Archie Miller Out At Indiana

[Omar]

Said this to my brother and will repeat here when it comes to trying to 'convince' some players who are wanting to transfer.

You come to Indiana to play for the name on the front of the jersey, not the back. Those back-of-the-jersey guys can go and transfer.
I only want those players who want to be Hoosiers. The rest, good riddance.

It’s not that simple. To win at the level IU expects to win, you need players with NBA talent. You have to sell kids on why IU can get them to the NBA, the idea kids will flock to IU just bc it’s IU isn’t realistic.

 

[14Red]

Said this to my brother and will repeat here when it comes to trying to 'convince' some players who are wanting to transfer.

You come to Indiana to play for the name on the front of the jersey, not the back. Those back-of-the-jersey guys can go and transfer.
I only want those players who want to be Hoosiers. The rest, good riddance.

I certainly understand that philosophy, and it's good we hear that. But at the end of the day, a student athlete is there it get a degree and build a better life for themself. The day they get their diploma, there's nothing else the school is obligated to do for them. Now for a player looking to play beyond college, you have to do what's best for your career, as bad as that sound for a team sport. Arman Franklin is "currently" going to a better situation for himself. Not sure if he met with Mike Woodson, but there are certainly worse places he could go than Virgina. That's a good program, good coaching and good competition.

 

[Omar]

And to be clear, I don’t like these mass transfers. My hope is that this yr is an anomaly due to the added Yr of eligibility. I’m also hoping the licensing & image rules that allow players to get paid will help keep the borderline NBA players in school.

 

[Omar]

I certainly understand that philosophy, and it's good we hear that. But at the end of the day, a student athlete is there it get a degree and build a better life for themself. The day they get their diploma, there's nothing else the school is obligated to do for them. Now for a player looking to play beyond college, you have to do what's best for your career, as bad as that sound for a team sport. Arman Franklin is "currently" going to a better situation for himself. Not sure if he met with Mike Woodson, but there are certainly worse places he could go than Virgina. That's a good program, good coaching and good competition.

Let’s be real most P5 Football & Basketball players are their to better their chances of a pro career. Of course, programs should be held to certain minimum academic requirements so athletes can take advantage of that education. However, we’re lying to ourselves if we think a degree is their top priority.

 

[nwwarrior09]

Not official yet, but by the sounds of it IU's third assistant is going to be Yasir Rosemond. He was most recently at Alabama on the previous coach's staff, and has also had stops at Georgia and Oregon before that.

Younger guy in his early to mid 40s that's supposed to be good with player development and supposedly has recruiting connections in the south being from Atlanta, a burgeoning hotbed of basketball talent with the rapid population growth in that state the last few decades.

 

[14Red]

And to be clear, I don’t like these mass transfers. My hope is that this yr is an anomaly due to the added Yr of eligibility. I’m also hoping the licensing & image rules that allow players to get paid will help keep the borderline NBA players in school.

Ba ha! The licensing and image rules are joke. First of all, there are about 3% of any college athletes who have enough juice to get paid, and they are already looking at a pro career. This will just turn into yet another thing that the schools will have to track. There will be cheating involved too. Big time recruit for State U will be asked to do a commercial for a local car dealership and they'll be paid way more than they should by the booster of the school, who happens to own the dealership. It's just organized cheating.

 

[14Red]

Not official yet, but by the sounds of it IU's third assistant is going to be Yasir Rosemond. He was most recently at Alabama on the previous coach's staff, and has also had stops at Georgia and Oregon before that.

Younger guy in his early to mid 40s that's supposed to be good with player development and supposedly has recruiting connections in the south being from Atlanta, a burgeoning hotbed of basketball talent with the rapid population growth in that state the last few decades.

Never heard of him, but seems like a good fit to the program.

 

[14Red]

Let’s be real most P5 Football & Basketball players are their to better their chances of a pro career. Of course, programs should be held to certain minimum academic requirements so athletes can take advantage of that education. However, we’re lying to ourselves if we think a degree is their top priority.

I'll agree, but only kind of. Out of any P5 football team, you may have at the major programs, 20 guys who are "NFL" caliber, and the mid major and lower programs maybe less than 5. That leaves alot of student athletes who are not going to be playing on Sundays. As universities, they still need to prepare the "majority" of their student athletes for life beyond sports, which begins alot faster for most of them than the few who make it.

 

[Omar]

Ba ha! The licensing and image rules are joke. First of all, there are about 3% of any college athletes who have enough juice to get paid, and they are already looking at a pro career. This will just turn into yet another thing that the schools will have to track. There will be cheating involved too. Big time recruit for State U will be asked to do a commercial for a local car dealership and they'll be paid way more than they should by the booster of the school, who happens to own the dealership. It's just organized cheating.

