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  #5011  
Old 01-02-16, 09:22 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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I did not say they could not play each other in the regular season. Lol
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  #5012  
Old 01-02-16, 09:27 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
So everyone gets a title. Whatever happened to the phrase to be the best you have to play the best.
I did nit say they could not play each other on the regular season.Lol
Plus they will play the best. Private/parochial will play the best Private/Parochial and Public will play the best Public..
Whats wrong with that?
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  #5013  
Old 01-02-16, 09:35 PM
haydenfrye haydenfrye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
I did nit say they could not play each other on the regular season.Lol
Plus they will play the best. Private/parochial will play the best Private/Parochial and Public will play the best Public..
Whats wrong with that?
We will use Glenville for this. Let's say they win the public State Title and the private state title goes to Elder. They didn't play in the regular season. Who is the best team in D1 at that point. How many private divisions would there be? Will you have Delphos St Johns playing Cleveland St Eds in the playoffs? What if a charter school is good at football? Will that charter school which is technically a public school be forced to join the private schools? What about the open enrollment schools they have what everyone claims is the same!e advantage as private schools do you kick out 70% of the public schools?
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  #5014  
Old 01-02-16, 10:51 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
We will use Glenville for this. Let's say they win the public State Title and the private state title goes to Elder. They didn't play in the regular season. Who is the best team in D1 at that point. How many private divisions would there be? Will you have Delphos St Johns playing Cleveland St Eds in the playoffs? What if a charter school is good at football? Will that charter school which is technically a public school be forced to join the private schools? What about the open enrollment schools they have what everyone claims is the same!e advantage as private schools do you kick out 70% of the public schools?
Lol..
If the separate public from private/parochial, then if Glanville wins Public they are champs for public and then Elder for Private/parochial plain and simple.
There would be the same private divisions as it is now D1 On down.if need be they can combine D3,4, then D5,6,7. D1 AND D2, could stay the same.
Does not look like it would be a problem at all
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  #5015  
Old 01-02-16, 11:02 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
We will use Glenville for this. Let's say they win the public State Title and the private state title goes to Elder. They didn't play in the regular season. Who is the best team in D1 at that point. How many private divisions would there be? Will you have Delphos St Johns playing Cleveland St Eds in the playoffs? What if a charter school is good at football? Will that charter school which is technically a public school be forced to join the private schools? What about the open enrollment schools they have what everyone claims is the same!e advantage as private schools do you kick out 70% of the public schools?
As far as kicking out 70% of the public schools. The answer is no. They can stay. Open enrollment will not be a problem,why simply because you wont get that many kids going to schools out side of thier local school. Do to the fact that they will have a chance at the playoffs with playing for their local school.
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  #5016  
Old 01-02-16, 11:51 PM
Captain_Cavman Captain_Cavman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
So everyone gets a title. Whatever happened to the phrase to be the best you have to play the best.
Why do they have divisions then?
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  #5017  
Old 01-02-16, 11:59 PM
Captain_Cavman Captain_Cavman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
Will you have Delphos St Johns playing Cleveland St Eds in the playoffs?
This brings up another question. Do you treat DSJ the same as St Eds with regards to multipliers as both are privates?

IMO, population density should be at least one factor in the balance formula.
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  #5018  
Old 01-03-16, 01:28 AM
TCSoup TCSoup is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
I did not say they could not play each other in the regular season. Lol
My Hunch is that the publics would duck the Privates at all cost then in the regular season.
you think a HHW or Big Red would want any part of a Hartley or St Ed's.?

It would be no more than a Massillon AP Paper Title to win a Public School only Championship.

No guess on as Journey or Hoser would say is the real Cowards here.
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  #5019  
Old 01-03-16, 02:10 AM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TCSoup View Post
My Hunch is that the publics would duck the Privates at all cost then in the regular season.
you think a HHW or Big Red would want any part of a Hartley or St Ed's.?

It would be no more than a Massillon AP Paper Title to win a Public School only Championship.

No guess on as Journey or Hoser would say is the real Cowards here.
Lol.
Why would it have to be that they ducking privates? Smh at that statement.
I know alot of privates that have ducked good public schools now,for fear of loosing to them and not making the playoffs. So who actually dodges who for real? Lol
Remember, Athletic Directors schedule out of conference games that they truly think they teams will win first off.

