23-24 SW Ohio

Saturday's Games
Milford (-28.5) @ Colerain
Oak Hills @ Harrison (-2.5)
Lakota West (-7.5) @ Fairfield
Ross (-0.5) @ Middletown
Centerville (-17.5) @ St. Ursula
Mount Notre Dame @ Mason (-0.5)
 
SWO RPI said:
Saturday's Games
Milford (-28.5) @ Colerain
Oak Hills @ Harrison (-2.5)
Lakota West (-7.5) @ Fairfield
Ross (-0.5) @ Middletown
Centerville (-17.5) @ St. Ursula
Mount Notre Dame @ Mason (-0.5)
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All the favorites won based on RPI except 2.5 point underdog Oak Hills picked up their 8th road win in a 9-6 season defeating 13-3 Harrison 43-40.
 
IMPORTANT WEEKEND RESULTS WITH SEEDING IMPLICATIONS
Princeton over Lakota East
Mason over MND
Oak Hills over Harrison

Computer points look to be updated on OHSAA.org this AM
Princeton should be 1, but probably won’t matter as now it looks like Mason will be 1 and Princeton 2 when seeding takes place
East will be in best situation because they’ll be able to choose what path of teams to face

NO WAY THERE ARE 10 TEAMS BETTER THAN LAKOTA EAST IN SW OH D1 GIRLS BASKETBALL, MAYBE 5

IMG_0892.jpeg
 
SWOHHSfan said:
IMPORTANT WEEKEND RESULTS WITH SEEDING IMPLICATIONS
Princeton over Lakota East
Mason over MND
Oak Hills over Harrison

Computer points look to be updated on OHSAA.org this AM
Princeton should be 1, but probably won’t matter as now it looks like Mason will be 1 and Princeton 2 when seeding takes place
East will be in best situation because they’ll be able to choose what path of teams to face

NO WAY THERE ARE 10 TEAMS BETTER THAN LAKOTA EAST IN SW OH D1 GIRLS BASKETBALL, MAYBE 5

View attachment 53267
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Odd season for Lakota East. Tough schedule but haven't gotten over the hump. 2 point loss @Princeton in heartbreaking fashion (where's the guy that said the this being a home game wouldn't matter? Home games could easily be a 2 point swing or more), loss vs Mason (after leading at half and getting outshot 32-8 on the FT line), 5 point loss to Pickerington Central (currently 2nd highest RPI in OH), shorthanded close losses to Alter and Springboro (on a buzzer beater). They can compete with anyone it seems, but haven't finished it out.

Mason led MND just about the whole way. Parrish got to the line 15 times and MND fouled 24 times. Mason is apparently very good at defending without fouling, while also getting to the FT more than any other team in the GMC. Mason certainly has their fair share of good wins. Lebanon, Lakota West, Lakota East, Bellbrook, MND.

Springboro looks like they have a good chance to finish out winning the GWOC, with Fairmont and Beavercreek right behind. Beavercreek is another interesting team. Some big losses to MND and Purcell but wins over Mason, Bellbrook, Springboro, Fairmont. They can compete with anyone on any given night.

West Clermont still has some big games to keep their ECC lead. @KINGS, @Winton Woods, Walnut Hills. They've been impressive and I didn't think they would be as good as they are.

Still can't convince me that Harrison is top 10 in D1 SWOH. Losses to Ross, Oak Hills, Mt. Healthy and wins over....CHL and MVC teams? Probably could make a similar statement on Goshen.
 
Checking SW D1 RPI today and noticed that #17 Mt. Healthy is listed as 8-7, but on the SWOC page they are 10-7-----two games vs Hamilton and Northwest which they won have not been recorded in Max Preps--they were played on 1/8 and 1/10. The problem comes in that they have 2 wins recorded in Max Preps over 8-6 Withrow when they only played once and a win over 2-8 Hughes that shows up on the SWOC site but not in their Max Preps schedule at all?????? With the tourney draw in less than 2 weeks it's essential that teams have all results posted and that the RPI is correct as teams that beat Mt. Healthy are affected by them not putting their results into Max Preps in a timely fashion/and recording wins and losses correctly vs opponents. The selection order of placing a team on the bracket is critical to being accurate with this new RPI system----c'mon Mt. Healthy get things correct before the draw.
 
