go over the same things?

why did X drop in several polls after a 3 overtime win?

not because their schedule changed

but based on their PERFORMANCE
 
let me try an analogy

there are two students

one takes a very hard schedule of tough classes

one takes a normal amount of tough, medium and maybe even some easy electives

the "tough schedule" student gets 3 A's 2 B's and a C

the "medium schedule" student gets 6 A's

who was the better student???

you can make the argument that either one was
 
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