To say it would be a paper state championship is wrong because it would be state for Public and Private would win state for private..Niether would be just Paper..lol

Why is it that most of the private schools supporters have a problem with private playing private and public playing public in the playoffs? I always thought this was about the kids, ALL kids.
And no im not saying every team should get a trophy I dont think that should happen. So please folks dont say that.
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  #5020  
Old 01-03-16, 09:05 AM
SSS SSS is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
Lol.
Why would it have to be that they ducking privates? Smh at that statement.
I know alot of privates that have ducked good public schools now,for fear of loosing to them and not making the playoffs. So who actually dodges who for real? Lol
Remember, Athletic Directors schedule out of conference games that they truly think they teams will win first off.

To say it would be a paper state championship is wrong because it would be state for Public and Private would win state for private..Niether would be just Paper..lol

Why is it that most of the private schools supporters have a problem with private playing private and public playing public in the playoffs? I always thought this was about the kids, ALL kids.
And no im not saying every team should get a trophy I dont think that should happen. So please folks dont say that.

Given your scenario Wayne would have been the public state champ and Ed's the private state champ. And we would never know who was the real state champ. It waters it down too much and doesn't allow the issue of who is the state champ to be settled the best way possible, on the field.
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  #5021  
Old 01-03-16, 09:31 AM
hoodrat hoodrat is offline
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If 7 divisions are ok now just make 3 private and 4 public divisions.
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  #5022  
Old 01-03-16, 09:32 AM
haydenfrye haydenfrye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
As far as kicking out 70% of the public schools. The answer is no. They can stay. Open enrollment will not be a problem,why simply because you wont get that many kids going to schools out side of thier local school. Do to the fact that they will have a chance at the playoffs with playing for their local school.
So you are OK with public school using the same advantages as private schools, but you want to kick the private schools out of the tourney for using the same advantages.
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  #5023  
Old 01-03-16, 09:43 AM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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The playoffs are fine as they are. DO NOT separate publics and privates. It is a point of pride that Ohio has a combined state football playoff.

Now with that being said, maybe a little humility on the part of the private school folks to at least acknowledge they have some structural advantages over the public schools in building and then SUSTAINING successful football programs would go a long way in taking the emotion out of this argument. Because if the split ever comes it won't be for logical reasons but for emotional reasons.
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  #5024  
Old 01-03-16, 10:07 AM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
The playoffs are fine as they are. DO NOT separate publics and privates. It is a point of pride that Ohio has a combined state football playoff.

Now with that being said, maybe a little humility on the part of the private school folks to at least acknowledge they have some structural advantages over the public schools in building and then SUSTAINING successful football programs would go a long way in taking the emotion out of this argument. Because if the split ever comes it won't be for logical reasons but for emotional reasons.
Private schools do have an advantage in getting top students to attend their schools, but publics have the advantage in dollars. Take Fairfield for example, their new facilities at both the HS and football field are college like. They are far and above anything that any private school has to offer. The phrase "build it and they will come" is very true. I applaud FF for stepping up and hiring good coaches and providing the kids with top notch facilities. The lure for "most" parents to send their child to a private school is the discipline, religious and academic atmosphere. The private schools facilities are either shabby or non existent compared to suburban publics. I know honks like Wolf and Hoser dispell this truth but the vast majority of kids attend private schools for the reasons I listed and certainly not for the facilities. Should a district like FF or Mason be penalized because of their advantages over inner city publics? I agree that Ohio has a great playoff system and that there are many, many examples of publics competing evenly if they have there act together. Shouldn't competition to be the best in the the classrooms and sports venues be encouraged at every school?
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  #5025  
Old 01-03-16, 11:26 AM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeeman View Post
Private schools do have an advantage in getting top students to attend their schools, but publics have the advantage in dollars. Take Fairfield for example, their new facilities at both the HS and football field are college like. They are far and above anything that any private school has to offer. The phrase "build it and they will come" is very true. I applaud FF for stepping up and hiring good coaches and providing the kids with top notch facilities. The lure for "most" parents to send their child to a private school is the discipline, religious and academic atmosphere. The private schools facilities are either shabby or non existent compared to suburban publics. I know honks like Wolf and Hoser dispell this truth but the vast majority of kids attend private schools for the reasons I listed and certainly not for the facilities. Should a district like FF or Mason be penalized because of their advantages over inner city publics? I agree that Ohio has a great playoff system and that there are many, many examples of publics competing evenly if they have there act together. Shouldn't competition to be the best in the the classrooms and sports venues be encouraged at every school?
The point I'm making Zeeman is that it's like pulling teeth to get private school supporters to admit that they have a built in advantage and even when they do, as you sort of did, they attach a bunch of caveats!