CometCountry said:
Checking SW D1 RPI today and noticed that #17 Mt. Healthy is listed as 8-7, but on the SWOC page they are 10-7-----two games vs Hamilton and Northwest which they won have not been recorded in Max Preps--they were played on 1/8 and 1/10. The problem comes in that they have 2 wins recorded in Max Preps over 8-6 Withrow when they only played once and a win over 2-8 Hughes that shows up on the SWOC site but not in their Max Preps schedule at all?????? With the tourney draw in less than 2 weeks it's essential that teams have all results posted and that the RPI is correct as teams that beat Mt. Healthy are affected by them not putting their results into Max Preps in a timely fashion/and recording wins and losses correctly vs opponents. The selection order of placing a team on the bracket is critical to being accurate with this new RPI system----c'mon Mt. Healthy get things correct before the draw.
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This is a bigger issue than just Mt. Healthy.

The OHSAA RPI is also currently counting Winton Woods loss to example sports (prep-school which should not count toward record) and has the Example record as 11-6 which is also nowhere close to being correct. Not only does this mess up WW RPI, but also all of their opponents who are now being docked on OOP (opponents opponent record) while West Clermont is not being docked for their loss to a team from Canada which is correct. Princeton no credit toward record for beating Niagara Prep from Canada, which is correct but also plays a major factor in seeding and Win %.
There are errors like this up and down the state at the moment.
 
I agree with you that the OHSAA is going to have to do some leg work to get the out-of-state teams records correct---it just seems that Mt. Healthy could at least post results that happened 12-14 days ago and to have their schedule at least accurate in Max Preps ( playing Withrow once and Hughes once and not Withrow 2 times) compared to what is on the SWOC website-----in 12 days at noon RPI will be determined on February 3rd for the draw on 2/4!!
 
Lebanon loses @Walnut Hills tonight. Walnut Hills now has wins over West Clermont, Milford and Lebanon. Lebanon has dropped two straight after winning 9 in a row.

Winton Woods beats Kings pretty easily. They seem to be finding their rhythm.

Goshen over Western Brown pretty easily.
 
JackAttack99 said:
Lebanon loses @Walnut Hills tonight. Walnut Hills now has wins over West Clermont, Milford and Lebanon. Lebanon has dropped two straight after winning 9 in a row.

Winton Woods beats Kings pretty easily. They seem to be finding their rhythm.

Goshen over Western Brown pretty easily.
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6 in a row for Walnut, with a good chance to make it 7 vs. Anderson next.

Conference title is pretty much out of reach, but they're going into the tournament with some great momentum.
 
Tuesday's Games
Princeton (-12.5) @ Lakota West
Seton (-9.5) @ Mercy McAuley
Mount Notre Dame (-35) @ Ursuline

Wednesday Games
Oak Hills @ Lakota West (-10.5)
Middletown (-9.5) @ Hamilton
Fairfield @ Lakota East (-18.5)
Colerain @ Mason (-49.5)
Princeton (-43.5) @ Sycamore
Mt. Healthy @ Harrison (-8.5)
Northwest @ Talawanda (-23.5)

Thursday Games
Loveland @ Lebanon (-19.5)
Milford (-15.5) @ Turpin
Walnut Hills (-26.5) @ Anderson
West Clermont (-4.5) @ Kings
Winton Woods (-22.5) @ Little Miami
Monroe @ Bellbrook (-23.5)
Seton (-11.5) @ Edgewood

Just one game with a spread of less than 8.5 over the next three days.
 
Does anyone know for sure if new basketball Computer Rankings for seeding will also pre-determine brackets like football?
(1v16, 2v15…, then 1v16 winner vs 8v9 winner in 2nd round)

Or will they only determine ranking 1-35 in D1 SW OH?

Then traditional way of draw will take place?
#1 seed places themselves on bracket, followed by all teams in numerical order
 
SWOHHSfan said:
Does anyone know for sure if new basketball Computer Rankings for seeding will also pre-determine brackets like football?
(1v16, 2v15…, then 1v16 winner vs 8v9 winner in 2nd round)

Or will they only determine ranking 1-35 in D1 SW OH?

Then traditional way of draw will take place?
#1 seed places themselves on bracket, followed by all teams in numerical order
Click to expand...
The traditional way will take place once computer rankings are completed.
 
