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Talk some sense

Active member
Sorry for the awkward patching here.

What I remember most about CJ in the last 20 years was a play in 2014 where they were up by 4 with just a few seconds to play. Middletown Fenwick had the ball and called timeout to set up a triple screen play on the wing. The CJ defenders faught so hard to get through the screen they ran into the shooter who hit the three, and he knocked down both free throws giving him a five point play and the win. That kind of stuff takes alot of respect out of the program.

Another reason Alter stands out is their down years are no where near the lows CJ has had, or is that just my recollection?

So they called a foul for running into the shooter or simultaneously into a screener as the shooter was shooting. Cause there ain't no 5 point play involving shooter only.
 

Talk some sense

Active member
They called the foul on hitting the shooter after the shot. Was an interesting call as it was a 1 and 1 instead of a basket and 1. I have seen it called that way a couple times in collegiate games but I don't ever recall another high school situation where they awarded a basket and two shots.

Technically, it would have been recorded in the scorer's book as a three with a separate one and one attempt.

The CJ coach argued it should have been an offensive player control foul since it was after the shot but he lost the argument. Well that doesn't make any sense at all
 

AllSports12

Moderator
I'd love to hear one of the refs here weigh in. I'll see if I can post our discussion there. Thanks.

I'm not quite sure what you are looking for. (It looks like you quoted parts of a discussion from another thread) This happened 7 years ago and absent video, there's no way to tell what did or should have happened.....

That said, in a situation where a player is fouled and his three point attempt is successful, there is only 2 ways that player can be awarded 2 free throws..... 1) The foul was ruled to be an intentional foul.... or 2) The foul was judged to have occurred after the shooter returned to the floor and the offending team had committed 10 or more fouls in that half.

If the player that was fouled was a screener, then that screener would have attempted any free throws.
 

USA70PP

Well-known member
Years ago, back in the early/mid 50s, the foul after the shot was often called on break away lay-ups. I was hit with it a couple times and benefited from it several times.
 

toestubber

New member
Question on substitutions. Team A has ball and gets fouled, after whistle player from team A is hit with a technical foul. Team B wants to sub in a shooter to shoot technical foul shots. Team A shoots foul shots. Team B is told they can sub after the techincal foul shots. Since its a dead ball shouldn't team B be able to substitute a player to shoot the technical shots?
 

zebrastripes

Well-known member
Question on substitutions. Team A has ball and gets fouled, after whistle player from team A is hit with a technical foul. Team B wants to sub in a shooter to shoot technical foul shots. Team A shoots foul shots. Team B is told they can sub after the techincal foul shots. Since its a dead ball shouldn't team B be able to substitute a player to shoot the technical shots?
Yes. Anyone can shoot the free throws, in fact the same player does not even have to shoot both of them.
 

toestubber

New member
so they should have allowed the substitution. Sucks it was at end of regional game that was won by 1 pt in overtime, no guarantees other shooter would have made them but ....
 

zebrastripes

Well-known member
so they should have allowed the substitution. Sucks it was at end of regional game that was won by 1 pt in overtime, no guarantees other shooter would have made them but ....
If the officials misapplied the rule, I agree that is unacceptable in any game especially this deep in the tournament. Hopefully the OHSAA was made aware of this.
 

AllSports12

Moderator
had a player go to table and checkin to sub shoot technical shots, refs said they could sub in after the technical shots

One possibility is that the officials weren't notified that the sub was coming in to shoot. In that case, they officials would be correct.

If the officials were told the sub was coming in to shoot and they denied the substitution, then they were wrong.

Without being on the floor, nobody knows for sure
 

D4fan

Well-known member
I'm not quite sure what you are looking for. (It looks like you quoted parts of a discussion from another thread) This happened 7 years ago and absent video, there's no way to tell what did or should have happened.....

That said, in a situation where a player is fouled and his three point attempt is successful, there is only 2 ways that player can be awarded 2 free throws..... 1) The foul was ruled to be an intentional foul.... or 2) The foul was judged to have occurred after the shooter returned to the floor and the offending team had committed 10 or more fouls in that half.

If the player that was fouled was a screener, then that screener would have attempted any free throws.
Define "returned to the floor". Does this just mean landed after taking the shot? And why would it matter if 10 or more fouls had been committed? What about 7 or more giving a 1/1 opportunity?
 

AllSports12

Moderator
Define "returned to the floor". Does this just mean landed after taking the shot? And why would it matter if 10 or more fouls had been committed? What about 7 or more giving a 1/1 opportunity?