See, I have no problem readily acknowledging that the Fairfield football program has enormous advantages over the CPS (Cincinnati Public School) programs and after FF beat Withrow you didn't see Indian fans bragging about how superior their kids/school district was. Yet how many times do we have to hear the braggarts from the private schools tout their "superiority" without ever acknowledging their advantages?

BTW, while the remodeled FF stadium is very nice and the new field house will help the football program (it may even convince a couple of kids not to go to Badin, X, Moeller or LaSalle) it was LONG overdue and hardly an example of immense financial resources for the district.

My point on this has been simple since day one: keep a single playoff system and celebrate the FACT that Ohio has one of the best football playoff formats in the USA.
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  #5026  
Old 01-03-16, 11:33 AM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
The point I'm making Zeeman is that it's like pulling teeth to get private school supporters to admit that they have a built in advantage and even when they do, as you sort of did, they attach a bunch of caveats!

See, I have no problem readily acknowledging that the Fairfield football program has enormous advantages over the CPS (Cincinnati Public School) programs and after FF beat Withrow you didn't see Indian fans bragging about how superior their kids/school district was. Yet how many times do we have to hear the braggarts from the private schools tout their "superiority" without ever acknowledging their advantages?

BTW, while the remodeled FF stadium is very nice and the new field house will help the football program (it may even convince a couple of kids not to go to Badin, X, Moeller or LaSalle) it was LONG overdue and hardly an example of immense financial resources for the district.

My point on this has been simple since day one: keep a single playoff system and celebrate the FACT that Ohio has one of the best football playoff formats in the USA.
Well gee Lotr, my very first sentence was stating the advantage privates have, but there are advantages that many publics have as well. To not mention them also would be disingenuous. The bottom line is most of the complainers on here don't want a level playing field, they want their school to be dominate without having to work for it. FF is a good example of working for it.
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  #5027  
Old 01-03-16, 01:07 PM
larry legend larry legend is offline
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[QUOTE=zeeman;6370749]Private schools do have an advantage in getting top students to attend their schools, but publics have the advantage in dollars. Take Fairfield for example, their new facilities at both the HS and football field are college like. They are far and above anything that any private school has to offer. The phrase "build it and they will come" is very true. I applaud FF for stepping up and hiring good coaches and providing the kids with top notch facilities. The lure for "most" parents to send their child to a private school is the discipline, religious and academic atmosphere. The private schools facilities are either shabby or non existent compared to suburban publics. I know honks like Wolf and Hoser dispell this truth but the vast majority of kids attend private schools for the reasons I listed and certainly not for the facilities. Should a district like FF or Mason be penalized because of their advantages over inner city publics? I agree that Ohio has a great playoff system and that there are many, many examples of publics competing evenly if they have there act together. Shouldn't competition to be the best in the the classrooms and sports venues be encouraged at every school?[/QUOTE]

EXACTLY, Sports should be about hard work and competition. Leave the rest out of it.
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  #5028  
Old 01-03-16, 03:23 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
So you are OK with public school using the same advantages as private schools, but you want to kick the private schools out of the tourney for using the same advantages.
Read my statement again.
I said it wont be a problem because the local kids will stay at there local school.
Private schools are not the same as open enrollment.
Private schools you have to be excepted and pass the entrance test. Plus pay to be there.
CPS,a kid just transfers in.no test no payment,as long as they are not a "bad kid" they will allow them in the school.
Private schools get kids from all over the city and in some case the Tristate area (kids from KY and Indy). Not the same.

