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  #31  
Old 02-19-19, 06:45 AM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
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Here is my issue. Dual meets are the foundation of our program. It's where the majority of our kids participate. I have no doubt the TJ can be handled at the championship level. The question that I think needs to be asked is can it be added to dual meets without adding extra time to meets. Can it be done safely? etc... I would think yes.

That's pretty much it for me. Reasons like scholarships for college etc, do not do much for me as our school has had many steeple chase runners in college and not once have we competed in the event in HS. We have multi event kids that did not do half the events in HS.

Dual meets should be the measuring stick.
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  #32  
Old 02-19-19, 12:43 PM
Throwscoach Throwscoach is offline
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You noticed that insanity, too, didn't you
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  #33  
Old 02-19-19, 02:49 PM
CC Track Fan CC Track Fan is offline
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Add it and drop the 4x200.
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  #34  
Old 02-19-19, 08:00 PM
Run4Life Run4Life is offline
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Originally Posted by CC Track Fan View Post
Add it and drop the 4x200.
Will not make any change for getting the meet finished faster. Takes other athletes out of the meet.
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  #35  
Old 02-20-19, 06:47 AM
mathking mathking is offline
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Triple Jump

We have had triple jump in numerous dual meets we have hosted and it has never lengthened the meet. We have been to invitationals with triple jump and one runway and it has never lengthened the meet. (In both of those cases it means the jumps started with the other field events and ended before the end of the meet.) In fact it generally takes less time to run the LJ and TJ than the PV. It is ridiculously cheap to paint a new line or two on the runway. It gives more kids a chance to compete. So what if those kids are more likely to be a sprinter than a distance runner?

It would require education on the part of coaches, as there are a lot technical aspects involved in teaching kids to jump well and safely. We already need that for PV and the throws.
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  #36  
Old 02-20-19, 09:10 AM
2020Dad 2020Dad is offline
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A couple of years ago when we thought TJ would be added it was an event at several invitationals. At least one of those had only one pit, and they finished all field events before the end of running. And as Javman says, other states do it. Now the javelin, there’s the field event I wish we had. Because I could competently coach that.
Any Javelin guys in the cincinnati area? I have a young lady that I coach in AAU track that has placed at the national level two years in a row at the AAU Junior Olympics. I taught her to throw the Javelin, but she could really benefit from someone that has some real experience and expertise in this event. She threw 109 ft 7 as a 15 year old last year. unfortunately we dont contest this event in high school in ohio so she only gets the opportunity in the summer.
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  #37  
Old 02-20-19, 11:14 AM
yj_runfan yj_runfan is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
Any Javelin guys in the cincinnati area? I have a young lady that I coach in AAU track that has placed at the national level two years in a row at the AAU Junior Olympics. I taught her to throw the Javelin, but she could really benefit from someone that has some real experience and expertise in this event. She threw 109 ft 7 as a 15 year old last year. unfortunately we dont contest this event in high school in ohio so she only gets the opportunity in the summer.
I'm guessing JAVMAN83 might know someone?
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  #38  
Old 02-20-19, 12:48 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
Any Javelin guys in the cincinnati area? I have a young lady that I coach in AAU track that has placed at the national level two years in a row at the AAU Junior Olympics. I taught her to throw the Javelin, but she could really benefit from someone that has some real experience and expertise in this event. She threw 109 ft 7 as a 15 year old last year. unfortunately we dont contest this event in high school in ohio so she only gets the opportunity in the summer.
Not sure about Cincinnati area, but you might ask around for Charlie Greene in the Dayton area (Kettering?). He is a top master's thrower, but was a national class thrower (250-270) back in the 1980s. I believe he has worked with throwers in the past, but not sure about the present. I'll see what I can dig up on my end by asking around.

109' 7" - Forget the question I just asked. I found her. I see she was 7th at the AAU Nationals in the girls ' 15-16 javelin throw last summer. That is an excellent throw for a young lady that is only piddling with it during the summer. I know many D3/NAIA programs would be interested in that for someone that young.

LANCERMANIA - You need to add this young lady to the SWOTCCCA record board! That would be a new Cincinnati Area record, supplanting the previous 97' 2" throw!