SWOHHSfan said:
Does anyone know for sure if new basketball Computer Rankings for seeding will also pre-determine brackets like football?
(1v16, 2v15…, then 1v16 winner vs 8v9 winner in 2nd round)

Or will they only determine ranking 1-35 in D1 SW OH?

Then traditional way of draw will take place?
#1 seed places themselves on bracket, followed by all teams in numerical order
Click to expand...
As John Doe said 1-10 will pick a place on the bracket, but they do have the ability to pass if they'd like and let the next team place on a line---after #10 goes on then #11 thru #35 will go on a line of their choice--no passes for #11 thru #35. Likely that #26 thru #35 are going to be stuck in a spot of choosing a bye or facing teams #1-#5 in a 1st round match-up---right now that would be Little Miami, Sycamore, St. Ursula, Northwest, Middletown, Ursuline, Western Hills, Anderson, Colerain, Hamilton.
 
CometCountry said:
Checking SW D1 RPI today and noticed that #17 Mt. Healthy is listed as 8-7, but on the SWOC page they are 10-7-----two games vs Hamilton and Northwest which they won have not been recorded in Max Preps--they were played on 1/8 and 1/10. The problem comes in that they have 2 wins recorded in Max Preps over 8-6 Withrow when they only played once and a win over 2-8 Hughes that shows up on the SWOC site but not in their Max Preps schedule at all?????? With the tourney draw in less than 2 weeks it's essential that teams have all results posted and that the RPI is correct as teams that beat Mt. Healthy are affected by them not putting their results into Max Preps in a timely fashion/and recording wins and losses correctly vs opponents. The selection order of placing a team on the bracket is critical to being accurate with this new RPI system----c'mon Mt. Healthy get things correct before the draw.
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OHSAA just updated the RPI from last night---looks like someone from Mt. Healthy was reading Yappi and they've gotten their games updated in MaxPreps to a 10-8 record, but they are still showing two wins over Withrow instead of one win over Withrow and one win over 2-8 Hughes---need to get this cleaned up to make it accurate by 2/3, as well as any other teams that are tardy on posting results or playing the correct opponents.
 
Gerton and Givens didn't play and West gets the win. Wouldn't be surprised if this is just a case of Davis resting players. Gerton also sat against Fairfield earlier this year.
 
I was at the game--neither Gerton or Givens were even at the game---assume they were both sick. Princeton led 30-21 at the half but West tied it at 39 after 3 quarters and won 56-48. I imagine the Comets of Mason appreciate the help from Lakota West tonight.
 
Princeton has the flu bug. I was very impressed with all the freshman they played tonight. Young crew went neck to neck with West.
 
Seed Predictions - Loosely based on SWO RPI of game predictions before draw
1. Mason
2. Princeton
3. MND
4. Winton Woods or West Clermont
5. Winton Woods or West Clermont

6. Lebanon
7. Lakota East or Lakota West
8. Goshen
9. Lakota East or Lakota West
10. Harrison

Kings Milford and Walnut outside the top 10 seeds
 
Madame Secretary said:
Seed Predictions - Loosely based on SWO RPI of game predictions before draw
1. Mason
2. Princeton
3. MND
4. Winton Woods or West Clermont
5. Winton Woods or West Clermont

6. Lebanon
7. Lakota East or Lakota West
8. Goshen
9. Lakota East or Lakota West
10. Harrison

Kings Milford and Walnut outside the top 10 seeds
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The Top 16 of 35 teams as of today in Division 1 per the RPI--results count up thru games of February 2nd--Draw is 2/4/24

1Mason0.7035570.8750000.6089090.56175414-2
2Princeton (Cincinnati)0.6829800.8571430.5620410.57363312-2
3Mount Notre Dame (Cincinnati)0.6772990.8333330.5715580.57568015-3
4West Clermont (Cincinnati)0.6753990.8823530.5334590.54299015-2
5Lakota West (West Chester)0.6547350.7857140.5758990.55553811-3
6Winton Woods (Cincinnati)0.6440010.7058820.6327750.56070612-5
7Lebanon0.6261950.7368420.5443800.56370214-5
8Goshen0.6228100.7777780.5114830.53071914-4
9Harrison0.6086810.7647060.5058900.50294913-4
10Lakota East (Liberty Township)0.6028630.6000000.6371240.5594799-6
11Walnut Hills (Cincinnati)0.6021820.6666670.5630260.55382512-6
12Milford0.5997200.7222220.4947000.55074613-5
13Kings (Kings Mill)0.5879250.6250000.5655470.55993310-6
14Western Brown (Mt. Orab)0.5802670.6470590.5477140.51897511-6
15Ross (Hamilton)0.5725530.6470590.5188710.52849911-6
16Oak Hills (Cincinnati)0.5582720.6250000.4975910.53646110-6
 
