Harrisburg

 
How many bids are given per age group? A lot of pressure on Vanguard 18 to perform to this tournament. Would hope they get over the hump from the other bid tournaments and string together some wins on the final day.

Side topic, since the winter club session is almost over are there any players on the 2nd team that have been playing better than those on the 1st team?

Same question just re-phrased: If the coaches selected one or two different players that are now on the 2nd team, would Vanguard's 1st team have a bid already?
 
I know at the 18s level there are 3 Bids available.

Also, from Vanguard I think that Oliver Miller and Deion Woodson would've added depth to the 18-1s team and could've helped in achieving a bid.
 
Sweetnothin said:
I know at the 18s level there are 3 Bids available.



Also, from Vanguard I think that Oliver Miller and Deion Woodson would've added depth to the 18-1s team and could've helped in achieving a bid.
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Possibly. But then who would you take off of the current 18-1's to make room for them?



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They wouldn't have to remove anyone, they would just have more guys on the roster and be able to rest guys in grueling 3 day tourneys.
 
True. But they pretty much stick to 10 man rosters on all of their gold teams


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So whats the ideal number to put on a team? 14; 1 backup for each position? 10; starters + 3 subs? 6; the minimum required? All of the best on 1 team?

Certainly there are pros and cons for each scenario - but Sweetnothin' makes a great point. Where do you draw the line?
 
For club, it all depends on the personnel you have trying out. I would say 9-11 players per club team is good. 2 Setters, 3/4 Outsides/OPP, 1/2 DS, 3 MB. This can obviously be tweaked if you have a player or who can function at a high level at multiple positions, or players who are specialized (OH who does not pass well, or one setter who has size and skill to run a 5-1).

I don't believe the Vanguard coaching staff made any wrong decisions with their team selection, just curious what others thought
 
I think a current example of this would be HPSTL. They currently have 12 on their roster and in past years they've had 14.

Granted, they have a very talented program all the way around, but they do have the ability to pull key players to rest them for a match or two during the long weekend tournaments. They are fortunate that they have enough talent that there is not a significant drop-off in the substitution.

I don't think Vanguard necessarily did anything wrong because they don't have the same depth as HPSTL and it is a different situation, but it would be interesting to see if there season would've gone differently if they carried more than 10 guys.
 
After looking at the pools for this weekend, it looks like a great opportunity for Vanguard to earn some bids this weekend.

https://www.advancedeventsystems.co.../PlayResults.aspx?e=PTAwMDAwMTE4MzM90&p=50896

9 teams going that either have bids or will/have declined them

1- Yorktowne 18 Blue (2nd in Rochester)
2- Eden Mizuno 18 (1st in Rochester)
3- Lakeside 18 (2nd in North Cal - declined)
4- Pitt 18 Black (3rd in Indy)
6- Pace Bootlegger (3rd in Rochester)
7- Bryc Boys 18 National (2nd in Florida)
8- Pakmen 18 (Assuming they would decline)
9- CUVC 18 Boys Onslaught (5th in Chicago)
12- Warren Sixpack 18-1 (5th in Florida)

10 teams go to gold - the remaining 1 seeds are

5- Vanguard Albertson (10th Chicago, 21st SoCal, 9th Indy)
10- Vanguard Randolph (39th Chicago, 9th Indy)
11- Club Lehigh 18 (lost 3/4 match-up against Pace for bid in Rochester)
13- LIVBC 18 National (21st Chicago, 33rd SoCal, 9th Indy)
14- Coastal B18 Navy (25th Chicago, 6th Florida)

Assuming that the top seeds seed out, it looks like going to gold will grant you a bid

Thoughts??
 
Seems incredibly favorable for both Vanguard teams. What's the rule for how far bids can trickle down before they are not awarded and become another At-Large bid that the USAV awards after the season?

Not sure getting a bid would be all that great for the Randolph team. I wouldn't see them competing with many of the teams in the 18 Open division, while they could make a real splash in the Club division
 
Brambleberry said:
Seems incredibly favorable for both Vanguard teams. What's the rule for how far bids can trickle down before they are not awarded and become another At-Large bid that the USAV awards after the season?

Not sure getting a bid would be all that great for the Randolph team. I wouldn't see them competing with many of the teams in the 18 Open division, while they could make a real splash in the Club division
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Typically the trickle down rule is based on two criteria, one the number of teams and the number of bids available. For this tournament >42 teams and 3 bids, the farthest the bids can drop is 16th.
 
Looks like all Attack teams are going to OVR regional tournament. I hope Attack reconsiders next year. This looks like a very easy tournament to get a bid with no other top midwest teams and the better East Coast teams already having bids
 
Sweetnothin said:
is attack going? anyone think Phoenix might contend for a bid?
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Sure they can contend but are in BYRC's initial pool. Their hope is to win that pool since there challenge match will be potentially with the 14 or 27 seed, which ever team wins.

If they finish second, they will play in challenge pool 2 ultimately facing Eden should they win their first challenge, not likely.
 
I think Vanguard 18-2 would decline the bid if they get it.
Going 0-fer for the first couple of days would not be pleasant.
 
disher said:
I think Vanguard 18-2 would decline the bid if they get it.
Going 0-fer for the first couple of days would not be pleasant.
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Possibly, but they have a few young guys on that team that could benefit from a high level. Even if they might take some licks.
 
It will be interesting to see how Vanguard 18-2 does this weekend. Their setter is injured and might not make the trip. FYI he's a freshman and has a big upside. He's fun to watch.
 
Outworker said:
Possibly, but they have a few young guys on that team that could benefit from a high level. Even if they might take some licks.
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top half of 18 Club is no joke. Many teams that could compete in Open but only went to one qualifier, or are from areas without a qualifier (Hawaii, PR)
 
So this is interesting.. I was just looking at the 18s and if I remember correctly, ~5/10 teams in gold are looking for a bid. Looks like teams need to win 1-2 matches to get one (depending on where they are seeded). Silver looks just as tough as gold with half of the qualified teams ending up there. My guess - they played their backups the whole tournament thus far.

Update

Vanguard 18 Albertson has Pitt Black in gold. Albertson most likely gets bid with win. Goes to playoff (not sure against who) with loss.

Vanguard 18 Randolph lost a rough one against Lehigh and end up with top seed in silver. Doubt they could get a bid even by winning out. They're most likely going club division. Could maybe get a low 1 or high 2 seed

Phoenix 18 Red has actually had a pretty decent tournament so far, with their 2 losses being against Eden and Bryc. They play First Capitol, winner plays Vanguard Randolph

How'd the other age groups do?
 
Bid for the season:
Vanguard 18 Gold Albertson
Cincinnati Attack 15 Black
Pheniox 15 Red

Am I missing anyone?
 
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Yes, they earned the bid in Harrisburg. I think they are pretty comparable to Attack's 16's team. Doubt either will crack the top 20 at nationals.
 
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