Why would it be such an issue for them to separate in the playoffs?
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  #5029  
Old 01-03-16, 03:28 PM
haydenfrye haydenfrye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
Read my statement again.
I said it wont be a problem because the local kids will stay at there local school.
Private schools are not the same as open enrollment.
Private schools you have to be excepted and pass the entrance test. Plus pay to be there.
CPS,a kid just transfers in.no test no payment,as long as they are not a "bad kid" they will allow them in the school.
Private schools get kids from all over the city and in some case the Tristate area (kids from KY and Indy). Not the same.

Why would it be such an issue for them to separate in the playoffs?
Short of the entrance exam and tuition which you also have to pay for at open enrollment schools it is the exact same thing. Open Enrollment schools and Private schools draw from the same pool it doesn't matter where in the state it is. Yes Cincinnati private schools will get kids from Indiana and Kentucky as well just as Toledo Private schools get kids from Michigan but in that respect so does Toledo Whitmer and that is a public school. So again why the Hypocrisy with where the kids come from 70% of the public schools get open enrolled kids why is that going to be treated any different
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  #5030  
Old 01-03-16, 03:40 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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[QUOTE=larry legend;6370799]
Quote:
Originally Posted by zeeman View Post
Private schools do have an advantage in getting top students to attend their schools, but publics have the advantage in dollars. Take Fairfield for example, their new facilities at both the HS and football field are college like. They are far and above anything that any private school has to offer. The phrase "build it and they will come" is very true. I applaud FF for stepping up and hiring good coaches and providing the kids with top notch facilities. The lure for "most" parents to send their child to a private school is the discipline, religious and academic atmosphere. The private schools facilities are either shabby or non existent compared to suburban publics. I know honks like Wolf and Hoser dispell this truth but the vast majority of kids attend private schools for the reasons I listed and certainly not for the facilities. Should a district like FF or Mason be penalized because of their advantages over inner city publics? I agree that Ohio has a great playoff system and that there are many, many examples of publics competing evenly if they have there act together. Shouldn't competition to be the best in the the classrooms and sports venues be encouraged at every school?[/QUOTE]

EXACTLY, Sports should be about hard work and competition. Leave the rest out of it.
You just named the 2 largest sch distrects in the city,so yes what you say about money would look good,but what about the other public schools which are the majority that dont have the finances like FF and Mason? No publics do not have the advantage in dollars privates do.
Most privates have better weight rooms.2 gyms, indoor practice facilities, 2 different helmets 4 sets of uniforms.Ect..

And who did those schools loose to most of the time in the playoffs? A private school! Or in the case of FF this past year get cheated by to loose to. Lol..
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  #5031  
Old 01-03-16, 03:52 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
Short of the entrance exam and tuition which you also have to pay for at open enrollment schools it is the exact same thing. Open Enrollment schools and Private schools draw from the same pool it doesn't matter where in the state it is. Yes Cincinnati private schools will get kids from Indiana and Kentucky as well just as Toledo Private schools get kids from Michigan but in that respect so does Toledo Whitmer and that is a public school. So again why the Hypocrisy with where the kids come from 70% of the public schools get open enrolled kids why is that going to be treated any different
I dont know how it is where you are at but where im at open enrollment PS, a kid does not pay tuition. They pay student fees which is under $200 in the majority of cases.
Private schools cost from $2,000 - $7500.
And somebody has the nerve to say that Public schools have the dollars over Privates..lmao..hahaha
You just said it private schools can get kids from out of state to come to there school,where as publics can not! Looks like an advantage to me. Ijs
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  #5032  
Old 01-03-16, 03:55 PM
TCSoup TCSoup is offline
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Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
Lol.
Why would it have to be that they ducking privates? Smh at that statement.
I know alot of privates that have ducked good public schools now,for fear of loosing to them and not making the playoffs. So who actually dodges who for real? Lol
Remember, Athletic Directors schedule out of conference games that they truly think they teams will win first off.