They’ll all get paid when the new NCAA video games come out.

 

[14Red]

They’ll all get paid when the new NCAA video games come out.

We'll see.

 

[nwwarrior09]

I don't see much cash getting around off of licensed NCAA video games once the pot is split up amongst everyone. The money that's out there to be made is going to be for the star players in men's basketball and football that are in major college towns/college markets like Columbus and Birmingham. On the women's side, some select athletes that have massive social media followings are going to have opportunities to make very good money advertising products on Instagram.

 

[14Red]

The IU staff is in place, Mike Woodson head coach, Thad Matta a special assistant, Kenya Hunter was retained from the previous staff, Dane Fife - former Hoosier and long time Michigan State assistant hired, and Yasir Rosemond was hired, most recently at Alabama.
As far as players involved, Al Durham is gone to Providence, Armon Franklin is going to Virgina and Joey Brunk is still looking but isn't coming back to IU.
So honestly from a month ago when Miller was let go, and we had 6-7 guys in the transfer portal, things look great now. The lynchpin in all this the return of Trayce Jackson Davis. Unless we brought in a ton from the transfer portal, next season would had been rough, but with TJD, this team can be very good.
A notable transfer is Xavier Johnson from Pitt. 3 year starter, aggressive point guard and I think can really make this team different. Probably the biggest flaw we had last season was the point guard position. Rob Phinesse simply has not developed as we thought. Khristian Lander simply wasn't ready to play or he could have easily moved into the starting spot last season.

Now I'm not saying this team is ready to hoist a banner, but with the guys who are back, adding Johnson and honestly the big ten is going to drop back next season. Although it was a disappointing tournament for the conference, it still loses alot of very skilled players from it's top teams.

 

[Thavoice]

Solid start to the Woodson Regime.
But then again, this is the easy part.

Cautiously optimistic. Rooting against the Zags got me into the NCAA games and tournament again and I look for that to vault myself into being a better Hoosier Fan once again.

 

[Stirred not Shaken]

Said this to my brother and will repeat here when it comes to trying to 'convince' some players who are wanting to transfer.

You come to Indiana to play for the name on the front of the jersey, not the back. Those back-of-the-jersey guys can go and transfer.
I only want those players who want to be Hoosiers. The rest, good riddance.

LOL, you win with talent and those type of players care about getting to the NBA as quickly as possible, period, nothing else. Look at Baylor most of their top players were transfers, the day of playing for State U are long gone.

 

[Omar]

LOL, you win with talent and those players care about getting to the NBA as quickly as possible, period, nothing else. Look at Baylor most of their top players were transfers, the day of playing for State U are long gone.

Yeah but only Mitchell and Butler are going to be NBA player, everyone else will bounce around the G League or play overseas.

 

[nwwarrior09]

Hoosiers have been hot on the trail the last couple of days...yesterday received a commitment from 4 star guard Tamar Bates, who was committed to Texas prior to Shaka leaving. The sites have him ranked somewhere around 50th-60th overall in this incoming freshman class.

Today they received a commitment from NW transfer Miller Kopp, who averaged in double figures the last two years for the Wildcats. A couple years ago he shot roughly 40% from three while averaging over 5 attempts per game.

 

[14Red]

Hoosiers have been hot on the trail the last couple of days...yesterday received a commitment from 4 star guard Tamar Bates, who was committed to Texas prior to Shaka leaving. The sites have him ranked somewhere around 50th-60th overall in this incoming freshman class.

Today they received a commitment from NW transfer Miller Kopp, who averaged in double figures the last two years for the Wildcats. A couple years ago he shot roughly 40% from three while averaging over 5 attempts per game.

It's been a good couple of weeks for Hoosier fans...As much as I like the pickups for Indiana, I don't like the direction college basketball is going. Spring is going to turn into a free for all with guys transferring from team to team. How long before we get a group of guys to all transfer to the same place (with some cash considerations) of course. Now the guys IU have got are not program changers, but the addition of 2-3 veteran players can make all the difference. This is a terrible precedence to set.

 

[nwwarrior09]

It's been a good couple of weeks for Hoosier fans...As much as I like the pickups for Indiana, I don't like the direction college basketball is going. Spring is going to turn into a free for all with guys transferring from team to team. How long before we get a group of guys to all transfer to the same place (with some cash considerations) of course. Now the guys IU have got are not program changers, but the addition of 2-3 veteran players can make all the difference. This is a terrible precedence to set.

