CAVS 2022-2023

CDRam84 said:
Yep…streaky outside shooting at best…I see K Love headed to another final and contributing 🤣…Yet we are hanging on to Okoro who couldn’t shoot his way out of a wet paper bag…Dean Wade is a project at this point…streaky shooting…average D (like Love) but nowhere near the rebounding, post play or outlet passing of Kevin…we live and die with draft picks like they are family…meanwhile the Heat with a raft of undrafted players are most likely headed to the finals…
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I loved Kevin Love in his prime, but let's not get too blinded by that. His shooting really declined the last couple of years. You say "average D" but that was when he was young. Today he cannot guard me, and I'm in my 60's and need a knee replacement.
 
Let's not get too wild here. Kevin Love averaged 12 mpg games 1-5 of the ECF and registered a DNP -- coach's decision, for a chance to eliminate the Celtics in Miami during game 6.

The way the Cavs were constructed...a decision to put Kevin Love on the floor almost always had to mean a decision to put Mobley or Allen on the bench. Perhaps he'd have helped a little in the postseason, but probably not a whole lot. His time has long since past.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Let's not get too wild here. Kevin Love averaged 12 mpg games 1-5 of the ECF and registered a DNP -- coach's decision, for a chance to eliminate the Celtics in Miami during game 6.

The way the Cavs were constructed...a decision to put Kevin Love on the floor almost always had to mean a decision to put Mobley or Allen on the bench. Perhaps he'd have helped a little in the postseason, but probably not a whole lot. His time has long since past.
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Somewhat true…but 12 mpg and contributing to a team that made the finals vs 0 mpg (by January) for a team that got manhandled in the first round? I think Pat Riley and Spoelstra might know a little more than our front office and coaching staff…they just keep gettIng it done with different players year after year..
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Let's not get too wild here. Kevin Love averaged 12 mpg games 1-5 of the ECF and registered a DNP -- coach's decision, for a chance to eliminate the Celtics in Miami during game 6.

The way the Cavs were constructed...a decision to put Kevin Love on the floor almost always had to mean a decision to put Mobley or Allen on the bench. Perhaps he'd have helped a little in the postseason, but probably not a whole lot. His time has long since past.
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Allen & Mobley could/didn’t play 48 minutes a night … they had to come off the floor at some point … with or without Love …. The question was would it better they come off with Love or Wade going in … I would say Love … then throw in that a team with very little playoff experience let’s go of the one player on their team with vast playoff experience … this experience could have helped some of the younger players even if his on court help was minimal … just a dumb decision period.
 
news.yahoo.com

Report: Cavs eyeing Wizards' Kyle Kuzma

Jun. 20—Don't snooze waiting for the Cavaliers to pick 49th in the NBA Draft, because team president of basketball operations Koby Altman might make franchise-altering moves before then if rumors circulating on the Internet become fact. Evan Dammarell of Right Down Euclid is reporting the...
news.yahoo.com news.yahoo.com
 
I would rather trade up to pick between 31-35 than trade up to pick at 26 or 29. Usually talking about the same type of guys, and they don't have guaranteed contracts tied to the draft slot.

Somebody that either has some red flags or that doesn't fit a positional prototype or a specific need of a contending team always drops into the second round, and you can often sign them at or just above the league minimum with a lot of flexibility as a shorter and/or non-guaranteed contract.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
I would rather trade up to pick between 31-35 than trade up to pick at 26 or 29. Usually talking about the same type of guys, and they don't have guaranteed contracts tied to the draft slot.

