McIntosh by major. No one comes close to McIntosh, and I don't want to hear about Evans keeping it close @ Ironman. If that match was on an actual mat instead of some pee wee mat, then that match would have been a major too. Evans was never close to scoring in that match.
As far as the Korb vs Gresham match, that ref needs to understand that no one came to see him. He completely blew that call. The refs in Cincinnati are absolutely horrible. It is not even fun to watch matches because of the inconsistency. A kid can't ride without the fear of a stall call in the first 30 seconds. All it takes is someone to yell, "he's stalling!" then bang.
someone sounds bitter. good thing evans chose the pee wee mat he wrestled mcIntosh on. give me a break. when it was all said and done he lost by a stall call. is mcintosh a man child-absolutely. evans did not push the action therefor he got dinged. end of story. dont leave it in the officials hands. you get a warning, let's wrestle. is it the right call sometimes yes sometimes no. theres only one way to avoid a stall call. Push the action!!!
Looks like conditioning was a factor in both matches for Gresham. He certainly has the explosion at times to score on good people.
After talking with that ref, that is exactly what happened, he shot at the same time the ref was ready to call stalling. It just happened to be at the wrong time as fans viewed it. That ref is considered to be one of the best in the SW and if you do not believe that, ask the top coaches who they think is in the top 5 of the SW and he will be named by most if not all. One questionable stall call does not erase 8 state tournament assignments in the past 10 years.well put THIS GUY, i thought he was hitting him right as he took his reshot. he was on his heels the entire match. i thought it was a good call, just looked bad because it was right when he reshot.
After talking with that ref, that is exactly what happened, he shot at the same time the ref was ready to call stalling. It just happened to be at the wrong time as fans viewed it. That ref is considered to be one of the best in the SW and if you do not believe that, ask the top coaches who they think is in the top 5 of the SW and he will be named by most if not all. One questionable stall call does not erase 8 state tournament assignments in the past 10 years.
i think korb clearly pushed the action and was more aggressive, and the call just came at an unfortunate time. i feel like that call was building up in the ref's head over the course of the match, and although the timing was bad he couldve been called for that stalling about 10-15 seconds earlier
Maybe Wjjsj or Tank 05 could comment from the ref perspective?
Since I was assisting on this match I have avoided commenting. I will say this, Bangor's post is accurate. Believe it or not referee's do not want to have to make a stall call to decide the match. But they will if stalling is there.
I have been in several conversations with coaches and officials over the years about stalling. Hopefully we'll keep plugging away to all get on the same page.
I make it my mission to call stalling when it is there and not to call it just because. I will add these few points:
*I had a match at the Moeller super duals this year involving two great wrestlers and called stalling near the end of regulation to tie a match. (Not a habit of mine like I said earlier, only when I feel it is there). Every official that I spoke with that saw it said it was definitely the right call and could have been called sooner. Some coaches I spoke with said it was wrong. At the Coaches Classic I happened to be sitting next to the wrestler's dad of whom I called stalling on. He looked me in the eye and said it was a bad call. But he did it with respect and class. I had no problem with it. We had a good conversation from it. I took the feedback and deciphered what I agree with and what I don't. I believe the wrestler and I both learned from it.
*I have been pretty vocal that we want to make sure we call stalling when it is there and not to make it our mission to look for. But I will quote one of the best quote's that I heard from our state interpreter:
"Stalling is boring. People will tell you that you shouldn't call stalling to determine a match. If one wrestler is being aggressive and trying to score and the other is stalling, you are determining the match by letting him stall. Nobody wants to watch stalling." Very true words!
*My dad wrestled many many years ago. He doesn't watch the sport much at all. He happened to see the Korb/Gresham match on tv. He called me up and said that he saw me on tv and he knew the kid would get called for stalling exactly when both instances were called. You're talking about a man whom is unbiased and never watches the sport anymore and can see right away that stalling should be called. Hmmm
*Lastly, I talked with the official who was the lead on that match and he thought maybe he should have called it a little bit earlier and he was man enough to admit it looked bad with the timing. He is one of our best officials and well respected.
I wish both of these stud wrestlers and all wrestlers for that matter a blessed wrestling season!
Well, this has been an interesting discussion and I feel I'm at a crossroad. As an aspiring indie film producer I posted this video as the potential catalyst to post more. I've even considered shlepping my camera to things like say, Dayton Holiday, Moeller/Elder Dual, etc, to shoot some marquee match-ups. In the end this becomes a test of this forum's decorum and I question my own wisdom in posting:
The Combatants I have a lot of respect for both athletes and the people close to them. Did I do them a disservice by posting this video and allowing some to cast aspersions on their intensity or desire to compete? Is this video also allowing some unfair covert study of their skill by potential opponents?