Madame Secretary said:
I see these as the games before draw that will be highly contested and could have an impact on the seeding. Of course all games matter but these appear to me to be the ones that could raise or drop a team's MaxPreps RPI

Mt. Healthy at Harrison
West Clermont at Kings
West Clermont at Winton Woods
Walnut Hills at West Clermont
Lebanon at Milford
Kings at Walnut Hills
Lakota West at Lakota East
Batavia at Goshen
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Those are big games for sure. What's disappointing is ALL GAMES actually don't matter, as some teams will play 3 to 4 more games after the seeds are set. I support this RPI system, BUT not with the season of games not completed.
 
Richmond said:
Those are big games for sure. What's disappointing is ALL GAMES actually don't matter, as some teams will play 3 to 4 more games after the seeds are set. I support this RPI system, BUT not with the season of games not completed.
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The seeding and draw has always taken place with one week left in the regular season---some schools will have finished their schedule before the draw such as ECC schools Lebanon, Walnut, Milford, Loveland, and Anderson----the problem is then the sectional tournament doesn't begin until 2/12,2/13, and 2/17 for opening round games---these schools could have up to over 2 weeks without playing a game. Most of the D1 schools are playing games after the draw to stay sharp and that is how the GMC league schedule fell for some match-ups this season.

The tournament site managers and schools need at least a week to secure workers for the numerous nights holding games while the schools have ticket sales and bus schedules to set up---can't have the draw on Sunday 2/11 and begin playing games on 2/12 or 2/13---logistics is important in running the sectional tournament for 35 teams just in Division 1 much less 3 other divisions in SW Ohio.
 
CometCountry said:
The seeding and draw has always taken place with one week left in the regular season---some schools will have finished their schedule before the draw such as ECC schools Lebanon, Walnut, Milford, Loveland, and Anderson----the problem is then the sectional tournament doesn't begin until 2/12,2/13, and 2/17 for opening round games---these schools could have up to over 2 weeks without playing a game. Most of the D1 schools are playing games after the draw to stay sharp and that is how the GMC league schedule fell for some match-ups this season.

The tournament site managers and schools need at least a week to secure workers for the numerous nights holding games while the schools have ticket sales and bus schedules to set up---can't have the draw on Sunday 2/11 and begin playing games on 2/12 or 2/13---logistics is important in running the sectional tournament for 35 teams just in Division 1 much less 3 other divisions in SW Ohio.
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The sites, dates, times have been scheduled for over a month. The sites know when their dates/times are, just don't know the teams, which doesn't impact workers, officials etc. al that is already determined. Buses, that takes a day to schedule. Tickets are all electronic

Yes, the old way the seasons weren't complete, but you voted, where teams could take into account other factors, I just feel if you're using this type of system it should be complete

Football seeds are released on Sunday, somehow they manage to play in 4 days on Friday. Simple solution, seed it like football, if your using this system it should be like that anyway.

I like the system, just think they went halfway.

It definitely makes for good discussion, and no matter what system they use SW DI will continue to be a strong tournament.
 
Mason-Princeton or Princeton-Mason doesn't really matter. They will be aligned to play in the Regional Finals no matter where they are seeded. MND or whoever is 3rd gets to choose which one they see first on the tournament brackets. After that it's just about open brackets and matchups. It will be interesting to see which way the third seed goes and to see how Goshen and Harrison do with the seeding. If it were voted like in the past, I do not believe either one one them would be in the top 10 whether they deserve to be or not. This is new, so it will be interesting to see how the coaches handle it.
 