Last edited by JAVMAN83; 02-20-19 at 12:58 PM..
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  #39  
Old 02-20-19, 12:53 PM
2020Dad 2020Dad is offline
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Her name is Kayla Williams she is a sophomore at shroder high school in Cincinnati the distance can be easily verified by checking to 2018 AAU junior Olympic results for javelin in the 15 to 16-year-old girls age group


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  #40  
Old 02-20-19, 01:00 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
Her name is Kayla Williams she is a sophomore at shroder high school in Cincinnati the distance can be easily verified by checking to 2018 AAU junior Olympic results for javelin in the 15 to 16-year-old girls age group


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Thanks. I was re-typing my response while you sent your message.
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  #41  
Old 02-20-19, 01:12 PM
EuclidandViren EuclidandViren is offline
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Originally Posted by psycho_dad View Post

Dual meets should be the measuring stick.
I have coached for 19 years and have been to 2 dual meets in my life. I see the importance of the JV runner and the team camaraderie for small schools.

I am confused by your statement that Dual meets should be the measuring stick. I am a teacher and we use measuring sticks to ready the students for the end of course assessment. We use problems similar to the EOCA/ACT all year long because they are the measuring stick. I fail to see why a dual meet should be the measuring stick for a track program. As a coach, I look at the end of the season (state meet) or New Balance Nationals and that is the measuring stick. That is what the goal is for the team. I fail to see how a dual meet should be the measuring stick.

Our normal Friday night meets for my school have 25+ schools and almost all of the meets we attend have the triple jump, steeplechase and hammer.
We attend a Wednesday JV meet every week. But normally they have 5-10 schools. They do not have the special events and that is ok with me. I look at the special events (hammer, steeple and triple) as an opportunity to give a standout JV athlete varsity experience. Or if I have a couple of studs over 40 feet, in which I did last year. We can score huge points in the triple jump. My thinking is that I give more kids opportunity and most kids eat it up.

I have sent multiple steeplechasers to college. But I have sent over ten kids just because they threw the indoor weight or the hammer or the triple jump. College coaches eat those kids up.
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  #42  
Old 02-20-19, 01:16 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
Her name is Kayla Williams she is a sophomore at shroder high school in Cincinnati the distance can be easily verified by checking to 2018 AAU junior Olympic results for javelin in the 15 to 16-year-old girls age group


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Suggestion: Give Susan Seaton, the Unversity of Cincinnati's Head Coach, a call to see if she knows anyone in the area that might be willing to work with Kayla. Many former UC athletes are in the area, and one of them may be a former javelin throw. She'd know her former athletes better.

https://gobearcats.com/coaches.aspx?rc=1568&path=track
513-556-1507
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  #43  
Old 02-20-19, 01:46 PM
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Lancermania Lancermania is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
Her name is Kayla Williams she is a sophomore at shroder high school in Cincinnati the distance can be easily verified by checking to 2018 AAU junior Olympic results for javelin in the 15 to 16-year-old girls age group.
I found her results from the 2018 meet. The results list her hometown as West Chester. http://image2.aausports.org/sports/a...games/Day6.htm Are you sure she went to Shroder? Any idea where I can get her picture for the city record?
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  #44  
Old 02-20-19, 01:58 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Originally Posted by Lancermania View Post
I found her results from the 2018 meet. The results list her hometown as West Chester. http://image2.aausports.org/sports/a...games/Day6.htm Are you sure she went to Shroder? Any idea where I can get her picture for the city record?
I confirmed she competed for Shroder last year. She's on the Athletic.net database:

