2022 GCYL Football

ElderMackStud

Active member
All of these Leagues are private and the AOC doesn't have any legal right or management of the teams/leagues. Having said that the AOC does own just about all the facilities the League/teams use. In theory the AOC could leverage ownership of the facilities but up to this point the AOC has demonstrated they do not want to get involved with the GCYL, GCCYS, WBC, GWAC, CYO, or any of the other Leagues in the area. As long as the folks running the leagues and each individual program don't do anything completely stupid it is very unlikely the AOC will ever get involved in the Leagues.
They tried this a while back and the leagues/Parish's pushed back successfully. I haven't been to a grade school athletic event this year but heard that there are things that they are doing that the AOC asked for

Here is a link that is on the AOC website

At the end of they day - too much $'s in the Athletic Coffers that the AOC can't ignore.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
In your hypothetical, you can't seem to separate the two pieces to it.

Part A
If someone from Jude wanted their kids to play for Visitation using the Parish Family as an argument as to why, your question is would the Priest approve? Yes the Priest would approve.

Part B
The League has rules stating that kids who go to school at St Jude play for the Volunteer Program - which is the combination of kids from the following schools - St Jude, St Als Bridgetown, St Catharine, St Martin and Lourdes.

You're suggesting the Priest has the ability to change the League rules. I disagree with that assertion in your hypothetical. No flip-flop here.

Now down the line the League will have to look at the way the teams are put together because this can and probably will happen at some point, but currently the League has rules in place for how players from each school are separated.
This is kind of exactly what I said.

I can separate them. I don't think a Priest has the ability to change rules. I don't think a Priest cares about the league rules or would even try to change them. He doesn't have to follow them. It's the opposite - he can make decisions in contrast to league rules. The league can still have rules, but the priest can always override them. And in this situation, he would.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
All of these Leagues are private and the AOC doesn't have any legal right or management of the teams/leagues.
Correct - but the AOC is under no obligation to follow their rules either. They can, at any time, make a decision regarding one of their students that would stand, and would go against league rules.
 

adselder09

Well-known member
This is kind of exactly what I said.

I can separate them. I don't think a Priest has the ability to change rules. I don't think a Priest cares about the league rules or would even try to change them. He doesn't have to follow them. It's the opposite - he can make decisions in contrast to league rules. The league can still have rules, but the priest can always override them. And in this situation, he would.
Clearly you can't, because you aren't following any of this.

If the League already has rules in place, the Priest cannot unilaterally say yes this kid can play here, even though it is against league rules. The team would be using an illegal player and would forfeit any games the illegal player had/would play in.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
If the League already has rules in place, the Priest cannot unilaterally say yes this kid can play here, even though it is against league rules. The team would be using an illegal player and would forfeit any games the illegal player had/would play in.
Again, right now, yes, that's probably true (there have been situations where this has happened). Granted, these times have been extenuating circumstances (e.g. bullying), but it has happened. They wouldn't allow it just because a kid wants to play with his friends. But in the situation quoted below, what grounds do you have to deny it when the other school is within the parish family?

Knowing the current circumstance where a parish kid might want to play for a parish team, I think it would be a slam-dunk, immediate yes from the pastor. He may communicate with the league, but he's not entitled to.

Put yourself in the pastor's shoes - how could you say no, unless he uses some of the rules that @IKS posted.

"Father Joe, I really love our new parish family. Jimmy has made a ton of friends with some of the Visitation kids and our family has also made some great new connections at Church and through the consolidation. He loves football and his new friends want him to play with them at Visitation. Why on earth do we play with Lourdes if they aren't even in our family? He can play with Visitation right?"

Again, unless the pastor brings out some canon law stuff that will gaze everyone's eyes over, on what grounds can a pastor say no to this? And this could happen tomorrow.
 
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adselder09

Well-known member
Again, right now, yes, that's probably true (there have been situations where this has happened).

Knowing the current circumstance where a parish kid might want to play for a parish team, I think it would be a slam-dunk, immediate yes from the pastor. He may communicate with the league, but he's not entitled to.

Put yourself in the pastor's shoes - how could you say no, unless he uses some of the rules that @IKS posted.