This is going to be the new norm. I see it as a two-way street, as it seems that coaches are on the move between jobs much more frequently than they were in the past, and it seems that over the last decade or so "roster management" has increasingly spilled over from certain successful football programs to making its way into college hoops. I expect that at some point we will find out that certain schools having taken undue liberties with tampering and poaching successful players at lesser programs by enticing them into the portal/free agency for their additional year of eligibility or a prospective situation of having multiple years without having to sit out.

 

[14Red]

This is going to be the new norm. I see it as a two-way street, as it seems that coaches are on the move between jobs much more frequently than they were in the past, and it seems that over the last decade or so "roster management" has increasingly spilled over from certain successful football programs to making its way into college hoops. I expect that at some point we will find out that certain schools having taken undue liberties with tampering and poaching successful players at lesser programs by enticing them into the portal/free agency for their additional year of eligibility or a prospective situation of having multiple years without having to sit out.

I don't view coach movement and player movement as the same thing. Coaches are adults, this is there occupation. Now they are not guaranteed a coaching job, it's contract labor and they many times are either contractually obligated to do the job or work out a deal to get out.
I view college athletes totally different. I'm old school and I feel that the athlete or student-athlete chooses a school some because of the athletics, but as much for the academic opportunities. Now I know that's not the case in all situations, but we've got way too loosey goosey with allowing kids to just move from school to school.

And yes, this will work out that some schools will seem to get the cream of the crop, both in incoming freshmen and transfers, and believe me money will become an issue. It always does.

Football and basketball are completely different, you can turn a program around with two star players, can't do that in football.

 

[nwwarrior09]

I don't view coach movement and player movement as the same thing. Coaches are adults, this is there occupation. Now they are not guaranteed a coaching job, it's contract labor and they many times are either contractually obligated to do the job or work out a deal to get out.
I view college athletes totally different. I'm old school and I feel that the athlete or student-athlete chooses a school some because of the athletics, but as much for the academic opportunities. Now I know that's not the case in all situations, but we've got way too loosey goosey with allowing kids to just move from school to school.

And yes, this will work out that some schools will seem to get the cream of the crop, both in incoming freshmen and transfers, and believe me money will become an issue. It always does.

Football and basketball are completely different, you can turn a program around with two star players, can't do that in football.

This is wherein the problem lies. College hoops and college football have become big business financially, and many of those participating aren't maxing out their educational opportunities due to the scheduling demands of their sport as demanded by their athletic program. Many schools encourage certain "easier" majors due to time constraints, and you can especially see this a lot in football with programs that have big numbers of players clumped into something like kinesiology, exercise science, or general studies.

The system is set up to encourage the athlete to see the sport as the main thing, and the way their educational component is set up for them they should view it that way as their best career opportunities for most of them will be either pro sports or working connections from their school's athletic department and alumni to land jobs. Those two sports have become amateur in name only.

 

[14Red]

This is wherein the problem lies. College hoops and college football have become big business financially, and many of those participating aren't maxing out their educational opportunities due to the scheduling demands of their sport as demanded by their athletic program. Many schools encourage certain "easier" majors due to time constraints, and you can especially see this a lot in football with programs that have big numbers of players clumped into something like kinesiology, exercise science, or general studies.

The system is set up to encourage the athlete to see the sport as the main thing, and the way their educational component is set up for them they should view it that way as their best career opportunities for most of them will be either pro sports or working connections from their school's athletic department and alumni to land jobs. Those two sports have become amateur in name only.

Boy we think alot alike, scary eh? You are 100% correct. Many of these kids would have no shot at a college education if it wasn't for sports, yet the narrative isn't to build their life with athletics AND education, but they just see the .5% chance they can hit the lottery and sign a multi-million dollar contract. Football is especially bad with this. For most that do play in the NFL, it's for a season or two, short contracts and no guarantees. We force feed hundreds of college football players annually into a system where they have little chance to succeed financially. They they are 27 years old, their football career is over and they have nothing to fall back on, that's if they finished their degree to begin with.

Sadly, we as fans encourage this because we don't publicize graduation rates as much as we do wins, losses and deep tournament runs. In a perfect world we'd give coaches who graduate players and keep them out of the police blotter the long term contracts and not fire them for losing more than winning.

 

[nooks]

I think the hire will be indicative of how relevant IU basketball still is or isn't. I'm sure Matta's name will start getting floated. Even seeing the Brad Stevens rumors starting. Others being mentioned are Tony Bennett, Scott Drew, Beard, as already mentioned, Beilein, and some assistants.

Hey...and Bennett can still sing! Not sure if he can still walk though, or scream...