Elder Enrollment Strategy

I think in this social media age we are dealing with parents and kids want to feel sought after when they visit the school. It's a game I don't think Elder will play. Parents/kids want to feel "special", and Elder is not going to kiss their butt to get them to go to the school. I think there is some merit to that, BUT at the end of the day you're seeing enrollment drop. I believe Elder had one of the biggest open houses they ever had and had a really good number of shadows. You got to ask yourself where did we go wrong? You don't want to kiss butt and make kids/parents feel "special" and "wanted" fine, but don't cry when enrollment continues to drop and teachers and coaches eventually have to lose their jobs. If the 175 number is true that is not good yet again. It's not terrible, but it's not good.
 
I think most people are right on here in just about everything. My question that I have posted before is where does Elder tuition go to? If we take the tuition as the cost to educate each student, then why is it so much higher than just about every public school? They pay their teachers less, don't have significant special education costs or transportation costs and don't have to pay into STRS. Where's the money going? I think people want actual concrete, and transparent answers to their ROI. Plus there is always fundraising. Make it transparent, everything. In Cincinnati Magazine's annual school issue, Elder was one of the few schools that didn't post their average ACT score. They already don't have to abide by the public schools ridiculous rating system, so people want to know what do I actually get from Elder? Mason just had 21 students get perfect ACT score and Walnut Hills had 17 student do the same last year. Most of the areas Nation Merit finalists come from public schools each year. Even with "generous financial aid" what TANGIBLE benefits does Elder provide in an overly saturated Catholic Education Market?

Students can get as good or better education at any public district in the area and save over 40k.

Now none of this is meant to be a dig towards Elder since I believe a good strong Elder is great for the area, but big questions remain unanswered for people on the fence.

I would argue the public school education is inferior. Yes, a really smart kid can excel at a public school, ace the SAT, get a college scholaship, etc. The difference comes in for the other 95% of the students that are not gifted. That is where I believe the Catholic school education is much better and prepares them better for college. Elder also does a great job of instilling a high work ethic and moral character in their students. There is a great sense of pride, giving, and values in the Elder graduate.
 
Dude, the population of students isn't declining. The population of kids going to Catholic schools is. That means those kids are leaving parochial schools and going elsewhere. This isn't rocket science.

Those kids don't leave Catholic schools and then cease to exist.
Dude, FYI. Ohio public school enrollment has declined 6% since the 2005-2006 school year.
5731
 
Just to interject some reality here:
  • Elder’s tuition is $11,100
  • On average, Ohio schools spend $11,953 per pupil in operational expenditures. CPS’ expenditures is $14,600; Oak Hills is $10,800; and Three Rivers is $10,700.
  • Considering Elder contributes significant financial aid, likely around $2-3k per student, they are operating well under any public school program they directly compete against.
  • Elder’s tuition is below the other 3 GCL-S schools and on-par with most GCL-N schools

As of 5 years ago, Upper Arlington was over $15k/student. And that was before a massive levy. On the whole, Catholic schools cost less than public schools. Most of your affluent districts and major urban districts cost more than Catholic by a good amount.
 
As of 5 years ago, Upper Arlington was over $15k/student. And that was before a massive levy. On the whole, Catholic schools cost less than public schools. Most of your affluent districts and major urban districts cost more than Catholic by a good amount.
Yeah, the latest narrative that Elder is excessively too expensive from an operational standpoint and the dioceses (affectionately referred to by our Elder super fan poster Trey as the “mob”), wildly profits from it is ignorant bs of course.
 
Yeah, the latest narrative that Elder is excessively too expensive from an operational standpoint and the dioceses (affectionately referred to by our Elder super fan poster Trey as the “mob”), wildly profits from it is ignorant bs of course.

Years ago, some of my neighbors were complaining about the lack of funding in the UA schools and giving me some grief for not sending my 2 kids there. I told them that their best approach would be to just thank me. Thank me for "saving" their schools $30k by not sending my kids there and then contributing another $5k+ in property taxes.
 
Tuition keeps rising, enrollment keeps dropping. Fundamental truths in this argument.

You can post all the crap you want, that formula won't sustain.

If they're not willing to look in the mirror and change some things they are so tied to, then what can you do?
 
Tuition keeps rising, enrollment keeps dropping. Fundamental truths in this argument.

You can post all the crap you want, that formula won't sustain.

If they're not willing to look in the mirror and change some things they are so tied to, then what can you do?

Is it really rising though? If it is, not by that much. Elder is doing what they can to keep tuition down. It's more to do with the feeder school numbers.
 
Tuition keeps rising, enrollment keeps dropping. Fundamental truths in this argument.

You can post all the crap you want, that formula won't sustain.

If they're not willing to look in the mirror and change some things they are so tied to, then what can you do?
Why do you consider actual facts crap? It may not be sustainable to have all these catholic schools. Consolidation is coming.
 
Is it really rising though? If it is, not by that much. Elder is doing what they can to keep tuition down. It's more to do with the feeder school numbers.
Not in real dollar terms, especially when you consider the aid being ramped up. There’s not a good path for growth here for Elder as they are locked into a declining west side that has declining interest in faith based education. The most prudent course isn’t to aggressively buy enrollment, but to stay financially strong to be in a better position when eventual consolidation occurs.
 
Just to interject some reality here:
  • Elder’s tuition is $11,100
  • On average, Ohio schools spend $11,953 per pupil in operational expenditures. CPS’ expenditures is $14,600; Oak Hills is $10,800; and Three Rivers is $10,700.
  • Considering Elder contributes significant financial aid, likely around $2-3k per student, they are operating well under any public school program they directly compete against.
  • Elder’s tuition is below the other 3 GCL-S schools and on-par with most GCL-N schools
So exactly as I stated, Elder COSTS MORE than the vast majority of public schools per child. Just because they give financial aid on average of 2-3k per child, doesn't mean the cost is magically 8-9k per child now. That is made up through donations.