"Father Joe, I really love our new parish family. Jimmy has made a ton of friends with some of the Visitation kids and our family has also made some great new connections at Church and through the consolidation. He loves football and his new friends want him to play with them at Visitation. Why on earth do we play with Lourdes if they aren't even in our family? He can play with Visitation right?"

Again, unless the pastor brings out some canon law stuff that will gaze everyone's eyes over, on what grounds can a pastor say no to this? And this could happen tomorrow.
LOL dude are you serious? How do you not follow this.

If this were to happen tomorrow, the League would say no. We have rules in place. St Jude kids play for the Volunteer Program. It wouldn't matter if the Priest says it is fine. He probably doesn't know the rules to begin with.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
LOL dude are you serious? How do you not follow this.

If this were to happen tomorrow, the League would say no. We have rules in place. St Jude kids play for the Volunteer Program. It wouldn't matter if the Priest says it is fine. He probably doesn't know the rules to begin with.
So you're telling me that the league is going to trump the Pastor in this situation?

I completely and wholeheartedly disagree. The league doesn't tell a pastor how to make decisions at his parish - they simply can't. A pastor absolutely would be the final say in this case. Now, he may deny it, but he definitely has the power to approve it.

And when I say tomorrow, I don't mean for kids to move in the middle of a season, that would be dumb. I mean just in general (e.g. if the league didn't change anything next year, and multiple families wanted to move to programs within their parish family).
 
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adselder09

Well-known member
So you're telling me that the league is going to trump the Pastor in this situation?

I completely and wholeheartedly disagree. The league tell a pastor how to make decisions at his parish - they simply can't. A pastor absolutely would be the final say in this case. Now, he may deny it, but he definitely has the power to approve it.

And when I say tomorrow, I don't mean for kids to move in the middle of a season, that would be dumb. I mean just in general (e.g. if the league didn't change anything next year, and multiple families wanted to move to programs within their parish family).
Yes that's what I'm telling you.

The League may have to change its rules based on the new Parish Families, I already said that earlier. But if the rules state that St Jude goes with this program and not Visitation. Then no, the Visitation Pastor would have the ability to veto league rules.

In that situation, you would likely have to petition the league to play for Visitation and state their case as to why. Then a decision would be made one way or another.
 
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E82

Active member
I have a friend that's a pastor of a large group of combined parishes in the AOC. He has no time for involvement in sports and rarely gets involved in the day to day running of the schools. He barely has enough time in a day to run the churches.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
I have no doubt they don't want anything to do with sports.

But in the situation I described, that could happen at any point, I think it would be hard for the pastor to deny the request. I think some of these questions will happen in football next year. In fact, I've already heard some parents ask the question in group parish settings. It's honestly what opened my eyes to the scenario. The person being asked the question (parish rep or whatever they call them) had no clue how to answer it.
 
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Patchwork

Active member
I wondered that as well with 3rd/4th splitting, but I assumed it was a coaching availability deal. That said, all these kids are getting to play on Saturdays as well as in the weekday games so they are all being developed. It helps when nobody has scored on you outside six points in one of the three B games and on TD after the score was frozen in a Saturday game.
It doesn’t make sense for anyone with 40 kids to not split unless the numbers are upside down in one grade over another. Finding coaches can also be a challenge to take a group on.
 
I heard Cov Cath will be banned from the league as early as next year. Supposedly the GCYL Coaches and orgs are fed up with them drawing from everywhere in NKY and being able to form 1 team. It would be about the equivalent of Jude Visi Victory Lourdes and Antoninus taking the top players from each school and forming a super team and playing in the league.
That’s ridiculous- The radius from which CovCath draws is actually smaller than Elder and X. The overall student population of CCH is significantly less. You’re just butt hurt bc the Ky boys are blessed with a talented class. Get over it, coach your kids up and quit whining.
 
…further, from what I’ve seen, you could go ahead a create a team of top players from Jude, Visi, Victory, Lourdes, and Antoninus, and CYF would still win. Why can’t you just appreciate talent when you see it?
 