Somebody that either has some red flags or that doesn't fit a positional prototype or a specific need of a contending team always drops into the second round, and you can often sign them at or just above the league minimum with a lot of flexibility as a shorter and/or non-guaranteed contract.
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But that is the key, these blow it up teams that own multiple 1st rounders make deals w/ contenders in season hoping one or two of them fall short so the pick is in the late teens to early 20s. When they are in the mid 20s and on they try and deal them for basically nothing so they don't have to eat a guaranteed 1st round contract. Not sure if the Cavs should go that way but it is why you hear a lot of chatter around them and the back end of the 1st round,. One or more of the players listed in the column and a bag of balls gets you a 1st rounder might be worth the guaranteed contract for a role player, an early 2nd rounder in the NBA is worth more. Maybe an enforcer type to at least grind guys in practice? A wing who can bury 3s and nothing much else? A guy that is good at waving a towel at the end of the bench?
 
Auggie said:
One or more of the players listed in the column and a bag of balls gets you a 1st rounder might be worth the guaranteed contract for a role player, an early 2nd rounder in the NBA is worth more. Maybe an enforcer type to at least grind guys in practice? A wing who can bury 3s and nothing much else? A guy that is good at waving a towel at the end of the bench?
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The two that stand out to me in that late first/early second range are Dariq Whitehead from Duke and Jaime Jacquez, Jr. from UCLA.

Whitehead shot 43% from 3 as a freshman at Duke and had a 6'10+ wingspan at the combine. Not sure he can do much else, but he checks my boxes as a perimeter shooter that ought to translate to the pros.

Jacquez I don't think will impress anyone as an older prospect with pretty average athleticism, albeit he had surprisingly good leaping ability in combine tests. Not necessarily a great perimeter shooter but a very productive college player; averaged around 21.5 points and 10 rebounds per 40 minutes for UCLA last year. Give me that guy all day in practice, and I imagine that's a guy that can find a nice 2nd unit niche.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
The two that stand out to me in that late first/early second range are Dariq Whitehead from Duke and Jaime Jacquez, Jr. from UCLA.

Whitehead shot 43% from 3 as a freshman at Duke and had a 6'10+ wingspan at the combine. Not sure he can do much else, but he checks my boxes as a perimeter shooter that ought to translate to the pros.

Jacquez I don't think will impress anyone as an older prospect with pretty average athleticism, albeit he had surprisingly good leaping ability in combine tests. Not necessarily a great perimeter shooter but a very productive college player; averaged around 21.5 points and 10 rebounds per 40 minutes for UCLA last year. Give me that guy all day in practice, and I imagine that's a guy that can find a nice 2nd unit niche.
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Kris Murray is another name to watch as a wing. Some think Nigerian James Nnaji might be an option as Allen's back up.

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NBA 2023 Draft Prospects | Emoni Bates | NBA.com

NBA 2023 Draft Prospects | Emoni Bates
www.nba.com www.nba.com

Projection

Bates has not been in an environment to comfortably and consistently showcase his game since displaying dominance during his sophomore year of high school. Bates’ midrange prowess isn’t a fit everywhere, but his upside as a microwave scorer gives him sixth-man potential. Bates could spend time in the G League, especially if NBA teams determine he needs to add weight or needs time to acclimate. All of the tangibles remain present for the 19-year-old to capitalize on his skills.



— Profile by RotoWire
 
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I've followed Bates' career for a while since we're both from the Ann Arbor area.

He's seen his draft stock drop quite a bit over these past few years but the fact that he's only 19 and possesses a fair bit of potential is a decent enough reason to take a flyer on him.

If he does stick to a NBA roster it'll be for his 3-point shooting ability and not much else.
 
I saw Bates when he played at Akron last year. He let the Akron student section get in his head and a small guard defensively harassed him into a dismal performance. His hangers on even approached the student section and got into it with them. He spent the last few minutes of the game on the bench with his head under a towel. All in all, an awful look.
 
A flyer on Bates is worth it at 49. There is some talent and potential. He won’t be the sole focus of every college defense like he was at Eastern. If he’s willing to work and gets his head right he could develop into a productive player. Nothing lost if he doesn’t.