https://www.athletic.net/TrackAndFie...x?AID=13799966

My task in compiling all-time lists, as I indicated in another thread, is the fact that no one online resource has everything. You'll notice in that link that none of her AAU meets are listed post-season. I have to look at EVERYTHING in order to compile tailored lists.
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  #45  
Old 02-20-19, 02:14 PM
2020Dad 2020Dad is offline
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Originally Posted by Lancermania View Post
I found her results from the 2018 meet. The results list her hometown as West Chester. http://image2.aausports.org/sports/a...games/Day6.htm Are you sure she went to Shroder? Any idea where I can get her picture for the city record?
I use the PO Box for my AAu TRack team when I purchase AAU cards for the team so that is why she shows up as west chester oh. I have pictures of her if you send me an email address I can send you something. Her dad has a million pics of her on his FB page and I have pics of her fro the Junior olympics I have coached her since she was 10 or 11
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  #46  
Old 02-20-19, 02:23 PM
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Lancermania Lancermania is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
I use the PO Box for my AAu TRack team when I purchase AAU cards for the team so that is why she shows up as west chester oh. I have pictures of her if you send me an email address I can send you something. Her dad has a million pics of her on his FB page and I have pics of her fro the Junior olympics I have coached her since she was 10 or 11
Yes, I found her in the AAU Region Four Qualifier as being in the 9th grade at Shroder. The results shows her winning in 87 feet. How in God's name did she go from 87' to 109' in one month. Good coaching? I have sent you my email address in a private message.
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  #47  
Old 02-20-19, 02:33 PM
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Mr. Slippery Mr. Slippery is offline
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Originally Posted by EuclidandViren View Post
I have coached for 19 years and have been to 2 dual meets in my life. I see the importance of the JV runner and the team camaraderie for small schools.

I am confused by your statement that Dual meets should be the measuring stick. I am a teacher and we use measuring sticks to ready the students for the end of course assessment. We use problems similar to the EOCA/ACT all year long because they are the measuring stick. I fail to see why a dual meet should be the measuring stick for a track program. As a coach, I look at the end of the season (state meet) or New Balance Nationals and that is the measuring stick. That is what the goal is for the team. I fail to see how a dual meet should be the measuring stick.

Our normal Friday night meets for my school have 25+ schools and almost all of the meets we attend have the triple jump, steeplechase and hammer.
We attend a Wednesday JV meet every week. But normally they have 5-10 schools. They do not have the special events and that is ok with me. I look at the special events (hammer, steeple and triple) as an opportunity to give a standout JV athlete varsity experience. Or if I have a couple of studs over 40 feet, in which I did last year. We can score huge points in the triple jump. My thinking is that I give more kids opportunity and most kids eat it up.

I have sent multiple steeplechasers to college. But I have sent over ten kids just because they threw the indoor weight or the hammer or the triple jump. College coaches eat those kids up.
I think you missed his point on dual meets.

I believe what he's saying is that dual meets should be the measuring stick with regard to making the triple jump or any other event a regular event in the track and field meet program. If it can't successfully be implemented as part of a dual meet, then it shouldn't become a regular event.

Incidentally, I wouldn't dispute Psycho Dad's program's approach to the sport too much. The school's resume speaks for itself with district and regional titles to their names, and FWIW, dual meets count toward his team's league standings. The same is true of at least 1 larger school league in my backyard. Oh yeah, they're pretty good at XC, too - just 1 boys team title away from tying Caldwell for the all-time state record.

I know they exist, but I have a hard time imagining teams that don't compete in any dual meets except for the incredibly small schools that don't have enough bodies to fill most events in a dual meet (in which case, they will sometimes look to piggyback on a dual meet b/w 2 other teams). Not scheduling any dual meets wouldn't fly with me or the kids on the team at my school.

Last edited by Mr. Slippery; 02-25-19 at 11:51 AM..
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  #48  
Old 02-20-19, 06:20 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Originally Posted by Lancermania View Post
Yes, I found her in the AAU Region Four Qualifier as being in the 9th grade at Shroder. The results shows her winning in 87 feet. How in God's name did she go from 87' to 109' in one month. Good coaching? I have sent you my email address in a private message.
At that level, Lancermania, that is not unheard of. I see that Kayla has done some 100m sprinting as of last year, and I suspect she has some natural quickness to her as well as some decent coordination. Beginning throwers typically have a wide range in performances early on. The more she throws, the less the discrepancy will become. 109' as a freshmen tells me she can throw over 40m (131') as a junior with some additional work. If she's done some hurdling and some combination of HJ & LJ work, I'd say we have a heptathlete in the making.
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  #49  
Old 02-21-19, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by JAVMAN83 View Post
LANCERMANIA - You need to add this young lady to the SWOTCCCA record board! That would be a new Cincinnati Area record, supplanting the previous 97' 2" throw!
The record has now been changed thanks to both 2020DAD and JAVMAN83