Madame Secretary said:
Mason-Princeton or Princeton-Mason doesn't really matter. They will be aligned to play in the Regional Finals no matter where they are seeded. MND or whoever is 3rd gets to choose which one they see first on the tournament brackets. After that it's just about open brackets and matchups. It will be interesting to see which way the third seed goes and to see how Goshen and Harrison do with the seeding. If it were voted like in the past, I do not believe either one one them would be in the top 10 whether they deserve to be or not. This is new, so it will be interesting to see how the coaches handle it.
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Not sure how you can say these games don’t matter:

Fairfield-Milford
Lakota East-Winton Woods
Kings-Fairmont
Mason-Princeton
Mason-Lakota West
Lakota East-Mason
Princeton-Lakota West

if Princeton dropped the Mason game or another one to Lakota West, based on record, Opponent win % and OOWP, MND would be the 2 seed. Lakota East with wins over Winton Woods or Mason could move up significantly. All of these teams in the 4-10 range like Lakota West, Winton Woods, West Clermont, and Lakota East could have major movement. If Lakota East or West Clermont beat Winton Woods (both pretty possible) and Lakota West loses to Princeton or Mason, Lebanon would be 5 and picking their own sectional playing a lower seed to get to a district game. They didn’t get to play Mason or Winton Woods or WC after the draw… instead they’ll be probably be 7 picking whether they want to play Princeton/Mason/or MND in a sectional final just to get a district game appearance. Tell them that’s fair. West Clermont could be a 3 in certain scenarios and that’s the difference between getting to play Springboro or Beavercreek in a district game vs. Mason or Princeton if one of them choose Cincinnati. Results could also be the difference between playing Princeton/Mason in a district final vs. a regional final. It absolutely matters. A 5 seed gets their own sectional and plays a lower seed in a sectional final. A 9 probably has to play 2 higher seeds just to get to a district. It also just leaves a massive unknown for coaches picking opponents. You don’t think they want to see how Lakota East fares against Mason and Winton Woods in their current form before deciding to play them? Or wanting to see Lakota West play against Princeton when they aren’t missing their two leading scorers? It’s an unnecessary premature draw. Host sites know when they’re hosting. Football has no issue making it work on 4 days notice.
 
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Northside24 said:
Not sure how you can say these games don’t matter:

Fairfield-Milford
Lakota East-Winton Woods
Kings-Fairmont
Mason-Princeton
Mason-Lakota West
Lakota East-Mason
Princeton-Lakota West

if Princeton dropped the Mason game or another one to Lakota West, based on record, Opponent win % and OOWP, MND would be the 2 seed. Lakota East with wins over Winton Woods or Mason could move up significantly. All of these teams in the 4-10 range like Lakota West, Winton Woods, West Clermont, and Lakota East could have major movement. If Lakota East or West Clermont beat Winton Woods (both pretty possible) and Lakota West loses to Princeton or Mason, Lebanon would be 5 and picking their own sectional playing a lower seed to get to a district game. They didn’t get to play Mason or Winton Woods or WC after the draw… instead they’ll be probably be 7 picking whether they want to play Princeton/Mason/or MND in a sectional final just to get a district game appearance. Tell them that’s fair. West Clermont could be a 3 in certain scenarios and that’s the difference between getting to play Springboro or Beavercreek in a district game vs. Mason or Princeton if one of them choose Cincinnati. Results could also be the difference between playing Princeton/Mason in a district final vs. a regional final. It absolutely matters. A 5 seed gets their own sectional and plays a lower seed in a sectional final. A 9 probably has to play 2 higher seeds just to get to a district. It also just leaves a massive unknown for coaches picking opponents. You don’t think they want to see how Lakota East fares against Mason and Winton Woods in their current form before deciding to play them? Or wanting to see Lakota West play against Princeton when they aren’t missing their two leading scorers? It’s an unnecessary premature draw. Host sites know when they’re hosting. Football has no issue making it work on 4 days notice.
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In an effort to be clear, I totally agree with you that all games should count toward seeding. However, I also believe that if all games were played, Mason and Princeton would be aligned to not meet before the Regional finals. I believe that would happen even if one of them dropped significantly in the seedings. Springboro and Beavercreek will do the same on the other side. I am saying the rest of the bracket will be built around the concept of avoiding those two as long as possible. Which, again you are right, makes a tough choice for the 5th seed.

The reason for seeding early is most likely for teams to be able to prepare over the sites being able to prepare.
 
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