To say it would be a paper state championship is wrong because it would be state for Public and Private would win state for private..Niether would be just Paper..lol

Why is it that most of the private schools supporters have a problem with private playing private and public playing public in the playoffs? I always thought this was about the kids, ALL kids.
And no im not saying every team should get a trophy I dont think that should happen. So please folks dont say that.
really give me one example where a private ducked a Public to make the Playoffs.
Thats the most ridiculous statement ever on Yappi and thats hard to do.
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  #5033  
Old 01-03-16, 03:56 PM
haydenfrye haydenfrye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
I dont know how it is where you are at but where im at open enrollment PS, a kid does not pay tuition. They pay student fees which is under $200 in the majority of cases.
Private schools cost from $2,000 - $7500.
And somebody has the nerve to say that Public schools have the dollars over Privates..lmao..hahaha
You just said it private schools can get kids from out of state to come to there school,where as publics can not! Looks like an advantage to me. Ijs
One problem with your theory there is they have a rule that kids from out of state cannot play on an OHSAA team unless they went to the schools feeder program. Being as you keep bringing up Cincinnati I thaught you might already know about that rule being as it was created because of St X
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  #5034  
Old 01-03-16, 03:56 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
Short of the entrance exam and tuition which you also have to pay for at open enrollment schools it is the exact same thing. Open Enrollment schools and Private schools draw from the same pool it doesn't matter where in the state it is. Yes Cincinnati private schools will get kids from Indiana and Kentucky as well just as Toledo Private schools get kids from Michigan but in that respect so does Toledo Whitmer and that is a public school. So again why the Hypocrisy with where the kids come from 70% of the public schools get open enrolled kids why is that going to be treated any different
Wow.. you just named 1 public school in comparison to 5-7 private schools that get kids from other states..lol
Advantage to private schools if you ask me..lol
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  #5035  
Old 01-03-16, 04:03 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
One problem with your theory there is their is a rule that kids from out of state cannot play on an OHSAA team unless they went to the schools feeder program. Being as you keep bringing up Cincinnati I thaught you might already know about that rule being as it was created because of St X
And that is why X and other private schools listed themselves as "open enrollment schools" (with stipulations) to get around that rule. Lol
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  #5036  
Old 01-03-16, 04:07 PM
haydenfrye haydenfrye is offline
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Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
And that is why X and other private schools listed themselves as "open enrollment schools" (with stipulations) to get around that rule. Lol
And that still wouldn't allow any students from out of state other than those who attended the feeder school to play so again where is the advantage. If you are going to bring up the public schools in poorer areas not getting enough state money I suggest calling your state assemblyman to find out why Olentangy gets more money than Moraine or any other poorer areas
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  #5037  
Old 01-03-16, 04:15 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Originally Posted by TCSoup View Post
really give me one example where a private ducked a Public to make the Playoffs.
Thats the most ridiculous statement ever on Yappi and thats hard to do.
In the past 3 years WINTON WOODS WAS DUCKED BY COUNTLESS PRIVATES/PAROCHIAL SCHOOLS FOR FEAR OF LOOSING TO THEM,and not making the playoffs.
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  #5038  
Old 01-03-16, 04:32 PM
Warrior Watcher Warrior Watcher is offline
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Originally Posted by haydenfrye View Post
And that still wouldn't allow any students from out of state other than those who attended the feeder school to play so again where is the advantage. If you are going to bring up the public schools in poorer areas not getting enough state money I suggest calling your state assemblyman to find out why Olentangy gets more money than Moraine or any other poorer areas
Yes it does and it has,and i just got it confirmed that kids went to private schools from out of state and did not attend the feeder schools this past season at 2 private schools. They used the open enrollment to get around that. Like I said.lol
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  #5039  
Old 01-03-16, 04:36 PM
haydenfrye haydenfrye is offline
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Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
Yes it does and it has,and i just got it confirmed that kids went to private schools from out of state and did not attend the feeder schools this past season at 2 private schools. They used the open enrollment to get around that. Like I said.lol
Right there is why the OHSAA is a joke as that is defined by a rule the association has made.
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  #5040  
Old 01-03-16, 04:53 PM
Termite2 Termite2 is offline
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Originally Posted by Warrior Watcher View Post
Yes it does and it has,and i just got it confirmed that kids went to private schools from out of state and did not attend the feeder schools this past season at 2 private schools. They used the open enrollment to get around that. Like I said.lol
You don't know what you are talking about, "open enrollment" refers to public schools, by definition all private schools are "open enrollment". That has nothing to do with whether a out of state student can play OHSAA sports.
A Indiana student, for ex; that attends SJB[Diocesan school] in Harrison [located 2 blocks from Indiana state line] from 7th on, can play at a Archdiocese of Cincinnati highschool.
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