Westsidepublic

Active member
That’s ridiculous- The radius from which CovCath draws is actually smaller than Elder and X. The overall student population of CCH is significantly less. You’re just butt hurt bc the Ky boys are blessed with a talented class. Get over it, coach your kids up and quit whining.
Huh? That wasn’t my point. Many of the CYF kids won’t go to CCH either.
Your point still make no sense. This discussion has nothing to do with where Elder and X draw from. Or even CCH. How many Parishes does the CYA draw from,
 

MickeyMantle

Well-known member
…further, from what I’ve seen, you could go ahead a create a team of top players from Jude, Visi, Victory, Lourdes, and Antoninus, and CYF would still win. Why can’t you just appreciate talent when you see it?
Out of curiosity: How does CovCath decide who plays on the 6th grade team, the combo team and the 5th grade team?
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
…further, from what I’ve seen, you could go ahead a create a team of top players from Jude, Visi, Victory, Lourdes, and Antoninus, and CYF would still win. Why can’t you just appreciate talent when you see it?
It's called a constant inferiority complex in this forum.

If someone is better, they're automatically cheating. That's the way it works here.
 

Westsidepublic

Active member
It's called a constant inferiority complex in this forum.

If someone is better, they're automatically cheating. That's the way it works here.
Trey, just so I understand, you believe this Cov. Cath model is the way to do it. Take all the kids on the west side make a select team and anyone that doesn’t make the select team should go play in their own league at much lower competition playing the same teams over and over again. Isn’t this what you criticized the little panther basketball program of doing. It must be a great life to just complain all the time and then tell people they are wrong
 

AlMar35

New member
Is Cov Cath doing anything against the rules? Why complain and kick them out vs addressing it through a rule update? It seems like every school looks for loopholes and whines at whoever benefits the most from them. Also, did I read correctly on this thread that kids can transfer from public schools repeat a grade and be a year older than everyone? How is this not addressed yet?
 

Westsidepublic

Active member
I think Trey is the only one that had said the word cheating. But should the goal of the league should be parity. If there is a team that is made up of 10 schools and has enough player to create 3 teams and they have 1 very good team and 2 teams that are not very competitive the league would should probably split the program into 2 or 3. If a team or program is exposing loopholes, the league should close them which they have done with repeating grades or kids being too old
 

AlMar35

New member
Agreed, a fix needs to happen. I read that there was talk of banning Cov Cath, which seems drastic vs a rule change. Whether Cov Cath should have used a little common sense here is another story, anything to get an edge I guess.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
Trey, just so I understand, you believe this Cov. Cath model is the way to do it. Take all the kids on the west side make a select team and anyone that doesn’t make the select team should go play in their own league at much lower competition playing the same teams over and over again. Isn’t this what you criticized the little panther basketball program of doing. It must be a great life to just complain all the time and then tell people they are wrong
1. Is it that much different from what St James or other schools that combines 5+ schools are doing?
2. I have no problem with the Little Panther program taking the best players. My problem is that they don't have open tryouts until 7th and 8th grade, and everything before that is hand-picked by dads and they never open it up outside of the feeders. I don't see a parallel here, in fact, it's the opposite.
3. There have been numerous people here complain about Cov Cath. I don't remember if they call it cheating, but that's what they're implying.
4. I'm not Footballjunkieky
 
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OnTheLine85

Well-known member
I think Trey is the only one that had said the word cheating. But should the goal of the league should be parity. If there is a team that is made up of 10 schools and has enough player to create 3 teams and they have 1 very good team and 2 teams that are not very competitive the league would should probably split the program into 2 or 3. If a team or program is exposing loopholes, the league should close them which they have done with repeating grades or kids being too old
Exactly - for example, say Visitation and Jude end up combining teams. Have tryouts for the first team, and the 2nd (and 3rd team) team can play in a lower division.
 

OnTheLine85

Well-known member
The point is - there has to be a vision from the leagues. You can't just continue to do the same things when everything is changing around you. Consolidation is going to happen - might as well start to lay the path for what that looks like within the sports leagues (doesn't have to be right away, but lay out the 3-5 year plan). Denying it or avoiding it to maintain status quo is just dumb.
 
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