The Referees I have a lot of respect for both refs in this match. Did I do them a disservice by enabling some to cast aspersions on their calls or competence?
Other Teams I would really hate to be banned from schools or events that I have no emotional involvement in because these videos are seen as kindling for flame wars that ultimately end up damaging kids and families? Bucksman, is there a forum POV on this?
I'm on the bubble...
Well, this has been an interesting discussion and I feel I'm at a crossroad. As an aspiring indie film producer I posted this video as the potential catalyst to post more. I've even considered shlepping my camera to things like say, Dayton Holiday, Moeller/Elder Dual, etc, to shoot some marquee match-ups. In the end this becomes a test of this forum's decorum and I question my own wisdom in posting:
The Combatants I have a lot of respect for both athletes and the people close to them. Did I do them a disservice by posting this video and allowing some to cast aspersions on their intensity or desire to compete? Is this video also allowing some unfair covert study of their skill by potential opponents?
The Referees I have a lot of respect for both refs in this match. Did I do them a disservice by enabling some to cast aspersions on their calls or competence?
Other Teams I would really hate to be banned from schools or events that I have no emotional involvement in because these videos are seen as kindling for flame wars that ultimately end up damaging kids and families? Bucksman, is there a forum POV on this?
I'm on the bubble...
Well, this has been an interesting discussion and I feel I'm at a crossroad. As an aspiring indie film producer I posted this video as the potential catalyst to post more. I've even considered shlepping my camera to things like say, Dayton Holiday, Moeller/Elder Dual, etc, to shoot some marquee match-ups. In the end this becomes a test of this forum's decorum and I question my own wisdom in posting:
The Combatants I have a lot of respect for both athletes and the people close to them. Did I do them a disservice by posting this video and allowing some to cast aspersions on their intensity or desire to compete? Is this video also allowing some unfair covert study of their skill by potential opponents?
The Referees I have a lot of respect for both refs in this match. Did I do them a disservice by enabling some to cast aspersions on their calls or competence?
Other Teams I would really hate to be banned from schools or events, that I have no emotional involvement in, because these videos are seen as kindling for flame wars that ultimately end up damaging kids and families? Bucksman, is there a forum POV on this?
I'm on the bubble.
Merry Christmas all...
On Flo, GOhio, or whatever website, I don't think most wrestlers are flattered by having their matches posted online. Nobody wants to be scouted, but we all know it's going on at various tournaments by dads, covertly.
That being said, I don't think anyone would be able to get too much out of this video.
Maybe Wjjsj or Tank 05 could comment from the ref perspective?
Well, this has been an interesting discussion and I feel I'm at a crossroad. As an aspiring indie film producer I posted this video as the potential catalyst to post more. I've even considered shlepping my camera to things like say, Dayton Holiday, Moeller/Elder Dual, etc, to shoot some marquee match-ups. In the end this becomes a test of this forum's decorum and I question my own wisdom in posting:
The Combatants I have a lot of respect for both athletes and the people close to them. Did I do them a disservice by posting this video and allowing some to cast aspersions on their intensity or desire to compete? Is this video also allowing some unfair covert study of their skill by potential opponents?
The Referees I have a lot of respect for both refs in this match. Did I do them a disservice by enabling some to cast aspersions on their calls or competence?
Other Teams I would really hate to be banned from schools or events, that I have no emotional involvement in, because these videos are seen as kindling for flame wars that ultimately end up damaging kids and families? Bucksman, is there a forum POV on this?
I'm on the bubble.
Merry Christmas all...
Well, I think Korb put any argument to rest if he could beat Gresham since he did it again in convincing style at Brecksville. He tore through his side of the bracket while Chaz struggled in the semis with an 8-7 win.
They are both nationally ranked, but Korb is clearly the better competitor at this point.
Well, I think Korb put any argument to rest if he could beat Gresham since he did it again in convincing style at Brecksville. He tore through his side of the bracket while Chaz struggled in the semis with an 8-7 win.
They are both nationally ranked, but Korb is clearly the better competitor at this point.
It was a 9-7 decision over Schafer from Chanel who was clearly the next best wrestler after the two in discussion here as he tore through the consos. While I believe Korb is the better wrestler at the present time I think you underestimate the talent of Gresham and try to lesson his accomplishments. Both are great wrestlers who have the talent to bring two state championships home to Cincinnati. Love them both![]()
I sure would hope this ref reviews this video, then has the guts to come on here and explain that call.
I sure would hope this ref reviews this video, then has the guts to come on here and explain that call.