Airborne Shooter (Rule 4-1-1)
An airborne shooter is a player who has released the ball on a try for a goal or has tapped the ball and has not returned to the floor.

If fouled before he returns to the floor he is considered in the act of shooting. (1 throw if try is successful, 2 throws if the try is unsuccessful)
If fouled after he returns to the floor, it is a common foul. (throws based on team foul count)
 

D4fan

Well-known member
Airborne Shooter (Rule 4-1-1)
An airborne shooter is a player who has released the ball on a try for a goal or has tapped the ball and has not returned to the floor.

If fouled before he returns to the floor he is considered in the act of shooting. (1 throw if try is successful, 2 throws if the try is unsuccessful)
If fouled after he returns to the floor, it is a common foul. (throws based on team foul count)
Ok, he was definitely on floor with shot probably half way to rim.
 

Talk some sense

Active member
I'm not quite sure what you are looking for. (It looks like you quoted parts of a discussion from another thread) This happened 7 years ago and absent video, there's no way to tell what did or should have happened.....

That said, in a situation where a player is fouled and his three point attempt is successful, there is only 2 ways that player can be awarded 2 free throws..... 1) The foul was ruled to be an intentional foul.... or 2) The foul was judged to have occurred after the shooter returned to the floor and the offending team had committed 10 or more fouls in that half.

If the player that was fouled was a screener, then that screener would have attempted any free throws.
Thank you for the clarification that the probability of the shooter making and 3 and getting 2 FTs is very rare and certainly not what was described in this situation. Always appreciate your expertise and experience.
 

serpico

Well-known member
Weird question, but it’s about drawstrings on basketball shorts. The shorts are rolled up :rolleyes: and the drawstring are not tied and flapping outside of the shorts. Should an official make the player tuck them in?
 

AllSports12

Moderator
Weird question, but it’s about drawstrings on basketball shorts. The shorts are rolled up :rolleyes: and the drawstring are not tied and flapping outside of the shorts. Should an official make the player tuck them in?
From the Case Book...

3.5.5 SITUATION:

An official notices that player A1 has rolled the waistband of the shorts and the inner band of the shorts is exposed. The rolling (a) exposes only one manufacturer's logo; (b) reveals multiple manufacturers' logos; (c) reveals no manufacturers' logo; (d) exposes the drawstring of the shorts.

RULING:
In (a) and (c), the logos are legal; in (b) and (d), the player may not participate until the multiple manufacturer logos are not exposed or the drawstring is tucked inside the shorts.

A simple, "tuck that in", should rectify the matter..... If it keeps happening, send the player out, they'll fix it for the rest of the game. ;)
 

CedarBuck92

Active member
Out of curiosity, if you are officiating and you see something different than another official on a foul are you able to initiate a conference? or is it like Baseball where you only say something if asked?
 

AllSports12

Moderator
Out of curiosity, if you are officiating and you see something different than another official on a foul are you able to initiate a conference? or is it like Baseball where you only say something if asked?
An official can never overrule another official's decision.

If an official sees something contrary to what another official ruled, that official can offer what they say to the other official. It is up to the original calling official to make any change to the original decision.

These situations should be extremely rare......... (usually occur on out of bounds calls..... last to touch)
 

umpire16

Member
Exactly...

B6 can shoot the first and they can even bring B7 in to shoot the second
I saw this last season - The coach had a player shoot the first and then realized it would be a cool way for his one senior to hit is 1,000th point as the assistant told him this while the first shooter was lined up. Pretty cool to see.
 

zebrastripes

Well-known member
I saw this last season - The coach had a player shoot the first and then realized it would be a cool way for his one senior to hit is 1,000th point as the assistant told him this while the first shooter was lined up. Pretty cool to see.
And thankfully the officials correctly allowed the coach to do that. Unfortunately I feel pretty confident that too many officials have no idea it is allowed by rule.
 

umpire16

Member
And thankfully the officials correctly allowed the coach to do that. Unfortunately I feel pretty confident that too many officials have no idea it is allowed by rule.
Honestly, it was one of those situations where I had read a caseplay or rules test question or something like that on it. When the coach asked me, I was like, heck yeah you can. The other coach, he did not say anything. I don't think he knew the rule either way, but likely figured this kid is going to score his 1,000th point, and my team (non-shooting team) was up by 25 in the 4th, that he didn't say anything.
 
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