They did it once before with Kevin Porter Jr. Turned into a productive player, just not with the Cavs.
 
cjb5656 said:
A flyer on Bates is worth it at 49. There is some talent and potential. He won’t be the sole focus of every college defense like he was at Eastern. If he’s willing to work and gets his head right he could develop into a productive player. Nothing lost if he doesn’t.

They did it once before with Kevin Porter Jr. Turned into a productive player, just not with the Cavs.
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Great analogy. I hope for the sake of the Cavs and the kid that he works out, I just wasn't happy with what I saw.
 
In other draft news... A white guy wins most talked about outfit of the draft:

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I remember 4-5 years ago when people were talking about him like he was another Kevin Durant, before everyone figured out he had marginal athleticism and a negative if not at best neutral wingspan on top of being thin framed.

I'd be thrilled if this dude became a plus shooter and maybe a guy with some scoring pop playing with the second unit. At pick 49...nothing lost if he ends up with the Charge for a few years and ultimately ends up elsewhere or overseas.
 
Y'all are underselling what Bates was/could be. This is the perfect pick for the Cavs. Low risk/high reward. He was the consensus #1 recruit in the country going into college, plenty of video out there of him playing against guys like Chet Holmgren in high school where Bates was consistently getting the better end of those battles.

Pure talent-wise, he could have been a lottery pick. It's all the other stuff, injuries, criminal history, etc etc etc that caused him to be almost not drafted. Someone said Kevin Porter Jr a few posts ago....perfect analogy.

Player comparison wise.....when I see his game I think Brandon Ingram. Both are 6'9", though Ingram has more wingspan, neither will seemingly wow you with speed but can get to the rim when needed and both have fairly consistent shooting strokes.

The cavs need more size at the guard spot or a wing with decent size that can shoot it. If Bates can get his head on straight (thats a huge IF)...he could be the perfect fit for what the Cavs need. And if it doesn't pan out....well all you've lost is a mid 2nd round pick. Whoopty-Doo....
 
Re: Bates:

Here is what one NBA scout recently told Seth Davis (via The Athletic):

“He’s not even on our board. Just too much of a circus. He has a scorer’s mentality but bad shot selection. He’s one of those athletic-looking guys that’s not really athletic. He has no interest in playing defense or utilizing his other abilities. He needs to learn how to play with other good players.
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ftw.usatoday.com

Explaining why Emoni Bates could have a massive slide in the 2023 NBA Draft

Emoni Bates was long considered one of the top basketball prospects in the world.
ftw.usatoday.com ftw.usatoday.com
 
tom 48 said:
Someone must be daft. It just goes to show how little the other teams regard the Cavs.

heavy.com

Sixers Proposed a Trade for Cavs' Entire Young Frontcourt: Report

The Philadelphia 76ers proposed a trade for the Cleveland Cavaliers' entire young frontcourt.
heavy.com heavy.com
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Yeah, that's crazy. Like the article said, it was probably just the Sixers telling the rest of the league "don't ask us for Harris in a trade unless you make a huge offer". Personally I would not trade Mobley for Harris straight up.
 
Yeah, the guy taking up 20% of the cap and coming off a year he averaged his 2nd fewest PPG, fewest RPG, worst FG%, 3pt% and worst PER in his career is going to push Utah over the edge and into the playoffs.
 
wolves82 said:
Yeah, that's crazy. Like the article said, it was probably just the Sixers telling the rest of the league "don't ask us for Harris in a trade unless you make a huge offer". Personally I would not trade Mobley for Harris straight up.
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Mobley will be an NBA MVP in a few years. Harris will never approach that territory.
 
Needs to get stronger. He has the skills, but lacks the bulk to fully utilize them.

Defensively he is already a stud player. He'd be a top 10 player if he could gain 20 pounds of muscle.
 
Did anyone see the cavs are giving Pete Nance a look? Probably nothing more than a feel good story, and throwing a bone to the Nance family....but still pretty cool. Rooting for him
 
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