We may be arguing over hundreds of dollars per child, but when the teachers get paid WAY less than their public counterparts, don't pay into STRS (almost 15% of teacher's salary), don't have medical benifits on par with the public schools, don't have to transport their students to and from school, and don't have major Special Education expenses (Biggest expense for districts, especially the large urban districts) I again ask, where is the money going?

I am well aware of the reality and already interjected it.
 
So exactly as I stated, Elder COSTS MORE than the vast majority of public schools per child. Just because they give financial aid on average of 2-3k per child, doesn't mean the cost is magically 8-9k per child now. That is made up through donations.

We may be arguing over hundreds of dollars per child, but when the teachers get paid WAY less than their public counterparts, don't pay into STRS (almost 15% of teacher's salary), don't have medical benifits on par with the public schools, don't have to transport their students to and from school, and don't have major Special Education expenses (Biggest expense for districts, especially the large urban districts) I again ask, where is the money going?

I am well aware of the reality and already interjected it.
So you want to know where that couple $100 dollars are going? Lol, okay.
 
Did you? He even admitted we were talking about maybe a couple hundred dollars.

Translation - the expenses for the privates is much less. How does that equate to a near equivalent cost per student? It's a legit question. There may be a legit answer, but if they're not transparent about it, then there's skepticism.
 
Translation - the expenses for the privates is much less. How does that equate to a near equivalent cost per student? It's a legit question. There may be a legit answer, but if they're not transparent about it, then there's skepticism.
Translation— I can’t prove at expenses are much less, but saying so supports a narrative I want to advance here, so I may as well throw more bs I can’t prove out there.
 
Much less? Prove it.

Prove it? Again, do you not agree with what he wrote? Did you even read it? Teachers aren't paid as much, medical benefits are worse, no payment into STRS, smaller transportation costs, less special education. Do you feel that is made up? Is that not a rational approach to comparing costs?
 
So you want to know where that couple $100 dollars are going? Lol, okay.
If you don't think that type of transparency will help, you are part of the problem. Facilities are about equal to every district in the area, not superior. Cost per student should in reality be thousands less than their public counterparts.
 
Prove it? Again, do you not agree with what he wrote? Did you even read it? Teachers aren't paid as much, medical benefits are worse, no payment into STRS, smaller transportation costs, less special education. Do you feel that is made up? Is that not a rational approach to comparing costs?
translation— I can’t prove what I say is true and even though the difference may be minuscule, it supports my narrative to throw as much bs as possible into the conversation.
 
If you don't think that type of transparency will help, you are part of the problem. Facilities are about equal to every district in the area, not superior. Cost per student should in reality be thousands less than their public counterparts.
With aid, it likely is. Also, funding is a reason SDs like OH and Three Rivers are struggling compared to other suburban counterparts, as most of the higher tier publics are in the $13k+ range.
 
So exactly as I stated, Elder COSTS MORE than the vast majority of public schools per child. Just because they give financial aid on average of 2-3k per child, doesn't mean the cost is magically 8-9k per child now. That is made up through donations.

We may be arguing over hundreds of dollars per child, but when the teachers get paid WAY less than their public counterparts, don't pay into STRS (almost 15% of teacher's salary), don't have medical benifits on par with the public schools, don't have to transport their students to and from school, and don't have major Special Education expenses (Biggest expense for districts, especially the large urban districts) I again ask, where is the money going?

I am well aware of the reality and already interjected it.

The archdiocese owns Elder. I'm sure the Archdiocese gets a % from every Catholic school. I'm not sure what the discussion is with that. Do you really expect the Archdiocese to take $0?

Elder's pay to play is significantly less than the public schools. I'm not sure if some of that is funded through fundraisers, but that is an added expense Elder may or may not take on.
 
I would argue the public school education is inferior. Yes, a really smart kid can excel at a public school, ace the SAT, get a college scholaship, etc. The difference comes in for the other 95% of the students that are not gifted. That is where I believe the Catholic school education is much better and prepares them better for college. Elder also does a great job of instilling a high work ethic and moral character in their students. There is a great sense of pride, giving, and values in the Elder graduate.

So why is the public education inferior? What makes Elder a better fit for 95% of students?

You say that Elder instills high work ethic and moral character. How do you quantify and measure that? So let me drop 40 grand to have sense of pride, giving and values?

Can anyone honestly tell me what Elder's average ACT score is? What would Elder score if they had to abide by the state report card?
 
With aid, it likely is. Also, funding is a reason SDs like OH and Three Rivers are struggling compared to other suburban counterparts, as most of the higher tier publics are in the $13k+ range.
They really aren't struggling as much as you are to believe. You'd get a top notch education from either school if you truly wanted to.
 
The archdiocese owns Elder. I'm sure the Archdiocese gets a % from every Catholic school. I'm not sure what the discussion is with that. Do you really expect the Archdiocese to take $0?

Elder's pay to play is significantly less than the public schools. I'm not sure if some of that is funded through fundraisers, but that is an added expense Elder may or may not take on.
What is the percentage?
Most publics don't have a pay to play around here. I thought we were talking about academics, not extracurriculars.
 
So why is the public education inferior? What makes Elder a better fit for 95% of students?

You say that Elder instills high work ethic and moral character. How do you quantify and measure that? So let me drop 40 grand to have sense of pride, giving and values?

Can anyone honestly tell me what Elder's average ACT score is? What would Elder score if they had to abide by the state report card?
I think an argument can be made either way. It sounds like you put very little value in a Catholic faith based education, which is your prerogative.
 
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