http://www.swotccca.com/Documents/Ci...%20Girls27.pdf

Last edited by Lancermania; 02-22-19 at 01:55 PM..
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  #50  
Old 02-25-19, 10:32 AM
2020Dad 2020Dad is offline
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Originally Posted by JAVMAN83 View Post
At that level, Lancermania, that is not unheard of. I see that Kayla has done some 100m sprinting as of last year, and I suspect she has some natural quickness to her as well as some decent coordination. Beginning throwers typically have a wide range in performances early on. The more she throws, the less the discrepancy will become. 109' as a freshmen tells me she can throw over 40m (131') as a junior with some additional work. If she's done some hurdling and some combination of HJ & LJ work, I'd say we have a heptathlete in the making.
She actually threw 94 ft at the junior olympics as an 8th grader finishing 7th overall. She threw 87 ft using just a 5 step approach at the qualifier, I took the next month to work on her approach and as you can see she improved drastically. I am somewhat of a novice(youtube) coach for Javelin and I think she has could benefit from someone that is more experienced and technical. If I find someone great if not I will be combing youtube for instructional videos as it has worked thus far. A little secret David Montgomery who is a Mt Healthy graduate threw the Javelin at the AAU JO when he was 13 or 14 and placed nationally. He currently attends Iowa State and is expected to get drafted in the 1st or 2nd round in the Nfl draft. What is the record for Males in Cincinnati. I also gave him the 1 month javelin crash course. LOL
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  #51  
Old 02-25-19, 11:36 AM
CoventryTrackXCguy CoventryTrackXCguy is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. Slippery View Post
I think you missed his point on dual meets.

I believe what he's saying is that dual meets should be the measuring stick with regard to making the triple jump or any other event a regular event in the track and field meet program. If it can't successfully be implemented as part of a dual meet, then it shouldn't become a regular event.

Incidentally, I wouldn't dispute Psycho Dad's program's approach to the sport too much. The school's resume speaks for itself with district and regional titles to their names, and FWIW, dual meets count toward his team's league standings. The same is true of at least 1 larger school league in my backyard. Oh yeah, they're pretty good at XC, too - just 1 boys team title away from tying Caldwell for the all-time state record.

I know they exist, but I have a hard time imagining teams that don't compete in any dual meets except for the incredibly small schools that don't have enough bodies to fill most events in a dual meet (in which case, they will sometimes look to piggyback on a dual meet b/w 2 other teams). That approach to scheduling wouldn't fly with me or the kids on the team at my school.
I have them as overwhelmingly heavy favorites for getting that state championship next season. They enter next season as defending champs, and they will return everybody from that squad.
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  #52  
Old 02-25-19, 12:39 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Originally Posted by 2020Dad View Post
She actually threw 94 ft at the junior olympics as an 8th grader finishing 7th overall. She threw 87 ft using just a 5 step approach at the qualifier, I took the next month to work on her approach and as you can see she improved drastically. I am somewhat of a novice(youtube) coach for Javelin and I think she has could benefit from someone that is more experienced and technical. If I find someone great if not I will be combing youtube for instructional videos as it has worked thus far. A little secret David Montgomery who is a Mt Healthy graduate threw the Javelin at the AAU JO when he was 13 or 14 and placed nationally. He currently attends Iowa State and is expected to get drafted in the 1st or 2nd round in the Nfl draft. What is the record for Males in Cincinnati. I also gave him the 1 month javelin crash course. LOL
Moeller's Ryan Smith threw 176' 0" this past June. That is the current Cincinnati area record according to my records.
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  #53  
Old 02-25-19, 02:14 PM
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Moeller's Ryan Smith threw 176' 0" this past June. That is the current Cincinnati area record according to my records.
JAVMAN83 and I agree on this one. I have Smith down in the coaches web site as holding the record. http://www.swotccca.com/Documents/Ci...s%20Boys34.pdf
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